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View Full Version : Best Hunting Spots in SoCal, south of LA


sandiegohunter
05-08-2010, 7:34 PM
I moved to San Diego from Los Angeles 8 years ago, born and raised in Montana.
When I tried to hunt here, everyone was hush hush and wouldn't say a word, I got absolutely no help at all.
Years later I ran into an experience San Diego hunter at a shooting range and he was kind and generous to escort me to a few spots in CNF off kitchen creek road.
Since then, every single person I have spoke with has been selfish an flat-out lied to my face.

I quit hunting in 2004 and sold my guns
In 2006, I had an itch, I bought a bunch of ranger forest survey maps (over $100 worth) I decided I wasn't going to quit hunting afterall,

I have spent the last 3 years driving around in my Kawasaki dual sport650 on and off road.
The whole time thinking, "Imagine how many people quit, and sold their guns, or just stick to target shooting. This is what the far left liberal freaks want???
WTF happened to this place and the unity? the brotherhood? The local hunter is not the enemy, he's a potential friend."
every place i look is protected, barren or private land or not accessible without crossing private property.

I have given a lot of thought into what I'm about to announce,
I truly feel I am doing the right thing for future hunters on Southern California,
but it may tick off a few selfish hunters who WILL get their "secret spots" posted on the net.

I know this because on a map of where you can legally discharge a firearm is not a significantly large area.
Southern California back woods only took me about 150 hours of driving, a few hundred gallons of gas and lots of energy bars for hiking.

I charted all the roads, marked all the private roads, perm closed roads and BLM land that is accessible without a machete.
I marked and photographed all the trails and marked them with GPS.
I ttok photos of all hunting locations and good spot and stalk areas, some good spots for treestands and blinds.
I then use a scanned composite satellite map 10,000p X 12,000p so this file is huge the file is 39 gigs large!
I will reduce the file size to under 1 gig, make a website and post everything.

I know the open grasslands, thick brush, conifer and oak woodlands, food sources, seasonal streams and creeks as well as permanent water sources.
I have over 800 GPS coords documented on a map.
I have 161 unmaintained roads charted and 47 designated areas to hunting between Los Angeles and Tijuana.

I called turkey, and marked 19 turkey locations in 7 months
any young or mature buck also was documented on GPS. I have 6 Bucks GPS coords (none of them shootable).
and about a dozen cows GPS coords just for population information.
over 100 cottontail, over 100 quail and pheasant sitings were also documented via GPS.
I did not document coyote, ground squirrel, crows or other varmints.

I'm not quite finished in the warner springs to aguanga area.
and I have to return to the salton sea for summer data.
__________________________________________________ ______________

Before I do so, I would like to hear your comments, I am curious how many people support my idea.
__________________________________________________ _______________
remember, I am a patriot and a supporter of our constitutional rights, 1st and 2nd amendments. Think about this as you reply.
__________________________________________________ ______________
My project will be finished in Oct 2010 (cooler weather different data) and I plan on posting my results soon after,
either privately or public, I will listen to everyone thoughts on this matter and I will decide what is the ethical thing to do.
3rd outcome, I sell my data to a publisher for $5000 which I think is the unethical thing to do.
__________________________________________________ _______________

If my GPS data and accessible roads have been reviewed by BLM managers and forest rangers, with signatures. Any locations not with a signature by a ranger or BLM land manager will be omitted for legal and liability reasons on my part. ie shooting on private property after following a map I made.
__________________________________________________ _______________
Find maps of Southern California at http:www.totalescape.com that's where I got mine to chart data on, while in the field.
__________________________________________________ _______________
If you want to explore yourself before I release all my data, start with kitchen creek road, boulder creek, pine creek wilderness an hauser wilderness if you're in good shape

Watch for snakes during the warmer months (i've seen several Southern Pacific Rattlesnakes) and bring your tick repellent, also be aware of illegal shooters in CNF, I encountered a few punks with automatic weapons out there. I have no idea what they were thinking.

__________________________________________________ ___________

san diego hunter

ScottB
05-08-2010, 8:50 PM
The problem with announcing decent public land hunting spots is that everyone who never invested a single hour or tank of gas in scouting will mark the announced spot and go there - along with everyone else and in no time its overrun, no game and even dangerous to hunt because of all the idiots that go there.

I had a friend that harvested an awesome 4x4 buck in San Diego County in an area we hunted for years. Access was a little tricky. As he was leaving the area with his trophy, a ranger stopped my trusting and naive friend and asked where he got it, took pictures, etc. And he posted them in the ranger station with the exact area the deer was taken! Next season it was a war zone. No deer taken despite hearing more shots than I could could count and we fled for our safety and have not been back since. So now, my best reports are that the area is devoid of game, previously unposted land is now posted and its a dead loss.

If you have invested a lot of time and effort and know where game can be had on public land, good for you! Find a good trustworthy hunting buddy and have a great time - year after year. But choose wisely. My best chukar spots are now overrun because I shared them with a couple bozos who invited everyone and their brother there who in turn invited everyone they knew and so on. I have not taken a chukar from any of those spots in 3 years.

California is not Montana. There are nearly 40 million people here and very little decent public land that holds game. Successful public land hunters are not mindless a-holes. They just understand they are destroying their own hard work and success and killing the goose that laid the golden egg by disclosing areas that hold game.

Baxter
05-08-2010, 9:17 PM
It is one thing to give out spots and or areas to friends, but this is the internet and alot of people are on it.
Spots that I have worked hard to find I will only take closet friends to. Your idea seems nice, but not really. Part of the fun of hunting is finding the areas that holds. Just seems kind of kooky.

jawbreaker
05-09-2010, 7:22 AM
As said above, if you do somthing like this to be nice you need to think about the end result. There are so many jackasses out there that just want everything handed to them without investing any time into reserching areas and scouting for good places to hunt that you will have a bunch of guys that don't belong in the feild out there shooting anything that moves and not being safe about it. Do a search of people looking for good places to hunt and take a few of them hunting and see how that works out for you, I'm not talking about the situations where someone has relocated into this state and has hunted for years but the guys that just want to go kill something.
I wouldn't give up all of my hard work for a couple of grand let alone have all the spots is so cal over run with knucleheads.

CavTrooper
05-09-2010, 12:35 PM
How much is hunting worth to you?

How much time, money, miles on your rig and boots and more have you invested into finding good hunting spots?

Are you willing to hand all that investment over to a guy who has no experience, time in the field or concern for safe and ethical hunting for nothing?

Its not that we are adverse to other people picking up the sport, we just want people to show a willingness to learn and demonstrate a little common sense and loyalty before we show them the "honey holes" we have worked hard to develop.

Jawbreaker, Baxter and myself have taken out many a newbie to introduce them to the sport, some have picked up the ball and ran with it, searching out thier own new ground and learning about hunting, some we have found in the exact same spots we took them to not the week before, some, never try heading out on thier own, waiting to be invited out again. If they dont have the drive, they dont deserve the help, if they do, they become part of the team, Marcelo5150 being the best example. After two or three trips with the crew, he headed out on his own, far away from the places we showed him and proceeded to absolutley SLAY his fair share of critters. Thats the kind of guy I will hunt with and share my spots.

sandiegohunter
05-12-2010, 3:55 PM
I'm really hoping to get some intelligent points of view from both sides.

I've received a ton of private emails encouraging me to publish the information but non posted here, but I want to have opinions publicly posted here, if you have an opinion, be proud to live in a country you can speak your mind. Don't be shy in supported this proposition and don't be shy to post why it's not something you support and why.

All opinions welcome, keep them intelligent and omit insults and uncivilized behavior please, so far you guys are on topic and have valuable points of view.

I hunt in Texas, Idaho, NM and Canada. Now that I'm retired and sold my business. I bought 190 acres in one of the best hunting areas in the NW, Moose, Elk, etc.
I gave up hunting in SoCal, but not everyone has a budget for hunting like I do. So I should pass on the information for everyone to share.
I want to encourage all the newbies out there not to give up.

If anything, I could at least just publish a map of public roads leading to land that is OK to hunt on, I don't HAVE to post game population stats.

rumblebee
05-12-2010, 5:05 PM
:confused::confused::confused:

seriously...think twice before you post this on the wide open INTERNET.

and this comment just kills me-
I gave up hunting in SoCal, but not everyone has a budget for hunting like I do. So I should pass on the information for everyone to share.

:eek:

taperxz
05-12-2010, 5:23 PM
Brain dead! I don't believe you are really from Montana. Not only are you telling other hunters where to go, you are telling the anti hunters where you will be!! Ever tried hunting and have an animal rights activist bang pots and pans as you were trying to bow hunt? Knock yourself out! I hunt my own ranch!!

kalguns
05-12-2010, 5:29 PM
wow!

gotime
05-12-2010, 5:40 PM
I think your third option is viable. You'll get compensated a bit for your troubles and people will have to pay to get valuable information (which most of the "punks" everyone is talking about will not do). The information will be kept off the world wide web and you'll still be doing a service to your fellow hunters. ::thumbsup::

Shoot-it
05-12-2010, 5:52 PM
just tell me I wont tell anyone.

Jon Wang
05-13-2010, 8:09 AM
I applaud your efforts to create the next generation of hunters and continue that legacy.

You've now obviously reached a different stage in life where you have the time, opportunity, and financial ability to travel and hunt as you please. Most of us are still tied to the breakfast in the car, daily commute, 9-5 grind, therefore don't have the time to get out and properly scout where we'd like to hunt.

When I first started out learning how/where to hunt, like you, I met with much difficulty. No one wants to tell you anything, especially their "honey holes". Understandably, nothing in life is free. You've worked hard all your life, and finally are now able to hunt as you please on your personal piece of hunting heaven.

If you wish to share your hard work, I'd suggest mentoring a novice hunter. Teach a new hunter HOW to hunt, and not just WHERE to hunt. I think the teaching of HOW to hunt for me was more important. Now that I know how, I can find my own spots. In time, this creates a lasting legacy that will carry forward into the next generation.

I'd suggest going over to jesseshunting(dot)com and sharing your hunting expertise.

elevated
05-13-2010, 8:23 AM
I think option 3 is the best. Show some ppl what hunting is all about.

professionalcoyotehunter
05-13-2010, 8:44 AM
The only way I show people my spots is to tag along with me.

AEC1
05-13-2010, 9:28 AM
You get an A for effort, but I doubt that the WWW is the best route. I am willing to take you to my Dove and Qual honey holes, and would love a turkey tip as well, but to put it on the WWW is a bad idea...

coma
05-13-2010, 9:41 AM
I can see both points of the argument, on one had you are handing over precious information to just anyone, no doubt some will be kids with no respect and might end up hurting the areas. As an avid backpacker/camper/hunter and just a person who loves nature and what it has to offer, I have encountered a lot of these types.

One of the things that have killed some shooting areas in the ANF has been just that, people who come in and trash the BLM land and places where at one point was allowed. So I kinda see that side of the argument.

But I would love to see what you have found, I guess a good way of doing it, although a lot more involved would be to have an initial outing, where you post here on calguns a day to hunt/shoot, people would come out and you get to meet people and see what they are about and perhaps then you could share the info with them and so on...

Either way I would love to see what you have come up with, I am actually looking into new prairie dog areas in socal...

rumblebee
05-13-2010, 9:49 AM
the only people you are going to find to "support" your idea, are the ones who want to hit the easy button, roll out to a spot and kill something...those are also the people (more than likely) that I end up picking up shotgun shells, spent cartidges\trash\etc while I'm out hunting in Socal....

Part of hunting IS finding a spot by putting boots on the ground and exploring, or hooking up with a hunting friend (old or new) to swap a spot and hunt together. It's not about hitting a website or having it spoon fed to you....I'm kinda glad it's difficult to find the "spots", it weeds out the ez button people :cool:

professorhard
05-13-2010, 10:58 AM
Bad idea. Keep the info for yourself or sell it so its not available to just anyone

professionalcoyotehunter
05-13-2010, 11:06 AM
Those of us who are dedicated will pay for info.:D

Tanner68
05-13-2010, 2:51 PM
My spots are closely held secrets. Anyone I show can only learn by tagging along. And they can't ever go without at least inviting me. And they can't show it to anyone without my approval. Or I won't share another spot with them. I think a lot of us operate under that principle.

There is this guy's maps, and I can corroborate them with the areas I am familiar with. He is pretty right on. But it still takes plenty of field time.
http://www.biggamehuntingmaps.com/

Go ahead and publish. I am curious to see what you've got. But you'll ruin a few good spots if you are too specific.

BigJB
05-13-2010, 2:57 PM
If I post my favorite secret hunting spots on an internet forum, can I expect the hunting to improve?

professionalcoyotehunter
05-13-2010, 3:04 PM
Sure you can as long as you are the first one to get there.:D

HokeySon
05-13-2010, 6:44 PM
I think you should do what you want with the fruits of your efforts. You did the work, you get to decide who to divulge it to. If you think the whole world should have it that is what you should do. If you think you should keep it moe to a select few, that is fine also. Really, it is up to you. There is also nothing unethical about selling the fruits of your labor, at leastt not in my book.

Personally, I would love to have this information. Frankly, I am a very new hunter and I don't have the first clue on finding hunting spots (other that on my own acreage). However, my desire for the information does not create an obligation for you to give it to me.

Just do what you want with the information that you have prepared.

ScottB
05-13-2010, 9:43 PM
Sandiegohunter; one other thing I would point out ...

While its true, you have a right to dispose of the information you have amassed as you choose, its naive to think no one else has invested similar effort to find those same areas and no doubt they enjoy the rewards of their efforts. By publicly disclosing your information, you are unilaterally deciding to disclose the same information gathered (and guarded) at considerable time, effort and expense by others and the opportunity of future hard working hunters to do the same - all leading to the same result: Nobody gets anything. All these decent spots you have found will be overrun and overhunted and become just another frustrating waste of time for old and new hunters alike. How does that advance the cause of encouraging new hunters? Keeping confidences and trusting others to do the same are just the realities that the public land hunter accepts and lives by and how we honor other's hard work. Who are you to decide unilaterally for others?

jawbreaker
05-14-2010, 4:20 PM
Sandiegohunter; one other thing I would point out ...

While its true, you have a right to dispose of the information you have amassed as you choose, its naive to think no one else has invested similar effort to find those same areas and no doubt they enjoy the rewards of their efforts. By publicly disclosing your information, you are unilaterally deciding to disclose the same information gathered (and guarded) at considerable time, effort and expense by others and the opportunity of future hard working hunters to do the same - all leading to the same result: Nobody gets anything. All these decent spots you have found will be overrun and overhunted and become just another frustrating waste of time for old and new hunters alike. How does that advance the cause of encouraging new hunters? Keeping confidences and trusting others to do the same are just the realities that the public land hunter accepts and lives by and how we honor other's hard work. Who are you to decide unilaterally for others?

Scott, that has to be the best response to this thread yet.

theseacow
05-14-2010, 4:58 PM
Every time I've seen someone post detailed information about a hunting spot in california on one of the many hunting forums, that spot becomes totally un-huntable within 2 years. Do what you want, but in my opinion all you are doing is ruining what you worked hard at accomplishing. I've seen this happen enough times to know how it ends.

professionalcoyotehunter
05-14-2010, 5:04 PM
I couldn't agree with you more cow.

repomanNWP
05-14-2010, 5:05 PM
First, I envy you, and want to thank you for considering your course of action. Please don't post this information on the Internet for all to see.

I caught the hunting bug only 6 months ago (I'm 45). In this short span of time, I've learned a lot, including how terribly difficult hunting in SoCal on public land is. But this has not deterred me. I've gotten a little help here and there, have a couple spots I've hiked and scouted and I relish the challenge of hunting on public land; it will make the result all the more satisfying. Now, wherever I go in the county, I'm on the lookout, I talk to locals, and have learned quite a bit already, not just about hunting, but about this area, its history and some hidden backwood treasures.

Sharing your hard earned information will take away some of the experience for me. Don't get me wrong, I welcome any tips and honey hole pointers, but I think of it like a magician's tricks... not nearly as fun and interesting when you know all the secrets.

Mac
05-15-2010, 8:09 AM
I think the DFG already beat you to the punch OP.
http://www.dfg.ca.gov/wildlife/hunting/deer/cazonemap.html
so you got some recon time in and got some GPS locations.
good for you.

Tanner68
05-15-2010, 3:53 PM
Sandiegohunter; one other thing I would point out ...

While its true, you have a right to dispose of the information you have amassed as you choose, its naive to think no one else has invested similar effort to find those same areas and no doubt they enjoy the rewards of their efforts. By publicly disclosing your information, you are unilaterally deciding to disclose the same information gathered (and guarded) at considerable time, effort and expense by others and the opportunity of future hard working hunters to do the same - all leading to the same result: Nobody gets anything. All these decent spots you have found will be overrun and overhunted and become just another frustrating waste of time for old and new hunters alike. How does that advance the cause of encouraging new hunters? Keeping confidences and trusting others to do the same are just the realities that the public land hunter accepts and lives by and how we honor other's hard work. Who are you to decide unilaterally for others?

This is a well thought out response that I agree with.

bridgeport
05-15-2010, 9:59 PM
Best spots are right where I left'em.

SIP2000GLO
05-15-2010, 11:22 PM
Didn't the OP say he does not want to be like the selfish Californians he encountered when he moved here from Montana?

That's the reason why he's going to post the informations publicly.

Abesnake
05-16-2010, 9:42 AM
Hunting to me has always been a haloed sport. It's precious and needs protection. It's not baseball or track. The only thing that comes close to it is bounty hunting. It's a relationship with your fellow hunters as much as it is with the land. I am one of the newbies you are talking about "helping". When I first decided to get serious about hunting I ran into Csacannoneer at Fort Courage. He told me I needed to start reading books and join Calguns, because I'd probably hurt myself or somebody else if I tried hunting to soon. That's what I've been doing. Learning slowly and making friends and a fool of my self with my opinion here. I've learned so much from you guys just reading...I just can't tell you...I'm really grateful. I've been invited on two hunts. One worked out as a camping trip and one is coming up. Like I said; hunting is a relationship. You have to nurture it with others, the game and yourself. Thanks for the offer, Sandie, but I'd rather go out with you and get some experience. If I read your maps or site it won't connect very well. I'm a newbie and I can't read maps yet. You can't give me maps, viewpoints and the best reststops unless it's AAA and I'm going to N.Y.

ScottB
05-16-2010, 11:32 AM
Didn't the OP say he does not want to be like the selfish Californians he encountered when he moved here from Montana?

That's the reason why he's going to post the informations publicly.

There is a certain selfishness to his plan if you think about it. Something along the lines of "I don't value all this information I have collected, so I am going to destroy whatever value it may have to others that have also collected it and insure that it becomes worthless to all"

Probably that is not his intent, but that is the reality and the result

problemchild
05-16-2010, 8:01 PM
The internet is just a bunch of tubes that go to Al Gores house, what could possibly go wrong?

Mac
05-17-2010, 6:13 AM
The internet is just a bunch of tubes that go to Al Gores house, what could possibly go wrong?

Since I am confusing all Game
with Deer only(Buck Fever onset) in another thread, somehow this makes sense to me. :)

Kestryll
05-17-2010, 6:48 PM
I love reading this stuff.

It's always good to see who wants to open up shooting sports and hunting to others and who wants to keep people out.

Frankly this is why I don't hunt, the cliquish nature and childish, selfish attitude that leads people to lie to people about where to go or what is in an area.

The last time I went hunting was a dove season many years ago.
Apparently a couple of people thought it was 'their' area. With no doves in the sky we heard them shooting and pellets started raining on us.
My dad who I was hunting with yelled that there were people over here, we heard laughing and another shot fired.

Nice to see this attitude is not just alive but flourishing.

ElvenSoul
05-17-2010, 6:58 PM
If we still can hunt with guns; this might prove useful.

Hunt
05-17-2010, 7:16 PM
I hunt San Diego and what we have here is a completely differnt situation than the rest of the States. The hunting pressure is so intense, the game so few in numbers and permanently spooked that any published "good spots" will be worthless in 1-2 years.
We have a terrible access situation here and the info on roads and boundaries is very marketable just don't locate "good spots". I have spent hundreds of hours in the field here noting roads and such, this is very, very valuable info. I would pay for the map info but I wouldn't pay for sightings info, as I figure this info in today's world would be useless in a matter of hours. Bucks in SD County are extremely difficult to sight on public land, they are imo nocturnal and in the thickest brush--good luck in SD County.


kystral you misunderstand Frankly this is why I don't hunt, the cliquish nature and childish, selfish attitude that leads people to lie to people about where to go or what is in an area. some of spend hundreds of hours and hundreds of dollars to get the opportunity for one shot! why should someone that has invested a great deal just give away their work? A successful hunt is an earned reward, that is what this is all about, challenging yourself on multiple fronts, physically, intellectually, outdoors, marksman skillsets and financially. I find great satisfaction when I go to the County Cartography office wade through the maps and find access to an area all the other hunters think is legally unaccessable, it's all part of the hunt and it's all good.

ScottB
05-17-2010, 8:36 PM
With all due respect, you don't get it. This is not about elitism or exclusivity. Its about HUNTING. Its about investing in success and not wanting someone else to deny you the fruits of your labor.

There are alternatives. Hunt private land. Go guided. Hunt out of state.

Public lands hunting in CA is for ordinary joes. Guys with jobs and weekends off. Guys who can't throw unlimited amounts of money at their passion. Guys who get a day off and go hunting near their homes on land they can't afford to own or pay for access. I would love to have sandiegohunter tell me what he's found. I look hard and spend a lot of time trying to find the same - as I know others do. So I'll settle for it not being destroyed if only to be shared with the friends of those who have busted their asses to find it.

Sorry you got your butt hurt on a dove hunt. Some guys are rude -Allow me to apologize for them. I'll be the first to declare public land is public land. But for you to extend that bad experience to a conclusion that it is wrong to keep your mouth shut about a public land honey hole after spending God knows how many hours, gallons of fuel and miles on your vehicle to find a place to hunt once or twice a year, is pretty small minded.

Just my opinion.


I love reading this stuff.

It's always good to see who wants to open up shooting sports and hunting to others and who wants to keep people out.

Frankly this is why I don't hunt, the cliquish nature and childish, selfish attitude that leads people to lie to people about where to go or what is in an area.

The last time I went hunting was a dove season many years ago.
Apparently a couple of people thought it was 'their' area. With no doves in the sky we heard them shooting and pellets started raining on us.
My dad who I was hunting with yelled that there were people over here, we heard laughing and another shot fired.

Nice to see this attitude is not just alive but flourishing.

theseacow
05-17-2010, 9:52 PM
I love reading this stuff.

It's always good to see who wants to open up shooting sports and hunting to others and who wants to keep people out.

Frankly this is why I don't hunt, the cliquish nature and childish, selfish attitude that leads people to lie to people about where to go or what is in an area.

The last time I went hunting was a dove season many years ago.
Apparently a couple of people thought it was 'their' area. With no doves in the sky we heard them shooting and pellets started raining on us.
My dad who I was hunting with yelled that there were people over here, we heard laughing and another shot fired.

Nice to see this attitude is not just alive but flourishing.

Sucks that you had a run-in with some A-holes. But on a serious note, I don't see how that relates to this thread as you are implying. Most hunters I know are more then willing to help out others and take them to hunting spots that they worked for. Posting that info on the internet is just plain stupid since now they won't be able to go enjoy that spot that they worked for because 10 million people will have overrun it before they can even get back out there. that's the reality here. Its very different in this state since there is so many people, and so little public land.

spectr17
05-17-2010, 10:09 PM
Kestryll's post is steel on target. Our numbers shrink every year and yet some cling to the notion certain spots on public land is theirs and theirs only. Everyone else be damned. If we don't welcome the new generation into our sport it will be gone in another generation. Just in my life time I've seen a dramatic change. At the last booth at Bass Pro only one kid out of maybe 40 knew what a hoot owl call was. None had ever turkey hunted or spent that much time afield hunting to know. Dad pops onto a hunting forum as a noob and asks about where to go and gets flamed for asking. Post a map of any general area and you get hate mail. Gotta be another way or we're doomed.

Kestryll
05-18-2010, 11:15 AM
With all due respect, you don't get it.

Actually, you don't get it.

How much more land was open to hunting 10-20 years ago?
What was the prevailing attitude towards hunting and hunters 10-20 years ago?
How much of the current generation consider hunting to be a waste of time or even something terrible that must be ended?

The problem isn't that the anti-gunners or anti-hunters are so powerful, it's that hunters are so wrapped up in being secretive and not wanting to invite new hunters, share the sport with others and couch the entire hunting concept in terms of 'I', 'me', 'my' and 'mine'.

With no new people joining the sport there are less and less people who care what limits or restrictions are placed on hunting and fewer to fight back.
Who wants to champion the cause of people who lambaste them when they ask for info or try to share the enjoyment they've found with others?

Give it another 10 years and hunting will be a non-issue in California with so much regulation and so few who give even the slightest care that restoring things will only be a dream.
And then all those little 'MY' areas will be closed to everyone.

Way to plan ahead.

professionalcoyotehunter
05-18-2010, 11:36 AM
I take people with me nearly every weekend and dont mind sharing my spots. asll I ask is if you are going to hunt the spots I have invested so much time in finding that you at least throw me an invite.

ScottB
05-18-2010, 1:08 PM
The last time I went hunting was a dove season many years ago.

Then may I suggest the conditions on the ground have changed since then? That the internet was every bit the "game changer" people say it is?

I think most of this thread revolves around species that are less abundant and less widely distributed - quail or chukar, deer and turkeys that have local populations that can be easily overhunted (to the detriment of the population as well as hunter success) or pressured onto private or closed land .

I am out there probably 30 days a season, big game, upland and waterfowl. I like to hunt with friends and hunting is a good way to make friends. I have shown many people places they were good hunting spots and and been shown many by others. There is a basic understanding that they are "good spots" for a reason and that the more widely distributed the knowledge of such a place is, the worse the hunting becomes there. You make not like that fact for various political reasons, but it is nonetheless a fact and ultimately works against the very thing you say you want to promote.

The decline in hunting has more to do with sprawl, urbanizing society, overregulating and groups such as CBD, PETA, HSUS, etc. suing for closures and more restrictions on access and use of public land.

As importantly, no one ever taught many folks how to hunt as children. I have always been a fan of mentoring and part of that is imparting not only skills, but locations with proper instruction how to respect the land, be safe etc. Just publishing all the where-to info only encourages newbs to go the DIY route, which usually ends in frustration and failure just the same.

The closure of private land is mainly over liability concerns. BTW, part of hunting is in fact talking to land owners. Much of that land is not as closed as people think. Many Ranchers just want to know who and what you are before allowing you on their property with dangerous weapons.

Too many people think huntingconsists of being given a set of GPS coordinates, driving out to the annointed spot, shooting something, taking a picture and driving home. What joyless and ethically barren experience. That is not hunting. Hunting is the act of doing all the research and legwork sandiegohunter described. Reducing it to a set of directions for the lazy and unskilled reduces real hunting to merely trying to kill something as quickly as possible.

I know people who tried hunting and gave up because it wasn't that easy, go-kill-something experience they expected. Too bad. That why we have golf. I also know people who started out believing that, got disappointed then buckled down and took up the challenge and became real "hunters" worthy of the name.

To attribute the decline in hunting to a handful of successful public land hunters who are savvy enough to be selective in who they share with is baloney.

CavTrooper
05-18-2010, 1:25 PM
I think Kes is missing the point entirely.

Hunting isnt a welfare program where you just hand out spots willy nilly to any swingin richard that asks. Hunting is more like an internship, you show people the ropes, you teach them the tricks of the trade and you help them learn the dos, donts, hows and whys. The OP is talking about handing stuff out for anyone and everyone to find, i can almost gaurentee that for every hunter that decides to check out a spot, there will be 100 target shooters on the way to the same place.

No one here is opposed to taking people out and teaching them to hunt, least of all me. Ive personally tried to help start at least 10 or more calgunners hunting, amoung others that ive met along the way, but for most people, its not the quick and easy thing they thought it would be and they never tried again. For those that persevere, they are rewarded with many good days and nights in field, the comraderie that comes with the hunting community and the satisfaction that comes from a successful hunt.

Ill take just about anyone hunting once, as Im sure everyone here would, but its up to them to want to continue, but im not about to hand all my information over to someone who may or may not care about the sport at all.

taperxz
05-18-2010, 1:36 PM
From what i can tell in some of the posts here it looks like the so cal folks seem to be disgruntled about areas to hunt. Which is the thread topic. However, there are plenty of places to go up here in Nor Cal. There seems to be plenty of game and it looks to me the statistics show the wildlife population is way up. Some of your problems down there are human population and most of all you live in a desert! Wild game is not as abundant as it might be up North. In my county we have a federal trapper who is always out having to get a bear who is wreaking havoc on farm animals. Deer seem to be abundant as are quail, turkey up the yang, dove and bear. I guess you guys just need to get out and travel a bit. This is just my perspective living up this way.

professionalcoyotehunter
05-18-2010, 1:46 PM
If you need someone to help control the abundance of game up there just hit me up.

rumblebee
05-18-2010, 1:56 PM
THIS!!!! :cheers2:

Then may I suggest the conditions on the ground have changed since then? That the internet was every bit the "game changer" people say it is?

I think most of this thread revolves around species that are less abundant and less widely distributed - quail or chukar, deer and turkeys that have local populations that can be easily overhunted (to the detriment of the population as well as hunter success) or pressured onto private or closed land .

I am out there probably 30 days a season, big game, upland and waterfowl. I like to hunt with friends and hunting is a good way to make friends. I have shown many people places they were good hunting spots and and been shown many by others. There is a basic understanding that they are "good spots" for a reason and that the more widely distributed the knowledge of such a place is, the worse the hunting becomes there. You make not like that fact for various political reasons, but it is nonetheless a fact and ultimately works against the very thing you say you want to promote.

The decline in hunting has more to do with sprawl, urbanizing society, overregulating and groups such as CBD, PETA, HSUS, etc. suing for closures and more restrictions on access and use of public land.

As importantly, no one ever taught many folks how to hunt as children. I have always been a fan of mentoring and part of that is imparting not only skills, but locations with proper instruction how to respect the land, be safe etc. Just publishing all the where-to info only encourages newbs to go the DIY route, which usually ends in frustration and failure just the same.

The closure of private land is mainly over liability concerns. BTW, part of hunting is in fact talking to land owners. Much of that land is not as closed as people think. Many Ranchers just want to know who and what you are before allowing you on their property with dangerous weapons.

Too many people think huntingconsists of being given a set of GPS coordinates, driving out to the annointed spot, shooting something, taking a picture and driving home. What joyless and ethically barren experience. That is not hunting. Hunting is the act of doing all the research and legwork sandiegohunter described. Reducing it to a set of directions for the lazy and unskilled reduces real hunting to merely trying to kill something as quickly as possible.

I know people who tried hunting and gave up because it wasn't that easy, go-kill-something experience they expected. Too bad. That why we have golf. I also know people who started out believing that, got disappointed then buckled down and took up the challenge and became real "hunters" worthy of the name.

To attribute the decline in hunting to a handful of successful public land hunters who are savvy enough to be selective in who they share with is baloney.

Kestryll
05-18-2010, 3:14 PM
Then may I suggest the conditions on the ground have changed since then?
Not having gone hunting in a several years does not equate to total ignorance.
Nor does it mean I've not been following the progression, or more appropriately the regression, of the sport.
To assume such is, well, rather presumptuous.

To attribute the decline in hunting to a handful of successful public land hunters who are savvy enough to be selective in who they share with is baloney.
Really?

You know, I hear from the occasional shooter, enthusiast, hunter and/or gun owner now and then. For some reason people email, PM, call or even run in to me on the street and ask questions and give me their opinions on things.

Can't imagine why, must be the Calguns shirts.

When it comes to hunting the two things I hear most are that there is very limited places and things to hunt in So Cal and that their interest in the sport of hunting has been quelled by the reception they've received when they ask about it. The 'High School clique' mentality was too prevalent and caused them to lose interest.

I know a cursory read of this thread alone puts that cliquish attitude on display for tens of thousands of people to see every day and there is flat out no denying that.

theseacow
05-18-2010, 3:33 PM
When it comes to hunting the two things I hear most are that there is very limited places and things to hunt in So Cal and that their interest in the sport of hunting has been quelled by the reception they've received when they ask about it. The 'High School clique' mentality was too prevalent and caused them to lose interest.

I know a cursory read of this thread alone puts that cliquish attitude on display for tens of thousands of people to see every day and there is flat out no denying that.

Throughout all the different hunting forums I've seen and the hunters I know, I've never seen a beginner lose interest due to some poor reception by other hunters (YMMV). In my experience it has always been the opposite. I was a beginner once too, and everyone was more than helpful with pointing me in the right direction. The beginners that I see who give hunting a try then give up, are usually the ones who thought it would be easy and realize it's a lot of work (including work involving scouting, research, etc). They sometimes also realize it isn't like they thought it would be, with easily accessible lush public land with animals waiting to be killed on it. Almost every hunter I know is always more then willing to help out other hunters. Now trying to keep this on the original topic, I don't see how the OP's proposed plans helps out anyone. Reality shows that it screws everyone, including the beginners and the experienced hunters.

ScottB
05-18-2010, 3:51 PM
Sorry Kestryll,

We'll just have to disagree. I didn't call you ignorant, but your're own comments indicate you are relying not on time in the field, but on people who choose to complain to you. Is that a random or even representative sample? I suspect it is a highly filtered sample

Maybe, as taperxz suggests, the view is different in NorCal. Hunting is a lot tougher in SoCal and we work hard for every bird or deer.

Sorry you have your back up over it, but if you read through all the other posts, I think you will see an overwhelming consensus over a few key points formed by a lot of very thoughtful, informed people. Maybe that's worth paying attention to. I certainly don't know how to explain the realities of the public lands hunter any more clearly.

Look at the dedicated hunting forums and see what consensus there is. Ask Jesse what happened to his waterfowl forum when he posted up Wister kill sheets, LOL.

spectr17
05-18-2010, 6:15 PM
Look at the dedicated hunting forums and see what consensus there is. Ask Jesse what happened to his waterfowl forum when he posted up Wister kill sheets, LOL.

There was some heartburn over the kill sheets. The poll we took was something like 65% for and 35% against publishing the Wister kill sheets. My email atta boys and threats ran about the same. I'll take that 65% any day. The first guy to download those sheets was of course one of the vocal opponents to making them public. Oh the irony.

Jim Matthews, the SoCal outdoor writer, catches a lot of grief over him publishing the guzzler locations in the desert. The clique that spits the venom are of course subscribers to his publication Western Birds in many cases. LOL. They can have the info but no one else is their logic. Guess where they got their secret spots in many cases?

There is an older Vietnam vet on our forum who is good with aerial maps, GIS and computers. He was a Raven I believe in Nam if you know what they were. He's posted many helpful maps over the years for newbies and anyone wanting info on public land. His postings have drawn attacks from the public land nazis, some so goofy they offer to post pics of his truck so folks can "dissuade" him from posting their area. Hunters attacking other hunters, the antis don't even have to lift a finger.

One other thing that cracks me up is the claim SoCal is different, more crowded. Really? I hunt UT, AZ, CA and MO. If you want to see crowded hit MO in the spring for turkeys on public land. Rifle season is also insane there. In AZ hunters fight over the water holes with outfitters staking out the best ones for their clients.

Another fallacy is if I give someone my honey hole they will kill something. Maybe. Most times you need to know when to be there and how to hunt the spot. That knowledge comes from time spent hunting that spot or someone telling you. Some claim it's the Interwebz causing all the problems. Really? I can remember the same type folks crying over CA Fish N Game Magazine and WON spilling the beans even before there was an Interwebz. The best part of this is that some of the ones crying foul over spilling locations are featured every month in the new mag Relentless 365 magazine. If you truly believe in the loose lips philosophy you really shouldn't be posting pics and stories all over the Interwebz and magazines should you? As many have pointed out, just backgrounds in pics can give away locations and last time I checked, most of these pics in the mags have their backgrounds intact. It's do as I say and not as I do at it's worst.

Mac
05-18-2010, 8:10 PM
spectr17 has nailed it. To the Wall. IMHO.

Hunt
05-18-2010, 8:43 PM
From what i can tell in some of the posts here it looks like the so cal folks seem to be disgruntled about areas to hunt. Which is the thread topic. However, there are plenty of places to go up here in Nor Cal. There seems to be plenty of game and it looks to me the statistics show the wildlife population is way up. Some of your problems down there are human population and most of all you live in a desert! Wild game is not as abundant as it might be up North. In my county we have a federal trapper who is always out having to get a bear who is wreaking havoc on farm animals. Deer seem to be abundant as are quail, turkey up the yang, dove and bear. I guess you guys just need to get out and travel a bit. This is just my perspective living up this way.

what area are you describing? If I can an OTC deer tag I may drive up