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View Full Version : Can you sue if your CCW is denied?


billym
04-08-2006, 11:47 AM
I was wondering if you live in a place like Oakland or Richmond. Had a spotless record and were denied a ccw. Could you sue the Sherriffs office for denying you the right to protect yourself while they fail miserably at policing your neighborhood.

It seems to me if they were doing their job well enough I might not need to carry a gun. However in both cities I named they are doing a piss poor job and it is their fault that many innocent people become victims of violent crimes under their juristiction.

What do you think? What if several residents of Oakland did the same and applied and sued when denied?

Nak
04-08-2006, 12:22 PM
Would you take yourself to court?

VeryCoolCat
04-08-2006, 12:31 PM
Unless it was grossly denied. Where lets say you carry large sums of money, transport several firearms, or have had someone threaten you.

They 'usually' won't approve your CCW just because you want one.

You need to have a legitimate reason to have one.

If crime is high in your area, and you 'want' one. That won't work, as you don't need a carry permit just to get to your car and drive, and anyone can easily get a home defense weapon.

Plus, most departments won't even consider you for it without proper history. Anyone can carry physically, but unless your legitimately knowledgable about it and will not pull a weapon at the slightest scare. They don't want any accidents that they can get blamed for because they approved you. Being ex-military or something along that line will help.

Security guards and those who transport high valuable objects are USUALLY approved. Remember, truckers don't even get approved. You need to have a found argument.

Give them a reason to give you one, and remove any possible reason of declining you one.

linuxgunner
04-08-2006, 12:54 PM
You can definitely sue but you have to have a strategy. Use PRAR to request issuance records and see if there is a correlation between issuance and campaign contributions. If there is, that could be grounds for a suit. If they won't release the issuance records (Sheriff Baca in LA withholds them illegally) that's also grounds for a strong lawsuit.

Google "prar wars" to find Jim March's site about this.

Any type of suit costs a lot of money. Don't even bother with this unless you are ready to blow $100k or so on lawyers. If I had the money I would do it, but I don't.

Richard
04-08-2006, 1:12 PM
You can definitely sue but you have to have a strategy. Use PRAR to request issuance records and see if there is a correlation between issuance and campaign contributions. If there is, that could be grounds for a suit. If they won't release the issuance records (Sheriff Baca in LA withholds them illegally) that's also grounds for a strong lawsuit.

Google "prar wars" to find Jim March's site about this.

Any type of suit costs a lot of money. Don't even bother with this unless you are ready to blow $100k or so on lawyers. If I had the money I would do it, but I don't.

Maybe you can get a group of backers if money is the determining factor...kind of like a class action,that is if this term applies.

linuxgunner
04-08-2006, 1:53 PM
Maybe you can get a group of backers if money is the determining factor...kind of like a class action,that is if this term applies.

Class action suits are tricky things. The first thing the defendant tries to do is to show that the plaintifs are not a "class" and should all file individual suits. There are complicated rules about this. What you would need to do is find a lawyer who specializes in class actions, who cares about gun rights, and who is willing to take some risks. Then you will have to write this up as a business case and pitch it to him, just like pitching a business. If he likes the idea, he will take it. You'll have to sign an agreement with him which would probably result in almost all the winning going to him, because he's taking the big risk on it. You probably won't need to pay anything; he's taking all the risk and it costs you nothing but your time.

The way it would work is you would get together a hundred applicants, who would apply and be denied and form a class. Then he would sue the sheriff for $100mil, and (if he does a good job) maybe settle for $10mil, and he keeps most of it. That's a lot of money for him! And that's a big chunk out of most sheriff's budgets.

That's if it all goes well. If that kind of thing works it would be a mighty force in reforming CCW in CA. Suddenly sheriffs would be afraid to not issue. Counties would tell their sheriffs, "you better issue or we risk bankruptcy". That would be good!

But it will be tough finding a lawyer willing to take this on.

Btw, there are lawyers who make fabulous amounts of money just taking on class actions. Some of the lawyers who won the tobacco lawsuits probably made tens of millions of dollars from it. This lawsuit is appealing because some counties do have fairly deep pockets and oculd pay tens of millions in a judgment.

And finally... if a sheriff does not respond properly to a PRAR request, that is a black-and-white legal issue and it's a very bad thing for him to do. That seems like the most obvious point of attack for a lawsuit. Any sheriff's department that illegally withholds public records SHOULD be bankrupted. If they are withholding public records they are not serving the public; they are thugs.

Richard
04-08-2006, 2:39 PM
Class action suits are tricky things. The first thing the defendant tries to do is to show that the plaintifs are not a "class" and should all file individual suits. There are complicated rules about this. What you would need to do is find a lawyer who specializes in class actions, who cares about gun rights, and who is willing to take some risks. Then you will have to write this up as a business case and pitch it to him, just like pitching a business. If he likes the idea, he will take it. You'll have to sign an agreement with him which would probably result in almost all the winning going to him, because he's taking the big risk on it. You probably won't need to pay anything; he's taking all the risk and it costs you nothing but your time.

The way it would work is you would get together a hundred applicants, who would apply and be denied and form a class. Then he would sue the sheriff for $100mil, and (if he does a good job) maybe settle for $10mil, and he keeps most of it. That's a lot of money for him! And that's a big chunk out of most sheriff's budgets.

That's if it all goes well. If that kind of thing works it would be a mighty force in reforming CCW in CA. Suddenly sheriffs would be afraid to not issue. Counties would tell their sheriffs, "you better issue or we risk bankruptcy". That would be good!

But it will be tough finding a lawyer willing to take this on.

Btw, there are lawyers who make fabulous amounts of money just taking on class actions. Some of the lawyers who won the tobacco lawsuits probably made tens of millions of dollars from it. This lawsuit is appealing because some counties do have fairly deep pockets and oculd pay tens of millions in a judgment.

And finally... if a sheriff does not respond properly to a PRAR request, that is a black-and-white legal issue and it's a very bad thing for him to do. That seems like the most obvious point of attack for a lawsuit. Any sheriff's department that illegally withholds public records SHOULD be bankrupted. If they are withholding public records they are not serving the public; they are thugs.


Yeah... I was pretty sure the term did not apply,thanks for clarrification......my point was if he needed money maybe he can get a group to back him .:o

MadMex
04-08-2006, 4:38 PM
1. Law enforcement personnel are under no obligation to protect you.
2. How were you damaged as a result of not being issued a permit?

Anyone can sue anyone for any reason (there’s always an attorney willing to take your money). You can sue me for the sky being blue, however you’ll have to prove how you were damaged.

harley66
04-08-2006, 4:58 PM
you can sue anyone for anything,,, just depends on how much $$$$ you are willing to throw at an issue..... Now don't sue me over this answer,,, but you could if you wanted too...lol

ldivinag
04-09-2006, 4:07 AM
Could you sue the Sherriffs office for denying you the right to protect yourself while they fail miserably at policing your neighborhood.



just google JIM MARCH...

wait...
is it equalccw.com?

glen avon
04-09-2006, 11:21 AM
just call the NRA and ask about their litigation re: same.