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Steyr_223
05-10-2010, 2:10 PM
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100509/ap_on_el_se/us_utah_senate

By BROCK VERGAKIS, Associated Press Writer Brock Vergakis, Associated Press Writer Sun May 9, 10:23 am ET

SALT LAKE CITY Once-popular Sen. Bob Bennett fell victim to a growing national conservative movement with his stunning defeat at Utah's GOP convention.

Delegates voted Saturday to bar the 76-year-old senator from seeking a fourth term, making him the first congressional incumbent to be ousted this year and demonstrates the challenges candidates face from the right in 2010.

Bennett was under fire for voting to bail out Wall Street, co-sponsoring a bipartisan bill mandating health insurance coverage and for aggressively pursuing earmarks.

"The political atmosphere obviously has been toxic, and it's very clear that some of the votes that I have cast have added to the toxic environment," Bennett told reporters Saturday, choking back tears.

"Looking back on them, with one or two very minor exceptions, I wouldn't have cast any of them any differently, even if I had known at the time they were going to cost me my career."

Bennett told The Associated Press he wouldn't rule out a write-in candidacy. State law prohibits him from running as an independent.

"I do think I still have a lot of juice left in me," Bennett said following his loss. "We'll see what the future may bring."

Bennett survived a first round of voting Saturday among roughly 3,500 delegates but was eliminated when he finished a distant third in the second round. He garnered just under 27 percent of the vote, while businessman Tim Bridgewater had 37 percent, and attorney Mike Lee got 36 percent. Lee and Bridgewater will face each other in a June 22 primary after a third round of voting in which neither got the 60 percent necessary to win outright.

"Don't take a chance on a newcomer," Bennett had pleaded in his brief speech to the delegates before the second round of voting began. "There's too much at stake."

Yet that urging, and Bennett's endorsements by the National Rifle Association and former presidential candidate Mitt Romney, did little to stave off anger toward the Washington establishment from delegates.

http://www.bennettforsenate.com/site/c.qkLUJ3MNKrH/b.5908005/k.7A32/NRA_Endorsement_Letter.htm?msource=BB100402EM&tr=y&auid=6160121

NATIONAL RIFLE ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA
POLITICAL VICTORY FUND
11250 WAPLES MILL ROAD
FAIRFAX, VIRGINIA 22030

March 17, 2010

The Honorable Robert F. Bennett
United States Senate
175 South West Temple, Suite 650
Salt Lake City, Utah 84101

Dear Senator Bennett:

On behalf of our four million members across the country, the National Rifle Association Political Victory Fund is proud to endorse you for re-election in your party's nomination for the United States Senate in Utah. Based on your solid pro-gun voting record in Congress, you have earned an "A" rating from the NRA-PVF.

As a U.S. Senator, you have demonstrated a proven and consistent commitment to our Second Amendment rights by supporting and voting for important federal legislation enacted into law to curb bogus lawsuits against gun manufacturers and to prohibit gun confiscation during states of emergency. We also appreciate you voting for the national Right-to-Carry reciprocity amendment that would allow any person with a valid concealed firearm carrying license or permit, issued by a state, to carry a concealed firearm in other states. You have also helped to restore self-defense rights in our nation's capital by cosponsoring and voting for the D.C. Personal Protection Act, as well as signing the pro-gun congressional amicus brief to the Supreme Court supporting our individual Right to Keep and Bear Arms in the Heller case. Most recently you signed the pro-gun congressional amicus brief that the Second Amendment applies to state and local governments in the McDonald case now before the Supreme Court. Finally, we appreciate your cosponsorship of and support for legislation to force reform at the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.

Again, thank you for your unwavering support for Utah's gun owners, hunters and shooters. Good luck and we look forward to our continued relationship.

Sincerely,

Chris W. Cox
Chairman

bwiese
05-10-2010, 2:24 PM
Fortunately there are not really any gunrights problems in Utah, so people apparently are less worried about the Fed/national issues that Bennett helped on - and/or are again worrying about other trivia over gunrights.

What worries me is that in NV, Harry Reid has been the gun owner's friend on a NATIONAL basis - he helped drive PLCAA, which saved the 2nd Amendment. (You can't really have an enforced right without a thriving commerce to support it: one side bolsters the other). PLCAA backs Heller & derivatives and vice versa.

Yet at the NV gunshows you see some NRA folks skirting around with the anti-Reid booth staff. Word needs to come down from On High and these NRA volunteers need to figure out if they're NRA gunrights activies or worrywarts for <item#2...N> that got a free hat.

bulgron
05-10-2010, 3:55 PM
Fortunately there are not really any gunrights problems in Utah, so people apparently are less worried about the Fed/national issues that Bennett helped on - and/or are again worrying about other trivia over gunrights.

What worries me is that in NV, Harry Reid has been the gun owner's friend on a NATIONAL basis - he helped drive PLCAA, which saved the 2nd Amendment. (You can't really have an enforced right without a thriving commerce to support it: one side bolsters the other). PLCAA backs Heller & derivatives and vice versa.

Yet at the NV gunshows you see some NRA folks skirting around with the anti-Reid booth staff. Word needs to come down from On High and these NRA volunteers need to figure out if they're NRA gunrights activies or worrywarts for <item#2...N> that got a free hat.

This is true only if any of the possible replacements for Reid is a lesser friend of the 2A than Reid is.

So who is running against Reid? And are any of them worse on the 2A than Reid is?

There is a bigger picture here, and we see it every time that a new SCOTUS nominee comes up. We need the Republican party to have enough clout in Washington that they can shut down an overtly anti-2A nominee should Obama put one up. Reid might be pro-2A, but being a Democrat I don't see him bucking Obama on a bad SCOTUS nominee. A pro-2A Republican replacement would do that bucking.

Frankly, given that we're talking about Nevada, I'm having trouble believing that any serious contender for a Senate seat in that state will be horrible on guns. So assuming that we have a full field of pro-2A candidates running for that seat, then I fully expect <#item 2..N> to decide who gets that seat.

a1c
05-10-2010, 3:59 PM
The Tea Party movement strikes again.

Let's hope their leaders and activists realize soon that all they're doing is hurting the GOP.

Window_Seat
05-10-2010, 4:32 PM
The Tea Party movement strikes again.

Let's hope their leaders and activists realize soon that all they're doing is hurting the GOP.

Hurting the GOP does not necessarily mean favoring the (D)s. Remember, we have g/als in the GOP that will favor total confiscation.

Erik; thinking ahead.

socalblue
05-10-2010, 4:44 PM
Lets see here ... cost us over 2 TRILLION $$ while representing a VERY fiscally conservative state. He is far out of touch with the average UT voter so he wasn't invited to back. Given there are no RKBA issues in UT his stance there had essentially zero impact.

hayesman76
05-10-2010, 4:49 PM
The Tea Party movement strikes again.

Let's hope their leaders and activists realize soon that all they're doing is hurting the GOP.

As if the GOP, with its Schwarzeneggers and Whitmans et al are "helping" 2nd Amendment supporters? That's the kind of "help" we don't need.

bwiese
05-10-2010, 4:54 PM
Fortunately there are not really any gunrights problems in Utah, so people apparently are less worried about the Fed/national issues that Bennett helped on - and/or are again worrying about other trivia over gunrights.

What worries me is that in NV, Harry Reid has been the gun owner's friend on a NATIONAL basis - he helped drive PLCAA, which saved the 2nd Amendment. (You can't really have an enforced right without a thriving commerce to support it: one side bolsters the other). PLCAA backs Heller & derivatives and vice versa.

Yet at the NV gunshows you see some NRA folks skirting around with the anti-Reid booth staff. Word needs to come down from On High and these NRA volunteers need to figure out if they're NRA gunrights activies or worrywarts for <item#2...N> that got a free hat.


This is true only if any of the possible replacements for Reid is a lesser friend of the 2A than Reid is.


Not quite; the NRA principle is to always support your friends and keep them elected as a reward for continued good behavior.

Reid's pretty much earned a Lifetime Achievement Award for his shepherding and stewardship of PLCAA.

Even if a pro-gun person as good as Reid on guns were to run against him, I believe Reid would be supported, unless Reid wavered and dropped the ball on some gun issues (Highly unlikely.). That way NRA's support is sought and valued and not "will-o'-the-wisp", unless some factionalism creeps into NRA support - I'd hope not.

Reid's facing some Republican challengers and it could be a tight race.


So who is running against Reid? And are any of them worse on the 2A than Reid is?Dunno, but 'promises' vs. 'demonstrated accomplishment' would favor Reid on gun issues.

I'd think NRA support for Reid would last until he loses/retires. It also helps keep other Dems out....

If LV metro area dominates the political skew - as it seems to - a Reid Dem successor may well be a real SEIU-style 'urban Dem', and that person could have a chance of being elected.

M198
05-10-2010, 10:13 PM
If Reid is voted out, that's very bad news for gun owners. When is the next time you expect to see a Democrat Senate majority (or Minority) leader who is very pro RKBA? Like it or not, Harry Reid controls most of the Senate and I don't think you'd want Dick Durbin (rated F) as the Majority/Minority Senate leader.

REH
05-10-2010, 10:31 PM
Lets see here ... cost us over 2 TRILLION $$ while representing a VERY fiscally conservative state. He is far out of touch with the average UT voter so he wasn't invited to back. Given there are no RKBA issues in UT his stance there had essentially zero impact.

You don't want to fall into the R or D trap. Look what the person stands for, then vote. We got Arnold because he had a R after his name. Learn from the past.

press1280
05-11-2010, 12:48 AM
Take note that some of the Dems like Reid in conservative states are "allowed" to vote pro-gun because of the large majority in congress. The national reciprocity bill is one example. If its a 50-50 tie and someone like Reid puts nat'l reciprocity over the top, then I'd really believe it.

Meplat
05-11-2010, 1:32 AM
The Tea Party movement strikes again.

Let's hope their leaders and activists realize soon that all they're doing is hurting the GOP.

Screw the GOP, Liberty is more important than any party.

Meplat
05-11-2010, 1:46 AM
If Reid is voted out, that's very bad news for gun owners. When is the next time you expect to see a Democrat Senate majority (or Minority) leader who is very pro RKBA? Like it or not, Harry Reid controls most of the Senate and I don't think you'd want Dick Durbin (rated F) as the Majority/Minority Senate leader.

Harry Reed controls nothing, he kisses the asses of and does parlor tricks for the neo-Marxists. That is why he is in trouble.

Wake up.

Billy Jack
05-11-2010, 6:37 AM
I have warned here before to stop being one trick ponies. Tea Party members are also firearm owners but we realize that issue alone does not qualify anyone at any level for public service. There are actually other Amendments to the Constitution.

Please do your homework, Tea Party members support the entire Constitution and we turn out people by the hundreds of thousands. Firearm owners can not match those numbers. Come join us at a Tea Party near you. Do your due diligence on the movement. We can help your cause if you will see the bigger picture.

Billy Jack
'The force is strong with this one'



www.californiaconcealedcarry.com

turbosbox
05-11-2010, 6:57 AM
I have warned here before to stop being one trick ponies. Tea Party members are also firearm owners but we realize that issue alone does not qualify anyone at any level for public service. There are actually other Amendments to the Constitution.
Please do your homework, Tea Party members support the entire Constitution and we turn out people by the hundreds of thousands. Firearm owners can not match those numbers. Come join us at a Tea Party near you. Do your due diligence on the movement. We can help your cause if you will see the bigger picture.
Billy Jack
'The force is strong with this one'
www.californiaconcealedcarry.com

The people I know who support the Tea party movement also feel that way. Being a fiscal conservative is necessary to avoid our country falling into collapse like Greece. That must take priority in consideration, closely followed by other rights.

The Director
05-11-2010, 7:21 AM
I have warned here before to stop being one trick ponies. Tea Party members are also firearm owners but we realize that issue alone does not qualify anyone at any level for public service. There are actually other Amendments to the Constitution.

Please do your homework, Tea Party members support the entire Constitution and we turn out people by the hundreds of thousands. Firearm owners can not match those numbers. Come join us at a Tea Party near you. Do your due diligence on the movement. We can help your cause if you will see the bigger picture.

Billy Jack
'The force is strong with this one'



www.californiaconcealedcarry.com

I actually agree with this. There are much bigger issues at hand than simply 2A stuff. I think we can get a little myopic at times.

bwiese
05-11-2010, 8:28 AM
Take note that some of the Dems like Reid in conservative states are "allowed" to vote pro-gun because of the large majority in congress. The national reciprocity bill is one example. If its a 50-50 tie and someone like Reid puts nat'l reciprocity over the top, then I'd really believe it.

Reid did push PLCAA to success.

stag1500
05-11-2010, 9:01 AM
Let's not forget about Montana's two Democrat Senators who wrote to AG Holder last year urging him not to push for renewing the Fed AWB.

Bad Voodoo
05-11-2010, 9:11 AM
Screw the GOP, Liberty is more important than any party.

E-X-A-C-T-L-Y right. And I agree w/ others in this thread re: Reid. He was dancing w/ the devil for so long he forgot you weren't supposed to look him in the eye.

Texas Boy
05-11-2010, 9:16 AM
Billy Jack is on Track! THE issue is a small and constrained government. A big powerful government that becomes more and more socialist will inevitably turn on gun owners - or kill the economy to the point that nothing else matters.

The only sustainable path is a constrained government (and a constrained population - which translates to immigration reform, since our population growth is only due to immigration).

Bad Voodoo
05-11-2010, 9:38 AM
Voting single-issue in CA is going to solve our problems how?

http://www.businessinsider.com/why-california-is-the-next-greece-2010-05

I think what we have here is a case of liberal guilt, by folks who happen to feel passionately about the 2A. Sorry, I'm not following anyone over THAT cliff. That's how we got here in the first place.

Liberty IS the answer. Liberty in ALL its forms and graces.

Billy Jack
05-11-2010, 10:16 AM
Tea Party Patriots http://www.teapartypatriots.org/

Come take a look. We are for smaller government, less taxes, less interference in our lives, accountability. Yes, we do sound like Libertarians but we are not. Unlike what the state media would like you to believe, we do not align ourselves with any party. Our philosophy is Constitutional, plain and simple. I have met current and retired LEOS, military, business people, soccer moms, gays, every color under the rainbow and we all shared one thing, our passion for the Constitution. Unlike members of Congress many of us have read the Constitution and recent Bills that they passed without reading.

Look forward to seeing some of you at these rallies.

Billy Jack
Patriot &
Son of Liberty

GuyW
05-12-2010, 9:16 AM
Not quite; the NRA principle is to always support your friends and keep them elected as a reward for continued good behavior.


Yeah? We'll see.

I'm guessing that an NRA A-rating means a candidate is a "friend".....or is the NRA rating system corrupted and gamed by NRA insiders?

.

GuyW
05-12-2010, 9:20 AM
Liberty is more important than any party.

I'm GOP. Most of the GOP base is pissed off - the GOP needs to get its head on straight and return to small government and implementing our principles...go Tea Partiers....

.

cmaynes
05-12-2010, 9:52 AM
Fortunately there are not really any gunrights problems in Utah, so people apparently are less worried about the Fed/national issues that Bennett helped on - and/or are again worrying about other trivia over gunrights.

What worries me is that in NV, Harry Reid has been the gun owner's friend on a NATIONAL basis - he helped drive PLCAA, which saved the 2nd Amendment. (You can't really have an enforced right without a thriving commerce to support it: one side bolsters the other). PLCAA backs Heller & derivatives and vice versa.

Yet at the NV gunshows you see some NRA folks skirting around with the anti-Reid booth staff. Word needs to come down from On High and these NRA volunteers need to figure out if they're NRA gunrights activies or worrywarts for <item#2...N> that got a free hat.



I do a good deal of class III business in Nevada and the vendors there are of mixed opinion on Reid- I personally feel it would be a horrible thing to see him unseated- as Majority leader in the Senate, protecting his own *** with Nevada's voters directly protects guns rights everywhere. In this case, I disagree VERY emphatically with any NRA support of a first term Republican getting his seat.

Window_Seat
05-12-2010, 1:21 PM
Many GOPers are soon going to realize that it's a matter of when they don't leave the party, but the party leaves them.

I agree 1000% with Billy Jack, but my question about the TP movement is that is it going to continue, or will it stop? I haven't heard of any up & coming rallies.

One can be loud, then go home at 10:00.

The worst thing we can do is stop at the end of the day, because that is what those who trample all over the COTUS expect us to do.

Erik.

Legasat
05-12-2010, 2:46 PM
2A is a very important issue for me, but not the only important issue.

gunsmith
05-12-2010, 2:47 PM
This is true only if any of the possible replacements for Reid is a lesser friend of the 2A than Reid is.

So who is running against Reid? And are any of them worse on the 2A than Reid is?

There is a bigger picture here, and we see it every time that a new SCOTUS nominee comes up. We need the Republican party to have enough clout in Washington that they can shut down an overtly anti-2A nominee should Obama put one up. Reid might be pro-2A, but being a Democrat I don't see him bucking Obama on a bad SCOTUS nominee. A pro-2A Republican replacement would do that bucking.

Frankly, given that we're talking about Nevada, I'm having trouble believing that any serious contender for a Senate seat in that state will be horrible on guns. So assuming that we have a full field of pro-2A candidates running for that seat, then I fully expect <#item 2..N> to decide who gets that seat.


I'm living back in NV now, CA was a big mistake-I still love calguns and will contribute what I can though. WRT Reid, the guy is hugely unpopular. I talked to(some of ) his possible opponents, the R's support VT carry. D's in NV would be considered right wing extremist in most of CA. I'm a life member of the NRA & just because they support him & I support the NRA doesn't mean I'll vote for Harry. There is a lot of anger here in NV.

oh yeah, Harry will lose, to an R. Any R can whip him right now, the Tea Party candidate ( Angle I think ) would win by a large margin, solidly pro gun. did I say there is a lot of anger here in NV.
B.O has hurt Vegas with all his neg comments, D's are on the ropes here now.

Paladin
05-12-2010, 8:31 PM
Tea Party Patriots http://www.teapartypatriots.org/

Come take a look. We are for smaller government, less taxes, less interference in our lives, accountability. Yes, we do sound like Libertarians but we are not. Unlike what the state media would like you to believe, we do not align ourselves with any party. Our philosophy is Constitutional, plain and simple. I have met current and retired LEOS, military, business people, soccer moms, gays, every color under the rainbow and we all shared one thing, our passion for the Constitution. Unlike members of Congress many of us have read the Constitution and recent Bills that they passed without reading.

Look forward to seeing some of you at these rallies.

Billy Jack
Patriot &
Son of Liberty

I have to say that I agree w/BJ on this. There are other important issues of the day. Some of my top public policy issues are: (1) promoting RKBA; (2) stopping illegal immigration; (3) promoting/speeding up the death penalty (See: "Studies: Death Penalty Discourages Crime" (http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,280215,00.html), and "John Lott: Death as Deterrent" (http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,284336,00.html));(4) promoting economic conservatism/fighting socialism; and (5) strong national defense.

Re. #2: Personally, I'd rather live in CA w/its current gun laws than live in a Latin American country w/"Shall Issue", legal hicaps, no AWB, and no handgun roster, and that is what this state (and our nation) will become very quickly if we don't get control of our borders and start deporting illegal immigrants, families and all. Anyone who thinks that our 2nd A RKBA will be secure by having tens of millions of voters who, at best, may have a Mexican high school education and can parrot parts of our Constitution has been smoking something (for medicinal purposes, of course).

This isn't about race. This is about culture and how people think and behave (and thus vote). Multiculturalism has stopped assimilation and thus "they" are not becoming one of "us." Just as having a plurality of ghetto people will turn any community into a ghetto (see: "American Murder Mystery," The Atlantic, http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2008/07/american-murder-mystery/6872/), so too having a plurality of Third World people will turn our country into a Third World country. Americans and the American way of life are being displaced by foreigners maintaining a foreign way of life. (Kind of makes you wonder why the liberals who insisted on family planning/birth control/etc in the 1970s, '80s, and '90s are not outraged at the huge influx of immigrants over the past three decades. Where's all the outcry for population control now? Or did they just want to displace and replace those despised WASPs who had a heritage and culture of freedom, self-reliance, and self-governance w/those who do not and will vote for socialism/totalitarianism?)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RM9uH4XgOmI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYOMJf7XOek

Other issues are important. If you don't believe me, just look at what socialist Greece is going through (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6443GA20100506). There is a very real risk that insolvency, too, may be in our (CA and/or USA) future (issue #4 above). Conditions like that could easily be manipulated to justify a government take over of the economy and restriction of rights, with or without a court's approval. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_uY9y8LOio

While I won't vote for an anti, Heller and McDonald will help restrain all politicians, thus allowing me to weigh other issues in deciding for whom to vote.

RRangel
05-12-2010, 9:19 PM
The Tea Party movement strikes again.

Let's hope their leaders and activists realize soon that all they're doing is hurting the GOP.

Bennet being gone is certainly a big deal, but in a way that's good for those who espouse freedom. He's been around too long and he got comfortable. His constituents were not pleased. His loss was calculated, and there is no shortage of good representatives in Utah, as in California.

The Tea Party is making the real legislative phonies, who will two face you on gun rights, shake in their boots. As it should be. Most of the rhetoric we now hear about the "evil" Tea Party is created by the liberal establishment who fear it.

It seems to be ok that leftist malcontents create near riots and disasters at every protest where they assemble. The Tea Party is the literal antithesis of such anti-American groups.

gunsmith
05-13-2010, 8:44 AM
Bennet being gone is certainly a big deal, but in a way that's good for those who espouse freedom. He's been around too long and he got comfortable. His constituents were not pleased. His loss was calculated, and there is no shortage of good representatives in Utah, as in California.

The Tea Party is making the real legislative phonies, who will two face you on gun rights, shake in their boots. As it should be. Most of the rhetoric we now hear about the "evil" Tea Party is created by the liberal establishment who fear it.

It seems to be ok that leftist malcontents create near riots and disasters at every protest where they assemble. The Tea Party is the literal antithesis of such anti-American groups.

The rinos want slave labor ( illegals ) the D's want slave votes both of the give a rats azz about RKBA and even though Harry is nominally pro gun ( afaik he supported the 94 AWB )
he would probably vote to appoint anti's to the Bench.

bwiese
05-13-2010, 8:49 AM
The rinos want slave labor ( illegals ) the D's want slave votes both of the give a rats azz about RKBA and even though Harry is nominally pro gun ( afaik he supported the 94 AWB )
he would probably vote to appoint anti's to the Bench.

IIRC, Harry Reid did not support Fed AW ban.

Again, what happens here is we have NV gunnies worrying about non-gun issues and screwing their message.

What's worse, as I've pointed out, is folks doing on-the-ground NRA work appear disobedient and supportive of attacks on Reid, not realizing the word from On High is to *support* Reid.

stormy_clothing
05-13-2010, 9:09 AM
Maybe it's just me but right now the NRA doesn't have any affect on who I'd vote for. Harry Reid was a good politician until he took the democratic bulldozer too far for his constituents to follow. I don't really feel that his pro gun stance is going to save him so the NRA should be thinking long and hard about what new friends they need to make to keep there message strong IMO.

I would'nt knock him to hard since Reids power and standing > stormy's power and standing. But I certainly think he should have stood out on some issues.

While I can't further comment on it I expect some promise to come out of UT in the next few years.

GuyW
05-13-2010, 9:19 PM
What's worse, as I've pointed out, is folks doing on-the-ground NRA work appear disobedient and supportive of attacks on Reid, not realizing the word from On High is to *support* Reid.

If we are to take the NRA at its word(s) - it is a grassroots member organization. Not so??

...freedom is messy that way....
.

PORCH
05-13-2010, 10:43 PM
Bill what about the question that others have posed concerning SCOTUS nominees? Do you think that Reid would turn his back on Obama in favor of the 2A? Where as a pro 2A republican would have no problem giving a no vote. Isn't that just as important?

Uriah02
05-13-2010, 10:54 PM
Not quite; the NRA principle is to always support your friends and keep them elected as a reward for continued good behavior.

Reid's pretty much earned a Lifetime Achievement Award for his shepherding and stewardship of PLCAA.

Even if a pro-gun person as good as Reid on guns were to run against him, I believe Reid would be supported, unless Reid wavered and dropped the ball on some gun issues (Highly unlikely.). That way NRA's support is sought and valued and not "will-o'-the-wisp", unless some factionalism creeps into NRA support - I'd hope not.

Reid's facing some Republican challengers and it could be a tight race.


Dunno, but 'promises' vs. 'demonstrated accomplishment' would favor Reid on gun issues.

I'd think NRA support for Reid would last until he loses/retires. It also helps keep other Dems out....

If LV metro area dominates the political skew - as it seems to - a Reid Dem successor may well be a real SEIU-style 'urban Dem', and that person could have a chance of being elected.

I can see how that makes sense if RKBA is a single issue, but when it comes to the national elections, I would say not even many calgunners are single issue voters.

SteveH
05-14-2010, 10:23 AM
There are many issues other than guns.

Guns wont matter much if your kids can't get a decent job because they dont recite the party line well enough or have the right skin color. Or when they do get a job the have to give half their pay to the government under threat of arrest to pay for other peoples food, housing and health care.

SteveH
05-14-2010, 10:23 AM
IIRC, Harry Reid did not support Fed AW ban.



I believe he voted for it and against it both.

2Cute2Shoot
05-14-2010, 10:38 AM
Lets see here ... cost us over 2 TRILLION $$ while representing a VERY fiscally conservative state. He is far out of touch with the average UT voter so he wasn't invited to back. Given there are no RKBA issues in UT his stance there had essentially zero impact.

But why would the NRA support somebody like that :confused:

bwiese
05-14-2010, 10:50 AM
But why would the NRA support somebody like that :confused:

NRA stance is to only support someone based on being pro-RKBA, and to support a tested pro-RKBA incumbent over an untested challenger.

The message to inferred from that is, "NRA tries to keeps you in your seat". That's the only way the game works.

The "R" in NRA generally stands for "Rifle" and not "rightwing".

We've seen the problems in California when other gun groups use gun rights as a hook into Republican politics.

It's also why I'm a single-issue voter.

Paladin
05-14-2010, 3:52 PM
But why would the NRA support somebody like that :confused:2C2S, earlier this week the NRA explained the process they use for grading candidates at:
http://www.nrapvf.org/News/Article.aspx?ID=413

Cokebottle
05-14-2010, 6:00 PM
The Tea Party movement strikes again.

Let's hope their leaders and activists realize soon that all they're doing is hurting the GOP.
The GOP hurt the GOP.

Today's GOP is more left than JFK's Democrat party.

Bunch of fuggin' RINOs, and it's pot calling the kettle black when they called Kerry a flip-flopper.

Now we've got Palin endorsing Carly... another Arnold.
I was wondering why her name was familiar... she's the late Ted Kennedy's Sister in Law.

2Cute2Shoot
05-14-2010, 6:07 PM
2C2S, earlier this week the NRA explained the process they use for grading candidates at:
http://www.nrapvf.org/News/Article.aspx?ID=413

So it's the incumbent thing?:confused:

Even if there is a better candidate out there?

So I guess even if the NRA endorses someone, we still have to look at the other candidates because there could be someone a lot better!

GuyW
05-14-2010, 6:15 PM
So it's the incumbent thing?:confused:

Even if there is a better candidate out there?

So I guess even if the NRA endorses someone, we still have to look at the other candidates because there could be someone a lot better!

So much for Truth, Justice and the American Way....

.

Paladin
05-14-2010, 9:41 PM
So it's the incumbent thing?:confused:That and them being a single issue organization (which is what we want it to be). That DOESN'T mean you can't factor in other issues or grades by other single issue organizations dealing w/other issues you care about when deciding for whom to vote.

Even if there is a better candidate out there?The NRA heeds the old proverb that "A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush."

So I guess even if the NRA endorses someone, we still have to look at the other candidates because there could be someone a lot better!Well, that depends upon what you mean by "a lot better." A lot better re. 2nd A RKBA or re. other issues that are also important to you?

While our RKBA is obviously extremely important to me, per my post #29 above, it is not the only public policy issue I care about. Fortunately, most of my issues fall under the general banner of "conservatism," both social and economic. Unfortunately, in CA and esp in the Bay Area where I live, a consistent conservative will not get very far in politics. So I have to weigh the issues, the candidates, the level of gov't they're running for, whether they'll impact the judiciary, if so, fed or state, and many other factors to decide who will have the best impact on my city/county, state, and country. After that, it is in God's hands.

Even though my vote is pretty much spitting in the wind in local and state races that doesn't mean I can't send money to support good organizations or candidates in other cities/counties or states who can improve their own state or our country.

Meplat
05-14-2010, 10:06 PM
The Tea Party movement strikes again.

Let's hope their leaders and activists realize soon that all they're doing is hurting the GOP.

The GOP needs to get on board or get left behind.:p

Meplat
05-14-2010, 10:28 PM
I'm GOP. Most of the GOP base is pissed off - the GOP needs to get its head on straight and return to small government and implementing our principles...go Tea Partiers....

.

+100

Meplat
05-14-2010, 10:42 PM
D uberalis?

IIRC, Harry Reid did not support Fed AW ban.

Again, what happens here is we have NV gunnies worrying about non-gun issues and screwing their message.

What's worse, as I've pointed out, is folks doing on-the-ground NRA work appear disobedient and supportive of attacks on Reid, not realizing the word from On High is to *support* Reid.

2Cute2Shoot
05-14-2010, 10:49 PM
So I guess even if the NRA endorses someone, we still have to look at the other candidates because there could be someone a lot better!


Well, that depends upon what you mean by "a lot better." A lot better re. 2nd A RKBA or re. other issues that are also important to you?

While our RKBA is obviously extremely important to me, per my post #29 above, it is not the only public policy issue I care about. Fortunately, most of my issues fall under the general banner of "conservatism," both social and economic. Unfortunately, in CA and esp in the Bay Area where I live, a consistent conservative will not get very far in politics. So I have to weigh the issues, the candidates, the level of gov't they're running for, whether they'll impact the judiciary, if so, fed or state, and many other factors to decide who will have the best impact on my city/county, state, and country. After that, it is in God's hands.

Even though my vote is pretty much spitting in the wind in local and state races that doesn't mean I can't send money to support good organizations or candidates in other cities/counties or states who can improve their own state or our country.

I know the NRA is going to be 'single issue' but it sounds like from their website that there might be a more 'pro-gun' candidate, but they would take the incumbent even if he was less 'pro-gun'??? Is that good for us gun owners?:confused:

Paladin
05-15-2010, 9:40 AM
I know the NRA is going to be 'single issue' but it sounds like from their website that there might be a more 'pro-gun' candidate, but they would take the incumbent even if he was less 'pro-gun'??? Is that good for us gun owners?:confused:

If the contender also has a strong RKBA legislative record, let's say at the state level, and now they're running against a federal level incumbent who also has a strong RKBA record, I'm not sure how the NRA would decide. They might say that both have earned As (or whatever the grade is), and endorse both of them. Has anyone seen such a situation and recall what the NRA-PVF did?

If the contender only promises to be a strong RKBA supporter and does NOT have a legislative record, well, promises are too easy to make, even if sincere. The incumbent who has proven themselves to support our RKBA by their votes should get the endorsement.

Things get muddy when you've got a strong RKBA supporter challenger w/o a voting record versus a moderate supporter of RKBA incumbent. A potential "good" (who may really just be a deceiver) versus an "okay" known. (FWIW, IIRC GHWB bought a Life Membership in the NRA a year or so before running for president knowing that the press would call him "a lifetime member of the NRA" and thus draw more conservative support.)

tankarian
05-15-2010, 10:02 AM
House cleaning time for the GOP. Throw the bums out.
When will the Dems start throwing out their own marxist garbage out of their own house and become the Party of JFK once again?

gunsmith
05-16-2010, 4:00 PM
Well, Sharon Angle came to the town I live in and convinced me to vote for her.
Harry ( so far ) has not.
Sharon told me she is in favor of national reciprocity, but she would prefer VT/AK carry personally and that what she would try to do.
Even if I did vote for Harry, it wouldn't make a bit of difference. Krusty the clown could beat Harry, the NV Dem's are conservative maniacs compared to CA repubs . ... I doubt many D's are voting for Harry, the D party has proven it hates Vegas and northern NV is repub so Harry's time is up. He was really good to gun owners but that didn't prove to be enough for all Nevadans. if BO hadn't made all those neg comments about Vegas he would have won. at least thats the way i see it in northern NV

goodlookin1
05-16-2010, 4:56 PM
Me to Bob Bennett: GOOD RIDDANCE

Most Repubs are no longer true Repubs. This is what you get when you dont listen to your constituents, or fall out of line with the party you are supposed to represent. Gun rights supporter or not, this guy deserved the boot.

I'm sick and tired of being forced to vote for a "lesser evil". What ever happened to "Good" or "Great"? Sad days in America lately....

gorblimey
05-16-2010, 8:35 PM
The Tea Party movement strikes again.

Let's hope their leaders and activists realize soon that all they're doing is hurting the GOP.


The GOP have betrayed the cause of liberty as much as the Democrats. The superficial differences between the two provide the illusion of choice to a population with a superficial capacity for critical thinking. Half of the bastards belong in jail, and all need to be thrown out.

CalNRA
05-17-2010, 1:27 AM
Now we've got Palin endorsing Carly... another Arnold.
I was wondering why her name was familiar... she's the late Ted Kennedy's Sister in Law.

.....what does that mean?

Cokebottle
05-17-2010, 6:03 PM
.....what does that mean?
She's a Kennedy.... like Arnold/Maria.

Hunt
05-17-2010, 6:48 PM
The Tea Party movement strikes again.

Let's hope their leaders and activists realize soon that all they're doing is hurting the GOP.

beyond TEA party-- see Icaucus-- I saw some fantastic videos put out by Icaucus that exposed Bennet for the graft grabber he truly was. These videos are exposing all the graft grabbers not just Bennet.
These politicians sold our manufacturing jobs overeseas for tax breaks then turned around and sold even more tax breaks for repurchase of these companies own foriegn assets. In other words big industry recieved tax breaks to ship American jobs overseas then these international companies recieved even more tax breaks each time they shifted their own assets from right pocket to left pocket. Bennet was just like the rest, now they are being exposed.

http://icaucus.ning.com/

Hunt
05-17-2010, 6:52 PM
The GOP have betrayed the cause of liberty as much as the Democrats. The superficial differences between the two provide the illusion of choice to a population with a superficial capacity for critical thinking. Half of the bastards belong in jail, and all need to be thrown out.

imo the only people really fighting for Liberty are the Free Staters everyone else is just using some other flavor of Statist tyranny under the banner of freedom. "yeah wlll *we will give you* limited rights under conditions we the State control". just wait, just wait until we have to pay the bill.

RoyGilds
05-17-2010, 8:14 PM
The Tea Party movement strikes again.

Let's hope their leaders and activists realize soon that all they're doing is hurting the GOP.

The "Tea Party" is on he right track. Screw the GOP that votes like he did.:cool2:

CalNRA
05-17-2010, 8:16 PM
She's a Kennedy.... like Arnold/Maria.

You are gonna have to enlighten me here, I am not familiar with that branch of the Kennedies....

Cokebottle
05-17-2010, 8:28 PM
You are gonna have to enlighten me here, I am not familiar with that branch of the Kennedies....
I've been trying to verify that.... can't find a reference right now, but it was mentioned on the news last week.

Could be some tie-in through her first husband?