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winnre
07-26-2010, 2:29 PM
I will be driving with rifles and pistols, in their cases, locked and unloaded. Ammo will be in my back seat. Guns in the very back... of my SUV. There is no trunk, but I can bury the guns under luggage. I am the only person in the vehicle.

Will Kalifornia be happy with this? What else can I do?

safewaysecurity
07-26-2010, 2:30 PM
Keep em out of reach. No need to lock rifles up just pistolas

paul0660
07-26-2010, 2:39 PM
According to the Federal School Zone law, long guns have to be locked as well. Definitely keep everything out of sight, and the subject will probably never come up.

CalNRA
07-26-2010, 2:42 PM
with the pistols locked and unloaded they can sit on the passenger seat if you felt like it. Transporting laws prohibit putting the guns in glove compartment and center consoles as locking containers but no requirement on them being in the back.

winnre
07-26-2010, 2:43 PM
I have a locking drawer under the front passenger seat, can I use that?

Flopper
07-26-2010, 3:00 PM
I will be driving with rifles and pistols, in their cases, locked and unloaded.

That's all you need to do. . .

/Thread.

safewaysecurity
07-26-2010, 3:13 PM
Don't think rifles need to ne locked just handguns

Krusher
07-26-2010, 3:16 PM
Here is a suggestion for you.
rolling air plane travel golf bag.
I have one a hard plastic almost like a rifle case type plastic.
It has 3 lock holes and when you get somewhere, you can wheel it right behind you and No one is the wiser that there is more than golf clubs in your rolling case.

I love it because I have a truck too and no cover etc. but my guns when i go shooting never leave my side. and all ammo is in ammo cans and covered in the bed. a win win for all, and keeps the ammo and weapons under lock and key
I will be driving with rifles and pistols, in their cases, locked and unloaded. Ammo will be in my back seat. Guns in the very back... of my SUV. There is no trunk, but I can bury the guns under luggage. I am the only person in the vehicle.

Will Kalifornia be happy with this? What else can I do?

stormy_clothing
07-26-2010, 3:24 PM
I wonder what the law is for driving while shooting at targets ?

toopercentmlk
07-26-2010, 4:38 PM
Every sheriff in my area I've chatted with about this always gives me his or her "rule of thumb," which all differ slightly from each other but are based on actual law that they haven't cared to brush up on. One thing that impressed me is their knowledge on OLLs and open unloaded passenger seat carry.

shooting4life
07-26-2010, 4:48 PM
Or you can have your pistols not locked and unloaded as long as they are not concealed. Just throw them up on the dash board.

shooting4life
07-26-2010, 4:48 PM
Forgot, stay out of school zones hole doing that

winnre
07-26-2010, 4:52 PM
I drive by a school on the way to the freeway....

Colt
07-26-2010, 7:17 PM
I wonder what the law is for driving while shooting at targets ?

Long guns or handguns?

Cokebottle
07-26-2010, 7:42 PM
Keep em out of reach. No need to lock rifles up just pistolas
They don't even need to be out of reach.
The gun can be in a locked case sitting right in your lap and you can have the ammo poking out of your ears and nose.

Outside of a GFSZ, the gun can be openly carried, either in a belt holster, or lying on the seat next to you, as long as it is in plain view.

Decoligny
07-27-2010, 8:25 AM
I have a locking drawer under the front passenger seat, can I use that?

The law specifically states
(1) The firearm is within a motor vehicle and it is locked in the vehicle's trunk or in a locked container in the vehicle other than the utility or glove compartment.

I am pretty sure that they would consider a locking drawer under the seat "a utility compartment".

As long as the firearms are unloaded, and locked in cases, you will be fine. The ammunition can even be locked in the same case as the firearm as long as it is not in the firearm.

No need for them to be out of reach. You could legally drive around with the locked cases sitting in your lap.

Cokebottle
07-27-2010, 7:15 PM
I am pretty sure that they would consider a locking drawer under the seat "a utility compartment".
Ya, there's been a fair amount of debate on that.
The most liberal acceptance seems to be that as long as it's not a factory compartment, it's good to go.... while the most conservative acceptance is that even an aftermarket lock box, the moment it is bolted into the vehicle, is considered a "utility compartment".

After all... what is the difference between the center console in my Blazer, and a replacement center console that I build out of 1/8" steel with a key lock and bolt to the floor.

It's a really tough call, and I don't know that there is any case law pointing one way or the other. Honestly, I have a feeling that most arrests involve loaded guns, or concealed guns not secured in any locked container.... but please don't bank YOUR freedom on MY feeling ;)

DPC
07-27-2010, 9:19 PM
As long as loaded magazine is not in pistol can you have loaded magazines in lock box as long as the magazine in pistol is empty?

Ron-Solo
07-27-2010, 9:27 PM
Protect them from your car being burglarized during stops on the road too.

Locked and unloaded is always the safest way to travel to avoid any misunderstandings.

MasterYong
07-27-2010, 9:35 PM
As long as loaded magazine is not in pistol can you have loaded magazines in lock box as long as the magazine in pistol is empty?

Yes.

6114DAVE
07-27-2010, 10:09 PM
I was at Camp Pendleton Pistol Range and i think heard some FUD being spread...So the RSO was telling this retired service member that the pistol lock had to be installed and the pistol in a locked container(double locked) it didnt sound right....I transport like this...Locked pistol container...Condition 4 weapon ...MAGS in pistol box(none in mag well) and in the trunk. Am I right>? Double locked doesnt sound right...

KylaGWolf
07-27-2010, 10:18 PM
6114 not sure what the requirements on base are. I do know that unloaded and locked container is all you need to keep you out of trouble in school zone. Nothing about double locked that i know of.

6114DAVE
07-27-2010, 10:21 PM
6114 not sure what the requirements on base are. I do know that unloaded and locked container is all you need to keep you out of trouble in school zone. Nothing about double locked that i know of.

when i go to the on-base range i completely unload ALL mags....Out in town i keep loaded mags in box...Getting in trouble on base for my guns = me going from Corporal to PFC...scary stuff

556MikeMike
07-27-2010, 10:44 PM
If you want to be extra safe. Pepper your rifle case with Yamaha keyboard bumper stickers and a bunch of christian rock stuff. The keyboard sticker will make everyone think there's a keyboard inside. If someone asks whats inside ask them if they have been saved by their lord and savior JC. This will deter 80% of people.

cmth
07-27-2010, 11:41 PM
Locked and unloaded is always the safest way to travel to avoid any misunderstandings.

Safest in reference to what? I feel pretty safe travelling with a loaded gun at arm's reach. The business end of a Glock will not be misunderstood by any ne'er-do-wells. But if you mean safest from the various agents de l'état, you are probably correct. Contrary to popular belief, you are not actually free to go about your peaceful business.

kel-tec-innovations
07-28-2010, 12:11 AM
I wonder what the law is for driving while shooting at targets ?

Technically according to couple LEO friends says shooting out of a vehicle or shooting on the vehicle like using it as a gun rest or shooting on top is illegal. Just do it in the desert

CalNRA
07-28-2010, 12:22 AM
Protect them from your car being burglarized during stops on the road too.


the safest way to transport a gun is to keep it loaded on your person so you can use it if your face threats to your life/limb.

But the sheriffs don't agree with that.

iareConfusE
07-28-2010, 12:23 AM
I've always brought my rifles with me in a soft case with a cable lock through them while they sit in the trunk of my sedan. Is the cable lock even necessary if the rifles are sitting in my trunk? I was always under the impression that any firearms you traveled with (regardless of pistol or rifle) had to either be directly locked with a cable or trigger lock, or kept in a locked container (apart from the trunk).

Ron-Solo
07-28-2010, 3:10 AM
Safest in reference to what? I feel pretty safe travelling with a loaded gun at arm's reach. The business end of a Glock will not be misunderstood by any ne'er-do-wells. But if you mean safest from the various agents de l'état, you are probably correct. Contrary to popular belief, you are not actually free to go about your peaceful business.

Safest to avoid any legal concerns, which is what the OP was asking about.

Ron-Solo
07-28-2010, 3:22 AM
Technically according to couple LEO friends says shooting out of a vehicle or shooting on the vehicle like using it as a gun rest or shooting on top is illegal. Just do it in the desert

Here is the penal code that covers that:

A driver or owner of a motor vehicle who allows any person to discharge a firearm from the vehicle may be punished by up to three years imprisonment in state prison and any person who willfully and maliciously discharges a firearm from a motor vehicle at a person who is not an occupant of a motor vehicle is guilty of a felony punishable by up to seven years in state prison. (Penal Code § 12034.

It gets you in the express lane for state prison. I get pissed every time I see a road sign that was shot up by some moron while driving down the road. It gives all shooters a black eye.

motorhead
07-28-2010, 9:27 AM
i like to fill my pockets with ammo, helps get me into the shooting mood.

Cokebottle
07-28-2010, 6:36 PM
I was at Camp Pendleton Pistol Range and i think heard some FUD being spread...So the RSO was telling this retired service member that the pistol lock had to be installed and the pistol in a locked container(double locked) it didnt sound right....I transport like this...Locked pistol container...Condition 4 weapon ...MAGS in pistol box(none in mag well) and in the trunk. Am I right>? Double locked doesnt sound right...
Heard the same thing from a Chino Hills Turner's employee....
Pistol lock, locked container, locked in the trunk, with the ammo in it's own locked container, locked in the glove box.

Also heard from a Chino Hills Turner's employee that the trigger lock is all that's needed :eek:

Cokebottle
07-28-2010, 6:41 PM
I've always brought my rifles with me in a soft case with a cable lock through them while they sit in the trunk of my sedan. Is the cable lock even necessary if the rifles are sitting in my trunk? I was always under the impression that any firearms you traveled with (regardless of pistol or rifle) had to either be directly locked with a cable or trigger lock, or kept in a locked container (apart from the trunk).
Lacking a "secure, locked container", the trigger/cable lock is 100% meaningless.
It's SOLE purpose is so no gun owner can claim that "they didn't have a way to secure their weapon" when a child finds it in the home and hurts a friend.

The trunk is a "Secure, locked container", provided that the rear seats either do not fold down, or that the release for the seats is in the trunk (I just saw that on a Corolla last week... they always used to release from inside the car).
If you need either a key or a combination to access the gun, it is legal.

low94noma
07-28-2010, 8:46 PM
If you need either a key or a combination to access the gun, it is legal.
There is a lot of mis information regarding carrying a firearms in your vehicle. From the facts of have gathered regarding the applicable penal codes regarding this subject, I have no issue carrying my unloaded handgun locked in a soft pouch with a combination lock thrown into the center console. The combo is already pre set. I can throw the mags in the center console as well but I feel more comfortable having it the side of my door or cupholder. Keep in mind, I am swimming in the gray area of these laws which are not clearly defined. Draw your own conclusions but err on the side of caution and go with the choice closest with the law.

iareConfusE
07-28-2010, 9:10 PM
Lacking a "secure, locked container", the trigger/cable lock is 100% meaningless.
It's SOLE purpose is so no gun owner can claim that "they didn't have a way to secure their weapon" when a child finds it in the home and hurts a friend.

The trunk is a "Secure, locked container", provided that the rear seats either do not fold down, or that the release for the seats is in the trunk (I just saw that on a Corolla last week... they always used to release from inside the car).
If you need either a key or a combination to access the gun, it is legal.

I've got buttons on the inside, right on top of the rear seats that I can use to drop them. It means I have to use a lock when transporting them then? Lame! >:|

Cokebottle
07-28-2010, 9:25 PM
I've got buttons on the inside, right on top of the rear seats that I can use to drop them. It means I have to use a lock locking container when transporting them then? Lame! >:|
Fixed it for you.

As I said... the trigger lock/cable lock is 100% worthless for meeting any legalities beyond what is legally required to walk out of the gun store after buying the gun.

The gun must be transported inside of a secure, locked container.


Just go to Staples and pick up a $15 briefcase, set the combo lock to 0-0-0, and lock it at 0-0-1.

tombinghamthegreat
07-28-2010, 10:05 PM
http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/FAQ#How_do_I_legally_transport_a_handgun.3F
question answered

iareConfusE
07-28-2010, 10:33 PM
Fixed it for you.

As I said... the trigger lock/cable lock is 100% worthless for meeting any legalities beyond what is legally required to walk out of the gun store after buying the gun.

The gun must be transported inside of a secure, locked container.


Just go to Staples and pick up a $15 briefcase, set the combo lock to 0-0-0, and lock it at 0-0-1.

I thought it was different for long guns? I don't even own a handgun, and if this rule applies to only handguns then it won't apply to me.

Librarian
07-28-2010, 11:03 PM
I thought it was different for long guns? I don't even own a handgun, and if this rule applies to only handguns then it won't apply to me.

Handguns and registered 'assault weapons' generally, but Federal Gun Free School Zone law requires locking up long guns in either a container or a gun rack.

iareConfusE
07-29-2010, 12:36 AM
Meh, might as well play it on the safe side and just cable lock it all up anyways. I usually drive past a school zone anyways. I just doing like having to unlock em when i get to the range, and lock em all back up when I leave. A lot more convenient to just pack up and go, ya know?

cmth
07-29-2010, 7:50 AM
just cable lock it all up anyways. I usually drive past a school zone anyways

You do know that cable locks are absolutely useless for securing firearms in a school zone, right? All firearms must be unloaded and padlocked in a fully enclosed, secure container. If you're caught in a school zone with nothing more than a cable lock through your guns, you will at the very least lose your gun rights for 10 years, if not forever, depending on how they charge the crime. You could be committing a felony.

You can get around this by transporting your guns in the locked trunk of your car. However your trunk might not even count as a secure container if you can access it from within by folding down the rear seats, as can be done in nearly every car made in the last 15 years.

This is what happens when the people delegate their security and responsibilities to an arbitrary and coercive organization such as the state. They will pass laws and regulations like this under the guise of protecting you from criminals, only to find out later that you are the very criminal they had in mind when they wrote the law. Some will attribute this to the law of unintended consequences, but we all know better than that, don't we?

iareConfusE
07-29-2010, 9:02 AM
Great! So I've gotta pin my rear folding seat buttons so that they won't fold down!

Glock22Fan
07-29-2010, 9:21 AM
Great! So I've gotta pin my rear folding seat buttons so that they won't fold down!

Put it in a locked case on the (floor of the?) seat next to you. Faster to get at anyway, especially if you use a combo lock so you don't have to find the key. And more use if you find yourself stranded and don't want to get out of the car unarmed.

dieselpower
07-29-2010, 9:48 AM
I have a locking drawer under the front passenger seat, can I use that?

if this hasnt been said...

NO. that locking drawer is a utility compartment, unless the firearm is also in a locked container inside that drawer. The glove box and utility compartments do not meet the standard as a locked container even if they lock.

paul0660
07-29-2010, 10:24 AM
Great! So I've gotta pin my rear folding seat buttons so that they won't fold down!

Just get a locking container because you need one to walk the pistol from the car to where you are going anyway, unless you are parked on private property unaccessable to the public.

hawk81
07-29-2010, 11:24 AM
Out of sight, out of mind.


I will be driving with rifles and pistols, in their cases, locked and unloaded. Ammo will be in my back seat. Guns in the very back... of my SUV. There is no trunk, but I can bury the guns under luggage. I am the only person in the vehicle.

Will Kalifornia be happy with this? What else can I do?

bogeyshooter
07-29-2010, 1:32 PM
I'm curious,

12026.1. (a)
(1) "The firearm is within a motor vehicle and it is locked in the vehicle's trunk or in a locked container in the vehicle other than the utility or glove compartment."

Where does the idea that you can't have a pass-through or fold down back seats into the trunk come from? Have there been legal decisions clarifing/interpreting the code (as written above) or is this urban legend?

paul0660
07-29-2010, 1:39 PM
Don't know if there is case law on that, but if one way in is locked, and the other isn't, is it locked? Like I said before, you are going to need a case anyway, without a CCW.

iareConfusE
07-29-2010, 1:40 PM
Just get a locking container because you need one to walk the pistol from the car to where you are going anyway, unless you are parked on private property unaccessable to the public.

I've said twice that I don't own pistols. I'm only talking about long guns right now. :|

paul0660
07-29-2010, 1:45 PM
Ah excuse me for not paying sufficient attention to your individual situation. Clear now?

iareConfusE
07-29-2010, 5:38 PM
Ah excuse me for not paying sufficient attention to your individual situation. Clear now?

Damn, didn't mean to be rude, I thought you were speaking to me, and I was just trying to say that I was talking about something else...

Anothercoilgun
07-29-2010, 9:05 PM
with the pistols locked and unloaded they can sit on the passenger seat if you felt like it. Transporting laws prohibit putting the guns in glove compartment and center consoles as locking containers but no requirement on them being in the back.

Thanks you. No need for me to reply you handled the situation.

harbinger007
07-29-2010, 9:26 PM
I've got a V-Line Top Draw Pistol Safe. It seems obvious that it qualifies as a locked container but I'm unclear why the description at Cabela's (not where I bought it) specifically says "California Approved". Does California have specific requirements that constitutes a locked container?? http://www.cabelas.com/link-12/product/0027552223551a.shtml?cmCat=perf&rid=0987654321&cm_mmc=Performics-_-CSE-_-GoogleBaseUSA-_-0027552223551a&mr:trackingCode=51BAB7CC-958E-DF11-A0C8-002219318F67&mr:referralID=NA

This container is much easier to use than something with a dial, fyi.

iareConfusE
07-29-2010, 9:37 PM
Lacking a "secure, locked container", the trigger/cable lock is 100% meaningless.
It's SOLE purpose is so no gun owner can claim that "they didn't have a way to secure their weapon" when a child finds it in the home and hurts a friend.

The trunk is a "Secure, locked container", provided that the rear seats either do not fold down, or that the release for the seats is in the trunk (I just saw that on a Corolla last week... they always used to release from inside the car).
If you need either a key or a combination to access the gun, it is legal.

http://www.ag.ca.gov/firearms/travel.php

Website tells me I don't even need to lock my long guns, just transport them unloaded. Were you referring to handguns?

Librarian
07-29-2010, 9:48 PM
http://www.ag.ca.gov/firearms/travel.php

Website tells me I don't even need to lock my long guns, just transport them unloaded. Were you referring to handguns?

That's true for California. Federal GFSZ says different about long guns. Since school zones are plentiful AND unmarked at the 1000 foot distance, that's an issue.

Try a longer discussion at the wiki - Transport (http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/Transporting) and GFSZ (http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/Gun_Free_School_Zones).

Cokebottle
07-29-2010, 9:55 PM
I've got a V-Line Top Draw Pistol Safe. It seems obvious that it qualifies as a locked container but I'm unclear why the description at Cabela's (not where I bought it) specifically says "California Approved". Does California have specific requirements that constitutes a locked container?? http://www.cabelas.com/link-12/product/0027552223551a.shtml?cmCat=perf&rid=0987654321&cm_mmc=Performics-_-CSE-_-GoogleBaseUSA-_-0027552223551a&mr:trackingCode=51BAB7CC-958E-DF11-A0C8-002219318F67&mr:referralID=NA

This container is much easier to use than something with a dial, fyi.
"DOJ Approved" simply means that it qualifies as a child-safe locking device.

That lock box will satisfy the requirement and you would not be forced to purchase a trigger lock with your new gun... however, the lock box is treated similarly to the trigger lock in that it doesn't qualify for the "safe affidavit"... it must have been purchased within 30 days of taking delivery of the gun.

taperxz
07-29-2010, 10:01 PM
http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/FAQ#How_do_I_legally_transport_a_handgun.3F
question answered

reposting for those that missed it! this says it all without question

harbinger007
07-29-2010, 10:03 PM
"DOJ Approved" simply means that it qualifies as a child-safe locking device.

That lock box will satisfy the requirement and you would not be forced to purchase a trigger lock with your new gun... however, the lock box is treated similarly to the trigger lock in that it doesn't qualify for the "safe affidavit"... it must have been purchased within 30 days of taking delivery of the gun.

Okay, thanks for the clarification on the "DOJ Approved", but I was also wanting to also make sure that it satisfies the requirements for a locked container when transporting a handgun in a vehicle. From the wiki:

(d) As used in this section, "locked container" means a secure
container which is fully enclosed and locked by a padlock, keylock,
combination lock, or similar locking device. The term "locked
container" does not include the utility or glove compartment of a
motor vehicle.

I don't know that pushing buttons in a sequence constitutes a combination lock but I would think it's a "similar locking device", right?

Cokebottle
07-29-2010, 10:13 PM
I don't know that pushing buttons in a sequence constitutes a combination lock but I would think it's a "similar locking device", right?
Absolutely GTG ;)