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gasol1ne
06-25-2010, 11:21 PM
Im thinking of buying a .22 conversion for my AR. Im really interested in getting a dedicated upper because i plan on only shooting the .22 conversion at the local indoor range. Would the CMMG kit fit my needs?

Oh does anyone know where i can find a good price on one? The cheapest place i found the cmmg kit was $136.49.

http://www.getgear.us/CMMG-AR15-22LR-Drop-In-Conversion-Kit-w-10rd-Mag-p/cmmg22lrcv10.htm

thanks

Anchors
06-25-2010, 11:52 PM
That's cool.
I want a .22 upper or conversion.
The ammo is so cheap, it'd be nice.

telcolineman
06-25-2010, 11:56 PM
Im thinking of buying a .22 conversion for my AR. Im really interested in getting a dedicated upper because i plan on only shooting the .22 conversion at the local indoor range. Would the CMMG kit fit my needs?

Oh does anyone know where i can find a good price on one? The cheapest place i found the cmmg kit was $136.49.

http://www.getgear.us/CMMG-AR15-22LR-Drop-In-Conversion-Kit-w-10rd-Mag-p/cmmg22lrcv10.htm

thanks

That seems like a good price, I have 2 ciener kits and they were up around $200

thayne
06-26-2010, 1:29 AM
if you get the cmmg i suggest getting the stainless steel version. It costs about $200. ive seen the finish come off the standard one in chunks around the part that goes into your chamber.

Droppin Deuces
06-26-2010, 1:37 AM
I just put 400 rounds through my CMMG conversion yesterday with zero jams. Shooting at 1" blullseyes from 75' it wasn't super accurate or anything, but I guess the point is that for the price of about 40 rounds of .223 I fired 500 rounds of .22. Good times. I recommend it! The thing has more or less paid for itself after maybe 3 trips to the indoor range.

thayne
06-26-2010, 1:44 AM
I just put 400 rounds through my CMMG conversion yesterday with zero jams. Shooting at 1" blullseyes from 75' it wasn't super accurate or anything, but I guess the point is that for the price of about 40 rounds of .223 I fired 500 rounds of .22. Good times. I recommend it! The thing has more or less paid for itself after maybe 3 trips to the indoor range.

not to mention you can have detachable mags! IE screw on your red bullet button tool :D

slomofo
06-26-2010, 1:46 AM
$136 is a good price, I'd go for that one. Mine costed me $199.99 when they first came out, so you're getting a pretty good deal.

Be sure to shoot heavier ammo if you plan on shooting it out of a standard .223 1:9 twist barrel. If you have a 1:7 twist barrel, DO NOT shoot anything less than 55gr. .22LR or you can kiss your muzzle device goodbye.

evidens83
06-26-2010, 8:19 AM
How well does this kit handle Wal Mart bulk ammo? I've been seriously considering getting one but not if its a jam-a-holic. Which kit is the most reliable?

Droppin Deuces
06-26-2010, 12:21 PM
I can only speak for the non stainless version. I've seen it written somewhere that 36 grain HV works best, so I picked up a box of Winchester 36 grain Xpert HV - 500 rounds for $18. It will jam a bunch at first, but after the first 150 rounds or so, it's broken in and suddenly just begins to work flawlessly - just like it says in the trouble shooting guide. I assume that during the break-in period, the finish is being worn smooth on all of the friction areas.

slomofo
06-26-2010, 12:30 PM
Hmm, I didn't know they came in different flavors. Mine is stainless steel, never had a jam, but if you don't slam the bolt shut, it won't close all the way and forward assist doesn't work with the conversion kit, so you gotta stick your finger on the carrier to close the bolt or you can recock and slam the bolt in.

Droppin Deuces
06-26-2010, 12:45 PM
Yeah I noticed that too. I think it's just a matter of the ejector latch spring being stronger than the recoil spring. Just make sure you pull the charging handle all the way back and let it slam home after changing mags.

icentropy
07-01-2010, 10:53 PM
Be sure to shoot heavier ammo if you plan on shooting it out of a standard .223 1:9 twist barrel. If you have a 1:7 twist barrel, DO NOT shoot anything less than 55gr. .22LR or you can kiss your muzzle device goodbye.

I'm looking to buy the stainless version soon. But i have some 36gr Remington Golden bullet value packs, a couple thousand rounds. Does this mean I can't shoot them with my 1/7 twist 16" barrel? What type of accuracy can one expect from these conversions?

telcolineman
07-01-2010, 11:38 PM
I'm looking to buy the stainless version soon. But i have some 36gr Remington Golden bullet value packs, a couple thousand rounds. Does this mean I can't shoot them with my 1/7 twist 16" barrel? What type of accuracy can one expect from these conversions?

Very good question and one I can not answer but the 22LR uppers usually have a 1:16 twist

AlliedArmory
07-01-2010, 11:41 PM
We have the non-stainless version for under $132 after the 15% off coupon in our July 4th sale.

http://www.alliedarmory.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=3&products_id=3573

derek@thepackingrat.net
07-01-2010, 11:46 PM
http://thepackingrat.net/2009/11/26/cmmg-conversion-vs-model1-sales-dedicated-22lr-ar15/

I have a short write up on the CMMG kit. I think they're worthwhile, but if you can drop the cash on a dedicated upper, I would recommend that route.

icentropy
07-02-2010, 7:37 AM
So Can anyone comment on if they've ever had a problem shooting a .22 conversion kit out of a 1:7 twist barrel? If you are shooting heavy bullets what bullets are you shooting? heavy 60gr subsonic or....?

I'm getting my rifle and conversion kit today, I have 36gr remington bullets stock piled and i don't want to "kiss my muzzle device goodbye".

yasushi
07-02-2010, 7:44 AM
On the stainless v.s. non-stainless, I've have/had old Ciener and Spike's and they both ran fine in my guns. The only thing about old Ciener is that it likes to run wet and really gets dirty with cheap bulk ammo.

As to shooting bulk ammo through the 1X7, I can't comment since I've only shot 1X9 and 1X12 and they both ran fine and fairly accurate at 25 yds. I perfer my pencil barrel 1X12 for .22lr converison if I'm shooting beyond 25 though.

icentropy
07-02-2010, 7:56 AM
Emailed CMMG and here's the trail:

(me) Hi I just purchased a stainless 22 conversion kit and will be using it in my 1/7 twist 16" barreled AR. But someone on Calguns said i should only shoot heavy 55gr or heavier ammo out of that barrel? is that true? I have a couple of thousand rounds of regular 36gr Remington Golden Bullet Value packs i was looking forward to using... Thanks for any info

(them) For .223 and 5.56 that is correct. With the .22 LR you are shooting a smaller diameter projectile through the bore anyway, so you will not be getting the same accuracy as you would with the ammunition your rifle is chambered for. A slower twist 1/12 would shoot a little better, but it is still not the same as a dedicated .22 LR barrel. We do not recommend Remington ammo, it has given us nothing but problems.

(me) So what ammo (& grain) do you recommend for the .22 conversion? I was excited to be able to shoot bulk .22 ammo

(them) Any other brand of ammunition should be alright. We do recommend a 36
grain bullet.

(me) Oh ok, so i don't have to go to a "really heavy" 55gr .22 bullet? Like i said before someone said that with a 1:7 twist barrel, using a bullet lighter than 55gr would be a bad idea. The exact text was: "Be sure to shoot heavier ammo if you plan on shooting it out of a standard .223 1:9 twist barrel. If you have a 1:7 twist barrel, DO NOT shoot anything less than 55gr. .22LR or you can kiss your muzzle device goodbye." What do you think he means by this and is it true? According to your User's Manual: "Use premium grade .22 Long Rifle high velocity round-nose ammunition. The unit was successfully factory test fired with Federal High Velocity Hollow Point ammunition. This type of ammo is recommended for best performance." But it doesn't specify the grain of the ammo or what barrel twists this will work for. I'd like to get this info so if this person is making everyone think that they need special 55gr or higher .22 ammo or risk damaging their gun. I can either confirm it or let people know it's not true. I think less folk will be interested in a kit if they think they have to use special ($$$) 55gr ammo on a 1:7 barrel. Please let me know and I'll forward the info.

That was the last email back to them. I can't seem to get anyone on the phone so email is taking a bit back-and-forth. I'll post the response when i get it.

Droppin Deuces
07-02-2010, 8:15 AM
Is there a big difference between a 1:9 and a 1:7 barrel? I'm shooting 36 grain through a 1:9 and it shoots just dandy aside from the occasional flyer.
From what I understand, the only real requirement is that you use HV ammo. Subsonic just won't work the action.

CHS
07-02-2010, 8:18 AM
So Can anyone comment on if they've ever had a problem shooting a .22 conversion kit out of a 1:7 twist barrel? If you are shooting heavy bullets what bullets are you shooting? heavy 60gr subsonic or....?

I'm getting my rifle and conversion kit today, I have 36gr remington bullets stock piled and i don't want to "kiss my muzzle device goodbye".

You can shoot 36gr bullets just fine out of a 1:7 twist barrel. I think that muzzle device guy is just high or something.

Problem with conversion kits is that accuracy tends to suck. They're good for training and plinking purposes, but really aren't accurate at all.

If you want accuracy, get a dedicated.

slomofo
07-02-2010, 8:48 AM
I'm going by what gunstore employees told me.

Colt M4 SOCOM 14.5" barrel
1:7 twist
80rds of .223 had been passed through it since it was new.
CMMG Stainless steel conversion
YHM Phantom Compensator
Federal Value Pack 36gr

Compensator and .22 conversion were both brand new.

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e237/slomofo562/Guns/8fb79a89.jpg
http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e237/slomofo562/Guns/988aa3ee.jpg

The rounds were kissing the compensator on their way out.


Per advice of the gunstore, I changed the compensator to a new one and ran 60 gr. Aquila through it without any problems.

hp95125
07-02-2010, 9:25 AM
This seems like lose-lose... a lighter bullet may damage the muzzle, but a heavier one is expensive and sub-sonic so may not work the action right.

I bought a stainless CMMG kit for my DDM4 (1:7 twist) last week and tried 4 different types of ammo with it - 36 grain HV HP from federal, winchester and remington as well as 40 grain winchester. They all worked OK with no particular jamming issues, and I don't see any damage or marks on my A2 flash hider. I have not shot hundreds of rounds yet, probably less than 100.

I do see 3 issues right now:

1) accuracy sucks. at 50 yards, where I can easily do a 1-2" group with .223, impact holes will be all over the place with .22. not that much fun and quite embarrassing at the range.

2) feeding issues with Black Dog .22lr- 10/27 Rd converted mags. I will contact CALEGALMAGS.com that sold me the mags. if I put a 10th bullet in the plate gets stuck in the bottom and will not push the bullets up. I can only put 9 in at a time. the original CMMG mag that came with the kit works fine.

3) The bolt can not stay open unless there's a empty mag. My range (sunnyvale) requires all weapons to be without mag and an open locked bolt during cease fire, which I can't do with the kit, so I have to put a shell case or something to hold the bolt open. minor issue but still annoying.

I plan to go back to the range today and fire several more mags through the kit, I can report back.

CHS
07-02-2010, 9:33 AM
I'm going by what gunstore employees told me.

Colt M4 SOCOM 14.5" barrel
1:7 twist
80rds of .223 had been passed through it since it was new.
CMMG Stainless steel conversion
YHM Phantom Compensator
Federal Value Pack 36gr

Compensator and .22 conversion were both brand new.

The rounds were kissing the compensator on their way out.


Per advice of the gunstore, I changed the compensator to a new one and ran 60 gr. Aquila through it without any problems.

Yeah, that's because that's a muzzle brake with a really tight bore. With a .22 conversion your accuracy is off enough that the bullets are probably going to kiss it.

There's no way that bullet would damage the muzzle brake. It's just going to screw up your accuracy.

The bullets aren't even going to contact most flash hiders, so saying that it's going to damage all muzzle devices is false advertising mixed with a little bit of FUD.

CHS
07-02-2010, 9:36 AM
1) accuracy sucks. at 50 yards, where I can easily do a 1-2" group with .223, impact holes will be all over the place with .22. not that much fun and quite embarrassing at the range.


Yeah, like I said earlier, if you want accuracy then get a dedicated. .22 conversions have terrible accuracy for several reasons. The biggest reason is the 2" of loose smoothbore before the bullet hits any rifling.


2) feeding issues with Black Dog .22lr- 10/27 Rd converted mags. I will contact CALEGALMAGS.com that sold me the mags. if I put a 10th bullet in the plate gets stuck in the bottom and will not push the bullets up. I can only put 9 in at a time. the original CMMG mag that came with the kit works fine.


That's easily fixed yourself. Take the mag apart and pull the follower. You will see a little bit of flashing on the follower on the inside part of the rear tab. Just take a razor to it and you'll fix the issue.

hp95125
07-02-2010, 9:44 AM
CALEGALMAGS.com must be super-glue-ing the mags to make them permanent 10 round because I couldn't open it... I'm sure they will make it right for me.

slomofo
07-02-2010, 9:50 AM
Yeah, that's because that's a muzzle brake with a really tight bore. With a .22 conversion your accuracy is off enough that the bullets are probably going to kiss it.

There's no way that bullet would damage the muzzle brake. It's just going to screw up your accuracy.

The bullets aren't even going to contact most flash hiders, so saying that it's going to damage all muzzle devices is false advertising mixed with a little bit of FUD.

Perhaps it was FUD and shouldn't be blamed on the ammo.

FWIW, the replacement muzzle device was the same as the damaged one (YHM Phantom), but has no problems thus far.

SixPointEight
07-02-2010, 10:01 AM
I'm going by what gunstore employees told me.

Colt M4 SOCOM 14.5" barrel
1:7 twist
80rds of .223 had been passed through it since it was new.
CMMG Stainless steel conversion
YHM Phantom Compensator
Federal Value Pack 36gr

Compensator and .22 conversion were both brand new.

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e237/slomofo562/Guns/8fb79a89.jpg
http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e237/slomofo562/Guns/988aa3ee.jpg

The rounds were kissing the compensator on their way out.


Per advice of the gunstore, I changed the compensator to a new one and ran 60 gr. Aquila through it without any problems.
Good to know. I just got a phantom and spent some time debating a .22lr kit. Nevermind. Just get me a 10/22

icentropy
07-02-2010, 10:33 AM
ok last response from CMMG on the subject.

"I have no clue what the person you are quoting is talking about.

We recommend 36 grain bullets. Barrel twist does not matter. All .223
and 5.56 twist rates are technically to fast for most .22 LR ammunition."

PlacerTactical
07-02-2010, 11:20 AM
I have a CMMG 22 kit and shot it out of 2 of my AR's without any real issues. One is a 16" mid-length 1/7 twist witha removable carry handle. At about 90 yards, it was close to zero shooting high velocity 36g. My other is a CMMG 14.5" phantom with a Matech sight. It is also 1/7 twist. I had to adjust the Matech to 450 to have it back to zero shooting at 100yds (i was shooting remington subsonic).
I didn't shoot it from a bench so I couldn't say how accurate it was but, a jack rabbit from 100 yds was not a problem.
High velocity rounds shoot best but after about 60 rounds through it, Remington subsonic was working fine.

KING_PALM
07-02-2010, 1:14 PM
same some cash and get or build a dedicated upper!

hp95125
07-03-2010, 12:37 AM
update - took the kit to the range today and I was much happier with the accuracy after 100 rounds. with winchester 36g HP (ones that come in the 333 round box) got nice groups at 50 yards. still not as tight as .223 but very reasonable. I also ordered a box of 60g aguila to try those out, they should work good with the 1:7 twist rate.

Spaceghost
07-03-2010, 10:50 AM
Send them a link to this thread and let them know there are pictures of the damaged muzzle posted.


ok last response from CMMG on the subject.

"I have no clue what the person you are quoting is talking about.

We recommend 36 grain bullets. Barrel twist does not matter. All .223
and 5.56 twist rates are technically to fast for most .22 LR ammunition."

slomofo
07-03-2010, 11:51 AM
Send them a link to this thread and let them know there are pictures of the damaged muzzle posted.

I think it was probably my muzzle device as someone else mentioned since others have had success with light ammo in 1:7.

calico9mm
07-04-2010, 7:07 AM
I have ciener kit and it works ok on my carbine and ar pistol but expect some jams. And don't forget to clean your rifle asap, that 22 ammo leaves a lot of crud. Like what everyone else is saying, accuracy sucks but it's a cheap way to kill time in between your serious shooting.

icentropy
07-04-2010, 7:15 AM
Send them a link to this thread and let them know there are pictures of the damaged muzzle posted.

Yeah I sent him the link. I got the kit as well and a box of 60gr. Hopefully I'll get a chance to compare the accuracy of the 60gr vs 36gr at the indoor range next week.

CHS
07-05-2010, 11:21 AM
Send them a link to this thread and let them know there are pictures of the damaged muzzle posted.

That muzzle device isn't damaged :)