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cannon
04-24-2010, 6:52 AM
Can someone school me on the legality of a .22 open bolt system rifle?

Rifle is in Ca. Can I buy and possess it?

More info: Rifle is used and it would be a PPT.

Jonathan Doe
04-24-2010, 6:57 AM
I don't think there is any regulation on open bolt firearms, unless I am missing something.

Rukus
04-24-2010, 7:29 AM
Pretty sure open bolt is a big no-no due to the fact that full auto is not far away based on that design. Isn't that ATF's stance currently?

ETA: Some quick googling tells me that open bolt weapons were "grandfathered" and that they are still legal to own, although new open bolt designs cannot be made. I do not know anything about the legalities of transferring ownership.

CSACANNONEER
04-24-2010, 7:41 AM
As long as it was made prior to ??????(I think May 1986????), it is just like any other firearm.

God Bless The Mauser
04-24-2010, 11:35 AM
Basically no new ones can be produced but the ones before they made that ruling are fine. Too bad since it would be nice to have a semi-auto open bolt MG42. Be careful with the open bolt .22s, there's one that just needs a pin removed to be a full auto.

Mikeb
04-24-2010, 11:58 AM
I saw one that was made by a home gunsmith. It was obviously a single shot machine gun. the horror...
Mike

anthonyca
04-24-2010, 12:10 PM
I don't think there is any regulation on open bolt firearms, unless I am missing something.

This is a very telling statement that underscores the complexity and confusing situation caused by over 10,000 firearms regulations in the USA. This man is an expert who works examining firearms in a crime lab and testifies to their legality in court, both for DAs, and defendants. His training and experience and knowledge is up there with anyone I have met in the firearms world. If he is not sure, how can the average person own guns without being a criminal?

wilit
04-24-2010, 12:16 PM
As long as it was made prior to ??????(I think May 1986????), it is just like any other firearm.

1981 was the year the BATF said no more open bolt semi's. Anything made prior is okay to own, even in CA (so long as it's not an AW). Anything made after 1981 as an open bolt is considered a MG or constructive possession of a MG. Not sure I ever saw definitively which is the one BATF would charge you with. I've even seen disapproval letters of open bolt single shots.

juicemansam
04-24-2010, 1:28 PM
This is a very telling statement that underscores the complexity and confusing situation caused by over 10,000 firearms regulations in the USA. This man is an expert who works examining firearms in a crime lab and testifies to their legality in court, both for DAs, and defendants. His training and experience and knowledge is up there with anyone I have met in the firearms world. If he is not sure, how can the average person own guns without being a criminal?

it's funny, that according to the courts, it is the citizens' job to know every legality about everything, not le, not the da, not the jury, not the judge, but you, the defendant. according to this logic, the average person is in violation of some crime that they don't know exists or hasn't been created yet, and hasn't been caught. stupid cows, we'll get your milk, one way or another.

anniepoks
04-24-2010, 2:23 PM
it's funny, that according to the courts, it is the citizens' job to know every legality about everything, not le, not the da, not the jury, not the judge, but you, the defendant. according to this logic, the average person is in violation of some crime that they don't know exists or hasn't been created yet, and hasn't been caught. stupid cows, we'll get your milk, one way or another.

very true!

Jonathan Doe
04-24-2010, 2:37 PM
This is a very telling statement that underscores the complexity and confusing situation caused by over 10,000 firearms regulations in the USA. This man is an expert who works examining firearms in a crime lab and testifies to their legality in court, both for DAs, and defendants. His training and experience and knowledge is up there with anyone I have met in the firearms world. If he is not sure, how can the average person own guns without being a criminal?

Yes, it is a complex issue. I have direct line to ATF and DOJ for questions. If I am not mistaking, converting a firearm to fixed firing pin is a no no. But, posession and purchasing a firearm which is manufactured as an open bolt is okay. Like M-10 and M-11's, they used to be open bolt guns, but now they are made as close bolt guns.

I need to do some more research and make phone calls on this issue when I go back to work next week.

CSACANNONEER
04-24-2010, 6:38 PM
1981 was the year the BATF said no more open bolt semi's. Anything made prior is okay to own, even in CA (so long as it's not an AW). Anything made after 1981 as an open bolt is considered a MG or constructive possession of a MG. Not sure I ever saw definitively which is the one BATF would charge you with. I've even seen disapproval letters of open bolt single shots.

Thanks for the correct date!

Omega13device
04-24-2010, 7:34 PM
This is a very telling statement that underscores the complexity and confusing situation caused by over 10,000 firearms regulations in the USA. This man is an expert who works examining firearms in a crime lab and testifies to their legality in court, both for DAs, and defendants. His training and experience and knowledge is up there with anyone I have met in the firearms world. If he is not sure, how can the average person own guns without being a criminal?

By doing a little homework. The penal code is posted on the internet, as are the Federal laws. Or they can come here and ask like the OP did. It's not that hard.