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kenc9
04-13-2006, 7:53 AM
OK, the list is starting to materilize.

Last year, the California Department of Justice (DOJ) issued several letter opinions stating that certain manufacturer's AK "series" receivers were not covered by the California Assault Weapons Control Act because the guns were not specifically listed in the California Code of Regulations. Correspondence from the DOJ regarding these firearms and others can be viewed here.
In response, the receivers (which are regulated as "firearms") were made available through firearm retailers in California, and hundreds of the receivers were sold.

Now, DOJ is planning to expand the definition of "assault weapons" to include more of the currently legal receivers/firearms by adding the make and model of the receivers to the AK series or AR series lists. See Penal Code sections 12276 (a)(1) and (5).

A DOJ "stakeholders" committee has been meeting to determine which firearms it will deem AK or AR "series." Materials relating to the committee hearings will be posted here. To date, the DOJ has identified at least three manufacturer's firearms that the DOJ plans to add to the AR or AK series lists: Stag-15, JP Rifles CRT-02, and All DSA receivers, including ZM4. The DOJ has stated that a committee has designated approximately 17 firearms as candidates for addition to the AK and AR series lists.

The Ferranto Commission has released a list of the firearms that it suggests should be added to the AK or AR Series "assault weapons" lists maintained by the California Department of Justice. The Ferranto Commission also recommended changes to the current list. The Department of Justice has indicated that additional firearms are likely to be added to this list, but it could not disclose those firearms at this time. The current list of changes proposed by the Ferranto Commission include:

A change to the Olympic arms classification to read:

CAR (all) take off the 97
add MFR (all).
Add "FEG" Hungarian as a classification
Model SA 85M
Add "Robinson Armament"
AK-47 series VEPR (all)
Add "DOUBLESTAR"
DSC STAR-15 rifles (all)
DSC STARCAR Carbine (all)
Add "DSA"
DS-AR (all)
Add "Barrett"
AR-series (all)
Add to Bushmaster - to go under model X M15E2S , Carbon 15 rifle and Carbon 15 pistol.
Add "European American Armory (EAA)"
Saiga
Add Century International Arms
WASR-10 (all)
Add FAR-15 (all)
Add STAG 15 (all)
JP - (all)
CMMG (all)

Bunyfofu69
04-13-2006, 7:55 AM
YaY 4 Stag!

kenc9
04-13-2006, 7:56 AM
State of California
M e m o r a n d u m
Department of Justice
P.O. Box 160487
Sacramento, CA 95816-0487
To : Randy Rossi, Director
Firearms Division
Date : December 20, 2005
Telephone: (916) 274-5990
From : Dale Ferranto, Assistant Director
Firearms Division
Subject : Commission Changes
(1) A change to the Olympic arms classification to read
CAR (all) take off the 97
add MFR (all).
(2) Add “FEG” Hungarian as a classification
Model SA 85M
(3) Add “Robinson Armament”
AK-47 series VEPR (all)
(4) Add “DOUBLESTAR”
DSC STAR-15 rifles (all)
DSC STARCAR Carbine (all)
(5) Add “DSA”
DS-AR (all)
(6) Add “Barrett”
AR-series (all)
(7) Add to Bushmaster - to go under model X M15E2S , Carbon 15 rifle and Carbon 15
pistol.
(8) Add “European American Armory (EAA)”
Saiga
(9) Add Century International Arms
WASR-10 (all)
(10) Add FAR-15 (all)
(11) Add STAG 15 (all)
(12) JP - (all)
All Special Agent Supervisors
January 23, 2006
Page 2
(13) CMMG (all)
Please make the changes to the existing Series list as soon as possible.

kenc9
04-13-2006, 8:03 AM
Once it was realized the California Department of Justice (CA DOJ) has not updated the "Kasler list" in the 5 years after Harrott decision, many Californians found they could legally purchase and possess AR and AK rifles not yet officially identified as "series" members. As of February 2006, over 10,000 "off-list" receivers (frames) for such rifles have been legally imported to, and purchased within, California. The only requirement for these receivers are that the combination of make and model is not explicitly listed as banned, and as long as the owner does not add certain "characteristic features" turning the firearm into an assault weapon (i.e. pistol grip, flash suppressor, etc). These characteristic features can be used, however, if a nondetachable 10-round (or less) magazine, conforming in the converse to the California Code of Regulations section 978.20 definition of detachable magazine[4] , is affixed to such "off-list" rifles. These off-list rifles can also be used without a pistol grip, folding stock or flash hider, in which case it is legal to own and use them with detachable magazines.

The CA DOJ produced a report from the Ferranto Commission in response [5]. It appears that this list will be updated in early 2006. CA DOJ also issued a controversial memorandum dated February 1, 2006 [6], whose described actions are not founded or supported within statutory law in Penal Code 12275-12290. This memo stated that once off-list "series" firearms are declared and registered as assault weapons, they will not be able to have characteristic features added or fixed magazines removed. This is being challenged by pro-gun groups, since there is no criminal violation in the California Penal Code for adding or changing features to a legally-acquired, registered assault weapon.

MaxQ
04-13-2006, 8:05 AM
Please make the changes to the existing Series list as soon as possible.

Don't hold your breath. This was the Ferranto Commission memo posted on calgunslaws.com back on January 23rd, that someone (maybe tonynorcal?) linked to. It can be found here: http://calgunlaws.com/Docs/ASSAULT%20WEAPONS/Articles/commision%20changes.pdf

A few Calguns threads have talked about it...

bwiese
04-13-2006, 8:09 AM
Old news, a bit reshaped by the Feb 1 memo.

But given DOJ is photographing lowers at various vendors it sounds like progress is being made.

Stanze
04-13-2006, 8:13 AM
Someone needs to make a non-listed AR lower and call it, "Uranium PU-36 Explosive Space Modulator"

I'd die, if that makes the DOJ list.:D

phobos512
04-13-2006, 8:28 AM
I'll get to work on it tonight.

One side can have Marvin the Martian and the other can have one of those weird martian pellet birds :)

kenc9
04-13-2006, 8:38 AM
I think my WASR-10 is on the way, Action in one box and the stock and grip in another minus the Mag. of course.

-ken

tenpercentfirearms
04-13-2006, 8:39 AM
Instead of a stag head or a dragon, what about a picture of Bill Lockyer? How awesome would that be? The Lockyer-15. Talk about evil assault weapons.

Muzz
04-13-2006, 8:40 AM
One side can have Marvin the Martian and the other can have one of those weird martian pellet birds :)
The "Marvin M-15"!! Quick, somebody post a pic.

phish
04-13-2006, 8:48 AM
Someone needs to make a non-listed AR lower and call it, "Uranium PU-36 Explosive Space Modulator"

I'd die, if that makes the DOJ list.:D

not until I buy one first! :p

I'd love to have that along with Marvin the Martian on the right side.

*harp strum sounds*

Fjold
04-13-2006, 9:38 AM
Someone needs to make a non-listed AR lower and call it, "Uranium PU-36 Explosive Space Modulator"

I'd die, if that makes the DOJ list.:D

I want one! Do I hear Group buy?

Marvin the Martian's wav file

http://www.gargaro.com/MaRvInWaVs/stolen.wav

CACitUP
04-13-2006, 10:36 AM
Someone needs to make a non-listed AR lower and call it, "Uranium PU-36 Explosive Space Modulator"

I'd die, if that makes the DOJ list.:D

Call Lauer. The will allow you to roll your own.

Chaingun
04-13-2006, 10:42 AM
This type of listing shows make (manufacturer) but no model. I haven't looked at CMMG too closely but they must not have models for the lowers. This is like "PWA (all)" which requires an update. This will cause an issue when CMMG adds models.

"(13) CMMG (all)"

tygerpaw
04-13-2006, 10:54 AM
How about the "Koretz SUX-15"! "Pistol Packing Perata PUTZ-15" I'd buy one of those in a heartbeat! "Feinstein Turn-'em-all-in Mr & Mrs. America-15"

"Boxer BOX-15" "Leno SSM-15"

:D :D

grammaton76
04-13-2006, 12:31 PM
And here I thought that the lower craze taught them that "(all)" didn't work... :)

Chaingun
04-13-2006, 12:57 PM
They have also left out the older Century models which is now WASR:

SAR-1
SAR-2
SAR-3

Go figure.

bwiese
04-13-2006, 12:59 PM
Instead of a stag head or a dragon, what about a picture of Bill Lockyer? How awesome would that be? The Lockyer-15. Talk about evil assault weapons.

The Lockyer-Merrilees 15. It spouts off unprompted (NB: Lockyer's known for intemperate off-the-cuff remarks), and has a high-capacity pistol grip that Alison Merrilees invented.

Stanze
04-13-2006, 1:35 PM
I dunno: It might not comply with the law, and perform with questionable accuracy.

lol...should I be concerned that I got that?(dang text limit)

Surveyor
04-13-2006, 1:36 PM
Hmmm, I didn't notice my HIGH STANDARD on that list.

You hear me Bill? I said HIGH STANDARD !!!



Thank you.


http://www.hunt101.com/img/395953.jpg

marklbucla
04-13-2006, 2:17 PM
Seriously,

Does anyone do custom model or serial numbers if I really wanted a Lockyer-15?

Yeah, I know that it might not make the list...

bwiese
04-13-2006, 2:37 PM
Seriously,
Does anyone do custom model or serial numbers if I really wanted a Lockyer-15? Yeah, I know that it might not make the list...

Please do NOT do INDIVIDUAL custom models. (Custom serial #s are fine.)

If XYZ Mfg Co. is making a "Super-15" model receiver for general sale, you should not be the only one that has a XYZ Mfg Co. "Super Duper" or "Mark Bucla #1" receiver.

Harrott protects you for unlisted brands/models. Having oddball custom models for just you could conceivably get in to territory similar to what I warn about for homebuilt lowers built up from 80% blanks: there's no real way Harrott could ever protect that, since the listing of customs/homebuilts would be unmanageable and impractical - thus, Harrott could fall down and Kasler takes over.

If there is enough interest in a specific new model name ;) a given mfgr could create, as is his right, a new model available for general sale. Ideally these should be sold inside _and_ outside CA.

I may be paranoid and all wet here, but I want maximum amount of Harrott protection. By ensuring your models are in general trade circulation and available to "not just you", I belive you're way better off.

marklbucla
04-13-2006, 2:39 PM
I'm not in Kalifornia now, so I can have my fun. I just wanna know where I'd go for one if I wanted it.

CACitUP
04-13-2006, 3:51 PM
Seriously,

Does anyone do custom model or serial numbers if I really wanted a Lockyer-15?

Yeah, I know that it might not make the list...

Lauer......Lauer........Lauer..........

C.G.
04-13-2006, 5:17 PM
Hmmm, I didn't notice my HIGH STANDARD on that list.

You hear me Bill? I said HIGH STANDARD !!!



Thank you.




What was that again? :D

csarel
04-13-2006, 8:14 PM
http://www.sundevilmfg.com/images/ad1.jpg


:D

dawson8r
04-13-2006, 9:36 PM
I wonder if "Robinson Arms" is the VEPR, XCR, M96 or (all). I bought the M96 a couple years ago via gunshow dealer. Legally sold in PRC without the evil pistol grip. Loves to eat Wolf.

I'd love to put the hidden-away-that-I-dont-have pistol grip on it.

10K2HVN
04-14-2006, 7:19 AM
I dont see any L.A.R. Grizzlys, either... :(

Seriously,

Does anyone do custom model or serial numbers if I really wanted a Lockyer-15?

Yeah, I know that it might not make the list...
Id totally buy another one as true "trophy" receiver, if they had that model! :cool:

Maybe we should all pitch in for a custom model "Lockyer-15" for Lockyer himself - with trophy stand and everything!

blacklisted
04-14-2006, 9:45 AM
Look at the date on the "Ferranto Comission" letter...

It's from late December.

bwiese
04-14-2006, 10:04 AM
No Vulcans?

This is an old list, as of late December.

Regular Vulcans will likely make the list.

I think the approved fixed-mag Vulcans and FAB10s will not.

TheMan
04-14-2006, 10:05 AM
I dont see any L.A.R. Grizzlys, either... :(


Id totally buy another one as true "trophy" receiver, if they had that model! :cool:

Maybe we should all pitch in for a custom model "Lockyer-15" for Lockyer himself - with trophy stand and everything!

Only if we demill it and fit it with airsoft components instead of the real thing. Giving a real gun to someone as clueless about firearms as they are, would be irresponsible.

bwiese
04-14-2006, 10:06 AM
I wonder if "Robinson Arms" is the VEPR, XCR, M96 or (all). I bought the M96 a couple years ago via gunshow dealer. Legally sold in PRC without the evil pistol grip. Loves to eat Wolf.

I'd love to put the hidden-away-that-I-dont-have pistol grip on it.

The 'list update' can ONLY include AR and AK series members. The M96, like any other nonAR/nonAK gun, will take a separate court add-on petition (12276.5) to get listed.

dawson8r
04-14-2006, 10:34 PM
Thanks Bill! The M96 is currently "neutered". Glad I have some off-list lowers!

bwiese
04-15-2006, 10:49 AM
Thanks Bill! The M96 is currently "neutered". Glad I have some off-list lowers!

Just so you know, since the M96 is not an AR/AK 'series' gun, it has to go thru a court 'add on' petition process (12276.5) and can't just be thrown on 'the list' like newly identified AR/AK series members can be.