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View Full Version : Riverside County Ord 514.10 and CA PC 12031


inbox485
03-25-2010, 3:46 PM
I was working on a shooting zones map to correspond with RC Ord 514.10 (http://www.clerkoftheboard.co.riverside.ca.us/ords/500/514.10.pdf), and while doing so, I noted that in no place does the ordinance prohibit loaded firearms except rifles and shotguns. And those are only considered loaded if they are chambered.

So then I went back and checked CA PC 12031 (http://law.onecle.com/california/penal/12031.html). It mentions "prohibited area" without elaborating on what is to be prohibited. I've seen a lot of posts suggesting that any prohibition on discharge triggers this clause, but:


I've yet to see any case law defining it in such a manner
12031 is focused on loaded firearms, not the discharge of firearms


So it would seem to me that the prohibition referred to would be somewhere that being loaded would be prohibited. RC Ord 514.10 never prohibits loaded handguns and contains conditions when discharge is lawful county wide. That being the case, 12031 has no effect in any area of unincorporated Riverside County. Thoughts?

E Pluribus Unum
03-26-2010, 3:11 AM
It is very clearly stated in statutory law... not case law...

12031. (a) (1) A person is guilty of carrying a loaded firearm when he or she carries a loaded firearm on his or her person or in a vehicle while in any public place or on any public street in an incorporated city or in any public place or on any public street in a prohibited area of unincorporated territory.

(f) As used in this section, "prohibited area" means any place where it is unlawful to discharge a weapon.



In unincorporated territory, the Fish and Game Code section 2006 defines loaded as a round in the chamber. This means a loaded magazine in the gun, but no round in the chamber is unloaded.

In incorporated areas, the penal code defines loaded as any round being placed into a position from which it can be fired (People v Clark).

This means, rounds in the magazine AND magazine in the gun means loaded. Loaded magazine next to, on, or even duct taped to the firearm is not loaded.

GrizzlyGuy
03-26-2010, 10:02 AM
They have defined "loaded" using the DFG definition for purposes of that ordinance only. For example, section 6 says that you cannot carry a loaded rifle or shotgun (except as allowed in that section) using that definition.

However, that has no relevance to PC 12031 (http://law.onecle.com/california/penal/12031.html) where the more restrictive definition of loaded applies (as later modified by People v. Clark (http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/Defining_loaded_in_California#People_v._Clark)).

This means that the 12031 prohibitions on carrying loaded, using the People v. Clark definition, do apply in the unincorporated areas of that county. Sections 3-8 define various instances when you cannot "shoot or discharge a firearm". Some of those restrictions vary depending on gun type as you say (e.g., in section 3 the distances are 150 yards for shotguns and 300 yards for other types), but if discharge is prohibited, it is a "prohibited area" per 12031(f). This means that you cannot carry a loaded firearm (People v. Clark definition) in those areas of the county, unless the ordinance has an exception for discharge (such as their various exceptions for discharge while hunting).

inbox485
03-26-2010, 6:33 PM
It is very clearly stated in statutory law... not case law...

(f) As used in this section, "prohibited area" means any place where it is unlawful to discharge a weapon.



Thanks. I thought I was missing something.