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View Full Version : Potentially burned by a calgunner...what to do?


jerryballs
07-27-2010, 10:03 PM
I am not sure where this transaction is going, but its not good...I sold a firearm here and part of the deal with the buying member was gun plus cash...Guy seemed honest and reliable so I agreed to send guns to each other for DROS and he would send money. He didn't suggest doing the trade this way, I did after many phone conversations...He had solid feedback and I got a little lax over my normal protocol. Anyway, it has been a month and I haven't rec'd payment, for a while I was assured that money was on the way, etc...but no. he calls me and leaves no message and then screens my calls in return. I have been patient and I am sure this guy is busy...At what point to I take this to the "next level"....and is there one? I am really bummed and not sure what to do...I don't want to call him out on the site...I feel comfortable explaining the details so far because I have sold so many firearms here over the last 6 months....This is not intended to blast anyone...just need advice.

BTW its a solid amount of money too...

Thanks

jerry

icentropy
07-27-2010, 10:07 PM
if this guy owes you money he shouldn't be screening your calls. I'd call him out. A month is way too long IMHO.

Black Majik
07-27-2010, 10:08 PM
Has he DROSed your guns yet?

Call the shop back and have them ship your guns back to you.

Then give him negative feedback and call him out.

jerryballs
07-27-2010, 10:11 PM
yes he dros'd the gun and gave me a reason that was suitable at the time for not sending the money...I trusted him because he seemed reasonable...Now its pissing me off. I call him daily and VM only...I am a retard for doing the transaction this way, but I figured it was fairly safe because I had all his info DL etc...

wilit
07-27-2010, 10:15 PM
Small claims court. Usually just the threat of being taken to court gets the payment sent quickly.

stitchnicklas
07-27-2010, 10:15 PM
just kidding,give him a ultimatum or report him for theft of the gun

Spiggy
07-27-2010, 10:15 PM
first, foremost. who wuzzit?

jerryballs
07-27-2010, 10:17 PM
first, foremost. who wuzzit?

not ready to share that yet, but will soon if this doesn't get handled

Thanks for the input guys!

Jerry

lorax3
07-27-2010, 10:17 PM
Forward the PM's to me. I will contact the other user and get it sorted out.

hkusp9c
07-27-2010, 10:18 PM
I hope you at least have the deal and the arrangement in some form of record like exchanged pms. If the mods can't help you out in retrieving the funds, Go to small claims. You have all the info right? One month is more than enough time to make sevral post office or bank visits to send you money. If I was supposed to pay someone back on certain day, I'd pay the person back on THAT DAY even if it was only $5 and my wife's having a baby because I am a man of my word and I dont trust people with endless bs excuses.

bjl333
07-27-2010, 10:20 PM
first, foremost. who wuzzit?

Guys like him gives the rest of us a BAD NAME !!!!

I am sure he is reading this post right now. Small claims court and :ban: !!!!

I hate people that takes advantage of others ... :12:

dg29
07-27-2010, 10:21 PM
Was it the Nighthawk that you had sold?

mosinnagantm9130
07-27-2010, 10:22 PM
I agree, contact the mods.

icentroy, your avatar is great.

"And if you tell anyone that that bush is there....":D

andalusi
07-27-2010, 10:23 PM
yes he dros'd the gun and gave me a reason that was suitable at the time for not sending the money...I trusted him because he seemed reasonable...Now its pissing me off. I call him daily and VM only...I am a retard for doing the transaction this way, but I figured it was fairly safe because I had all his info DL etc...

Then to be frank, you have all the information you need to serve him with a small claims suit. It sucks to have to resort to that, but you could always drop the suit if he pays up, so really it'd be on him if you actually went to court over this.

Ranger20
07-27-2010, 10:24 PM
Hopefully Lorax3 gets it worked out for you...
Bummer... to have to go through this.

If the guy is really trying to put the screws to you... (Thief)
Eventually, his name may need to come out so he doesn't do the same to another CalGunner. But I figure the Mods are on it so that doesn't happen..
Money first... Gun sent 2nd. Unless you are really really sure... then kick yourself and wait for the money.

Way to go Mods! Above and beyond... !

4Defense
07-27-2010, 10:32 PM
Out the guy so it won't happen to anyone ever again.

oddjob
07-27-2010, 10:55 PM
This is not a criminal matter, but a civil matter. Having said that take him/her to small claims court. You can bang him/her for not only the price of the gun, but the following;
Travel expenses (gas, hotel, long distance calls, meals & etc)
Time off work
Service fees (if the marshall does it)
And any expenses associated with this transaction.

I have done the small claims deal & it worked out just fine (a traffic accident). I also had all documents associated with my claim. Tell him/her you will do this (in writing) and when they do the math....they should see its better to pay you ASAP. Run the other party through lexus-nexus or another data base (to find out where they work) and after small claims court is done tell them you will attach their wages (thats what I did).

Years later when the girl who hit me got married. Her new husband and her tried to buy a house. She paid me off, but I didn't sign off in small claims court that she paid. She called me at least 6 times asking that I go to the courts and sign off that she paid. I waited a long time on purpose. She pissed me off and I made her pay in other ways.

The small claims process isn't fast, but it will work. And revenge will be ultimately yours.

norcal77
07-27-2010, 10:58 PM
Out the guy so it won't happen to anyone ever again.

Seriously...I hate when people start these threads then don't follow through. Seems to me the OP is just using this thread as a whipping stick to get his way only...once he does..the person he is dealing with is free to do the same thing to somebody else.

lorax3
07-27-2010, 11:01 PM
Seriously...I hate when people start these threads then don't follow through. Seems to me the OP is just using this thread as a whipping stick to get his way only...once he does..the person he is dealing with is free to do the same thing to somebody else.

The OP is already in contact with us. This is why we have the feedback system. Someone with negative feedback stands out.

If anyone has an issue with buying/selling in the marketplace, please contact a moderator. We are here to help.

slobson
07-27-2010, 11:05 PM
Seriously...I hate when people start these threads then don't follow through. Seems to me the OP is just using this thread as a whipping stick to get his way only...once he does..the person he is dealing with is free to do the same thing to somebody else.

yep. it would take a hell of a lot of splaining on the part of the other part in this type of situation to convince me to not only out him/her on calguns, but on any other forum/location I could track them down on as well

lorax3
07-27-2010, 11:08 PM
yep. it would take a hell of a lot of splaining on the part of the other part in this type of situation to convince me to not only out him/her on calguns, but on any other forum/location I could track them down on as well

Sometimes it is better to try and get your money back first. If you out the person, they know there is no chance of anyone else on CG's selling to them again. So in the words of the Steve Miller Band, they will 'take the money and run'.

We would hope the other party pays the OP before legal action has to be taken.

slobson
07-27-2010, 11:08 PM
The OP is already in contact with us. This is why we have the feedback system. Someone with negative feedback stands out.

If anyone has an issue with buying/selling in the marketplace, please contact a moderator. We are here to help.

please correct me if I'm wrong, but in this situation once the other party pays the OP then there would be no grounds for negative feedback per itrader rules yes?

lorax3
07-27-2010, 11:11 PM
please correct me if I'm wrong, but in this situation once the other party pays the OP then there would be no grounds for negative feedback per itrader rules yes?

It would depend on the length the OP had to go to get his funds returned.

slobson
07-27-2010, 11:12 PM
Sometimes it is better to try and get your money back first. If you out the person, they know there is no chance of anyone else on CG's selling to them again. So in the words of the Steve Miller Band, they will 'take the money and run'.

We would hope the other party pays the OP before legal action has to be taken.

I was unclear in my previous statement; I meant I would out them after I received payment, not as a method of getting payment. I agree that it would be a mistake to try using that as coercion for payment, and I apologize if it seemed like I was suggesting not utilizing the great resource you guys (mods) are

Ed_Hazard
07-27-2010, 11:23 PM
Sucks that it has come this far. It just goes to show that you never know what can happen. Well hopefully you will get your money

bruss01
07-28-2010, 5:43 AM
I have not sold guns, but I have done the following: Paid half up front, had the gun shipped to my FFL where I inspect it, and pay the remainder immediately while the gun is still in 10 day jail. This way the seller knows I am not running around with a new gun at half price, he can call the FFL and put a stop to things right away if he doesn't receive the remaining payment. The "act of good faith" is me sending the half payment up front, that is the limit of my exposure. Hope this all works out for you.

jigenax
07-28-2010, 5:58 AM
I bought several guns here and all were done FTF. Call me old fashioned but I like to meet with folks I'm dealing with plus it prevents things like this from happening to me. On the flip side, I have put alot of miles on my car. ALOT. But I do make the long trips worthwhile by making them into mini road trips. LA can get irritating so for me, escaping now and then is a good thing.

I hope everything works out for you. Good luck.

6172crew
07-28-2010, 8:38 AM
In the NFA world you pay at least 50% before the toy is sent, then after it arrives you pay the other 50%. then you get to wait another few months before you can take it home.

My first machine gun was bought out of state and I had to pay $5500 for the bolt up front. Then it was transferred to my FFL and I was allowed to inspect it 2 months later. When my FFL got my stamp in the mail I was able to pay $900 for the host and a $25 dros and able to walk away with my machine gun 3.5 months after I sent the funds.

You really have to have faith in the system to play this game. Hopefully my fellow mod can get this taken care of.

evidens83
07-28-2010, 9:42 AM
Money first. Then transfer gun. Thats what I wouldve done at least. Good luck!

Mr. Beretta
07-28-2010, 9:45 AM
Good Luck!

I hope everything works out the best!

Ding126
07-28-2010, 9:59 AM
I think you made the 1st mistake by not getting funds in full first. Then item is shipped to or transfered to..

sorry to hear about this..it may be an expensive learning lesson. I hope it works out.

jerryballs
07-28-2010, 10:16 AM
Expensive lesson, yes...Whipping post, no...I am sincerely just trying to get this figured out without creating an bigger issue...If a bigger (legal) issue is not needed. If I was trying to make this a whipping post, I would have out'd him/her from the start.

Thanks for all the help...

Jerry

VictorFranko
07-28-2010, 10:28 AM
"I'll gladly pay you Tuesday for a handgun today." -Wimpy

Sure hope you get your satisfaction Jerry.

Soldier415
07-28-2010, 10:54 AM
Tagged for outcome

Decoligny
07-28-2010, 11:52 AM
Then to be frank, you have all the information you need to serve him with a small claims suit. It sucks to have to resort to that, but you could always drop the suit if he pays up, so really it'd be on him if you actually went to court over this.

If you do file, and he pays up, make sure he pays what he owes PLUS the filing fees for small claims court.

Joe
07-28-2010, 12:07 PM
Tagged

Sillyguy
07-28-2010, 12:24 PM
man that sucks.....i am curious to know what excuse he gave you...

elsolo
07-28-2010, 12:44 PM
. he calls me and leaves no message and then screens my calls in return.

I wouldn't bother calling some sucker that I ripped off.

Saigon1965
07-28-2010, 2:53 PM
OP - I am sorry to hear of this - As our forum grows - We need to be more vigilant -

rg_1111@yahoo.com
07-28-2010, 3:31 PM
That's messed up. Hope you get your money. If not post the Name.

PsychGuy274
07-28-2010, 4:18 PM
Don't call him for two days straight. Then call him from a different phone.

BigJB
07-28-2010, 4:30 PM
As I recall, there was similar thread over in General Discussion, a guy with a good itrader rating was paid and then had no contact with the buyer for a month or so. Turns out guy was in bad car wreck, hospitalized, bad shape.

So what is it we have here? A calgunner jobbing another calgunner, or a another calgunner in the hospital, either way it is bad deal.

plan-b
07-28-2010, 6:57 PM
Don't call him for two days straight. Then call him from a different phone.

If someone wants to avoid you bad enough, they figure out ways. My brother once sold some car stereo equipment to a coworker. The guy eventually found another job but didn't get around to paying back my brother. He screened calls too. When my brother would try calling from different phones, he'd answer and just keep saying things like "hello? who's there? hello? hello?" and pretending it was a bad connection. My brother eventually got in touch w/ someone that knew the flake and found out where he'd moved to. The two of us showed up at his house one day and walked away with the money that he owed.

Rob454
07-28-2010, 8:56 PM
Another reason to simply do business face to face. Unless there is some sort of escrow service you can use. Sorry to hear about what happen. I hope you get your money back. Are you sure your calls are screened? There have been instances where members jumped to conclusions just to find out that the guy was in the hospital etc. Not saying thats the case. 1 month is way too long to settle a financial debt like this.

kmullins
07-28-2010, 10:18 PM
Wait, you have his "details", as in, home address? Sure it could be an old or BS license he gave you (assuming you checked it was current and matched him?), but the fact you know where he lives or at least a place he has some connection to sounds like game over to me...

I would really like to know who this was, for all we know he's pulling this on another CalGuns member right now.

Turbinator
07-28-2010, 11:01 PM
Guys, let's stop the speculation for now, as we are involved and investigating. We'll post an update and closure once we get this sorted out.

Turby

eijjie33
07-28-2010, 11:07 PM
i hope everything gets sorted out.

dan12580
11-28-2010, 12:50 PM
hello all. it was me that the deal was with. its taken me awhile to get around to post a response. i wanted to be able to have the time to post a well thought out response. as a punishment to myself ive made it a point to stay away from the board and i also never fired the nighthawk and have since sold it. iam not a "karma" kind of guy but i dont like knowing that there may be someone out there who wont deal with me again. first and foremost jerryballs is a stand up guy. no real rebuttle to anything he posted and i was 100% in the wrong. i obviously had zero intention of screwing him over as it would have been very stupid/hard to so as we exchanged guns as part of the deal. he had a copy of my drivers license and as you can see by my other feedback ive had good dealings with other calgunners both buying and selling. my first mistake was trying to do a deal before i went on vacation for 2 weeks. 1 week in middle of nowhere in south texas and 1 week on a cruise. i had phone service for about 8 hours during this time and to be honest guns were not one the forefront of my mind. i then had a family member whom iam in business with take it upon himself to spend some money of mine to replace some tools that were stolen. some of that money was to be sent to jerry. all has been cleared up for some time now but i regret that a good guy like jerry has had a less then perfect deal with someone on the calguns bored and i further regret that i am the source/cause of this deal. lastly- my public apologies to jerryballs. you held up your end from day one and iam sorry that i failed to do the same. and to anyone who may deal jerry in the future, do so with no hesitation. thanks.

Calgunz420
11-28-2010, 1:50 PM
Wow...

warbird
11-28-2010, 2:04 PM
I am no fan of DOJ but in this case I would file not only a stolen gun report with your local police department giving all the details because he took the guns under fraudulent conditions/swindled you but I would also file a report with DOJ giving this man's name and address and ask them to recover your firearms for you. Give them a copy of what you give the police. If the police refuse to take the report and some departments have done that, then send them a certified letter with all the details and info on the guns and send a copy of that to DOJ. Then look to small claims court and make sure everyone knows what he did to you. You can't slander him if all you are telling is the truth and the facts back your version of the events.

plan-b
11-28-2010, 3:04 PM
I am no fan of DOJ but in this case I would file not only a stolen gun report with your local police department giving all the details because he took the guns under fraudulent conditions/swindled you but I would also file a report with DOJ giving this man's name and address and ask them to recover your firearms for you. Give them a copy of what you give the police. If the police refuse to take the report and some departments have done that, then send them a certified letter with all the details and info on the guns and send a copy of that to DOJ. Then look to small claims court and make sure everyone knows what he did to you. You can't slander him if all you are telling is the truth and the facts back your version of the events.

Two posts above yours:
all has been cleared up for some time now

Joe
11-28-2010, 3:06 PM
hello all. it was me that the deal was with. its taken me awhile to get around to post a response. i wanted to be able to have the time to post a well thought out response. as a punishment to myself ive made it a point to stay away from the board and i also never fired the nighthawk and have since sold it. iam not a "karma" kind of guy but i dont like knowing that there may be someone out there who wont deal with me again. first and foremost jerryballs is a stand up guy. no real rebuttle to anything he posted and i was 100% in the wrong. i obviously had zero intention of screwing him over as it would have been very stupid/hard to so as we exchanged guns as part of the deal. he had a copy of my drivers license and as you can see by my other feedback ive had good dealings with other calgunners both buying and selling. my first mistake was trying to do a deal before i went on vacation for 2 weeks. 1 week in middle of nowhere in south texas and 1 week on a cruise. i had phone service for about 8 hours during this time and to be honest guns were not one the forefront of my mind. i then had a family member whom iam in business with take it upon himself to spend some money of mine to replace some tools that were stolen. some of that money was to be sent to jerry. all has been cleared up for some time now but i regret that a good guy like jerry has had a less then perfect deal with someone on the calguns bored and i further regret that i am the source/cause of this deal. lastly- my public apologies to jerryballs. you held up your end from day one and iam sorry that i failed to do the same. and to anyone who may deal jerry in the future, do so with no hesitation. thanks.

Good to see you responding and taking ownership of the problems. And glad to hear it finally all got fixed.

sevensix2x51
11-28-2010, 3:13 PM
hello all. it was me that the deal was with. its taken me awhile to get around to post a response. i wanted to be able to have the time to post a well thought out response. as a punishment to myself ive made it a point to stay away from the board and i also never fired the nighthawk and have since sold it. iam not a "karma" kind of guy but i dont like knowing that there may be someone out there who wont deal with me again. first and foremost jerryballs is a stand up guy. no real rebuttle to anything he posted and i was 100% in the wrong. i obviously had zero intention of screwing him over as it would have been very stupid/hard to so as we exchanged guns as part of the deal. he had a copy of my drivers license and as you can see by my other feedback ive had good dealings with other calgunners both buying and selling. my first mistake was trying to do a deal before i went on vacation for 2 weeks. 1 week in middle of nowhere in south texas and 1 week on a cruise. i had phone service for about 8 hours during this time and to be honest guns were not one the forefront of my mind. i then had a family member whom iam in business with take it upon himself to spend some money of mine to replace some tools that were stolen. some of that money was to be sent to jerry. all has been cleared up for some time now but i regret that a good guy like jerry has had a less then perfect deal with someone on the calguns bored and i further regret that i am the source/cause of this deal. lastly- my public apologies to jerryballs. you held up your end from day one and iam sorry that i failed to do the same. and to anyone who may deal jerry in the future, do so with no hesitation. thanks.

thanks for being honest. sometimes life deals a turd sandwich, and youre forced to take a bite.

YZINGERR
11-28-2010, 3:16 PM
great thread.. I was reading it like a Judge Judy episode.
J/k, im glad it is all cleared up

AlliedArmory
11-28-2010, 10:04 PM
Good to see it was all cleared up.

It was good that dan12508 manned up and gave a explanation. &*!$ happens to all of us and he took responsibility.

PsychGuy274
11-28-2010, 11:36 PM
Good to see it was all cleared up.

It was good that dan12508 manned up and gave a explanation. &*!$ happens to all of us and he took responsibility.

+1 to "Dan the Man;" or "a Dan Fool." Anyone else see that commercial? :p

Recession
11-28-2010, 11:47 PM
Eh... glad you manned up and gave an explanation, but the explanation in itself doesn't sound too reassuring.

tenpercentfirearms
11-29-2010, 5:19 AM
I am no fan of DOJ but in this case I would file not only a stolen gun report with your local police department giving all the details because he took the guns under fraudulent conditions/swindled you but I would also file a report with DOJ giving this man's name and address and ask them to recover your firearms for you. Give them a copy of what you give the police. If the police refuse to take the report and some departments have done that, then send them a certified letter with all the details and info on the guns and send a copy of that to DOJ. Then look to small claims court and make sure everyone knows what he did to you. You can't slander him if all you are telling is the truth and the facts back your version of the events.

Yeah because the DOJ goes out and recovers firearms. :rolleyes:

Ron-Solo
11-29-2010, 12:27 PM
just kidding,give him a ultimatum or report him for theft of the gun

'm glad this was cleared up and it takes backbone to come on and own up to ones mistakes.

For those of you who suggested filing a theft report with the local police or DOJ, the gun was not stolen and it is a civil matter that would need to be handled in small claims court.

trautert
11-29-2010, 3:39 PM
It occurs to me that the only exercise some people get is jumping to conclusions. :)

Recession
11-29-2010, 3:52 PM
It occurs to me that the only exercise some people get is jumping to conclusions. :)

How many calories does that burn?

Zdiddy
11-29-2010, 4:12 PM
It occurs to me that the only exercise some people get is jumping to conclusions. :)

That gives me an idea for a board game.

TurboChrisB
11-29-2010, 4:18 PM
While I appreciate Dan stepping up and "going public" on this.... I do feel strongly that he has EARNED a negative on his iTrader....why it's not there...I don't know. But it needs to be there.

IsaacGlass
11-29-2010, 10:34 PM
Wow, what a story and outcome. Dan the stand up man! ;)

OP gets the last word on negative itrader remark.

jerryballs
12-01-2010, 1:50 PM
Thanks everyone for following up...Yes Dan took care of things and I have moved on. I have decided not to leave anything on iTrader for now because life happens and I got my money. I feel no comment is better than a negative...

ZX-10R
12-01-2010, 2:19 PM
yes he dros'd the gun and gave me a reason that was suitable at the time for not sending the money...I trusted him because he seemed reasonable...Now its pissing me off. I call him daily and VM only...I am a retard for doing the transaction this way, but I figured it was fairly safe because I had all his info DL etc...

Mistake NUMBER 1...Trust no one except immediate family - yes even friends can burn you since MONEY can CORRUPT.This my friend is a lesson learned.

Sorry to hear this problem. Unless someone has the cash to buy just look away. Just because we are all "Calgunners" does not mean we have a secret strong pact of honesty...Assume everyone here can and will cheat you. FTF is the best form for transactions except if it is low cost. Since this is sizable, you set yourself up on this for sure.

Put his name out here and if you have an address go meet him. Don't waste your time writing waste your time getting you f'n money.

GixxRacer
12-01-2010, 3:48 PM
i was burned by Ballistic043, he was sent 620 bucks for a USP 40Cal Full size, promised to send it and never did. i feel your pain

bjl333
12-01-2010, 3:52 PM
Thanks everyone for following up...Yes Dan took care of things and I have moved on. I have decided not to leave anything on iTrader for now because life happens and I got my money. I feel no comment is better than a negative...

I'm glad you got your money. I am still out $400 from a friend that bought stuff from me before. I had extended credit to him before twice and one of them was over $2000. Well its been 9 months and I haven't heard from him since June. Live and learn !!! :cuss:

Cbr1000Rider
12-01-2010, 3:57 PM
Regardless of if he paid or not... he still tread on you by this length of time. Negative feedback is needed either way in my opinion.. even if he leaves an apology on this thread. It is still good for future members who don't glance in this thread. Heck, 1 negative feedback with an excuse is better than 0 feedback... shyt happens.. people will either understand or move on.

pennys dad
12-01-2010, 4:53 PM
Wow, what a story and outcome.

Saigon1965
12-01-2010, 5:40 PM
Did you read the thread - The guy posted an apology a page or so back -

Put his name out here and if you have an address go meet him. Don't waste your time writing waste your time getting you f'n money.

sleepur606
12-01-2010, 6:48 PM
I am no fan of DOJ but in this case I would file not only a stolen gun report with your local police department giving all the details because he took the guns under fraudulent conditions/swindled you but I would also file a report with DOJ giving this man's name and address and ask them to recover your firearms for you. Give them a copy of what you give the police. If the police refuse to take the report and some departments have done that, then send them a certified letter with all the details and info on the guns and send a copy of that to DOJ. Then look to small claims court and make sure everyone knows what he did to you. You can't slander him if all you are telling is the truth and the facts back your version of the events.

Great job on that whole "reading the thread" thing...Look up a post or so above yours for the details.

It sucks that this happened, but sometimes, sh*t happens. The best part of this is the person in the wrong manned up and made things right. It wasn't a perfect situation, but he made it right. Everyone has fixed their side of things and moved on.