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krby
04-18-2006, 2:28 PM
I'm asking for a friend. Seriously, this isn't my question. It really is for a friend.

He purchased a handgun from someone else in the mid 90's, they did not use an FFL. The previous owner purchased the gun legally. The previous owner isn't in California anymore and generally not available (I think both buyer/seller have to appear in purson at an FFL to do a private-party transfer, right?).

So, my buddy asked me to look into how to make the sale legal. I found this page:
http://calgunlaws.com/modules.php?name=FAQ&myfaq=yes&id_cat=47&categories=Transferring+Firearms

Which mentions a voluntary registration forum and reply from DOJ stating they won't prosecute people which attempt to correct the violation by registering.

So, assuming my buddy is eligable to own a firearm, can he just fill out that form and send it in? Does he need to take an HSC test?

I hope this works out for him, I'll get yet another new shooter in my group of friends.

maxicon
04-18-2006, 3:02 PM
I asked them the same question on the phone once for a friend, and got the same answer - just send the form in and register it, no problem, no questions about HSC.

The friend has since moved out of state, so he never did it, but that's what they said on the phone.

Phone advice isn't very trustworthy, of course, but there seems to be a pattern here.

max

harley66
04-18-2006, 5:52 PM
I do not remember the cut off date when a PPT was suposed to have been done by a FFL in CA --- If the First owner was before that cut off date - then how would DOJ know when your friend got the gun??? was it before the cut off date or after - if there is no paper trail after the cut off date then it is a dead issue... now if you WANT to regisiter it, thats another issue

krby
04-18-2006, 6:51 PM
IIRC, the cut-off was around '91-'92. He (my friend) says the gun was bought new from an FFL after that and he recieved it sometime later.

colossians323
04-19-2006, 6:21 AM
Also, from a friend who is an ffl, he said that your girlfriend or wife can go down with you, and do a ppt with her, and this will get the gun registered, no problem and make everythijg legal.

krby
04-19-2006, 7:57 AM
Also, from a friend who is an ffl, he said that your girlfriend or wife can go down with you, and do a ppt with her, and this will get the gun registered, no problem and make everythijg legal.

I don't see how this would work.
- Let's say Bob is married to Alice.
- Charlie buys a handgun new in the box from an FFL in 1996.
- Bob buys this handgun from Charlie in 2000.
- Bob goes to an FFL with Alice and does a PPT [from or to?] Alice.

When Bob writes down the serial number of the gun, won't the DOJ realize that it was previously purchased by Charlie after the DROS requirement, so Bob must be in possession illegally? I mean, Bob could have easily stolen the gun from Charlie instead of buying it, how would the DOJ know? Maybe I've been watching too much TV, does the Govt not run a serial number of a gun for a PPT? Do they just do the eligibility check on the buyer (and maybe the seller in case the buyer can't possess).

Or, is doing the PPT looked at the same as the voluntary registration? Sort of a "you're trying to make it right now, so we excuse the past". It's nice to know both options exist, but the vountary registration form seems to be the easier path, it's $19, it's all done by mail, there's no 10-day waiting period, you never have surrender the gun, unless your background check comes back "ineligible".

artherd
04-19-2006, 10:59 AM
Volentary reg appears to be the ticket. I would retain an attorney (the one who initiated that DOJ letter would not be a bad one!) to make sure I did not self-incriminate.

krby
05-01-2006, 8:29 AM
He's going with the voluntary registration. I'll post an update when I hear about the results.

RRangel
05-01-2006, 10:49 AM
I'm pretty sure all handgun transfers after January 1, 1991 had to go through a DROS and background check at your local federal firearms license dealer.

I know your friend is not alone as the gun laws change every year in this state. That's a major problem in California for people who aren't really keeping abreast of the gun issues.

bwiese
05-01-2006, 11:10 AM
Yes, essentially all CA firearms transfers since Jan 1 1991 had to be papered.

However, if you illegally did an unpapered transfer and then filed a Voluntary Registration form you would be OK.

I do recall there is a letter on calgunlaws.com from DOJ's former Asst Dir (and former Deputy AG) Tim Rieger, writing to Chuck Michel, that this filing would not be self-incriminating.

I'll update this with a link to such letter if & when I find it.

jonb
05-01-2006, 5:04 PM
Yes, essentially all CA firearms transfers since Jan 1 1991 had to be papered.

However, if you illegally did an unpapered transfer and then filed a Voluntary Registration form you would be OK.

I do recall there is a letter on calgunlaws.com from DOJ's former Asst Dir (and former Deputy AG) Tim Rieger, writing to Chuck Michel, that this filing would not be self-incriminating.

I'll update this with a link to such letter if & when I find it.

Very good to hear this, I will take advantage of it.
Thanks,
jonb

LOW2000
05-01-2006, 9:51 PM
Too bad the same doesn't apply to assault weapons as well, if it did, i know a friend who would register his...

NeoWeird
05-01-2006, 11:31 PM
*snip*

uhhh....you might want to watch what you say. It's not like this website is unmonitored (it's probably more monitored than most sites out there) and the last you would want to do is incriminate your "friend" or get pulled in on a subpoena if anything happens.

LOW2000
05-01-2006, 11:36 PM
Funny thing is he is now a .gov contractor and is out of state. I'm not 100% sure as I hardly ever hear from him, but if I were to take a wild *** guess i'd say all his toys are still at his moms house.

For all I know, he took his stuff with him, but I doubt it...

csarel
05-02-2006, 6:13 PM
Yes, essentially all CA firearms transfers since Jan 1 1991 had to be papered.

However, if you illegally did an unpapered transfer and then filed a Voluntary Registration form you would be OK.

I do recall there is a letter on calgunlaws.com from DOJ's former Asst Dir (and former Deputy AG) Tim Rieger, writing to Chuck Michel, that this filing would not be self-incriminating.

I'll update this with a link to such letter if & when I find it.

Bump.. any luck on the letter? I have a similar issue.:o

krby
05-02-2006, 7:17 PM
Follow the link in my original post.

It has a link to a letter indicating the DOJ won't prosecute someone who has failed to DROS and comes forward of their own accord by voluntarily regisitering.

csarel
05-02-2006, 9:25 PM
Thanks, kbyrd!:)