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View Full Version : What is California's stance on stockless longguns?


NeoWeird
03-12-2006, 8:53 PM
A shooting buddy and I were talking the other day and we got talking about shotguns. I just prchased a 870 and was looking at the shotgun picture thread on arfcom where I saw some nice toys. I got to describing one of them, which had a pistol style grip with no stock, and the question of if that was legal in California came up. I assumed that as long as all other laws are follwed it would be legal, but the more I thought about it the more I was thinking California probably has some stupid obscure law that would make it a pistol or AOW style weapon.

So for the real question (practicallity aside as this is far more to understand the law than actual intent), would a longgun that is not illegal in any other way be legal without a stock? (ie: a shotgun with a pistol grip, bolt action with a pistol grip, or a fixed mag semi-auto with a pistol grip assuming that all three don't have any other evil features and meet both barrel and overall length requirments).

If a longgun requires a stock, how long does it need to be for it to be legal? If you cut off one inch everyone knows it is still a stock, but what happens if the stock is only one inch long in total? Would a AR pistol style of build with a (for legal sake to make sure we go over the length requirment) 24" barrel be legal if you used a pistol non-tube stock so it was just fluch in the back?

I know, off subject now, but anyone know for certain what the rule is when it comes to stockless longguns?

ohsmily
03-12-2006, 10:43 PM
Pistol grips without a buttstock on a shotgun is fine. They even sell some like that directly from the factory.

As long as you meet the overall minimum total length of 26" and a 18" barrel, you are good to go. As for pistol grips on those other types of guns, that is fine as well.

grammaton76
03-12-2006, 10:46 PM
I believe Turner's occasionally carries some shotguns in precisely the config you're talking about.

Mssr. Eleganté
03-12-2006, 10:51 PM
California law requires that semi-auto centerfire rifles be at least 30 inches in overall length.

So for shotguns, rimfires, and non-semi-auto centerfire rifles you just need to keep them over the 26 inch Federal limit and make sure the barrels are at least 18 inches on shotguns and 16 inches on rifles.

NeoWeird
03-12-2006, 10:58 PM
Hmmm that is good to hear. I was hoping to hear that I couldn't do it (glad I can though) because I didn't want to have this image of a small bastard shotgun for behind my truck seat and the side of my bed because I know sooner or later I will be stupid enough to build it.

Now I just need to keep myself from buying a 20-28 gauge shotgun and I should be ok, even though those ones on Gunbroker sure do look tempting.....

...

NO! remember the credit cards and near future wedding.

artherd
03-13-2006, 1:08 AM
California law requires that semi-auto centerfire rifles be at least 30 inches in overall length.
Only if they are capable of accepting a detachable magazine

For clarity's sake, a fixed-mag semiauto only must be 26" OAL (fed requirement)

So for shotguns, rimfires, and non-semi-auto centerfire rifles you just need to keep them over the 26 inch Federal limit and make sure the barrels are at least 18 inches on shotguns and 16 inches on rifles.
correct, also covers non-DM semi-autos centerfires, as above.

Mssr. Eleganté
03-13-2006, 5:35 AM
Only if they are capable of accepting a detachable magazine

For clarity's sake, a fixed-mag semiauto only must be 26" OAL (fed requirement)

The 30 inch minimum requirement is for all semi-auto centerfire rifles, even if they have a fixed magazine.

See section 12276.1(a)(3) of California law.

shopkeep
03-13-2006, 10:18 AM
Only if they are capable of accepting a detachable magazine

For clarity's sake, a fixed-mag semiauto only must be 26" OAL (fed requirement)


correct, also covers non-DM semi-autos centerfires, as above.

THANK GOD! You guys scared the crap out of me!!! Of course this brings up a question about my carbine:

If it's less than 30 inches with an ACE Entry stock and 14.5" barrel (don't worry I pinned/welded a break on it) I have to add some extra length to it to run a detachable mag setup? Is there any recoil pads or anything to extend the length of the entry stock?

bwiese
03-13-2006, 10:45 AM
No No No No!!!

Detachable magazine status is not relevant to the 30" overall length issue in CA:

12276.1. (a) Notwithstanding Section 12276, "assault weapon" shall also mean any of the following:
.
.
.
(2) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has an overall length of less than 30 inches.

This is one of the alternate definitions of a rifle-based assault weapon; the other two are the evil features combo w/detachable magazine, or a rifle that has a fixed mag holding more than 10 rds.

Keep it 30" or over if it's any semiauto centerfire rifle to avoid being considered an AW.

The over-30" attribute is not relevant to CA AW status for shotguns.