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biofire
04-21-2010, 11:13 AM
The open carry movement has its own section in the Letters section today on page A13, with the title, "World's Gun Capital". All 5 letters are anti-UOC as expected, but one writer asks a good question: What's the aim? Aside from expressing one's view, what is the greater goal? How does it advance gun rights? I honestly don't know and would like to hear an answer.

If today's news coverage is any indicator, these public displays seem to be freaking out a lot of people, but I'm wondering if there is any actual research on public opinion of UOC, rather than just opinion.

I haven't taken a position on UOC yet, and am honestly looking for research information. I am concerned, though, that these public displays could impair CA moving to a shall issue state if the public gets sufficiently freaked out.

Tadjman
04-21-2010, 11:25 AM
Good article, yes.
I do you one better, bio... these displays of open carry, specially in a place like CA, in my opinion, severely hurts the ongoing CCW movement in our state. I have always believed in the existence of the extreme left and right, for it's the only way we can achieve the middle ground in all things. it may seem that the UOC may be the path to put gun ownership / carry issues on the minds of the undecided but I fear it will have the opposite effect: UOC will be put in the same sentence as militias and outlaws, at least in the light of the media in No. CA. it is, however, an interesting thing to see unfold. I too would like to see the research on this and what all the"experts" might think.

biofire
04-21-2010, 12:17 PM
Thanks Tadjman. I have the feeling that you are right, as that seems to be the current reaction. Don't know about you, but I would gladly give up UOC for CCW.

BluNorthern
04-21-2010, 12:39 PM
"In 2006, guns murdered 10,177 people in the United States"...
"To the Prius-driving, unloaded-gun-toting gay man and his like-minded friends, let's just call carrying unloaded gun what they really are: another form of drag.

I just love the logical insights of the anti-gunners.:rolleyes:

gunsmith
04-21-2010, 2:06 PM
gays kissing in public freaked people out, Captain Kirk kissing LT Uhura freaked people out. People need freaking out sometimes.

Shady
04-21-2010, 2:19 PM
gays kissing in public freaked people out, Captain Kirk kissing LT Uhura freaked people out. People need freaking out sometimes.

I second that

ripcurlksm
04-21-2010, 2:21 PM
good, let UOC/OC freak them out, so CCW is a no brainer post McDonald

Havoc70
04-21-2010, 2:31 PM
I find it laughable they call CA the "World's Gun Capital".

Bob Hostetter
04-21-2010, 2:34 PM
I also have wondered what the point is of these "Open Carry" demonstrations. There are a lot of issues that need to be brought forth for public discussion but I have failed to see the value of walking around with an empty gun other then to piss off the locals. We now have the state lawmakers pushing for a law to ban "Open Carry" as a gun control issue and it will probably be passed which will open the door for other more important issues to fall to more restrictive gun control laws. While it important to be willing to fight the good battles it is equally important to pick the right ones to fight.

Someone involved in this issue should share the overall perceived value of these demonstrations to reestablishing reasonable firearms rights to the citizens of California to the rest of us non mall ninja types.

cmaynes
04-21-2010, 2:36 PM
"In 2006, guns murdered 10,177 people in the United States"...
"To the Prius-driving, unloaded-gun-toting gay man and his like-minded friends, let's just call carrying unloaded gun what they really are: another form of drag.

I just love the logical insights of the anti-gunners.:rolleyes:

so you get those people into Pink Pistols.

gunsmith
04-21-2010, 2:40 PM
I also have wondered what the point is of these "Open Carry" demonstrations. There are a lot of issues that need to be brought forth for public discussion but I have failed to see the value of walking around with an empty gun other then to piss off the locals. We now have the state lawmakers pushing for a law to ban "Open Carry" as a gun control issue and it will probably be passed which will open the door for other more important issues to fall to more restrictive gun control laws. While it important to be willing to fight the good battles it is equally important to pick the right ones to fight.

Someone involved in this issue should share the overall perceived value of these demonstrations to reestablishing reasonable firearms rights to the citizens of California to the rest of us non mall ninja types.

open doors? post McDonald it may well be true that if they DO outlaw UOC/LOC in CA that they HAVE to go over to shall issue.!

Glock22Fan
04-21-2010, 2:48 PM
California has had the open carry law for how long?

At present California does not, never has had and probably never will have, have a law that says Open Carry is legal, because laws only prescribe what is illegal.

Thus, at present, you can open carry because there is no law against it. This looks like changing soon, and yes, my view is that without the drama from certain groups of people, it would have remained legal.

OK, well, I guess there's not a lot of point in it being legal if exercising that right leads to getting it banned, but IMHO it would have been better if people had been patient and waited to see the results of forthcoming legislation that might have made it harder to pass that law.

Aldemar
04-21-2010, 2:51 PM
California has had the open carry law for how long?

And now they want to abolish it or put on restrictions?

What is the motivation for this latest infringement on the 2nd amendment coming from?

What really is the agenda here? And how far is it gonna go?

Not sure how long the law has been on the books but it was modified from LOC to UOC in 1968. The sight of the Black Panthers marching around with loaded rifles was just too much for our fearless leaders in Sacramento back then.

As far as motivation, I'm afraid it's yet another overreaction to the UOC folks.

You already know what their agenda is and how far they want to carry it.

Mikeb
04-21-2010, 2:57 PM
I had a thought the other day about open carry. I stopped at a fast food place for lunch. There was a guy in line with a holstered pistol. No one payed him any attention. Maybe because he was a security guard. So I was thinking ...All it takes is a blue shirt and a patch on the sleeve and you fit right in.
Just a thought
Mike

santacruzstefan
04-21-2010, 3:06 PM
I had a thought the other day about open carry. I stopped at a fast food place for lunch. There was a guy in line with a holstered pistol. No one payed him any attention. Maybe because he was a security guard. So I was thinking ...All it takes is a blue shirt and a patch on the sleeve and you fit right in.
Just a thought
Mike

Hmm, yeah, but be careful you don't get busted for impersonation. Though, I'm not sure if impersonating a security guard is the same as impersonating LEO.

Mikeb
04-21-2010, 3:18 PM
Hmm, yeah, but be careful you don't get busted for impersonation. Though, I'm not sure if impersonating a security guard is the same as impersonating LEO.

No I'm not planning on any impersonations. The point I was trying to make is there was a guy with a gun, not LEO, and children weren't crying , mothers weren't hiding them under their skirts, people weren't running out or screaming or even just cowering in the corner. And the guys patch could have said "eat at Joe's" no one payed any attention or asked to see his permit. But when the press reports people carry empty guns as an expression, the world goes crazy. People write to the paper terrified at the danger and our reps go into overdrive to put a stop to it.
anyway
Mike

Desert Dude
04-21-2010, 3:27 PM
I had a thought the other day about open carry. I stopped at a fast food place for lunch. There was a guy in line with a holstered pistol. No one payed him any attention. Maybe because he was a security guard. So I was thinking ...All it takes is a blue shirt and a patch on the sleeve and you fit right in.
Just a thought
Mike

I travel in Nevada quite often. I usually see several folks open carry in markets, cafes and stores. No one pays any attention to these guys. I guess it's because they know it's legal and they see it all the time. I guess the more you see and hear about OC the less you are afraid of it. The guns in Nevada are LOADED. I see no real object in OC an empty gun on my hip. I wanted to carry so I applied for a CCW permit. It was issued. Why not just apply for a CCW permit? If enough get turned down without a reasonable cause perhaps we could make progress in 'shall issue' status.

Zomgie
04-21-2010, 3:28 PM
Now I'm tempted to OC while wearing a black suit, white shirt, black tie, shades... ;)

Havoc70
04-21-2010, 3:30 PM
I travel in Nevada quite often. I usually see several folks open carry in markets, cafes and stores. No one pays any attention to these guys. I guess it's because they know it's legal and they see it all the time. I guess the more you see and hear about OC the less you are afraid of it. The guns in Nevada are LOADED. I see no real object in OC an empty gun on my hip. I wanted to carry so I applied for a CCW permit. It was issued. Why not just apply for a CCW permit? If enough get turned down without a reasonable cause perhaps we could make progress in 'shall issue' status.

You live in Kern County. Kern County has sensible CCW issuance. Living in the Bay Area, good luck with getting a CCW.

N6ATF
04-21-2010, 3:41 PM
Let me guess, 4/5 out of the letters were sent in by CGN members who repeatedly refer to the lawful bearing of arms as "dick waving" and "compensating for inadequacy down there".

Almost every poll, comments section, and letters section in every media source runs 4/5 PRO-2A, not anti, no matter how "liberal" the source. Something stinks there.

Now I'm tempted to OC while wearing a black suit, white shirt, black tie, shades... ;)

Doesn't that imply a black blazer or sportcoat, with a concealed holster? Where would you open carry it?

jdberger
04-21-2010, 3:50 PM
The tone of the letters irked me.

My response:

RE: Letters to the Editor "World's Gun Capital"

Editors,

Since when has the Chronicle condoned name calling, pejoratives and insults in its "Letters" section?

In three separate letters, writers suggest that gun owners are in "drag", have small penises, wouldn't be tolerated if they were black and are terrorists.

By simply printing these myopic and insulting statements, the Chronicle is tacitly approving a policy of hatred towards ordinary citizens simply exercising their Constitutional rights.

Apparently, the Editorial Board has assumed the role of Bull Connor.

timdps
04-21-2010, 4:16 PM
I find it laughable they call CA the "World's Gun Capital".

The reference is to "America" not CA.

Here is the link: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/04/21/ED391D1H5Q.DTL