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BANG BANG
07-28-2010, 1:07 PM
A firearm did not come from the manufacturer with a gun lock but the seller bought one for it. If he includes it with deal would I still need to go buy another NEW lock when it's time to pick up the firearm?

AlliedArmory
07-28-2010, 2:00 PM
Yes, you will need a proof of purchase dated within the last 30 days.

858casper858
07-28-2010, 2:01 PM
You need a reciept to go along with the lock showing it was bought within the last 30 days. 31 days = new lock purchase.

858casper858
07-28-2010, 2:01 PM
Damn, you beat me by a minute!

shooting4life
07-28-2010, 2:14 PM
But you can have he seller write a receipt showing he is selling it to you.

CHS
07-28-2010, 2:31 PM
Have the seller write up a sales receipt for the gun lock showing the date of the sale and the make/model of the DoJ-approved firearms safety device.

Now you can use the lock that came with the gun.

SVT-40
07-28-2010, 3:18 PM
Hand gun or long gun? If It's a long gun and you have a safe you can complete the safe waiver. Or without a safe bring the dated receipt within the last 30 days of purchase along with the lock at pick up.

If it's a hand gun and it's with the hand gun at the time of the transfer the FFL MAY allow that to suffice. Otherwise you will either need to buy a lock from the FFL the day of pick up. Or you could buy a lock the day of pick up from some other vendor. Bring both the lock AND the receipt to the FFL so he can make a copy of the receipt for his records.

BANG BANG
07-28-2010, 3:29 PM
Have the seller write up a sales receipt for the gun lock showing the date of the sale and the make/model of the DoJ-approved firearms safety device.

Now you can use the lock that came with the gun.

so seller can type up a note stating the above info himself and that will suffice?

It's for a shotgun

AlliedArmory
07-28-2010, 3:45 PM
Since it is a shotgun, you can fill out the safe affidavit if you have a safe.

BANG BANG
07-28-2010, 3:49 PM
Since it is a shotgun, you can fill out the safe affidavit if you have a safe.

NOPE, NO SAFE.

shooting4life
07-28-2010, 3:52 PM
All you need is a receipt. Does not say it has to be from a chain store.

BANG BANG
07-28-2010, 9:27 PM
So a typed up note by the seller will do for the gun shop? Does it have to say price or it be signed by the seller ???

Joe
07-28-2010, 9:33 PM
Which gun store will you be going to?

I usually just buy a gunlock at big5 and then return it right after picking up the gun.

marc4
07-28-2010, 10:00 PM
If I'm the buyer, I normally bring a lock with me during ppt. I give it to the seller and when we go to the counter, he says the lock goes with the gun I'm buying. Never had a problem with any dealer.

tenpercentfirearms
07-28-2010, 10:15 PM
Yes, you will need a proof of purchase dated within the last 30 days.

I don't think this is accurate.

Do you require buyers to provide a receipt when their brand new factory Glock comes with a lock? Then why would you require the buyer to provide a receipt when his used Glock comes with a lock?

Here is actually what the PC says.

12088.1. (a) All firearms sold or transferred in this state by a licensed firearms dealer, including private transfers through a dealer, and all firearms manufactured in this state, shall include or be accompanied by a firearms safety device that is listed on the Department of Justice's roster of approved firearms safety devices and that is identified as appropriate for that firearm by reference to either the manufacturer and model of the firearm, or to the physical characteristics of the firearm that match those listed on the roster for use with the device.
(b) All firearms sold or transferred in this state by a licensed firearms dealer, including private transfers through a dealer, and all firearms manufactured in this state shall be accompanied with warning language or labels as described in Section 12088.3.
(c)(1) All long-gun safes commercially sold or transferred in this state, or manufactured in this state for sale in this state, that do not meet the standards for gun safes adopted pursuant to Section 12088.2 shall be accompanied by the following warning:
"WARNING: This gun safe does not meet the safety standards for gun safes specified in California Penal Code Section 12088.2. It does not satisfy the requirements of Penal Code Section 12088.1, which mandates that all firearms sold in California be accompanied by a firearms safety device or proof of ownership, as required by law, of a gun safe that meets the Section 12088.2 minimum safety standards developed by the California Attorney General."

(2) This warning shall be conspicuously displayed in its entirety on the principal display panel of the gun safe's package, on any descriptive materials that accompany the gun safe, and on a label affixed to the front of the gun safe.
(3) This warning shall be displayed in both English and Spanish in conspicuous and legible type in contrast by typography, layout, or color with other printed matter on the package or descriptive materials in a manner consistent with Part 1500.121 of Title 16 of the Code of Federal Regulations, or successor regulations thereto.
(d) The sale or transfer of a firearm shall be exempt from subdivision (a) if both of the following apply:
(1) The purchaser or transferee owns a gun safe that meets the standards set forth in Section 12088.2. Gun safes shall not be required to be tested, and therefore may meet the standards without appearing on the Department of Justice roster.
(2) The purchaser or transferee presents an original receipt for purchase of the gun safe, or other proof of purchase or ownership of the gun safe as authorized by the Attorney General, to the firearms dealer. The dealer shall maintain a copy of this receipt or proof of purchase with the dealers' record of sales of firearms.
(e) The sale or transfer of a firearm shall be exempt from subdivision (a) if all of the following apply:
(1) The purchaser or transferee purchases an approved safety device no more than 30 days prior to the day the purchaser or transferee takes possession of the firearm.
(2) The purchaser or transferee presents the approved safety device to the firearms dealer when picking up the firearm.
(3) The purchaser or transferee presents an original receipt to the firearms dealer which shows the date of purchase, the name, and the model number of the safety device.
(4) The firearms dealer verifies that the requirements in (1) to (3), inclusive, have been satisfied.
(5) The firearms dealer maintains a copy of the receipt along with the dealers' record of sales of firearms.

PC 12088.1(a) states that all firearms shall include or be accompanied by an approved FSD. So provide them with a FSD. If the seller includes one with the gun, the gun not only includes an FSD, but is accompanied by one as well!

Well what about 12088.1(e)? It gets better. (e) simply exempts you from (a). So if you do not want a firearm to include or be accompanied by a FSD, you have to follow the (e) rules. I want all of my firearms to include a FSD or be accompanied by a FSD and by doing so I comply with (a). Since I comply with (a), there is no requirement for me to satisfy (e) in order to skip (a).

So simply have the seller include the lock with the gun and write the lock make and model in the DROS comments. Done.

If you want to buy the lock off the seller and have a receipt so you do not have to have the handgun include a FSD, that is your choice, but that is more paperwork than I would want to do and as an FFL that is more paperwork that I don't want to keep on file. I would rather simply write down the make and model of the lock that was included with your firearm, just like I do on all of the firearms that come with a lock from the factory.

faterikcartman
07-28-2010, 10:24 PM
I heard about an FFL that doesn't require a lock for handguns if you sign a safe affidavit.

I don't think that's correct. Is it?

tenpercentfirearms
07-28-2010, 10:34 PM
I heard about an FFL that doesn't require a lock for handguns if you sign a safe affidavit.

I don't think that's correct. Is it?

It is no longer correct by Federal law. They might have issues come next ATF audit.

DaveFJ80
07-28-2010, 11:08 PM
The sad thing is, I've heard of people writing down any model safe they found online and filling that out on the safe affidavit (I've heard of a couple of guys talking about it when buying a gun at the store). Obviously this is illegal, but to them they figure how often will this actually get followed through on.

joedogboy
07-28-2010, 11:44 PM
Falsifying your safe affidavit will come back and bite you in the *** if your firearms are ever stolen, or if a minor gains access to them.

BANG BANG
07-29-2010, 6:21 AM
Which gun store will you be going to?

I usually just buy a gunlock at big5 and then return it right after picking up the gun.

Jackson arms in SSF, that's a good idea too about Big 5. I might do that just in case instead since the seller has the lock and a few parts that he still needs to give me.

tenpercentfirearms
07-29-2010, 6:46 AM
Falsifying your safe affidavit will come back and bite you in the *** if your firearms are ever stolen, or if a minor gains access to them.

Not if you sold your safe for cash in between.