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View Full Version : quick dumb question; please dont kill me


yiha
04-06-2006, 11:53 PM
A stripped lower with no pistol grip, but an open magwell and with a folding stock attatched.. legal?

adamsreeftank
04-06-2006, 11:59 PM
I don't think so. (You probably mean collapsing stock, not folding.) In any case, it counts as an evil feature which is not legal with an open magwell. To run without a fixed mag, it has to be without pistol grip, forward grip, collapsing stock or flash supressor.

If you really mean a folding stock, the obove is true, but there is also a minumum length requirement as well.

by the way, check out the FAQ. It might answer your question better.

C.G.
04-07-2006, 12:01 AM
A stripped lower with no pistol grip, but an open magwell and with a folding stock attatched.. legal?

NO!
http://caag.state.ca.us/images/shim.gif

12276. As used in this chapter, "assault weapon" shall mean the following designated semiautomatic firearms: (a) All of the following specified rifles: (1) All AK series including, but not limited to, the models identified as follows: (A) Made in China AK, AKM, AKS, AK47, AK47S, 56, 56S, 84S, and 86S. (B) Norinco 56, 56S, 84S, and 86S. (C) Poly Technologies AKS and AK47. (D)
12276.1. (a) Notwithstanding Section 12276, "assault weapon" shall also mean any of the following: (1) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine and any one of the following: (A) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon. (B) A thumbhole stock. (C) A folding or telescoping stock. (D) A grenade launcher or flare launcher. (E) A flash suppressor. (F) A forward pistol grip. (2) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has a fixed magazine with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds. (3) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has an overall length of less than 30 inches. (4) A semiautomatic pistol that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine and any one of the following: (A) A threaded barrel, capable of accepting a flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer. (B) A second handgrip. (C) A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel that allows the bearer to fire the weapon without burning his or her hand, except a slide that encloses the barrel. (D) The capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip. (5) A semiautomatic pistol with a fixed magazine that has the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds. (6) A semiautomatic shotgun that has both of the following: (A) A folding or telescoping stock. (B) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon, thumbhole stock, or vertical handgrip. (7) A semiautomatic shotgun that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine. (8) Any shotgun with a revolving cylinder.

yiha
04-07-2006, 12:09 AM
ok, thanks :)

NeoWeird
04-07-2006, 12:22 AM
Now what happens if you run an open mag well with the tube only and remove the actual moving stock piece? I don't believe there is any portion of law that defines how large or what shape a stock has to be, so as long as it doesn't fold/collapse, which the tube alone can't, then it is a solid stock and should be ok; right?

Just an option for people with only a carbine telestock and no money to buy the rifle style stocks.

adamsreeftank
04-07-2006, 1:40 AM
There might be an issue if you use one of the 4 or 6 position tubes, as opposed to a smooth tube. The idea being that you could easily attach the collapsing stock.

If you just want a short stock, use the fixed length entry stock.

kantstudien
04-07-2006, 7:03 AM
Kill him! Kill him now!

6172crew
04-07-2006, 7:53 AM
Kill him! Kill him now!

:confused: Long week?

Walking Fire
04-07-2006, 9:07 AM
Kill him! Kill him now!

Thats a little Harsh isnt it?
How about we wrap him from head to toe in blue 3M tape?

Note to self, Buy more stock in 3M...

Glasshat
04-07-2006, 9:08 AM
Wait a minute. A stripped lower can not accept a magazine, it will fall right out. With a stock attached and no barrel it's way less than 30". It's not an AW and it's not even a good club.
I'm curious about the situation you envision that prompts this question. Can you share with the group?

kantstudien
04-07-2006, 9:10 AM
Thats a little Harsh isnt it?

Okay, how about we baptize him in CLP?

Smokeybehr
04-07-2006, 12:03 PM
Okay, how about we baptize him in CLP?

How about a swim through some Ed's Red?

tpliquid1
04-07-2006, 12:04 PM
Thats a little Harsh isnt it?
How about we wrap him from head to toe in blue 3M tape?

Note to self, Buy more stock in 3M...


yes sir, provide address.

bwiese
04-07-2006, 12:09 PM
Wait a minute. A stripped lower can not accept a magazine, it will fall right out.

Stop spreading misinformation. That would not be the standard a prosecutor argues. Nothing says a rifle has to be truly operational to be regarded as an AW.

An off-list AR with open magwell but no mag catch would still 'accept' a detachable magazine since it fits in the magwell. The magazine would be detachable since it could be removed - thus triggering 12276.1 definition of an AW if other features (pistol grip, telestock, etc.) were attached.

Not only that, it could likely fire/be at least somewhat operational with the mag held in place by one of your hands.

Glasshat
04-07-2006, 4:29 PM
Stop spreading misinformation. That would not be the standard a prosecutor argues. Nothing says a rifle has to be truly operational to be regarded as an AW.

An off-list AR with open magwell but no mag catch would still 'accept' a detachable magazine since it fits in the magwell. The magazine would be detachable since it could be removed - thus triggering 12276.1 definition of an AW if other features (pistol grip, telestock, etc.) were attached.

Not only that, it could likely fire/be at least somewhat operational with the mag held in place by one of your hands.

yeah but a stripped lower with a collapsable stock doesn't have an upper or any LPK. What kind of d***head cop would bust you for that?
Is this even a realistic scenario worthy of discussion???

kantstudien
04-07-2006, 5:02 PM
What kind of d***head cop would bust you for that?

Why don't you go to DOJ headquarters in Sacramento and find out. Ask for "Iggy" :p

shopkeep
04-07-2006, 5:14 PM
As long as you pin a folding/fixed stock it's OK. Personally I'd stick with using the A2 or ACE buttstock just to make it more straight forward.

xenophobe
04-07-2006, 11:13 PM
There might be an issue if you use one of the 4 or 6 position tubes, as opposed to a smooth tube. The idea being that you could easily attach the collapsing stock.

That would be legal. California does not have any constructive possession wording in law. But, any DA might not like that and could try to prosecute you.

You can have an off-list lower receiver with an upper receiver with flash hider, a detached collapsable stock, detached pistol grip, the screws, springs, detents as well as the tools to assemble them in the same case and you do NOT have a banned firearm. Perhaps you could be the test case for a DA that thinks so, but DOJ has already opined that would not be illegal.

This is not grey area either.

adamsreeftank
04-08-2006, 12:49 AM
yeah but a stripped lower with a collapsable stock doesn't have an upper or any LPK. What kind of d***head cop would bust you for that?
Is this even a realistic scenario worthy of discussion???

A stripped lower is considered a centerfire rifle, regardless of what parts are or are not on it. If there is an open magwell, there can be NO evil features, such as pistol grip, collaps stock, flash sup, etc.

If you don't think it is worth discussing whether someone is (perhaps unintentionally) commiting a felony, maybe you should consider what you have to lose.

adamsreeftank
04-08-2006, 12:51 AM
That would be legal. California does not have any constructive possession wording in law. But, any DA might not like that and could try to prosecute you.


Thanks for that info. I was wondering if my stipped lowers and spare pistol grips might get me into hot water.

NeoWeird
04-12-2006, 8:29 PM
:D I would think that the safest place for stripped lowers would be in a locked SAFE and personally I would have mine in a locked safe thats within a locked safe like in the old safes of the 1800,s where there was a smaller safe inside the big ones (think butch cassidy & sundance kid film) like the safe that was in this box car (see pic)

my first time uploading a pic hope it came out correctly

You pull crap like that here in California and you're safe will end up on blocks, homie.

filefish
04-12-2006, 8:39 PM
Okay, how about we baptize him in CLP?



CLP enema!!