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monstertodd
06-13-2010, 10:56 PM
What's your opinion on this pistol?

Anyone have any FHE with this weapon?

I'm looking at the FNP .45 DA/SA USG for home defense.

Quiet
06-14-2010, 12:02 AM
It's not on the approved list, so not many people have experience with it.

NSR500
06-14-2010, 12:31 AM
I have an FNP45 and it has been 100% reliable with SAAMI spec ammo. I've done more testing with my gun and it will shoot WWB ammo, but the magazine will not feed WWB reliably. The problem is in the WWB ammo running long and jamming in the mag.
As soon as I get my night sights installed it'll be my SHTF pistol.

monstertodd
06-14-2010, 5:19 AM
It's not on the approved list, so not many people have experience with it.

That's a super bummer.

Is it because it has a 14/15 round magazine?

On their website, they have two different part numbers. One with a 14/15 round magazine, and one with a 10 round magazine.

Would the ten rounder be legal in CA?

Rhythm of Life
06-14-2010, 6:21 AM
No chance unless you get it through PPT. I was looking at those for a while too until I checked the roster :(

Hayashi Killian
06-14-2010, 6:28 AM
Would the ten rounder be legal in CA?
Only if it was on the roster. Only the FNP-9 and FNP-40 are on the roster, so you'd need to find someone willing to PPT it.

monstertodd
06-14-2010, 6:50 AM
Only if it was on the roster. Only the FNP-9 and FNP-40 are on the roster, so you'd need to find someone willing to PPT it.

Forgive my newbness, but what does PPT mean?

bigbob76
06-14-2010, 7:11 AM
Forgive my newbness, but what does PPT mean?

PPT means Private Party Transfer. If you have a handgun that's not on the CA DOJ approved roster you can sell it just like any other handgun. You meet the buyer at an FFL and do the paperwork. He pays you and the FFL holds the handgun while he is cleared during his 10 day wait. Many law enforcement officers buy handguns we can't buy new and when they want to sell them we can buy them PPT.

huck
06-14-2010, 7:11 AM
PPT=Private Party Transfer. If someone in CA already owns that pistol, he can sell it to you even though it's not on the roster. The sale has to go through a FFL.

I have a FNP-40. Great gun.

monstertodd
06-14-2010, 7:29 AM
Cool, thanks for the replies everybody.

So basically, I'm F&$^%d.

The only way I can legally own one of these in CA is to find a LEO who owns one, and have them sell it to me PPT?

What a bunch of B.S.

What is so different about this gun that it's not legal? How is it different than the HK45 or Springfield XD?

civilsnake
06-14-2010, 7:50 AM
Cool, thanks for the replies everybody.

So basically, I'm F&$^%d.

The only way I can legally own one of these in CA is to find a LEO who owns one, and have them sell it to me PPT?

What a bunch of B.S.

What is so different about this gun that it's not legal? How is it different than the HK45 or Springfield XD?

Well the HK45 isn't on the roster either LOL...

Most of the pistols currently on the roster could not get rostered now due to changes in the requirements. However, since they're already on the list they can stay as long as they pay on the regular. Currently CaDOJ requires a magazine disconnect (the gun won't fire if there's no magazine in the gun) and a sufficient (as defined by the DOJ, natch) Loaded Chamber Indicator. So far, the only gun I know of that actually meets the requirements is the Ruger SR9/SR9C. Pretty much any other firearm on the market would fail to meet the criteria, particularly for the approved LCI. But because most of these guns were on the roster before these new requirements, they can stay.

Hence, you're not going to see any pistols newer than, say, 2007 on the roster unless the company has specifically designed a version with California in mind.

Obviously this sucks, but at least most of the tried and true designs are still available to us for now, and with any luck we'll see the roster disappear in the next few years, allowing you your FNP45 goodness.


EDIT: Forgot to add: Do you by chance have a parent, grandparent, child, grandchild over 21 living out of state?

monstertodd
06-14-2010, 8:00 AM
Well the HK45 isn't on the roster either LOL...

Most of the pistols currently on the roster could not get rostered now due to changes in the requirements. However, since they're already on the list they can stay as long as they pay on the regular. Currently CaDOJ requires a magazine disconnect (the gun won't fire if there's no magazine in the gun) and a sufficient (as defined by the DOJ, natch) Loaded Chamber Indicator. So far, the only gun I know of that actually meets the requirements is the Ruger SR9/SR9C. Pretty much any other firearm on the market would fail to meet the criteria, particularly for the approved LCI. But because most of these guns were on the roster before these new requirements, they can stay.

Hence, you're not going to see any pistols newer than, say, 2007 on the roster unless the company has specifically designed a version with California in mind.

Obviously this sucks, but at least most of the tried and true designs are still available to us for now, and with any luck we'll see the roster disappear in the next few years, allowing you your FNP45 goodness.


EDIT: Forgot to add: Do you by chance have a parent, grandparent, child, grandchild over 21 living out of state?

Good info, thankyou!

Yea, my parents and sister live in Virginia.

civilsnake
06-14-2010, 8:06 AM
Good info, thankyou!

Yea, my parents and sister live in Virginia.

You might just be in luck then :D

There's an exemption to the roster laws for intrafamily gifts. If has to be through parental lineage, though; no brothers or sisters. If you have parents in Virginia that owned an FNP45, they could give it to you as a gift. There's a form to fill out and send to the CADOJ. I'm sure you can find it or someone who has the link handy will post it.

manuelcardenas77
06-14-2010, 8:14 AM
You might just be in luck then :D

There's an exemption to the roster laws for intrafamily gifts. If has to be through parental lineage, though; no brothers or sisters. If you have parents in Virginia that owned an FNP45, they could give it to you as a gift. There's a form to fill out and send to the CADOJ. I'm sure you can find it or someone who has the link handy will post it.
Sounds right!!

monstertodd
06-14-2010, 8:25 AM
You might just be in luck then :D

There's an exemption to the roster laws for intrafamily gifts. If has to be through parental lineage, though; no brothers or sisters. If you have parents in Virginia that owned an FNP45, they could give it to you as a gift. There's a form to fill out and send to the CADOJ. I'm sure you can find it or someone who has the link handy will post it.

Well, that IS good news then. :) Thankyou for that tidbit.

So how would that work if I'm at the range, and a LEO says "hey, let me see that". Do I just make sure I carry the CADOJ paperwork with me any time i'm shooting it?

xr650r
06-14-2010, 8:34 AM
Say "hey, get your own".

Hayashi Killian
06-14-2010, 8:40 AM
So how would that work if I'm at the range, and a LEO says "hey, let me see that". Do I just make sure I carry the CADOJ paperwork with me any time i'm shooting it?
"No."

monstertodd
06-14-2010, 8:40 AM
Say "hey, get your own".

lol, if I say that will it get my pistol confiscated and me in jail? he he.

huck
06-14-2010, 8:41 AM
Well, that IS good news then. :) Thankyou for that tidbit.

So how would that work if I'm at the range, and a LEO says "hey, let me see that". Do I just make sure I carry the CADOJ paperwork with me any time i'm shooting it?


It most likely won't happen. There are several laws like this in CA where it's legal to possess something, but illegal to buy it.

monstertodd
06-14-2010, 9:23 AM
All good info everybody thank you.

DaveFJ80
06-14-2010, 9:33 AM
You might just be in luck then :D

There's an exemption to the roster laws for intrafamily gifts. If has to be through parental lineage, though; no brothers or sisters. If you have parents in Virginia that owned an FNP45, they could give it to you as a gift. There's a form to fill out and send to the CADOJ. I'm sure you can find it or someone who has the link handy will post it.

I've been researching the intrafamily transfer rules quite a bit lately for handguns since I'm working on one right now. From what I've found out is that with a handgun transfer, if your parents are not CA residents (in this case they're VA residents), then a CA FFL is needed to do the transfer. His parents can either ship the gun to a CA FFL, or they can go in there in person with him to do the transaction, but it won't be a PPT and will need to be a transfer (with transfer fees applying). The form that needs to be filled out for the CADOJ is taken care of during the time of transfer at the FFL.

A couple more hurdles to jump through, but still easy enough to accomplish.

bigbob76
06-14-2010, 9:59 AM
I've been researching the intrafamily transfer rules quite a bit lately for handguns since I'm working on one right now. From what I've found out is that with a handgun transfer, if your parents are not CA residents (in this case they're VA residents), then a CA FFL is needed to do the transfer. His parents can either ship the gun to a CA FFL, or they can go in there in person with him to do the transaction, but it won't be a PPT and will need to be a transfer (with transfer fees applying). The form that needs to be filled out for the CADOJ is taken care of during the time of transfer at the FFL.

A couple more hurdles to jump through, but still easy enough to accomplish.

I'm not going to say you're wrong but I will say there have been thousands of these transfers done differently than you describe.

monstertodd
06-14-2010, 10:07 AM
Hey guys,

So I found this form on the CA DOJ website.

Is this the form I need for this type of transfer?

civilsnake
06-14-2010, 10:12 AM
So how would that work if I'm at the range, and a LEO says "hey, let me see that". Do I just make sure I carry the CADOJ paperwork with me any time i'm shooting it?

There is no law prohibiting the ownership of any handgun as long as it's not an "assault weapon", which a standard FNP45 is not based on its standard configuration. The tactical version has a threaded barrel, which is a nono in this state (assault weapon status for pistols).

Your parent can't legally give you the full capacity magazines, though. You would need to receive them disassembled and either permanently modify them to 10-rounders or just leave them apart in the state and buy 10-rounders from FN.

The DOJ paperwork is just for putting registration in your name. There's no need to carry a copy since the gun is perfectly legal to own. If a cop wants to see it you can let him or not. You can't get in trouble for it.

I've been researching the intrafamily transfer rules quite a bit lately for handguns since I'm working on one right now. From what I've found out is that with a handgun transfer, if your parents are not CA residents (in this case they're VA residents), then a CA FFL is needed to do the transfer. His parents can either ship the gun to a CA FFL, or they can go in there in person with him to do the transaction, but it won't be a PPT and will need to be a transfer (with transfer fees applying). The form that needs to be filled out for the CADOJ is taken care of during the time of transfer at the FFL.

A couple more hurdles to jump through, but still easy enough to accomplish.

I'm honestly not sure if these gift transfers require an FFL or not if there's shipping involved. I assume there would be. However, if your parents flew out to visit you and brought it with them, no FFL would be necessary for the transfer. The DOJ form would need to be sent in with the $19 fee so that California would know that the gun is now yours and register it to your name.

monstertodd
06-14-2010, 10:29 AM
There is no law prohibiting the ownership of any handgun as long as it's not an "assault weapon", which a standard FNP45 is not based on its standard configuration. The tactical version has a threaded barrel, which is a nono in this state (assault weapon status for pistols).

Your parent can't legally give you the full capacity magazines, though. You would need to receive them disassembled and either permanently modify them to 10-rounders or just leave them apart in the state and buy 10-rounders from FN.

The DOJ paperwork is just for putting registration in your name. There's no need to carry a copy since the gun is perfectly legal to own. If a cop wants to see it you can let him or not. You can't get in trouble for it.


I'm honestly not sure if these gift transfers require an FFL or not if there's shipping involved. I assume there would be. However, if your parents flew out to visit you and brought it with them, no FFL would be necessary for the transfer. The DOJ form would need to be sent in with the $19 fee so that California would know that the gun is now yours and register it to your name.

Yea, luckily FNH has two different part numbers for the FNP45. One is for the high capacity mags, and the other is for a 10 round mag.

More than likely, I would go to VA and receive the gift from my parents, and then transport it back to CA and send the paperwork in. But that is the correct form that I posted above yes?

civilsnake
06-14-2010, 12:15 PM
Yea, luckily FNH has two different part numbers for the FNP45. One is for the high capacity mags, and the other is for a 10 round mag.

More than likely, I would go to VA and receive the gift from my parents, and then transport it back to CA and send the paperwork in. But that is the correct form that I posted above yes?

Yes it is.

till44
06-14-2010, 6:04 PM
I owned one for a bit last year.

What I liked: very rough textured grip, I liked the ability to adjust size/shape of the grip, great point of aim, ambi mag release, and I loved the 15-14 rounds of 45!

What I didn't like: lack of holsters and ambi safety. I have big hands and with my thumb over thumb grip, every time I fired it would shove the pivot point of the safety into the base of my thumb. I tried adjusting my grip but couldn't break my habit/training. I kept the USP 45 and the G21 Ambi SF and sold the FNP.

If it fits your grip and style then its a great gun though.

saber
06-14-2010, 6:40 PM
You can't go out of state to receive a handgun since the BATFE (Federal Government) says that interstate transfers of firearms have to occur through a dealer. You can still physically do it but you would be in violation of Federal Law.

Quiet
06-14-2010, 10:34 PM
More than likely, I would go to VA and receive the gift from my parents, and then transport it back to CA and send the paperwork in. But that is the correct form that I posted above yes?
If you do this, both you and your parents will be committing Federal felonies.

I'm honestly not sure if these gift transfers require an FFL or not if there's shipping involved. I assume there would be. However, if your parents flew out to visit you and brought it with them, no FFL would be necessary for the transfer. The DOJ form would need to be sent in with the $19 fee so that California would know that the gun is now yours and register it to your name.

A CA FFL DEALER IS REQUIRED.

It does not matter if the handgun is shipped or if his parents bring it to CA, it must be transfered through a CA FFL dealer.

Federal laws prohibits the transfer of firearms between non-licensed residents of different states, unless the transfer is done through a FFL dealer in the recipiant's state of residence. [18 USC 922(a)(3) & (5)]

There is no gift exemption to the Federal laws.

So, in order to comply with Federal laws, the handgun must be transfered through a CA FFL dealer.

Failure to do so equates to a Federal felony for the giver and a a Federal felony for the receiver.

Just sending in the form will satisfy CA state law, but it also documents that the parties involved violated Federal laws.

monstertodd
06-14-2010, 11:21 PM
If you do this, both you and your parents will be committing Federal felonies.



A CA FFL DEALER IS REQUIRED.

It does not matter if the handgun is shipped or if his parents bring it to CA, it must be transfered through a CA FFL dealer.

Federal laws prohibits the transfer of firearms between non-licensed residents of different states, unless the transfer is done through a FFL dealer in the recipiant's state of residence. [18 USC 922(a)(3) & (5)]

There is no gift exemption to the Federal laws.

So, in order to comply with Federal laws, the handgun must be transfered through a CA FFL dealer.

Failure to do so equates to a Federal felony for the giver and a a Federal felony for the receiver.

Just sending in the form will satisfy CA state law, but it also documents that the parties involved violated Federal laws.

Ahhh, point taken. Thankyou for posting that. So then it would be better to transfer the gun through an FFL. lol.

I definitely don't want to make myself or my parents convicted felons.

NewbieDave
06-15-2010, 12:11 AM
All the transfer questions aside... FNP45 has the best DA trigger I've pulled in a *long* time. When I pulled the trigger on the first round, almost made me think I was shooting a striker-type trigger.


~dpc

monstertodd
06-15-2010, 6:48 AM
All the transfer questions aside... FNP45 has the best DA trigger I've pulled in a *long* time. When I pulled the trigger on the first round, almost made me think I was shooting a striker-type trigger.


~dpc

How were the ergos on the gun? I don't have huge hands, I have average size hands. Did you think it was comfortable? Did you try changing out the different back straps? How was the general operation of the gun? Was the slide smooth? Have any malfunctions while shooting it?

NewbieDave
06-15-2010, 7:41 AM
Ergo is very good since you can change out back strap. I went with small flat one... I have small hands. Slide and decocker is where it should be. No issues... I actually shoot WWB, Focciah and UMC without any problems. I just love the double actione pull... better then my Sig220. Just have to get a good holster for it now.

DarkHorse
06-15-2010, 1:37 PM
I haven't tried it yet, but I've read on the FN forums that an XD holster will work with some slight mods, or a Glock 21 holster will fit, but will be a little long. (Specifically, Blackhawk Serpa holsters.)

Crossbreed holsters and Bladetech both make units specifically for the FNP.45.

I would say I have small hands, but I use the arched backstrap at the moment. Don't have many rounds through it yet, so I don't know definitively which I like yet.

redline
06-15-2010, 2:06 PM
A few weeks ago, I had sent an inquiry about availability to FNH. Below is the reply. Assuming it's already been submitted (not quite clear), it looks like 9 months wait at the outside limit.


from <@fnhusa.com>
to "" <.com>
date Tue, Jun 1, 2010 at 11:43 AM
subject RE: FNP-45 for California Pistol Roster?


Yes!

The approval process usually takes from 6-9 months.



Thank you!

Customer Support

ext.

@fnhusa.com



From: [mailto:]
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2010 12:13 PM
To: info
Subject: FNP-45 for California Pistol Roster?

Hello:

Does FNH have any plans to submit the FNP-45 to the CA DOJ for inclusion on the so-called "safe list?"

monstertodd
06-16-2010, 4:52 AM
A few weeks ago, I had sent an inquiry about availability to FNH. Below is the reply. Assuming it's already been submitted (not quite clear), it looks like 9 months wait at the outside limit.


from <@fnhusa.com>
to "" <.com>
date Tue, Jun 1, 2010 at 11:43 AM
subject RE: FNP-45 for California Pistol Roster?


Yes!

The approval process usually takes from 6-9 months.



Thank you!

Customer Support

ext.

@fnhusa.com



From: [mailto:]
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2010 12:13 PM
To: info
Subject: FNP-45 for California Pistol Roster?

Hello:

Does FNH have any plans to submit the FNP-45 to the CA DOJ for inclusion on the so-called "safe list?"



hrmph, very short reply they gave you. I wonder if that is indicative of their customer service. :rolleyes: