PDA

View Full Version : OC sheriff Sandra Hutchens unpaid tax liens


RomanDad
03-29-2010, 6:19 AM
http://www.occcws.com/?p=871



OCCCWS has learned that Sheriff Sandra Hutchens, shortly before she was promoted to the rank of Captain in the Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Department, was the subject of massive tax liens by the very county she served (see the actual documents below).

Documents obtained by OCCCWS show that Sheriff Hutchens, then known as Sandra Anderson, along with her former husband, were delinquent in paying property taxes in the amount of more than $36,000 to Los Angeles County. No public record was found showing that these liens were ever directly paid by Sheriff Hutchens and her former husband.

This raises troubling questions about Sandra Hutchens’ ability to manage not only her personal finances, but those of the Orange County Sheriff’s Department. More importantly it raises the issue of integrity, as every applicant to become a deputy sheriff is expected to fully disclose any deficiencies in their financial history, and failing to do so would likely end their hope of employment with OCSD. The question must be asked: did Sandra Hutchens inform the Board of Supervisors of this past deficiency, either directly or through the search firm retained to evaluate candidates for appointment to the office of Sheriff-Coroner?

If Sandra Hutchens withheld this information, she is plainly holding herself to a lesser standard of integrity than the deputies she commands. If she disclosed this information, and was still appointed, then the process adopted by the Board of Supervisors failed the citizens of Orange County.

Hundreds of thousands of Orange County residents honor their obligations to pay their taxes, even in difficult times and through trying personal circumstances. That fact that appointed Sheriff Sandra Hutchens apparently did not, and may have concealed this from the voters of Orange County, speaks volumes about her fitness for the office she seeks.


http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y154/MovieLawyer/Lien1REDACTED.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y154/MovieLawyer/Lien2REDACTED.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y154/MovieLawyer/Lien3REDACTED.jpg

ocspeedracer
03-29-2010, 7:02 AM
this is great, can we kick her out now?

Curtis
03-29-2010, 7:44 AM
I received a similar notice a year or two ago. It was for $60,000 and a property in Los Angeles county. It turns out it was related to a building permit pulled on a property. I was the engineer of record and some how I was listed as the one pulling the "owner-builder" permit.

nick
03-29-2010, 8:36 AM
Taxes are for little people.

RomanDad
03-29-2010, 8:38 AM
I received a similar notice a year or two ago. It was for $60,000 and a property in Los Angeles county. It turns out it was related to a building permit pulled on a property. I was the engineer of record and some how I was listed as the one pulling the "owner-builder" permit.

I am unaware of our esteemed Sheriff's prior career as an architectural engineer.

Ron-Solo
03-29-2010, 9:36 AM
The release of liens is done on a separate document. Methinks someone might be spreading 'half truths' to further their own agenda.

I happen to know both of them, but do not consider them friends. I worked with them over the years with LASD. During that time, they were going thru a divorce. We all know those things can get messy.

If you have issues with her record, fine. Bring those to light all you want. But don't stoop to half-truths and innuendos.

C'mon, be better than that. It makes us all look bad.

RomanDad
03-29-2010, 9:51 AM
The release of liens is done on a separate document. Methinks someone might be spreading 'half truths' to further their own agenda.

I happen to know both of them, but do not consider them friends. I worked with them over the years with LASD. During that time, they were going thru a divorce. We all know those things can get messy.

If you have issues with her record, fine. Bring those to light all you want. But don't stoop to half-truths and innuendos.

C'mon, be better than that. It makes us all look bad.


What half truths? This isn't a case of her paying her taxes a few weeks or even months late. The county had to file liens on her YEARS after the taxes were due and owed. You can google map the situs and tell me if you think this was their primary residence. Given that it is a 16 unit apartment complex in a depressed neighborhood in Long Beach it very likely was an investment rental property.

These are two people with well paying jobs, who can afford multiple real estate holdings, who rather than pay the taxes that helped pay their salaries, appeared to have stiffed the taxpayers of Los Angeles. We have found NO INDICATION that these liens were paid by them. They may have been satisfied in a foreclosure sale that barely covered the liens, let alone any outstanding mortgage, however, we dont know because she is less than direct when asked questioned about possible foreclosures. If she wishes to produce documents proving she's paid these debts, thats fine, she has better access to her financial history than the public does. It still does not speak well of her overall financial responsibility that in 1998 she had not yet paid taxes due in 1996.

As far as a divorce, millions of people get divorced and keep up with their financial obligations, and when they dont, the law looks dis-favorably on it divorce or no divorce. And the ones who can't, don't later run for high ranking elected office without questions about those deficiencies being asked.

She is running to be the SHERIFF of Orange County. A department with a budget of nearly three quarters of a billion dollars. Her financial responsibility is a legitimate question in this election, especially when it would have likely barred her taking a job as a Deputy with the department. She was a Lieutenant with the LASD when these obligations came due. By that time she should have been wearing her big girl pants.

Californio
03-29-2010, 10:22 AM
Gentlemen,

I don't have a dog in this fight but on the issue of tax liens. 1997/1998 was when Rent Control Property owners were able to go to market on voluntary vacancies. Prior to that rent control vacancies had to be re-rented at rent control prices. I myself picked-up a rundown rent control property, put massive capital into the property and created a clean place for people to live as well as a reasonable return on investment. The Tax Assessor wanted to tax the building way over its cost basis, I did not pay, hired an attorney and fought the bums. I was at the Appeals Board with my attorney before they finally folded and I won 100% of my points.

Could the parties mentioned had the same experience? The Tax Assessor was an *** and the appeals process was the only way to get justice.

Now on her CCW stance, I am all for her taking a hike.

RomanDad
03-29-2010, 11:49 AM
Gentlemen,

I don't have a dog in this fight but on the issue of tax liens. 1997/1998 was when Rent Control Property owners were able to go to market on voluntary vacancies. Prior to that rent control vacancies had to be re-rented at rent control prices. I myself picked-up a rundown rent control property, put massive capital into the property and created a clean place for people to live as well as a reasonable return on investment. The Tax Assessor wanted to tax the building way over its cost basis, I did not pay, hired an attorney and fought the bums. I was at the Appeals Board with my attorney before they finally folded and I won 100% of my points.

Could the parties mentioned had the same experience? The Tax Assessor was an *** and the appeals process was the only way to get justice.

Now on her CCW stance, I am all for her taking a hike.

I'm glad you bring up CCW....

"One older California Decision concerning a civil service application for employment as a police officer defined good moral character as including all the elements essential to make up such character, including honesty and sobriety... Certainly it would also appear that a person who has committed acts of moral turpitude lacks good moral character. Moral turpitude has been defined as anything contrary to justice, honesty, modesty, or good morals...."

Evelle J. Younger Attorney General of California "Salute v Pitches memo" August 23, 1977



The above quote can be found in the unpublished Attorney General opinion No. CR. 77/30 I.L. The very memo Sheriff Hutchens used to justify the revocation and restrictions of existing CCW permit holders who had their permits "expired early" without cause...

The U.S. Department of justice defines willful tax evasion as a crime of "moral turpitude".

The sheriff would be barred from carrying her firearm by her own standard.

RomanDad
03-29-2010, 12:14 PM
Now on RedCounty:

http://www.redcounty.com/sheriff-2010-hutchens-tax-liens/38220

rc601962
03-29-2010, 12:34 PM
You have to feel sorry for the guy she was married to. I'll bet he feels the same way about her now that we feel. She seems as cuddly as a rabid porcupine. At least he escaped.

RomanDad
03-29-2010, 1:46 PM
You have to feel sorry for the guy she was married to.

At least he picked her.... We had her appointed to us.

SteveH
03-29-2010, 1:46 PM
OC voters will not care about old tax liens from LA county.

RomanDad
03-29-2010, 2:08 PM
I'm an OC voter and I very much resent it when our elected officials hold themselves to a lower standard than the average tax payer.

But of course you've become a reliable voice of support for Sheriff Hutchens.

Ron-Solo
03-29-2010, 2:15 PM
Well, it appears they are duplicates for the same piece of property for the same tax year (1996). Think the LA County Assessor might have goofed somewhere? It's possible.

I'm dealing with issues with the Riverside County Assessor who mailed tax bills to a wrong address then wants me to pay penalty fees for their mistake.

Bark up the CCW tree all you want. Get more facts on this is all I'm trying to say. I doubt you have the "smoking gun" you think you have. (no pun intended)

Ron-Solo
03-29-2010, 2:17 PM
I'm an OC voter and I very much resent it when our elected officials hold themselves to a lower standard than the average tax payer.

But of course you've become a reliable voice of support for Sheriff Hutchens.

I hope you are not referring to me. I'm not a supporter of hers. I just hate seeing people go off half cocked on weak info.

SteveH
03-29-2010, 2:21 PM
I'm an OC voter and I very much resent it when our elected officials hold themselves to a lower standard than the average tax payer.

But of course you've become a reliable voice of support for Sheriff Hutchens.

I'm actually a Hunt supporter. Hutchens needs to go. I'm just saying an old tax lien from LA County isnt going to hit home with OC voters.

RomanDad
03-29-2010, 2:23 PM
Hi ron (blackberry can't quote)m. They are not duplicates. It appears the property is a large apartment complex that was built on three separate parcels of land. Under those circumstances its fairly normal to receive a separate tax bill for each underlying parcel.

Californio
03-29-2010, 2:26 PM
Ok I dug this up. Looks like a Newer Building, 1987, and it sold in March 1998 so the Liens, safe bet were paid off in Escrow. I redacted the current owner but its listed on the link. Looks like a simple divorce game, no one got away with paying their taxes.

2415 15th Street
Long Beach, CA 90804
Find on map >>
Owner: New Owner 3-31-1998
Total land value: $216,988
Total building value: $455,062
Total value for property: $672,050
Recording date: 03/31/1998
Year built: 1987
Effective year built: 1987
Area of property: 12,146 square feet
Assessment for fiscal year: 2008/2009

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/los-angeles-county/1/15th-Street-37.html#ixzz0jbQe3lGl

RomanDad
03-29-2010, 2:31 PM
Ron- these are public documents. I f there is a reasoable explanation for them, then the Sheriff can provide it. If not, the taxpayers and voters deserve to know that she has played fast and loose with her own tax obligations.

OrangeCountyCCW
03-29-2010, 2:35 PM
The biggest and strongest wall is still built using small bricks.

Unpaid tax liens may resonate more with some voters than others (say, someone just evicted from their home because of them, or a family struggling to do the right thing and pay them) -- and may resonate with voters not terribly jazzed up about CCW or jails.

Good work by RomansDad and hats off to him and whoever worked with him to get this information out to the voters!

RomanDad
03-29-2010, 2:38 PM
You can try to defend her... I think you may regret doing so when more comes out.

hill billy
03-29-2010, 2:58 PM
The biggest and strongest wall is still built using small bricks.



Wise words

RomanDad
03-29-2010, 3:02 PM
Somebody on Red County (and no... I have no idea who... We looked for this info and didn't find it) just posted her record of divorce.

It was filed for in November of 1993 and finalized in October of 1994. They were DIVORCED TWO YEARS prior to these taxes becoming due. And the liens were imposed ALMOST FOUR YEARS after they were divorced (and 5 years after they separated). Yet they still held title as joint tenants. She can't blame this on her very much EX husband.... This was an on-going income stream and business venture for the two of them.

This of course begs the question.... What happened to the 1997 taxes?

BadIndianSwamp
03-29-2010, 3:08 PM
Whatever it takes to get her out will work for me.
Bill Hunt gets my vote.

KylaGWolf
03-29-2010, 3:47 PM
Now on RedCounty:

http://www.redcounty.com/sheriff-2010-hutchens-tax-liens/38220

link is broken

RomanDad
03-29-2010, 4:00 PM
link is broken

Its there.... Theyre having sever issues today.

IGOTDIRT4U
03-29-2010, 4:04 PM
It opened for me. The comments from ltpar are suspicious.

RomanDad
03-29-2010, 4:08 PM
It opened for me. The comments from ltpar are suspicious.

Mr. Sandra Hutchens?


Their servers are horrible.

KylaGWolf
03-29-2010, 4:10 PM
OK will try agian/

VW*Mike
03-29-2010, 6:43 PM
I just find it surprising she found a guy to marry her......

Doheny
03-29-2010, 7:01 PM
For the life of me, I can't understand why she didn't leave the CCW issue alone until after the upcoming November election. Even if she issued new ones sparingly, but kept and renewed existing ones, she wouldn't be having these issues pop up.

FWIW, I was in a meeting today with two people on the OCSD above the rank of Sgt. (I don't want to get too specific.) They said it was her election to lose. Obviously, their opinion and how they see things.

U2BassAce
03-29-2010, 7:29 PM
I like Mondays now. :mnl:

So I have the TIVO set for next Monday's edition of RomanDad smack down!!!!

Reloaderx2
03-29-2010, 7:45 PM
Although the title of this thread calls them "unpaid" taxes. There is no evidence that the taxes were paid or unpaid. The only evidence that exists is that there was a lien 12 years ago. If they were divorced, that doesn't mean that they didn't continue to hold the rental property as "Joint Tenants". I am no fan of Sandy Sue but if your are going to throw something out there it better stick. Otherwise there will be some blowback as far as the fence sitters are concerned.

proxiedjohnny
03-29-2010, 8:03 PM
Be careful RomanDad. We may be reading a detailed description of your favorite pair of fuzzy handcuffs after you're mistakenly arrested for male prostitution.

Mr. Sandra Hutchens?
Their servers are horrible.

It seems like it's impossible for conservative or pro-gun sites to find good hosting.

glbtrottr
03-30-2010, 12:34 AM
I just find it surprising she found a guy to marry her......

Not one, but two.

Maybe some boys have a need for a sugar momma far more than anything else...even if they have to wake up and listen to her everyday.

Specially given that she's always simply "enforcing the law".

Chances are she marries men who're far more on the slighter, wimpier, quieter side so she can enjoy her limelight and less femenine approach.

Doheny
03-30-2010, 12:44 AM
/\/\ Her current husband is a retired chief or thereabouts with the LA School police, IIRC. I'm sure he wasn't paid in chicken feed, so between their two retirements and her current income as sheriff, they're pulling in some bank.

Doheny
03-30-2010, 1:28 AM
As much as I think she should pay her taxes on time like everyone else, I'm not sure it's going to make a difference. No one is going to remember this when it comes to casting their ballot (no one other than us.) People just don't pay attention to the sheriff race.

Californio
03-30-2010, 9:52 AM
I am all for you guys running the current OC Sheriff out on a rail but this matter is a non issue.

Divorce 1994, 3 years of unpaid taxes somewhere around 8K a year or 24K in taxes, 12K in penalties and interest, the gubment got its due. If you remember 1993 was a RE recession. Property probably sat on the market from 1994 to early 1998. Property went into Escrow and TC placed a Lien to be paid in Escrow, the property would not have changed hands without the Lien being satisfied in Escrow.

This is SOP in Divorce cases, as an Accountant I have seen it more often than not and it is not illegal. After 5 years the County could have sold the property for taxes.

Now go after her for her poor conduct in office especially the crap she pulled at your CCW County Supervisor meetings and the lot.