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Sea-Fore
06-19-2010, 9:22 PM
Are they legal in California? If not, what states are they legal in? Sorry It's just because the only weapon I own right now is a Winchester 1200 (w/o pistol grip).

69Mach1
06-19-2010, 9:23 PM
Yes, a lot of Kasashnikov type guns are legal in CA, in the proper config. None of the list models are legal though.

Sea-Fore
06-19-2010, 9:27 PM
Yes, a lot of Kasashnikov type guns are legal in CA, in the proper config. None of the list models are legal though.
I see, and what do you mean by "list models"? Is there a limit of ammunition the magazine must have? (i.e 10 round ammo box or 30?). It also must be semi-automatic, correct?

69Mach1
06-19-2010, 9:32 PM
By name (make and model)
http://www.calguns.net/caawid/flowchart.pdf

mswanson223
06-19-2010, 9:42 PM
get a saiga

C.W.M.V.
06-19-2010, 9:46 PM
I hope you have lots of money if you plan on getting into AK's. Their like those potato chips you cant have just one, I think Mach is a good example of that!

Get a Saiga, best bang for the buck easy legal AK going. Then get another one, and another one, and just one more, well you could always use a Krink...

http://shop.peachstateguns.com/product.sc?productId=570&categoryId=136

evidens83
06-19-2010, 9:53 PM
Looks like somebody has plenty of reading to get to. Welcome to CG.

Post 88
06-19-2010, 11:13 PM
Go to Big 5. Order a CASAR from I.O. Buy a BB from Calgun member. Order pistol grip and the long bolt from Tapco. After this, you'll have a legal AK look alike.

C.W.M.V.
06-19-2010, 11:19 PM
Go to Big 5. Order a CASAR from I.O. Buy a BB from Calgun member. Order pistol grip and the long bolt from Tapco. After this, you'll have a legal AK look alike.

Or order a Saiga for $350, spend $100 on conversion parts and use the $150 you save over the IO at big 5 on ammo and mags.

The Saiga is the closest your going to legally get to standard Russian AK's. Made in the same factory.

Fattracker
06-20-2010, 3:26 AM
Basically, if you study this flowchart (http://www.calguns.net/caawid/flowchart.pdf) document it will answer all of your questions.

RobGR
06-20-2010, 11:40 AM
I do not like the look of the CASARs at BIG 5, they look like a hack job. I also believe they are going for $599 too, so get the bloody decks 20% off coupon if you do plan on buying one.

Granted this will cost you twice as much, but getting one from Arizona Response Systems is just the way to go imo. That's if you don't want to build it yourself and appreciate the knowledge of a master gunsmith. I've only heard good things about his work, as in "excellence".

http://www.arizonaresponsesystems.com/store/storeguns/pagestoreguns.shtml

I am definitely considering getting a AK74 from him. Those Bulgarian AK74s look handsome. Just contact him, a man of few words, and let him know that you are in Cali. Not sure who he ships too, but you should contact him and then contact your nearest FFL in regard to a transfer. Transfer will cost possible $50-$75 (like Turners for instance) and then the $25-$35 DROS fee. No tax because it comes form Arizona. Hopefully he can accommodate you and set you up with a 10 round mag and a bullet button (BB), two things that will make it legal. I'm not sure about the flash suppressor on the AK74, not sure if that is illegal.

I would have gotten one already but I got laid off two weeks ago.... bastards. But hopefully I can speak from first hand experience one day. I never bothered contacting him because I didn't want to waste his time.

Let us know what you end up doing.

CSACANNONEER
06-20-2010, 11:49 AM
I see, and what do you mean by "list models"? Is there a limit of ammunition the magazine must have? (i.e 10 round ammo box or 30?). It also must be semi-automatic, correct?

You can use your legally owned 75 round drums, 30 round mags, etc. in your RAW or on a featureless rifle.

If you have a fixed mag rifle, you will be limited to 10 round mags but, it can have "evil features".

No, it does not have to be semi auto. While it can not be full auto or select fire, it can be a pump, single shot, staight pull back "bolt action", etc. Non-semi autos are not regulated as far as "evil features" go so, no mag lock is required and you can use any legally own magazine in non-semi auto guns.

RobGR
06-20-2010, 11:52 AM
And folding stocks are illegal if, that's if, the rifle is below 30" in length with the stock in the folded position. Or you need a folded stock with a lock in it so it cannot be folded, thus fixed.

(I'm no expert on these freaking laws either, but hopefully I've provided you with the correct info. The laws are there and once one is aware of them, it's rather easy to work with them. It does suck that good law abiding citizens that might screw up on one thing could be potentially arrested & fined for it though.)

RobGR
06-20-2010, 11:55 AM
The evil features law does no apply to .22 rimfire weapons either. Like I have the S&W M&P 15/22 with some evil features and do not have to have a bullet button, because it is cleared under the law. But we are not talking about .22 cal here. They do have some AKs in .22 cal. though.

chaseface
06-24-2010, 11:26 AM
You can use your legally owned 75 round drums, 30 round mags, etc. in your RAW or on a featureless rifle.

If you have a fixed mag rifle, you will be limited to 10 round mags but, it can have "evil features".

No, it does not have to be semi auto. While it can not be full auto or select fire, it can be a pump, single shot, staight pull back "bolt action", etc. Non-semi autos are not regulated as far as "evil features" go so, no mag lock is required and you can use any legally own magazine in non-semi auto guns.

how do you legally own 75 round drums?

drunktank
06-24-2010, 12:05 PM
Aside from gov. agencies etc. own them before the ban or rebuild your legally owned "hi" caps.

chaseface
06-24-2010, 12:15 PM
gotcha. I've been looking at the Saiga 12's and wishing I could buy the 20 rd drums for it.

ZombieKiller
06-24-2010, 12:21 PM
Welcome.....AKs are the secret black hole of money in the world of firearms. Trust me. ARs are fun- but there is something I really enjoy about shooting my AKs.....

stix213
06-24-2010, 3:06 PM
Welcome.....AKs are the secret black hole of money in the world of firearms. Trust me. ARs are fun- but there is something I really enjoy about shooting my AKs.....

What the hell do you mean "secret black hole of money"???? After you get your 7.62x39 all tacticooled up, all you need after that is another in wood, one in 5.45x39, .308 short barrel, another .308 in long barrel, .223, a Saiga 12, and an AK pistol. Oh wait... :p

jaustin612
06-24-2010, 5:15 PM
Yup, you buy a saiga. Cheap enough, then you convert it. Not too bad. Then you start looking at ultimak rails, ouch, then to make it worse you start wanting russian optics, and when it's all said and done, you've spent 700 dollars on a 350 dollar gun. Is it worth it. Hell yes.

CSACANNONEER
06-24-2010, 5:23 PM
how do you legally own 75 round drums?

The same way I, and many others, legally own 250 round cloth belts, +200 round belts of linked ammo, countless +10 round box magazines, etc. We either legally aquired them prior to 1-1-2000 or, there are still LEOs and a few civilians with "high-cap" permits who can still legally buy them today.

I guess the real question should be: How come you don't legally own any 75 round drums?

chaseface
06-24-2010, 5:31 PM
The same way I, and many others, legally own 250 round cloth belts, +200 round belts of linked ammo, countless +10 round box magazines, etc. We either legally aquired them prior to 1-1-2000 or, there are still LEOs and a few civilians with "high-cap" permits who can still legally buy them today.

I guess the real question should be: How come you don't legally own any 75 round drums?

I guess that is the real question. So pardon my ignorance but can i buy high-cap mags from someone who has bought them legally with their permit? and if so how to I prove to a LEO who pulls me over that it is legit?

C.W.M.V.
06-24-2010, 5:33 PM
The same way I, and many others, legally own 250 round cloth belts, +200 round belts of linked ammo, countless +10 round box magazines, etc. We either legally aquired them prior to 1-1-2000 or, there are still LEOs and a few civilians with "high-cap" permits who can still legally buy them today.

I guess the real question should be: How come you don't legally own any 75 round drums?

Probably because he didn't have any prior to the ban.

CSACANNONEER
06-24-2010, 5:41 PM
I guess that is the real question. So pardon my ignorance but can i buy high-cap mags from someone who has bought them legally with their permit? and if so how to I prove to a LEO who pulls me over that it is legit?

If you don't have them, you will not be able to buy them unless you are a LEO or you get a "high capacity magazine permit" from DOJ.

chaseface
06-24-2010, 5:45 PM
yeah i was 15 in 2000 so...

ZX-10R
06-24-2010, 5:48 PM
Do not get a CASAR and go to Riflegear and pick up a WASR 10/63 almost same price as CASAR and it is close to an AK pattern you can buy without going broke.

CASAR...LOL.

onley11
06-24-2010, 6:02 PM
yeah i was 15 in 2000 so...
But you could still buy mags. Not guns, but mags...

cannon
06-24-2010, 6:03 PM
Get a Saiga and a case of ammo. After that you can modify away at your leisure. It can be a never ending affair unless you are careful.

chaseface
06-24-2010, 6:54 PM
But you could still buy mags. Not guns, but mags...

True but i was too busy buying paintball guns, pellet guns, and building potato cannons than magazines for my non-existent real guns

Ian
06-24-2010, 7:38 PM
How hard is it to tacticool an AK out? I want to keep mine all black for the most part, get a vltor modstock if it fits, and get a rail and maybe an eotech on the AK I plan to build,

aslowdodge
06-24-2010, 10:32 PM
Go to Big 5. Order a CASAR from I.O. Buy a BB from Calgun member. Order pistol grip and the long bolt from Tapco. After this, you'll have a legal AK look alike.

what is the long bolt?

CSACANNONEER
06-24-2010, 10:35 PM
yeah i was 15 in 2000 so...

Oh well. I'm sorry that you weren't brought up around firearms. By the time I was 15, I had many 25 and 50 round 10-22 mags.

chaseface
06-24-2010, 11:55 PM
I was brought up around firearms but pretty much limited to handguns, shotguns, and low capacity or bolt action rifles. I wish I had parents that brought me up on AR's and AK's though!! Not all of us are that lucky. I gotta teach myself about the good stuff :). But thats what Calguns is for right? The next purchase is definitely gunna be the Saiga 12!!

Glock 22
06-25-2010, 12:52 AM
Soooo???? Where do you buy a Saiga for that price????? Also, are they good or at least just as good as the "other" AK's????

ZX-10R
06-25-2010, 7:32 AM
Riflegear has them cheap.

C.W.M.V.
06-25-2010, 7:36 AM
PRK had 5.45 saigas for 389 on the shelf a while back.

rainman8819
06-25-2010, 7:41 AM
My first and only AK variant is the Saiga. I bought it from DD's Ranch. They were great to deal with and was very cheap. They're one of the vendors here at CalGuns.

dieselpower
06-25-2010, 8:13 AM
I was brought up around firearms but pretty much limited to handguns, shotguns, and low capacity or bolt action rifles. I wish I had parents that brought me up on AR's and AK's though!! Not all of us are that lucky. I gotta teach myself about the good stuff :). But thats what Calguns is for right? The next purchase is definitely gunna be the Saiga 12!!

Couple things.
1) Why an AK type rifle and Saiga 12...do you have something against good ole American AR15 type rifle and pump shotty?

2) Just want to make sure you know you can legally buy any size magazine and keep it in pieces. You can only put it together while outside of CA, then disassemble it before returning. So you can buy those 20rd Saiga mags. Just use them when you target shoot or Hunt out of CA.

cannon
06-25-2010, 8:22 AM
Soooo???? Where do you buy a Saiga for that price????? Also, are they good or at least just as good as the "other" AK's????

Wellll, Saiga are real AK's. Made by the same company and at the same factory as other real Russian AK's.

Not knowing where you live I can only say that in the Antelope Valley in So. Cal. the Gun Shop will send you out the door after tax, dros etc with a 7.62 for $458.00

You won't be disapointed in a Saiga. Just shop around and buy as cheap as possible.

chaseface
06-25-2010, 9:21 AM
Couple things.
1) Why an AK type rifle and Saiga 12...do you have something against good ole American AR15 type rifle and pump shotty?

2) Just want to make sure you know you can legally buy any size magazine and keep it in pieces. You can only put it together while outside of CA, then disassemble it before returning. So you can buy those 20rd Saiga mags. Just use them when you target shoot or Hunt out of CA.

No I prefer AR's for rifles over AK's but thats just my opinion. I even like AR pistols. I wish I could have one as a SBR too. I wish I was rollin' in the dough and could afford the ammo to have a .50 beowulf upper put on to do some real damage.

I've already got a pump shotgun. But the Saiga is a badda** shot gun. And yes I understand about the disassembled mags.

dieselpower
06-25-2010, 10:45 AM
Last time I was at Shooters Paradise in Oxnard CA, they had a Siaga 12.

dieselpower
06-25-2010, 10:49 AM
Wellll, Saiga are real AK's. Made by the same company and at the same factory as other real Russian AK's.

Not knowing where you live I can only say that in the Antelope Valley in So. Cal. the Gun Shop will send you out the door after tax, dros etc with a 7.62 for $458.00

You won't be disapointed in a Saiga. Just shop around and buy as cheap as possible.

I have heard this before and some here have taken to whipping my butt for not believing this. I still have never seen proof Siagas are real AKs.

Please remember CMT made both Stag and for awhile Colt...that doesnt mean Stags are the same as Colts.

chaseface
06-25-2010, 12:09 PM
I know they have them at OC armory too. I don't see one with the pistol grip though and their websight doesn't say the price but they got em.

HotRails
06-25-2010, 12:20 PM
I have heard this before and some here have taken to whipping my butt for not believing this. I still have never seen proof Siagas are real AKs.

Please remember CMT made both Stag and for awhile Colt...that doesnt mean Stags are the same as Colts.

Its the closest you can get without moving to another state.. The original "real" AK's are listed. Most of the "AK's" that you see around are built up from Romy or Yugo parts kits, at least the Saiga is Russian built and well built at that! :D

CSACANNONEER
06-25-2010, 12:27 PM
I have heard this before and some here have taken to whipping my butt for not believing this. I still have never seen proof Siagas are real AKs.

Please remember CMT made both Stag and for awhile Colt...that doesnt mean Stags are the same as Colts.

I guess the only way for you to understand is to see for yourself. Let me know when you feel like field stripping a stock Saiga and an AK or two and I will let you use mine. You will find that the actions are identical. They operate the exact same, etc. The only differences are cosmetic or minor. I'm thinking of the bolt hold open on a Saiga, the different furniture, and the trigger group which has been moved rearward.

To make it easy to understand, is a car not the same car if it gets a paint job and different rims?

icefire
06-25-2010, 12:38 PM
I have heard this before and some here have taken to whipping my butt for not believing this. I still have never seen proof Siagas are real AKs.
Please remember CMT made both Stag and for awhile Colt...that doesnt mean Stags are the same as Colts.

http://forum.saiga-12.com/uploads/gallery/1268189761/gallery_22253_427_28233.jpg


What about the markings on every Saiga, "Made in Russia by Ishmash"? that doesnt convince you they are real?

How much more real do you need? My Saiga uses mil-spec AK mags, is 7.62 caliber, and was made in Russia.

if thats not a "real" AK, what is?

dieselpower
06-25-2010, 12:43 PM
I guess the only way for you to understand is to see for yourself. Let me know when you feel like field stripping a stock Saiga and an AK or two and I will let you use mine. You will find that the actions are identical. They operate the exact same, etc. The only differences are cosmetic or minor. I'm thinking of the bolt hold open on a Saiga, the different furniture, and the trigger group which has been moved rearward.

To make it easy to understand, is a car not the same car if it gets a paint job and different rims?

wheres canyon country? If its near Ventura I would like to take you up on that sometime. I have only shot AK47s, never broke one down and compaired to a Siaga. I know a buddy picked up a Rommy just before the ban and that thing jammed all the time. Another buddy had a mak90 and nothing could jam it. he has a 100drum and the thing never quit firing...ever.

doc1buc
06-25-2010, 12:43 PM
http://forum.saiga-12.com/uploads/gallery/1268189761/gallery_22253_427_28233.jpg


What about the markings on every Saiga, "Made in Russia by Ishmash"? that doesnt convince you they are real?

How much more real do you need? My Saiga uses mil-spec AK mags, is 7.62 caliber, and was made in Russia.

if thats not a "real" AK, what is?
That just doesn't look right, the trigger housing that far back.

dieselpower
06-25-2010, 12:45 PM
http://forum.saiga-12.com/uploads/gallery/1268189761/gallery_22253_427_28233.jpg


What about the markings on every Saiga, "Made in Russia by Ishmash"? that doesnt convince you they are real?

How much more real do you need? My Saiga uses mil-spec AK mags, is 7.62 caliber, and was made in Russia.

if thats not a "real" AK, what is?

a real AK....

CSACANNONEER
06-25-2010, 12:46 PM
wheres canyon country? If its near Ventura I would like to take you up on that sometime. I have only shot AK47s, never broke one down and compaired to a Siaga. I know a buddy picked up a Rommy just before the ban and that thing jammed all the time. Another buddy had a mak90 and nothing could jam it. he has a 100drum and the thing never quit firing...ever.

Between Santa Clarita and Palmdale. Send me a PM and we can figure out a time and day.

icefire
06-25-2010, 12:46 PM
Thats an old picture, before I did the trigger guard conversion. its in the right place now...I'll post a newer pic in a few days when I get home..That was just the 'bolt-on' shortcut until i could get the conversion parts..

CSACANNONEER
06-25-2010, 12:48 PM
http://forum.saiga-12.com/uploads/gallery/1268189761/gallery_22253_427_28233.jpg


What about the markings on every Saiga, "Made in Russia by Ishmash"? that doesnt convince you they are real?

How much more real do you need? My Saiga uses mil-spec AK mags, is 7.62 caliber, and was made in Russia.

if thats not a "real" AK, what is?

How come I can't see the picture?

icefire
06-25-2010, 12:48 PM
a real AK....

"real" AK's ARE made in the Ishmash factory...all others are not real. Saiga is the ONLY brand made there for civilian use...

CSACANNONEER
06-25-2010, 1:45 PM
"real" AK's ARE made in the Ishmash factory...all others are not real. Saiga is the ONLY brand made there for civilian use...

No, "real" AKs are made in caves using only sticks and stones. Any that are made in factories are cheap fakes.

HotRails
06-25-2010, 2:31 PM
Last time I was at Shooters Paradise in Oxnard CA, they had a Siaga 12.

Last time I was there they were treating anyone with OLL's as criminals. Im glad to see they have revised that policy. . .

dieselpower
06-25-2010, 3:37 PM
Last time I was there they were treating anyone with OLL's as criminals. Im glad to see they have revised that policy. . .

money talks....they now have AKs Siagas, ARs, FALs...all for twice the price as Uncle Pauls.