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hoffmang
06-26-2010, 11:47 AM
On this day two years ago, the Supreme Court issued it's opinion in DC v. Heller (http://www.hoffmang.com/firearms/DC_v_Heller.pdf).

I post this to add some perspective. Many gun owners think that progress is too slow or that nothing good is happening. However, 2 years is a really short time to be on the eve of having the Second Amendment apply to the states in McDonald.

Now waiting is certainly frustrating and yes some bad things have happened in legislatures and city/county ordinances but what is often missed are the things that didn't happen.

* Lots of wives got to keep their husbands guns when their husbands became prohibited.

* DC now has at least 800 legal gun owners so far.

* DC caved after adopting CA's handgun roster when SAF w/ CGF assistance sued them.

* More counties in California moved to virtual shall issue (even more will move after McDonald and all the holdouts after Sykes/Palmer.)

* SF dropped it's public housing firearms ban.

* Lot's of people were not prosecuted for legally owned firearms that otherwise would have been.

* The simple threat that appeals would open up 2A issues makes them settle much more quickly and at the initial court level.

* Legislators have to spend a bunch of time claiming that their gun control bill de jour doesn't violate Heller.

* Heller helps demotivate Dems at the federal level from passing new gun control while creating political air cover for pro-gun Dems and instead they've passed park carry, AMTRAK transport, etc.

* Heller significantly moved the public polling against handgun bans and towards pro-gun sentiment.

McDonald next Monday will move all of this a bit further. What has to (and will) happen at the macro level is for two major changes to occur in public opinion. 24 months is a super short time in Federal court timelines!

1. Create the impression that most new gun control laws are unconstitutional and will be struck by the courts if passed. This happened with segregation and it's going to happen with gun laws too.

2. Remove "gun control" as a knee jerk way for politicians to look like their doing something to combat crime problems. There are very few actually anti-gun politicians. Usually they are using gun control as a crutch to allow them to look tough on crime without doing any hard work whatsoever. When #1 becomes the norm, then those sorts of proposals get laughed at. You can see that happening in Chicago today where gun control sympathetic media members are questioning why Daley keeps pushing to limit guns since it doesn't work and is unconstitutional.

Happy Heller day everyone!

-Gene

7x57
06-26-2010, 11:51 AM
Hmm. If "McDonald Day" will come two days after "Heller Day," do we get to have two holidays or do they get rolled up into "Second Amendment Day" a la "President's Day"? :D

7x57

obeygiant
06-26-2010, 12:05 PM
Hmm. If "McDonald Day" will come two days after "Heller Day," do we get to have two holidays or do they get rolled up into "Second Amendment Day" a la "President's Day"? :D

7x57

I vote for "Second Amendment Day" but I will be happy to celebrate 2 if need be.

remsenlab
06-26-2010, 12:09 PM
Don't forget that Heller turned a bunch of keyboard commandos who can't even spell into constitutional scholars.

Window_Seat
06-26-2010, 12:57 PM
This all wouldn't have happened without the SAF, Alan Gura, CGF/N, CRPA, the NRA, and all the other good organizations. Without these groups, the Katrina confiscation incident would not have happened, because totalitarian confiscation would have already happened prior to that.

And let's not forget that the Brady's are also about to go down in the history books as another massive failure.:clap:

Erik.

bulgron
06-26-2010, 1:23 PM
Hmm. If "McDonald Day" will come two days after "Heller Day," do we get to have two holidays or do they get rolled up into "Second Amendment Day" a la "President's Day"? :D

7x57

Gee, if we can keep getting 2A cases decided in and around this time of year, maybe we can have a "Twelve Days of Heller" holiday.

On the first day of Heller
my true love sent to me:
A cartridge in an ammo can.

On the second day of Heller
my true love sent to me:
2 Magazines
and a cartridge in an ammo can.

...

:D

7x57
06-26-2010, 1:32 PM
Gee, if we can keep getting 2A cases decided in and around this time of year, maybe we can have a "Twelve Days of Heller" holiday.


OK, I'll play. This is singable, if you are a bit flexible with the syllables (no carping about the metaphysical origin of rights, please):

On the first day of Heller, the Supreme Court gave to me...
An enumerated individual right.

On the second day of Heller....
Incorporation against the states,
And an enumerated individual right.

On the third day of Heller, ...
Shall issue carry,
Incorporation against the states,
And an enumerated individual right.

etc.

Of course there are other effects of Heller already, and it would be better to be complete.

Maybe it should be "the years of Heller" and not days.

7x57

Smithereens
06-26-2010, 1:42 PM
HAPPY HELLER DAY!!! I think we should we should wrap them together and call it McHellald :biggrinjester:

FreshTapCoke
06-26-2010, 1:46 PM
I vote for "Second Amendment Day" but I will be happy to celebrate 2 if need be.

I'll be celebrating EVERY day after McDonald. :)

Librarian
06-26-2010, 1:58 PM
Don't forget that Heller turned a bunch of keyboard commandos who can't even spell into constitutional scholars.

I have always been a very good speller. Typing is another issue. :)

dunndeal
06-26-2010, 3:47 PM
Don't forget that Heller turned a bunch of keyboard commandos who can't even spell into constitutional scholars.



+ this.

I've only been here 6 months and my constitutional knowledge has grown immensely.

Davidwhitewolf
06-26-2010, 5:09 PM
Nice song, but I (sniff) prefer my entirely unofficial Calguns Fighting Song, (http://www.softgreenglow.com/wp/?p=9276) just in time for McDonald.

(Original song thread here. (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=302178&highlight=nowick))

N6ATF
06-26-2010, 5:39 PM
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Hellerbration&defid=3349438

What should the McDonald celebration be called?

REH
06-26-2010, 5:47 PM
Gene,
What do you believe will be the first positive effect of McDonald here in California?

Davidwhitewolf
06-26-2010, 7:07 PM
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Hellerbration&defid=3349438

What should the McDonald celebration be called?

Hard to beat Hellerbration, and I think "Food, Folks and Guns!" that somebody came up with on another thread is the winner for McDonald. Nevertheless, here's some riffs on some familiar themes:

McDonald. I'm lovin' it.

McDonald. What you want is what you get.

It's a good time for the great case of McDonald.

Nothing can do it like McDonald.

You deserve a break today...at McDonald.

McDonald: We love to see him smile!

RRangel
06-26-2010, 9:21 PM
Those are great reminders. Hopefully this post will make things a little more understandable for some of the impatient ones. That two years went by in a flash. The next two years will go by in another flash but we'll have even more to look forward to.

:party:

jdberger
06-26-2010, 9:24 PM
Hmm. If "McDonald Day" will come two days after "Heller Day," do we get to have two holidays or do they get rolled up into "Second Amendment Day" a la "President's Day"? :D

7x57

Second Amendment Weekend!

7x57
06-26-2010, 9:24 PM
What do you believe will be the first positive effect of McDonald here in California?


Conan! What is best in life?
Conan: To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women.


While I would personally think the lamentation of Josh Sugarman would be about as gratifying as anyone's, who am I to doubt Conan? So I guess the first positive effect will be the queasy feeling in the stomachs of Diane Feinstein, Barbara Boxer, Juliet Leftwich, and the other California Women of Gun Control.

7x57

69Mach1
06-26-2010, 9:51 PM
I can't wait for it to be 2 years from Monday. :)

N6ATF
06-26-2010, 10:12 PM
While I would personally think the lamentation of Josh Sugarman would be about as gratifying as anyone's, who am I to doubt Conan? So I guess the first positive effect will be the queasy feeling in the stomachs of Diane Feinstein, Barbara Boxer, Juliet Leftwich, and the other California Women of Gun Control Victim Disarmament.

Fixed. What they do is try to make sure guns are totally out of control, in the hands of criminals only.

bulgron
06-26-2010, 10:18 PM
So on Monday should we hang up a sign somewhere that says: "McDonald: 300 million served"?

:D

7x57
06-26-2010, 10:26 PM
So on Monday should we hang up a sign somewhere that says: "McDonald: 300 million served"?

:D

Can we make up one with an Oleg Volk photograph of Mr. McDonald holding his hard-won legal 1911 in his home sporting that precise caption?

7x57

bulgron
06-26-2010, 11:30 PM
Can we make up one with an Oleg Volk photograph of Mr. McDonald holding his hard-won legal 1911 in his home sporting that precise caption?

7x57

I like it! :thumbsup:

If you point me at the picture, I'll do the photoshopping.

CaliforniaCarry
06-26-2010, 11:49 PM
Also since Heller:

Our Democratic President signed a law passed by our Democratic Congress that allows people to carry in National Parks in accordance with state law.

We came extremely close (one or two votes, can't remember exact details) of passing National CCW Reciprocity through Congress.

Congress and Obama haven't tried to touch guns since 2008.

Blackhawk556
06-27-2010, 11:14 AM
tomorrow

can't wait

Joe
06-27-2010, 11:52 AM
happy anniversary

Sunday
06-27-2010, 11:57 AM
Now to punish all those who have been trampling on our rights.

CHS
06-27-2010, 5:15 PM
Unfortunately, California still has absolutely no bones whatsoever about passing unconstitutional absurd gun laws like AB962.

I have some hope, but it's going to be a long hard bitter fight here in this state.

Gray Peterson
06-27-2010, 8:00 PM
Also since Heller:

Our Democratic President signed a law passed by our Democratic Congress that allows people to carry in National Parks in accordance with state law.

We came extremely close (one or two votes, can't remember exact details) of passing National CCW Reciprocity through Congress.

Congress and Obama haven't tried to touch guns since 2008.

Thune Amendment, 58-42 (Voinovich and Lugar are statist anti-gun Republicans), though Mark Pryor (D-AR) voted no before voting yes. Presumably with Scott Brown we have 59, but we still need two or three more votes. Perhaps the McDonald decision will push them to fix the problem.

CCWFacts
06-27-2010, 10:48 PM
Thune Amendment, 58-42 (Voinovich and Lugar are statist anti-gun Republicans), though Mark Pryor (D-AR) voted no before voting yes. Presumably with Scott Brown we have 59, but we still need two or three more votes. Perhaps the McDonald decision will push them to fix the problem.

That's what I'm thinking. I believe that after the midterm elections, Congress will pass national reciprocity. It will most likely be an amendment on something else, otherwise the President won't sign it. I hope the NRA really pushes this. If it goes through it could be a major help for CCW reform in California and the other hold-outs.

CCWFacts
06-27-2010, 10:53 PM
By the way, the whining (http://www.theglobalist.com/StoryId.aspx?StoryId=8559) is already starting:

In Heller v. D.C., which ruled only on the federal territory of the District of Columbia, the court overturned a long history of precedent and radically re-interpreted the Second Amendment as an individual right, rather than a collective-security right in the form of state-organized militias.

Only by ignoring the first clause so completely as effectively to delete it and exclusively focusing on the second clause of the Second Amendment could the court reach such a false and dangerous conclusion.

The Supreme Court appears to be oblivious to the social impact its decisions have on the lives of ordinary citizens. The courtís politicized errors cost lives.

Whine whine whine.

Jarhead4
06-27-2010, 11:01 PM
With the assumption that the 2nd amendment will be incorporated tomorrow, I think we should thank McDonald by buying him his first hand gun.

N6ATF
06-28-2010, 12:34 AM
By the way, the whining (http://www.theglobalist.com/StoryId.aspx?StoryId=8559) is already starting:

The Supreme Court appears to be oblivious to the social impact its decisions have on the lives of ordinary citizens. The courtís politicized errors cost lives.

Whine whine whine.

Indeed it does. Their opinion, and hopefully punitive backing, will come 28 years too late, or months if you only count orals. How many tens if not hundreds of thousands of lives have been sacrificed on the altar of victim disarmament maintained for 28 years?