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View Full Version : FN five seven...talk me out of it


pyro3k2
04-29-2010, 2:42 PM
First and fore most, I've hit the CGN google seach button with most threads not relating to sales started in 2007.

With that said, I've come across a damn good deal on one, the kind you would be a fool to pass up on. Why do I not want this handgun?

smarter
04-29-2010, 2:45 PM
It kills. :2guns:

For me the grip is uncomfortable, but if it works for you I don't see anything wrong with it. You also get awesome mag capacity if yo decide to go shooting out of state. 20 rnds+10rnd mag extensions = awesomeness.

usctrojan
04-29-2010, 2:47 PM
Expensive bullets... HUGE muzzle flash (at least from what I have seen)... not a 1911 :) I tried!

Uriah02
04-29-2010, 2:48 PM
If you can find one and its ammo go for it. I'd get one in a free state but PRK nerfs it too much for my taste out here.

djleisure
04-29-2010, 2:59 PM
I've never shot one, but always liked the design and it feels comfortable in my hand. Ammo's not too bad if you buy it in bulk. Sportsman's Guide has it for $200 per 500 rounds.

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/cb.aspx?a=667542&ecid=EX17F

b.faust
04-29-2010, 3:03 PM
A buddy of mine has one, and I love shooting it, but always feel guilty because getting ammo is hit or miss for him.
It's weird, he'll find it at great prices then a few months later, can't find any, or it's astronomical.

That said, I'd probably get one if I thought the price was right and if I really wanted one (sounds like you got a bit of the bug for one)

Buy it, take care of it, and if you decide later that ammo is a pain, or it's just not your bag, sell it.

Sleeping Lesson
04-29-2010, 3:11 PM
I've got the Fiven seveN bug myself.

Biggest cons I've come across in my extensive research...
-Expensive ammo
-Possibility of the ammo being even more limited in the future. It is basically proprietary and FN could stop making it at some point. This isn't likely in the near future, but absolutely a possibility.
-Cost upfront. $1000 is a lot, even for a quality polymer gun.

I still want it.

Saym14
04-29-2010, 3:13 PM
expensive ammo
cost
only hold 10 rounds in Cal

jasonnorcal
04-29-2010, 3:16 PM
The specialty bullets is what kills it for me. Good luck finding ammo at Walmart\Big 5\ Longs Drugs and the like. It's all well and good to mail order ammo, but if\when our infrastructure breaks down or a battlefield p\u type situation your pretty much SOL. You can always find 9\40\45. That being said.....I want 1......bad.

About the muzzle flash, I realize it's not a good thing, but it's just plain cool. 22 mag pistol or Federal 193 out of a 16" barrel with no mb\fh is awesome:punk:

raw24
04-29-2010, 3:21 PM
Ive been wanting one real bad for a while:

But there are 3 huge deterrents for me.
1. Having a 20 round gun neutered to 10, sucks!
2. I prefer the FDE, and that is off list.
3. Cost, cheapest I found new is $1020.00.

raw24
04-29-2010, 3:24 PM
First and fore most, I've hit the CGN google seach button with most threads not relating to sales started in 2007.

With that said, I've come across a damn good deal on one, the kind you would be a fool to pass up on. Why do I not want this handgun?

Out of curiosity, what constitutes a "damn good deal"?

Sleeping Lesson
04-29-2010, 3:28 PM
I'm curious about that myself. Best deal I've seen is $1000 even.

Also, how difficult would it be to find an additional magazine for a Five seveN, anyway?

pyro3k2
04-29-2010, 3:30 PM
Out of curiosity, what constitutes a "damn good deal"?

The company I am getting hired to has a program that puts 600 dollars (of company money) towards the purchase of your firearm.

Sleeping Lesson
04-29-2010, 3:31 PM
Oh geez, hook a brother up.

tonelar
04-29-2010, 3:33 PM
get it/ then buy a PS90

saber
04-29-2010, 3:37 PM
I have shot one and liked it. My only concern is about accessories and other related items. Since they are fairly rare, it might be difficult to find holsters, extra magazines, etc. Scarcity of ammo should be another concern.

I tend to think about gun in the 10-20 year horizon. I don't want to get stuck with something that I won't be able to find ammo for down the road or I won't be able to find a holster for it if I need one.

I think they are cool but may you have to ask yourself if that gun is one that will be sitting in my safe 10 years from now since I can't get ammo anymore.

raw24
04-29-2010, 3:38 PM
The company I am getting hired to has a program that puts 600 dollars (of company money) towards the purchase of your firearm.

If I only had to put up $400.00 of my own $, I would buy one in a heartbeat.

SixtyDashOne
04-29-2010, 3:38 PM
I agree with most everyone here. I was thinking of getting one for awhile when I was in Oregon. Ended up deciding against it because of the availability of ammo. You're not going to just walk into Walmart and find a box of 5.7 and you probably won't even find it at a gun store for that matter.

Also, with CA's mag capacity law, having a gun that was meant to hold 20 rounds, nerfed down to 10 rounds... well that just sucks. I won't rule out getting one someday when I move out of CA, but there are plenty other guns I'd rather spend my cash on first.

pyro3k2
04-29-2010, 3:47 PM
Sorry forgot to mention that the company falls into a loop hole which allows for normal cap mags (as long as they are factory unmodified) to be used during working hours. So while im at work 20 rounds will be allowed, requirements for the firearms are it must be double action and have a 5 inch barrel. I also have a Colt 1911 and a barretta 92fs, please dont go into the 9mm vs 45acp thing that is 90% of reason why im looking into another cal.

ILVSMOG
04-29-2010, 3:50 PM
I have one and absolutely LOVE it, but the "cons" people have listed have merit. I mail order all my ammo in bulk, which solves the availability issue for me. It fits me well, also. There are a few companies that make holsters for the five-seven, even with the option for a light installed. I wouldn't have it as my only pistol (I have several 1911s) but as a second (or 10th) pistol, it's great! Additionally, the low recoil means my wife can shoot it, and she enjoys doing so when I can actually get her out to the range.

jasonnorcal
04-29-2010, 3:56 PM
I saw 1 at the local gun show last year for 850$. I just didn't have the cash..or the credit:kest:

eccvets
04-29-2010, 3:56 PM
why talk you out of it, I have one and its one of my best! It's the only handgun i turn to when i gotta hit something 100+yards away consistantly. when you move out of cali, you can get 30 round mags.

plus its super easy to load, sorta like a rifle

djleisure
04-29-2010, 4:00 PM
Also keep in mind that next year when (if?) AB 962 goes into effect, you will not be able to mail order handgun ammo as easily as you can now. Not a huge deal to some, but it's another factor to consider.

virulosity
04-29-2010, 4:25 PM
The controls feel cheap to me, including the trigger. Its made of plastic. Ammo is expensive. Its too accurate. You'll love it.

1 SIG fan
04-29-2010, 4:30 PM
Grip is wierd. Feels sorta like a cheap rtf glock... But costs 2x. I would buy it... Cause then it's one less for me to find :). I love the gun after shooting and the ammo ad will buy one. Just gotta stockpile ammo or buy outta state

Once A Marine
04-29-2010, 4:30 PM
It's funny - I never had problem finding SS197 through the "crunch" - but since January, finding SS197 has been hit and miss (though there is more SS195 on the market).

I'd still pick one up - it's a great pistol, and has quickly supplanted the Glock 19 as my favorite.

1 SIG fan
04-29-2010, 4:31 PM
Ammomans got it pretty cheap. Don't remember if it's tr 197 or 195....

Once A Marine
04-29-2010, 4:35 PM
Just checked ammoman and don't see any.

Usually with a bit of prodding you can find something at a decent price online. The prices in local stores are insane.

Truehuntersupply (here in California) typically has ammo and at a good price!

Wholesale Hunter has good deals also - http://www.wholesalehunter.com/asp/prod.asp?productid=51284&title=Federal+Cartridge+SS197+SR+5%2E7x28mm%2F40gr %2C+50Rnds

teflondog
04-29-2010, 4:40 PM
Also keep in mind that next year when (if?) AB 962 goes into effect, you will not be able to mail order handgun ammo as easily as you can now. Not a huge deal to some, but it's another factor to consider.

That's the main reason why I don't own one.

CombatMP
04-29-2010, 4:43 PM
don't buy it

Once A Marine
04-29-2010, 4:44 PM
That's the main reason why I don't own one.

You can make that argument for any handgun in CA, post AB 962.

Sleeping Lesson
04-29-2010, 4:46 PM
I hadn't read up on AB 962 until now. Wow. I hate my state.

Johansenk
04-29-2010, 4:46 PM
please dont go into the 9mm vs 45acp thing that is 90% of reason why im looking into another cal.


.357 Sig?

runninmike
04-29-2010, 5:00 PM
just curious if anyone has seen or heard of any gunfight stats on this 5.7 yet? It would be interesting to read about. I haven't come across any data. This seems like it may be a kind of nice survival bag pistol.

El Gato
04-29-2010, 5:09 PM
First and fore most, I've hit the CGN google seach button with most threads not relating to sales started in 2007.

With that said, I've come across a damn good deal on one, the kind you would be a fool to pass up on. Why do I not want this handgun?

I suppose that depends upon why you want it...
I had one... a good deal...couldn't figure out what it was good for... sold it and bought another AR...

it didn't work for me...as in it didn't meet any particular need ... I can shoot small game with a 9mm too... so why the 5.7?...couldn't figure it out so sold it..and am happy with selling it...
if it works for you...mo power to ya

Bizcuits
04-29-2010, 5:16 PM
If it is a real good deal where you could turn a profit, buy it, play with it, if it doesn't fit you then sale it and make a profit.

Personally the 5.7 never interested me much, I'd rather have a Glock, 1911 or Sig.

leelaw
04-29-2010, 5:33 PM
I've come across a damn good deal on one, the kind you would be a fool to pass up on.

If you want it and can afford it, then I can't talk you out of it for the above reason.

leelaw
04-29-2010, 5:38 PM
<tough guy>

<tough guy>

Hush, the both of you.

Rekrab
04-29-2010, 5:38 PM
At that price it would be worth it just for the novelty I suppose. I don't like the way they handle and I don't like the trigger. But I haven't actually shot one.

I am curious as to how effective the 5.7 round is for self-defense since you're using this for your job.

If you're just looking for a different caliber, why not check out .40?

pyro3k2
04-29-2010, 5:57 PM
At that price it would be worth it just for the novelty I suppose. I don't like the way they handle and I don't like the trigger. But I haven't actually shot one.

I am curious as to how effective the 5.7 round is for self-defense since you're using this for your job.

If you're just looking for a different caliber, why not check out .40?

My other options were a H&k in 40sw or a sig in 40sw, or just trick out my 1911.

Rekrab
04-29-2010, 6:04 PM
If that's the case Pyro, I say go with your plan B and get the sig.

...or maybe a PX4:chris:

gearhead15
04-29-2010, 6:09 PM
It's more of a long-range pistol than a traditional personal defense pistol. I have one because my job sometimes requires me to transport belt-fed machine guns offsite for testing. We do long-range machine gun testing in an abandoned quarry that's out in the middle of nowhere, one way in and out. It would be ridiculously easy for a bad guy to come in behind us and try to take our machine guns when we are loading up after firing all our ammo. For a handgun to engage a bad guy at 100 yards I can't think of another pistol I'd rather have, but I would only purchase one for normal personal defense scenarios if I had some sort of infirmity that required me to use a handgun with very soft recoil.

stormy_clothing
04-29-2010, 6:20 PM
9mm glock 17 with 17 round clip of 147gr +p and a lone wolf barrel and xs big dot sights.

You point the barrel pull the trigger they fall down, If they don't fall down the first shot aim better. All this body armor garbage I keep hearing is forum fantasy talk.

There is no other gun I'd rather have for a pistol and I have had many others. If this gun is meant to protect you the choice is pretty clear, revolver and speed clips or a glock.

holasrmateo
04-29-2010, 6:26 PM
...

Unit74
04-29-2010, 7:41 PM
Expensive ammo you guys say? Can't find ammo?


I don't know what rock you crawled under but ALL the usual ammo spots ALWAYS have SS197 in stock. It can be had on any day for $20 a box of 50. So it's cheaper to shoot than .45 and makes one helluva fireball out the front end. Not to mention it's far more accurate that ANY .45 gun out there.

Those who have not shot it seem to be the ones bad mouthing it. Buy the gun and realize what a blast it is to shoot. I love mine. And will prolly get another in FDE by the end of the year.

JPurp
04-29-2010, 7:47 PM
I wanted a Five seveN for a while and then I got a chance to hold one. I didn't like the feel and the sights seem somewhat cheap for such an expensive gun.

At this point I would only get a Five seveN if I had a PS90/P90 to match.

Just my $.02 and to each there own.

-JP

five.five-six
04-29-2010, 7:47 PM
it's kinda a worthless gun, well it's good for getting through light body armor

SixPointEight
04-29-2010, 7:48 PM
Sorry forgot to mention that the company falls into a loop hole which allows for normal cap mags (as long as they are factory unmodified) to be used during working hours. So while im at work 20 rounds will be allowed, requirements for the firearms are it must be double action and have a 5 inch barrel. I also have a Colt 1911 and a barretta 92fs, please dont go into the 9mm vs 45acp thing that is 90% of reason why im looking into another cal.

Curious, what kinda job is that? Or if you told us would you have to kill us? lol

leelaw
04-29-2010, 8:01 PM
It is a sound gun however. The Haji who attacked Ft Hood was armed with a Five Seven.

Yes, but it's been argued that there would have been more dead if another firearm was used.

Mexican drug cartels prefer it in the current Mexican Drug War.

Bull. Cite this from a reputable source.

It is one of the standard sidearms of the Secret Service and numerous other Mil/LEO agencies.

The Secret Service uses the P90 submachinegun, not the Five-seveN pistol.

Please cite the agencies that issue the Five-seveN as a duty pistol.

Cyc Wid It
04-29-2010, 8:05 PM
Thought the Secret Service carried P229's in .357 sig?

Biff...
04-29-2010, 8:26 PM
Here mine: shoots pretty good, ammo is about the same cost of 45acp, I get my 50rnd boxes for $20 shipped from Sportsmans Guide. Feels great in my hand

http://i39.tinypic.com/rw3ukh.jpg

abusalim81
04-29-2010, 8:27 PM
WAY TOO EXPENSIVE TO SHOOT!

STOP AND RECONSIDER A DIFFERENT PISTOL!

Falstaff
04-29-2010, 8:35 PM
At Front Sight's "Man on Man" competition" the 5.7's had 100% failure to knock over steel target plates that even 9mm's knocked over first hit...

NEE (Not Enough Energy)

I overheard an instructor saying "well, I guess that answers the stopping power debate..."

You did ask for negatives.....

Of course if your main planned adversary wears level III body armour, AND you have (illegal) AP 5.7 ammo, then of course go ahead an get the five seven!

(I want one too though, jus fer the novelty of it..)

aermotor
04-29-2010, 8:59 PM
I'd say it's a novelty gun. Don't think I'd ever get one.

What else do you already have?

holasrmateo
04-29-2010, 9:06 PM
...

holasrmateo
04-29-2010, 9:09 PM
...

dfens
04-29-2010, 10:27 PM
One thing the op. forgets to consider he said double action. Is that Double Action Only or is that DA/SA?

In CA I think unless you are a LEO or one of the other exceptions the DAO version is not on the list.

The five-seven is a Singe Action only with a internally shrouded hammer. It's like a 1911 that you can't thumb down the hammer. He would have to carry it cocked and locked. Don't know if his job is ok with such a gun.

Personally using such a gun on the job depending on the work I wouldn't want to use some exotic gun and if you had to use it got in some legal mess over it.

Or the fact he might not be able to get the armor piercing ammo what the gun was designed and made famous for.

If you're getting a 600 dollar credit use it for a gun you like and that works for you and not try to find a excuse to buy some spur of the moment piece.

leelaw
04-29-2010, 10:37 PM
If your issue is that you just don't like the gun, that's within your right, but other people don't have to subscribe to your intermittent bias logic.

Excuse me?

I own one.

I like it.

I recommended it to the OP.

So where exactly are you coming from with this, and the "Fort Hood/Secret Service/Mexican drug cartels" false logic?

bombadillo
04-29-2010, 10:50 PM
The specialty bullets is what kills it for me. Good luck finding ammo at Walmart\Big 5\ Longs Drugs and the like. It's all well and good to mail order ammo, but if\when our infrastructure breaks down or a battlefield p\u type situation your pretty much SOL. You can always find 9\40\45. That being said.....I want 1......bad.

About the muzzle flash, I realize it's not a good thing, but it's just plain cool. 22 mag pistol or Federal 193 out of a 16" barrel with no mb\fh is awesome:punk:

I find ammo all over the place for it. Its still less than .45acp for the most part. Here is the first place I looked: http://www.ammunitiontogo.com/catalog1/product_info.php/cPath/23_54/products_id/403

The 3rd: http://palmettostatearmory.com/57-28-ammo.php

mswanson223
04-29-2010, 10:55 PM
I rented one. personally they look fugly. Plus isnt the ammo only made by fnh? let me know if otherwise.

Bill Carson
04-29-2010, 11:35 PM
I would so buy it.

Once A Marine
04-30-2010, 6:26 AM
Yes, but it's been argued that there would have been more dead if another firearm was used.

It's also been argued if the guy was a better shooter there would have been more dead.

For those arguing for and against, each gun has it's strengths and weaknesses. Know both for your carry gun of choice, and be proficient with it.

teflondog
04-30-2010, 8:38 AM
You can make that argument for any handgun in CA, post AB 962.

But I'll have a better chance of finding ammo at a store in a different caliber. I rarely see 5.7x28 in every store where I live. But if the OP's local stores have it then my point is moot.

pyro3k2
04-30-2010, 9:00 AM
Curious, what kinda job is that? Or if you told us would you have to kill us? lol

Sorry for the delayed response, but the position is for an armored truck driver/guard.

theneko
04-30-2010, 9:47 AM
Get one - the ammo is $20 per 50 and you get get a sweet trigger job from Elite Ammunition if you don't like the trigger.
The only downside is that when you discover EA ammo you won't want to buy the pokey FN stuff again. :D And that will get expensive. But it is a blast like others have said. The keyboard ninjas who say "its worthless" and provide no data onviosly have never seen or fired one.

DRAB_81
04-30-2010, 10:00 AM
I know it's a little off topic, but I say forget about the FN57. Get a Glock 20 for free, since they are putting $600 towards your weapon. Then you can have 15rds of 10mm mayhem, and a much more functional/versatile caliber. IMHO the 10mm will better suit your purpose, ammo will be easier to find, and I'm guessing 10mm is easier to reload if you go that route. I'm not saying the FN57 is a bad gun or caliber, it just seems like more of a novelty handgun caliber to me.

Either that, or buy the FN and try it out. If you don't like it, sell it, and buy something else.
cough cough... Glock 20...

KevinXT
04-30-2010, 10:39 AM
theres on at the turners in corona... i saw it in the case last night with 2 boxes of bullets next to it :cool: give them a call?

CEDaytonaRydr
04-30-2010, 10:41 AM
Why do I not want this handgun?

You want it!!! :43:

GET IT!!!

DannyZRC
04-30-2010, 11:05 AM
it's a good round when you take into account that it was designed around a requirement to penetrate the CRISAT target at 100m, and be fielded by rear echelon military personnel.

strictly as an SD round, it's certainly adequate. the pistol isn't the most compelling piece of hardware, and it makes a lot more sense to a military or paramilitary organization that has reason to equip people with it's SMG calibermate, the P90.

I don't know if armored truck or any other private security companies can get any special dispensation on LEO only equipment, but if such provision exists the Five-seveN with a 20 or 30 round mag loaded with AP SS190 ammunition would seem appropriate.

after all, knocking over a truck like that would seem a likely place to find an assailant wearing some body armor.

pyro3k2
04-30-2010, 11:28 AM
One thing the op. forgets to consider he said double action. Is that Double Action Only or is that DA/SA?

In CA I think unless you are a LEO or one of the other exceptions the DAO version is not on the list.

The five-seven is a Singe Action only with a internally shrouded hammer. It's like a 1911 that you can't thumb down the hammer. He would have to carry it cocked and locked. Don't know if his job is ok with such a gun.

Personally using such a gun on the job depending on the work I wouldn't want to use some exotic gun and if you had to use it got in some legal mess over it.

Or the fact he might not be able to get the armor piercing ammo what the gun was designed and made famous for.

If you're getting a 600 dollar credit use it for a gun you like and that works for you and not try to find a excuse to buy some spur of the moment piece.

Very good point, I'm going to look more into that. Good catch that little fact crossed my mind.

I know it's a little off topic, but I say forget about the FN57. Get a Glock 20 for free, since they are putting $600 towards your weapon. Then you can have 15rds of 10mm mayhem, and a much more functional/versatile caliber. IMHO the 10mm will better suit your purpose, ammo will be easier to find, and I'm guessing 10mm is easier to reload if you go that route. I'm not saying the FN57 is a bad gun or caliber, it just seems like more of a novelty handgun caliber to me.

Either that, or buy the FN and try it out. If you don't like it, sell it, and buy something else.
cough cough... Glock 20...

Could you give me some more info about the 10mm? Most of my searches result in WTS/WTB or "10mm the brand new round!" and are a little out of date, but I will do some homework on the glock 20

it's a good round when you take into account that it was designed around a requirement to penetrate the CRISAT target at 100m, and be fielded by rear echelon military personnel.

strictly as an SD round, it's certainly adequate. the pistol isn't the most compelling piece of hardware, and it makes a lot more sense to a military or paramilitary organization that has reason to equip people with it's SMG calibermate, the P90.

I don't know if armored truck or any other private security companies can get any special dispensation on LEO only equipment, but if such provision exists the Five-seveN with a 20 or 30 round mag loaded with AP SS190 ammunition would seem appropriate.

after all, knocking over a truck like that would seem a likely place to find an assailant wearing some body armor.

As it was explained to me, the individual employee can not go out and purchase the high round mags and specality ammo, but the company itself has the legal ability to do so and then equip their employee's with requested gear. SO I would legally have access to the AP rounds (from my understanding) and your last comment is what got me thinking about the five seven to begin with.

DannyZRC
04-30-2010, 11:39 AM
have you considered having this conversation with the organization's armorer?

he might be able to set you on the right path in terms of what the organization does/does not provide and why.

chiselchst
04-30-2010, 11:46 AM
Get one. They are great pistols, IMO.

I was at the range last year, and shot a strangers FiveseveN, then immediately called my gun man and said "take it off the shelf, I'll be in tomorrow"...

Ammo ? Easier and cheaper than most everything else I shoot.

Ergonomics are fine. It is light, almost feels like a toy. I'm a multi 1911 & Sig P220 owner, and the 5.7 feels fine in my hands. Comes with 3-mags, and the recoil is pratically nil. Blast to shoot.

Used by SWAT & the Mil, it's legit weapon.

Full Clip
04-30-2010, 11:49 AM
expensive ammo
cost
only hold 10 rounds in Cal

+1
I wanted one as well, but these reasons moved me back to sanity.

SoCalRandy
04-30-2010, 12:36 PM
I know it's a little off topic, but I say forget about the FN57. Get a Glock 20 for free, since they are putting $600 towards your weapon. Then you can have 15rds of 10mm mayhem, and a much more functional/versatile caliber. IMHO the 10mm will better suit your purpose, ammo will be easier to find, and I'm guessing 10mm is easier to reload if you go that route. I'm not saying the FN57 is a bad gun or caliber, it just seems like more of a novelty handgun caliber to me.

Either that, or buy the FN and try it out. If you don't like it, sell it, and buy something else.
cough cough... Glock 20...

Could you give me some more info about the 10mm? Most of my searches result in WTS/WTB or "10mm the brand new round!" and are a little out of date, but I will do some homework on the glock 20

If cost or availability of ammo is a factor then I would steer clear of 10mm....

DRAB_81
04-30-2010, 1:15 PM
Here are a couple places you can start your research. Also, use the search function on those forums for 10mm, Glock 20, G20, Glock 20sf, G20sf. There is a ton of good current info there.

Glocktalk.com
The Ten Ring:
http://glocktalk.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=38

Glocktalk.com
10mm Reloading:
http://glocktalk.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=67

Glocktalk.com
Caliber Corner:
http://glocktalk.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=31

10mmTalk Forum:
http://www.ar15armory.com/forums/10mm-Talk-Forums-f187.html

Double Tap Ammo:
http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/index.php?cPath=21_25

I have never had any trouble finding ammo. It may be a little more expensive than 45, but I don’t shoot my G20SF enough to break the bank. My SD guns (G30SF & G21SF) get most of the range time.

The only reason I suggested 10mm, was that the OP seemed like he already has a few handguns, and wants something that wasn't a 9/40/45. With the extra money he would have put in for the FN57, he could buy over 500rds of DoubleTap ammo, or a reloading setup...

smarter
04-30-2010, 1:43 PM
The company I am getting hired to has a program that puts 600 dollars (of company money) towards the purchase of your firearm.

BUY IT NOW!!

SixPointEight
04-30-2010, 2:28 PM
Sorry for the delayed response, but the position is for an armored truck driver/guard.

Really? I didn't know they were exempted, but that's an awesome job.

SixPointEight
04-30-2010, 2:33 PM
Here are a couple places you can start your research. Also, use the search function on those forums for 10mm, Glock 20, G20, Glock 20sf, G20sf. There is a ton of good current info there.

Glocktalk.com
The Ten Ring:
http://glocktalk.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=38

Glocktalk.com
10mm Reloading:
http://glocktalk.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=67

Glocktalk.com
Caliber Corner:
http://glocktalk.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=31

10mmTalk Forum:
http://www.ar15armory.com/forums/10mm-Talk-Forums-f187.html

Double Tap Ammo:
http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/index.php?cPath=21_25

I have never had any trouble finding ammo. It may be a little more expensive than 45, but I donít shoot my G20SF enough to break the bank. My SD guns (G30SF & G21SF) get most of the range time.

The only reason I suggested 10mm, was that the OP seemed like he already has a few handguns, and wants something that wasn't a 9/40/45. With the extra money he would have put in for the FN57, he could buy over 500rds of DoubleTap ammo, or a reloading setup...

From what I've been reading, unless you load hot, or buy high-dollar defensive ammo the 10mm doesn't really offer much that the .40 doesn't. If the company springs for your duty-ammo too...Look into the 10mm. If not, might want to get a quality .40.

Then see if they'll put cash towards an ACR haha

DRAB_81
04-30-2010, 2:51 PM
From what I've been reading, unless you load hot, or buy high-dollar defensive ammo the 10mm doesn't really offer much that the .40 doesn't. If the company springs for your duty-ammo too...Look into the 10mm. If not, might want to get a quality .40.

Then see if they'll put cash towards an ACR haha

Not to get in a caliber war, but a .40 Short & Weak won't push a 135gr JHP over 1500fps, 165gr over 1400fps, 180gr over 1300fps, and 200gr over 1200fps. A 10mm cartidge can shoot the same projectile faster and just as accurately, if not more accurately. You can get soft loads to match .40 velocities, or hot stuff that blows it out of the water.

hk91666
04-30-2010, 2:56 PM
I had one for a year and a half and sold it then got a CZ52 7.62x25mm does the same alleged penetration (Kevlar) and cost a lot less to feed. CZ52 cost $140 yes it is more ($250) now but... less than a grand for a plastic pistol with a very bad trigger. Don't get me wrong I love FN products just not this one. Also reloading was a real pain.

SixPointEight
04-30-2010, 3:00 PM
Not to get in a caliber war, but a .40 Short & Weak won't push a 135gr JHP over 1500fps, 165gr over 1400fps, 180gr over 1300fps, and 200gr over 1200fps. A 10mm cartidge can shoot the same projectile faster and just as accurately, if not more accurately. You can get soft loads to match .40 velocities, or hot stuff that blows it out of the water.

Didn't I just mention that "unless you get hot loads" it doesn't offer anything over .40? Of course if you get hot-loads you're going to get more performance. However, if you buy a 10mm, and load it at minimum pressures, or buy the cheap plinking 10mm amm0, you won't be gaining anything over a .40Smith & Wesson.

I don't see where your accuracy comment comes in, I believe you're just making that up, there's nothing about the 10mm Auto cartridge that make it inherently more accurate than the .40S&W. Though your Short & Weak comment was clever...or childish.

DannyZRC
04-30-2010, 3:19 PM
JT, though you're not at all wrong, I think you're framing the question in the wrong light.

a 10mm can do everything a 40 can do except for fitting into shorter length frames.

but there are a group of things a 10mm can do that a 40 cannot.

I don't see the flexibility as a weakness, I see the firearm size as a potential weakness for sure, but not that the 10mm can be downloaded.

maybe it's better to say that the ability to upload 10mm past .40S&W is of variable value, at a fixed cost: the larger firearm frame length.

SixPointEight
04-30-2010, 3:26 PM
JT, though you're not at all wrong, I think you're framing the question in the wrong light.

a 10mm can do everything a 40 can do except for fitting into shorter length frames.

but there are a group of things a 10mm can do that a 40 cannot.

I don't see the flexibility as a weakness, I see the firearm size as a potential weakness for sure, but not that the 10mm can be downloaded.

maybe it's better to say that the ability to upload 10mm past .40S&W is of variable value, at a fixed cost: the larger firearm frame length.

I'll agree with you on that. Though if you don't reload, there's an additional cost. Though...your lightened wallet will make up for the larger gun haha.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the 10mm is a bad round. In fact, I want one. What I am saying is that, not all 10mm ammo is equal. If you skimp on ammo, you might as well have gone with the .40 and saved yourself the size.

If the OP likes 10mm and doesn't mind the size, go for it. Especially if, as I said before, the company will spring for your duty ammo.

Once A Marine
04-30-2010, 3:31 PM
Sorry forgot to mention that the company falls into a loop hole which allows for normal cap mags (as long as they are factory unmodified) to be used during working hours. So while im at work 20 rounds will be allowed, requirements for the firearms are it must be double action and have a 5 inch barrel. I also have a Colt 1911 and a barretta 92fs, please dont go into the 9mm vs 45acp thing that is 90% of reason why im looking into another cal.

FiveSeveN is only single action, unless you can find one of the original, pre-IOM versions that were DAO.

pyro3k2
04-30-2010, 3:46 PM
FiveSeveN is only single action, unless you can find one of the original, pre-IOM versions that were DAO.

well....****....H&k or a sig now. Leaning more towards the sig the H&k's with a 5inch barrel are just freaking huge and I have large hands.

raw24
04-30-2010, 4:23 PM
It also fails the 5 inch barrel requirement:

http://www.fnhusa.com/mil/products/firearms/model.asp?fid=FNF003&gid=FNG001&mid=FNM0004

Specs from FN:

• 5.7x28mm
• SAO operation
• Matte Black color
• 4.75" barrel length
• 8.2" overall length
• 10- or 20-round magazines

DRAB_81
04-30-2010, 4:27 PM
Didn't I just mention that "unless you get hot loads" it doesn't offer anything over .40? Of course if you get hot-loads you're going to get more performance. However, if you buy a 10mm, and load it at minimum pressures, or buy the cheap plinking 10mm amm0, you won't be gaining anything over a .40Smith & Wesson.

I don't see where your accuracy comment comes in, I believe you're just making that up, there's nothing about the 10mm Auto cartridge that make it inherently more accurate than the .40S&W. Though your Short & Weak comment was clever...or childish.

Ha Ha, I'm surprised you hadn't heard that yet. Short & Weak, Small & Wimpy, there's a bunch of them. Anyway, You're right. If you ONLY get the weak stuff, you might as well get a 40. But having the capabilty of shooting a wider range of projectiles with the 10mm (135gr-230gr), at a wider range of velocities (1600fps-1000fps) makes it a better all around caliber IMO. I figured since it was a duty weapon, he would buy premium SD ammo. I didn't say it was inherently more accurate, I said just as accurate if not better with the same projectiles at a higher velocities. The 10mm just shoots flatter, with a different kind of recoil.

I'll agree with you on that. Though if you don't reload, there's an additional cost. Though...your lightened wallet will make up for the larger gun haha.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the 10mm is a bad round. In fact, I want one. What I am saying is that, not all 10mm ammo is equal. If you skimp on ammo, you might as well have gone with the .40 and saved yourself the size.

If the OP likes 10mm and doesn't mind the size, go for it. Especially if, as I said before, the company will spring for your duty ammo.

I think we are basically on the same page.

It looks like the OP isn't thinking about the 10mm anymore, so I don't know why I posted this. Sorry to threadjack...

MrSlippyFist
04-30-2010, 7:10 PM
Expensive ammo you guys say? Can't find ammo?


I don't know what rock you crawled under but ALL the usual ammo spots ALWAYS have SS197 in stock. It can be had on any day for $20 a box of 50. So it's cheaper to shoot than .45 and makes one helluva fireball out the front end. Not to mention it's far more accurate that ANY .45 gun out there.

Those who have not shot it seem to be the ones bad mouthing it. Buy the gun and realize what a blast it is to shoot. I love mine. And will prolly get another in FDE by the end of the year.

THIS

corrupt
04-30-2010, 8:09 PM
I have heard from some people that it is absolutely their favorite handgun to shoot.

ILVSMOG
04-30-2010, 8:20 PM
FN should send me a commission check. I've sold 3 of these things for them just by letting friends shoot mine. They're great. Buy it!

TitanCi
04-30-2010, 9:01 PM
Trick out your 1911!

gunrun45
05-01-2010, 2:13 AM
I don't own 1, I own 2. I use one as a CCW gun, the other I use to teach law enforcement across the US. I have no problems carrying it with SS197 ammo and my 20 and 30 round mags.

I can tell you that Fackler's assertions (the only negative quasi-scientific opinion) about the 5.7x28 rounds are just ridiculous. Even his own testing mediums, the results were impressive. It did not meet his penetration parameters though. Knowing your ammo selection changes this part of the equation though.

Martin Fackler is a consultant to the FBI for ballistics research. I can tell you that I have personally seen what SS197 does to soft body tissue and it is incredible... It creates a temporary wound channel that is impressive. It DOES NOT work well against intermediate targets such as auto bodies and exterior house doors.

I have tested several of the available rounds and I am quite happy with most of my results. I know the limitations of the system though and know where I would want to employ it.

I personally do believe that you would be better served with a more traditional sidearm though due to overall usability if you ever leave the company you are going to work for.

I have carried the full size H&K USP's on duty and they are a fine weapon. They ARE rather large though and are NOT for everyone. 12 rounds in a H&K USP45 full size magazine is a tough one to beat.

I am a (full power) 10mm fan. This is an excellent round, but you need to be aware of its propensity to overpenetrate soft targets. Since you would theoretically be shooting in mostly domestic settings, errant rounds are an issue.

elSquid
05-01-2010, 3:18 AM
I can tell you that Fackler's assertions (the only negative quasi-scientific opinion) about the 5.7x28 rounds are just ridiculous. Even his own testing mediums, the results were impressive. It did not meet his penetration parameters though. Knowing your ammo selection changes this part of the equation though.

I think Doc Roberts has picked up Fackler's mantle:

http://www.m4carbine.net/showpost.php?p=630407&postcount=18

-- Michael

Swift Justice
05-01-2010, 7:49 AM
I bought one. I don't regret my purchase. Everyone asks to shoot it at the range. They all want one after they shoot it.

gunrun45
05-01-2010, 11:16 PM
I find that most officers have heard a lot about it, but never actually fired one. Once they shoot one, they are typically sold on it. I know several who carry one as an off-duty piece. I know several other PD's and SO's in CA that have them as special purpose weapons and have several have done EXTENSIVE testing with them using MOST available ammo.

I have also used the AR57 uppers to test the round in a 10in platform and 16in platform. This round just shines like crazy for those teams that need a SBR type setup (say 10in) for vehicle use and protection details.

gasol1ne
05-02-2010, 12:06 AM
if you have small hands the grip could be a problem. i handled a few and i found the grip to be kinda long, like a cz52 or a tokarev.

Angry Scotsman
05-02-2010, 12:41 AM
Get it. SAM FISHER uses it, so why not you too. LOL.

hammerhands32
05-02-2010, 5:30 AM
Get an ar pistol in 5.7. 50 rounds, 10 inch barrel but kind of hard to find a holster for:D