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MadMax
07-16-2010, 7:45 AM
In the market for a 10mm "1911" style handgun and I could use a bit of info on what brand.

I was wanting a kimber but also saw tanfoglio, dan wesson, colt, S&W and even a les baer.

I am leaning tword the kimber but if there is a better option like less expensive for same thing or magazines are better/more available ect I would appruciate the advice.

HighLander51
07-16-2010, 8:04 AM
The recoil event of a 10mm is brutal in the 1911 platform, I have a Glock 20 and that is manageable.

uxo2
07-16-2010, 8:09 AM
I would go with a Glock if your going to be doing alot
of shooting.

But if you just shoot a couple hundered a year...The a S&W double action.

dfletcher
07-16-2010, 8:37 AM
Most of what you listed can't be brought in via the usual FFL - maybe the Kimber and Les Baer are CA OK? I'd like to have a 10mm semi but won't buy a poly framed gun, just my like/dislike nothing wrong with them. I have a 6.5" Smith 610 (earlier model with a full lugged barrel) and recoil is modest as a result. I have a Bond Derringer with a 10 mm barrel - not all that bad, but definitely not an all day shooter.

I have 2 DW 1911s and if their 10 is made at all like their others I'd not hesitate to buy one. I have a Tanfoglio 90 (41 AE & 9mm barrels) and have to say it's a well made gun, kind of surprised me actually. I paid $200.00 for the darn thing at Bullseye - they just wanted to get rid of the darn thing, had only the 41AE barrel at the time. The EAA Witness line is the latest version with a slightly larger frame. No doubt it can handle the 10mm and dollar for dollar a great buy, but I don't think it's in the same category as the Kimber. Still, if I could get one that might be my choice because you can do all sorts of barrel swaps and I suspect, like the 610 revolver, could plink away with 40 S & W with just a barrel and spring change. EAA parts aren't all that expensive either, not as though you'd spend $300.00 for a barrel - my 9mm barrel cost $70.00.

THT
07-16-2010, 8:39 AM
My long-slide 10mm Glock is my favorite handgun to shoot. Recoil is very tame even with full power Double Tap loads. I highly suggest going this route if you can.

Miltiades
07-16-2010, 8:48 AM
I would recommend a Colt Delta Elite 10mm if you can find one. I've had the Gold Cup version below for about 12 years and have been quite happy with it. I use Georgia Arms target ammo in the gun and the recoil is similar to a .45 caliber Gold Cup, only it cycles a little faster. I've found the gun to be quite accurate and reliable.

http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o25/pogo2/ColtDeltaGoldCup102.jpg

sammy
07-16-2010, 1:30 PM
If you want to try my 10mm's I have a G20 and a Smith 1006. I am heading out to USI Sunday morning and we can meet up. I love them both and they have much less recoil than a Kimber I tried a while back. The 1911 is not built for the 10mm and will get beat up pretty quick. It is a cool concept but not the right platform. Sammy

guns_and_labs
07-16-2010, 1:46 PM
In the market for a 10mm "1911" style handgun and I could use a bit of info on what brand.

I was wanting a kimber but also saw tanfoglio, dan wesson, colt, S&W and even a les baer.

I am leaning tword the kimber but if there is a better option like less expensive for same thing or magazines are better/more available ect I would appruciate the advice.

I have a few 10mm's, and a little bit of experience with them. My current 10mm Posse consists of: Colt Delta Elite, Kimber 10mm, iAi Javelina Hunter, EAA Witness Hunter, Glock 29, Para P16/40 (10mm), Wyoming Arms Parker 10mm, Sig 220 (Grayguns conversion), and a Glock 20L. Past 10mm's include: S&W 610 (2), S&W 1006, Ruger Blackhawk Buckeye, and other Colt Delta Elites (3). I'm probably forgetting something.

The Kimber is on the CA list, and is an excellent choice, in my opinion. The Colt Delta Elite can be a good choice used, but I've seen all manner of problems with the occasional DE. Make sure that you check it carefully or have it checked. The DW and the Baer are top of the line, but also top dollar - and not on the list. The Tanfoglio/Witness platform is excellent, though not a 1911, and also not on the list. You can also convert a Para P16-40 to 10mm fairly easily, and that may be the best of all worlds.

The Glocks are good -- don't get me wrong, I have and trust both a G20 and a G29 -- but I prefer my Kimber or my Delta Elites.

guns_and_labs
07-16-2010, 1:50 PM
The 1911 is not built for the 10mm and will get beat up pretty quick. It is a cool concept but not the right platform.

I respectfully beg to differ. I have many, many thousands of rounds of 10mm through 1911s, all full power. When sprung correctly and maintained, they are as good as they need to be.

That said, the S&W 1006 is a tank, and probably could shrug off a tactical nuclear device, if you could fit one in the cartridge case.

MadMax
07-16-2010, 2:09 PM
Thanks for all the replies.

I already have two glocks (34 and 32) so I didn't really want to get another one, I have shot my buddies glock 10mm and I liked it.

Is the recoil in the 1911 style 10mm really worse than a glock. I thought the glock would be worse cause they are lighter?

This always confuses me a bit, so the baer and Dan Wesson are off list meaning only in state ppt transferable right? The kimber is on list so I can buy it from out of state and have it transfered in?

@ Guns and Labs there are a few kimber models any advice on a better model like Custom vrs Target. I would really like it to be a full size pistol, maybe even a longslide but I doubt they have one. Kimbers wesite is a bit confusing. On a sidenote you must REALLY like 10mm:-)

@ Sammy, thanks for the offer but I have shot 10mm and have a pretty good feel for it. If you want to shoot sometime just cause I am down. I go to chabot though it is really the only decent place to shoot rifles in the bay area.

Thanks again for the advice

sammy
07-16-2010, 2:21 PM
I respectfully beg to differ. I have many, many thousands of rounds of 10mm through 1911s, all full power. When sprung correctly and maintained, they are as good as they need to be.

That said, the S&W 1006 is a tank, and probably could shrug off a tactical nuclear device, if you could fit one in the cartridge case.

That might be true. I only tried a Kimber once loaded with Double Taps and I swear the thing was going come apart in my hand. The 1006 absorbs full power 10mm's fine but the Glock has much less "snap" for lack of a better word. I have shot both in IDPA and I can get on target much faster with the Glock. It could be because the Glock has a much larger grip and gives the shooter more to hang on to.

I have 2 Les Baers and was interested in having one converted to 10mm. I called the factory and spoke with Les himself. He would not entertain the thought of converting my Baer. He said the round was way too powerful for that design. That is all I needed to hear.

guns_and_labs
07-16-2010, 2:37 PM
Is the recoil in the 1911 style 10mm really worse than a glock. I thought the glock would be worse cause they are lighter?

This always confuses me a bit, so the baer and Dan Wesson are off list meaning only in state ppt transferable right? The kimber is on list so I can buy it from out of state and have it transfered in?

@ Guns and Labs there are a few kimber models any advice on a better model like Custom vrs Target. I would really like it to be a full size pistol, maybe even a longslide but I doubt they have one. Kimbers wesite is a bit confusing. On a sidenote you must REALLY like 10mm:-)



As to recoil, I personally do not find it "worse". It feels a little different due to the different shape of the grips, and how you hold each. I do know that the Glock takes longer for me to bring back on target, which I assume is due to how high it kicks or how high I hold it. The Glock also does damage to my fingers after a long range session. I can't seem to figure out what part of the trigger guard I'm hitting, but whatever part, it hurts. The G29 is worse.

I'd be happy to meet you at Chabot and let you try the Kimber. My G20 is in teardown mode, waiting for some better sights and a better trigger.

Baer, DW and Colt are all PPT-only. The Kimber is on the list for a couple of versions, so can be imported.

On the Kimber, I started with the Target, as I preferred the finish on that one. The Eclipse Custom II is only cosmetically different, as far as I could tell. The sights might have been different, too.

guns_and_labs
07-16-2010, 2:47 PM
I have shot both in IDPA and I can get on target much faster with the Glock. It could be because the Glock has a much larger grip and gives the shooter more to hang on to.


Shooting IDPA with a 250+ power factor is impressive. You certainly avoid any Failure To Neutralize penalties from concussion alone.

I think I must grip the Glock too low, as I have the opposite -- my splits with the Glock are MUCH worse than the Kimber.

robert101
07-16-2010, 4:46 PM
I have a DW PM-7 10MM and the gun is awesome. Smooth as silk. I personally wouldn't have an issue with a Kimber 10MM either. To bad Springfield Armory doesn't make a TRP in 10MM. Oh well. I think the 1911 platform is well suited to the 10MM and recoil is only marginally more than full-house 45 loads. But it is more. I shoot a fair amount of 45 ACP and only a little of my DW 10MM. If you can find a DW Sportsman or PM-7 here in CA, don't hesitate to buy it. I wish I had a Les B. in 10 that would be some fine gun.

aermotor
07-16-2010, 5:25 PM
I'll throw down another vote for a Glock 20. Fantastic gun, manages the recoil quite well even on super hot loads. Going to get a 10mm barrel for my Glock 21 & 30 soon.

Suvorov
07-16-2010, 5:33 PM
I love my Smith 1006! However in the new world that shuns slide mounted safety/decockers it might not be what you are looking for.

ih8ca
07-16-2010, 5:45 PM
Dan Wesson 10mm is a great gun. I also have a lar grizzly 45 win mag with a 10mm conversion kit. I really like that setup. You can also get 357 mag and 45 acp.

joedogboy
07-16-2010, 5:45 PM
I go to chabot though it is really the only decent place to shoot rifles in the bay area.

While Chabot is nice, I find that I much prefer USI (in Concord).

The "two berm" setup on the rifle range allows you to get two targets, and hang one at the 50 and the other at 100. Very convenient for firing multiple rifles, or for zeroing and then practicing at longer range.

dstiltner
07-16-2010, 5:49 PM
You won't go wrong with the Kimber if you want a 1911 pattern gun. I was also fortunate enough to pick an STI frame (PPT) and sent it to Fusion Firearms to have my longslide built (my avatar).

CoolCalGunner
07-16-2010, 6:00 PM
In the market for a 10mm "1911" style handgun and I could use a bit of info on what brand.

I was wanting a kimber but also saw tanfoglio, dan wesson, colt, S&W and even a les baer.

I am leaning tword the kimber but if there is a better option like less expensive for same thing or magazines are better/more available ect I would appruciate the advice.

Tanfoglio it is...I have a compact .45 frame and placed an order for a compact 10mm conversion kit and it is amazing to shoot the 10mm, even with factory loaded ammo. Note that it's compact, not full-sized slide!!! :D
I tried 10mm 1911 and it was punishing my wrists pretty much...
Get the Tanfoglio, you won't regret it!

JTROKS
07-16-2010, 7:31 PM
The recoil event of a 10mm is brutal in the 1911 platform, I have a Glock 20 and that is manageable.

Not if you get a 6" slide and a barrel to go with it like this one: http://www.fusionfirearms.com/servlet/Detail?no=152

Get the barrel threaded and install a sleeve to turn it into a bull barrel. The extra weight of the slide and barrel will tame the hottest safe 10mm load you can find. The fully supported chamber is a plus in making sure you won't have a case head separation.

Go for a custom built. Go find a 1911 frame and a good gunsmith to build it. Now if you can find a way to get one of these http://www.fusionfirearms.com/servlet/the-592/Grand-Sport-1911-Hunter/Detail it would be so much easier to getting what you're dreaming of.

kellito
07-16-2010, 9:05 PM
Is it really that bad in a 1911? I have shot it in a glock, wasn't bad at all. I can't immagine the 1911, which I feel is easier to shoot than a glock, is worse than a glock in 10mm. Anybody shoot them back to back.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

MadMax
07-16-2010, 9:35 PM
Just found another option, nighthawk custom longslide only like 3000:rolleyes:
So many guns so little time and money, not to mention my wife would castrate me.

Just curious though is the nighthawk on the list:p

I am gonna go with the kimber, seems to be the best option for me.

NotEnoughGuns
07-16-2010, 9:35 PM
Glock 29 / Steel, Polymer Pistol 3.78" 10mm 4/4/2011
Glock 29 OD / Steel, Polymer Pistol 3.78" 10mm 11/1/2010
Glock 29SF (Black) / Steel, Polymer Pistol 3.78" 10mm 12/30/2010
Smith & Wesson 610-3 / Stainless Steel Revolver 6.5" 10mm 4/17/2011
Smith & Wesson 310NG (Matte Black) SKU 163426 / Alloy; Stainless Steel Revolver 2.75" 10mm 6/2/2011
Smith & Wesson 610-3 / Stainless Steel Revolver 3.87" 10mm 5/8/2011
Smith & Wesson 610-3 / Stainless Steel Revolver 3.87" 10mm 9/3/2011
Glock 20 / Steel, Polymer Pistol 4.60" 10mm 12/31/2010
Glock 20 OD / Steel, Polymer Pistol 4.60" 10mm 12/22/2010
Glock 20SF (Black) / Steel, Polymer Pistol 4.60" 10mm 12/30/2010
Glock 20C / Steel, Polymer Pistol 4.6" 10mm 1/9/2011
Kimber Stainless Target 10mm II / Stainless Steel Pistol 5" 10mm 10/14/2010
Kimber Eclipse Custom II / Stainless Steel Pistol 5" 10mm 10/31/2010

shooting4life
07-16-2010, 9:53 PM
I would skip the 10mm and get a 10mm magnum.
http://i630.photobucket.com/albums/uu30/shooting4life/IMG_2646.jpg
http://i630.photobucket.com/albums/uu30/shooting4life/IMG_2643.jpg
http://i630.photobucket.com/albums/uu30/shooting4life/IMG_2648.jpg

Got to get those 180grs moving at 1400fps for some fun.

JTROKS
07-17-2010, 5:37 PM
Is it really that bad in a 1911? I have shot it in a glock, wasn't bad at all. I can't immagine the 1911, which I feel is easier to shoot than a glock, is worse than a glock in 10mm. Anybody shoot them back to back.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The original 10mm loads were harsh on the original Delta Elite configuration even with the dual spring set up. Install a 24 lb Wolff recoil spring and a single shock buff and it should be good for some original Norma 10mm loads. I really advise for the bull barrel especially with the 5" configuration. It just add enough weight to tame it down.

Just to add about the problems the Delta Elites had. It was the part of the rail cracking just above the slide stop. When it cracks it will migrate to other areas of the frame making them useless. Colt figured that the area was a weak portion and is really not required so the solution was to machine it off from the start to eliminate starting a crack.

Sort of like this.
http://www.caspianarmsltd.com/images/main_images/receivers/hcgm.jpg

Turbinator
07-18-2010, 9:50 AM
Get the barrel threaded and install a sleeve to turn it into a bull barrel. The extra weight of the slide and barrel will tame the hottest safe 10mm load you can find. The fully supported chamber is a plus in making sure you won't have a case head separation.


Careful - unless I'm missing something here, a threaded barrel will turn that handgun into an "assault weapon" unless something is permanently attached to the threads at the end of the barrel.

This is a moot point if you've already reg'ed your handgun as an AW prior to year 2000.

Turby

cocorador
07-18-2010, 11:23 AM
I have a Glock 20, Custom Caspian 1911, and an STI 2011 with a 6 inch frame/barrel/slide. I shoot full 10 mm loads in all of them. In my opinion, the STI has the least felt recoil, with the G20 being next in line. There is very little difference between the 2 pistols. Since you can't readily get a 6 inch STI, I would go with the G20.

The Caspian has a lot more felt recoil. The 2 custom guns do have a bull berrel for added weight and do have shock buffs as well. Just to add, my G20 is a generation 1. I've had it since they were first release in the US. On the STI, I left a little extra metal on the frame for weight, it used to be a 7 inch frame. You can't go wrong with any of the choices out on the market. I do use my pistols for handgun hunting and occasional paper punching. I prefer my G20 in stock form for hunting.
http://i28.tinypic.com/29z22vk.jpg

SnWnMe
08-14-2010, 7:23 PM
I have a Kimber and a 610. The 1911 kicks like a hot 38 out of a K frame I guess. Brutal isn't a word I will associate with it. Snappy is more like it. My loads run 1,150 to 1175 for 180 gr with a healthy dose of AA#9.

Brian2217
08-14-2010, 7:42 PM
I have the Kimber in a 10mm. I have had no issues.

7anthony7
08-15-2010, 8:10 PM
Wilson is making them as well. You really need to take a look at the loads though you are shooting. A bunch of them around today are not loaded to the original Norma round. If you are shooting the 200gr at full power it will give you a much different feel then the 180 gr sub sonic which is basically going to be a 40. I am waiting for my Wilson to be finished in 10mm and already purchased a bunch of ammo for it. I have shot the 1006 and it isn't bad at all with the full power loads.

hefedehefe
08-26-2010, 3:41 PM
What do you think about the G29's? I'm thinking about getting one of those instead of the 20

cpt_majestic
08-26-2010, 5:35 PM
Ammo costs kill me

Greg-Dawg
08-26-2010, 5:37 PM
Kimber:
http://mysite.verizon.net/reso3b4u/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/eclipse10mm.jpg

TKM
08-26-2010, 7:05 PM
I can recommend the Glocks, Colts, Kimbers, Smiths and Rugers.

Try to be environmentally responsible and shoot to the south. 20+ years of 10mm being fired northwards has rotated the planet and caused global warming.

dexter9659
08-26-2010, 9:08 PM
I have two Glock 20s. One is a G20c and the other is a G20sf. I would suggest the G20 like others have said over a 1911 platform due to the power of a true full power load. In general a true full power load will not be found on the shelf, but will rather be a hand load, a 135gr bullet at speeds nearing 1800ft/sec or a 180 gr bullet going near 1400ft/sec. These are full boat loads. Loads like these will cause the glock frame to twist and tweak as it absorbs the recoil. Thanks to the elastic principals of the polymer frame however, the frame returns to its original shape. The same cannot be said for a 1911 frame which does not share the same elastic properties of polymer.

If however you plan on only shooting factory 10mm loads get the 1911.

randy
08-27-2010, 1:10 AM
Increase your options by looking for a 1911 in .40. A simple barrel change and magazines you have two calibers in one gun. You could have the chamber cut for 10 mill too.

With two barrels you can shoot 40 if you're broke 10mil when you're feeling flush.

I have a DE and a Glock in 10 I shoot the Glock.

CoolCalGunner
09-05-2010, 7:11 PM
Ammo costs kill me

Not if you do reload :D