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Abysmal
02-04-2006, 9:21 AM
Still hunting for the ultimate gunsafe...
http://www.brownsafe.com/categories/gun_safes/gun_safes.htm

The Finest Gun Safe made??????
....and more

Why own a Brown Gun Safe? Chances are there is a burglary in your future. It is a frightening but indisputable fact, and if you own guns, you are increasing those odds. Firearms are one of the three prime targets for burglars. They are valuable, easy to carry and are extremely easy to sell with no questions asked. Even after the most sophisticated alarm system is tripped, an experienced burglar can strip all the household valuables and disappear before the police arrive. The well-trained thief's major enemy is time, and nothing will discourage him more than a rugged safe. A quick inspection will tell him if he can gain easy access. Although most safes can be compromised in a few minutes, your intruder's enthusiasm will be diminished upon encountering a "burglary rated" Brown Safe. He will immediately recognize that possible entry would take hours of special tools. As a gun owner, you already have a sizable investment that is subject to possible loss. Even if your collection is insured, you probably have several cherished firearms that could not be replaced for any amount of money. Add to this your other valuable possessions such as jewelry, precious metals, camera equipment and important documents, and you should realize the importance of protection. A safe is a once in a lifetime investment and should be selected very carefully. There are tips to ensure a good buy. Too many people have been shocked to find their "safe" offered virtually no resistance to even a novice burglar. Burglary rated Brown Safes have been designed, engineered and manufactured with one purpose to provide the owner with peace of mind. A comparison will prove that a Brown Safe is in a class by itself and provides a value unmatched in today's security industry.


Standard Features of B & C Rated Gun Safes

U.L. approved combination lock
**Heavy half inch solid steel door on B rated models**
**Ultra-secure 1 inch solid steel door on C Rated models**
Flush door with exclusive anti-hydraulic spreading devices
1 inch hardened steel locking bolts with anti-drive resistance
5 active and passive relocking devices
Granulated carbide hardplate to protect lock from drill attacks
1 inch laminated, interlocked & double-welded door jamb
Ball and roller bearing hinge
Four 5/8 inch holes for anchoring
High gloss finish with choice of color

Additional Features of the TL-15 & TL-30 Gun Safes
TL-15
Massive 1 1/2 inch thick laminated steel door and 1 inch solid steel body
TL-30
Ultra-secure 1 3/4 inch thick laminated steel door, with full face manganal, and 1 inch thick body.
1 inch continuous welded steel body
5 active, passive and thermal relocking devices,randomly placed

Gun Safes Optional Equipment
Full Size Shelves
Adjustable full and half gun racks
Key Locking Combination Dial
Glass Plate Relocking Device
Three way Bolt Work with Anti-Drive

Abysmal
02-04-2006, 9:27 AM
They go on to offer a few more comments...

Gun safe buying tips

Here at Brown Safe Mfg, we pride ourselves in building safes that can withstand attack, be easily repaired, and continue to faithfully serve our clients; thus, providing long term savings and conserving resources. Use the following tips when looking to purchase a gun safe to better ensure the security of your cherished possessions.

Always check that a safe has a U.L. Group 2 lock or better. The three dependable lock manufacturers are LaGard, Sargent & Greenleaf, and Kaba Mas. The last thing you want are your most valued items locked in a safe with a malfunctioning lock.

It is important that the safe has a minimum of a ½” thick solid steel door (beware if the safe manufacturer doesn’t state solid steel or lists ‘composite’ as this can be anything from sheet metal wrapped around wood to sheet metal and drywall) and a ¼” thick solid steel body. Steel is expensive and many manufactures cut costs by making their safes with thin sheet metal.

Consider convenience: if you don’t make the safe convenient you are less likely to use it. Adding an electronic lock can make opening the safe quick and easy, as well as enabling the user to easily reset the combination when needed (without the aid of a locksmith.)

All safes should have relockers to help ensure the safe remains locked in the case of a burglary. Relockers are hardened pins that are triggered, in a variety of ways during an attack, and cannot be retracted without hours of drilling. The number of relockers on a safe will range from 2-10+ depending on the size and burglary grade of the safe.

When shopping for a gun safe be aware of features that are only seen on ‘gun safes’ such has internal hinges, fire liners, etc. as they are usually marketing features more than safety features. The gun safe industry is very competitive and manufacturers are always coming out with ‘new features.’ It is often helpful to look at commercial safes to get an idea of how a safe, which is built for extremely high burglary risk, is constructed. For example, external hinges are a standard feature on commercial safes because the average burglar will waste time trying to cut or pry them. In any quality safe the hinges simply swing the door and shouldn’t be part of the security of the safe. Internal hinges usually cause the burglar to immediately attack the lock and other vital areas on the safe.

Fire liners: Be extremely careful when considering a safe with a ‘fire liner,’ ‘ceramic fire layer,’ ‘fireboard,’ etc. You will never find these fire liners in a commercial or high end safe, simply because they do not work for any substantial length of time. Many of the manufactures are using the specifications of the building material used. For example ‘U.L. listed fireliner’ which just refers to the U.L. rating of the drywall used and in no way means the safe is U.L. rated. Also, many of the manufacturers will test the safes in there own labs rather than having an independent (preferably U.L. labs) test the safe.

Construction of a fire safe:
A true U.L. rated fire only safe is made with two thin skins of sheet metal with a water retaining media (typically a concrete and vermiculite mixture) in between. The door jam is highly convoluted with a heat seal. As the heat hits the outside of the safe the fire retardant gives off the retained water as steam. This expands inside the safe and forces the heat out of the convoluted door jamb forming a heat seal. This steam also saturates the contents to artificially raise its flash point.

Unfortunately this type of construction doesn’t provide any burglary protection due to the safe only having sheet metal and a soft fire media.

If you are looking for burglary protection in addition to fire protection, the safe needs to be built with at least B-rated safe construction ( ½” thick solid steel door and ¼” solid steel body.) Due to the thickness of the steel (which will conduct heat) a 2.5” thick fire cladding must be used in order to insulate the steel portion of the safe from the heat of the fire. This fire cladding is a concrete amalgamate which insulates the solid steel portion of the safe. The fire cladding also has the advantage of adding considerable additional burglary protection (due to being a mix which includes concrete) with added torch, thermic lance and brute force protection.

When comparing gun safes it is helpful to compare the weight of similar sized models from different manufacturers. This will let you compare the actual amount of steel in the safe (as apposed to sheet metal wrapped around wood or drywall).

socalsteve
02-09-2006, 5:52 PM
Have you decided which is best yet?

I am thinking of an AMSEC burglary/fireproof safe in the $3000 to $4000 range. I think the mid 2000lb range is all I can get moved into my house. Also, shipping for a 4000 lb safe gets expensive.
It doesn't have to be called a gun safe just give me more than 52" interior height.

I like some of the $4700 safes but how do I get 4000 lbs into my bedroom?

http://graffundersafes.com/

These guys have a good rep. expensive tho.

mysecuritypro.com has a Amsec CF6528 for $3760 but @ 3200 lbs ouch!

and an Americam Security (amsec) BF7240 firelined for $2347 around 1/2 the weight which I know I can get movers to handle and should be cheaper to ship but its a "gun" safe so its not a great burglary safe.

Amsec also makes the FS5737DD which looks possible.

The Brown Safe Manufacturing looks like they make a good product but I can't see much difference between them and Amsec.

bonjing
02-20-2006, 8:32 PM
They go on to offer a few more comments...

Fire liners: Be extremely careful when considering a safe with a ‘fire liner,’ ‘ceramic fire layer,’ ‘fireboard,’ etc. You will never find these fire liners in a commercial or high end safe, simply because they do not work for any substantial length of time. Many of the manufactures are using the specifications of the building material used. For example ‘U.L. listed fireliner’ which just refers to the U.L. rating of the drywall used and in no way means the safe is U.L. rated. Also, many of the manufacturers will test the safes in there own labs rather than having an independent (preferably U.L. labs) test the safe.

Construction of a fire safe:
A true U.L. rated fire only safe is made with two thin skins of sheet metal with a water retaining media (typically a concrete and vermiculite mixture) in between. The door jam is highly convoluted with a heat seal. As the heat hits the outside of the safe the fire retardant gives off the retained water as steam. This expands inside the safe and forces the heat out of the convoluted door jamb forming a heat seal. This steam also saturates the contents to artificially raise its flash point.

Unfortunately this type of construction doesn’t provide any burglary protection due to the safe only having sheet metal and a soft fire media.

If you are looking for burglary protection in addition to fire protection, the safe needs to be built with at least B-rated safe construction ( ½” thick solid steel door and ¼” solid steel body.) Due to the thickness of the steel (which will conduct heat) a 2.5” thick fire cladding must be used in order to insulate the steel portion of the safe from the heat of the fire. This fire cladding is a concrete amalgamate which insulates the solid steel portion of the safe. The fire cladding also has the advantage of adding considerable additional burglary protection (due to being a mix which includes concrete) with added torch, thermic lance and brute force protection.

When comparing gun safes it is helpful to compare the weight of similar sized models from different manufacturers. This will let you compare the actual amount of steel in the safe (as apposed to sheet metal wrapped around wood or drywall).

so with this, it's not a good idea to put stuff like silica gel (that moisture absorbing stuff) inside the safe?

Senna
02-27-2006, 8:58 PM
Hi this is my first post here so I thought I'd share my safe with you. :)
http://www.libertysafe.com/Safe_Classic.lasso
The large one
http://www.libertysafe.com/Safe_Magnum.lasso

mperA6
03-28-2006, 2:23 AM
I just did alot of research on gun safes. In the $2500 to 3500 range for 72" x 40"
The two that I really thought stood out were the Champion's and Fort Knox. Comparing both I think you get the same amout of protection, steel & weight, from both but the champion for maby $500 or $1000 less. I think a better deal.
Problem is ten or more week wait, no instant gratification.

jessegpresley
03-28-2006, 11:01 AM
I was at a safe store a few weeks ago, and they had a bunch of Champions still in the box, with huge "assembled in mexico" stickers on them.

Pablo
03-28-2006, 2:40 PM
I was at a safe store a few weeks ago, and they had a bunch of Champions still in the box, with huge "assembled in mexico" stickers on them.

I don't think this is a bad think of course I would prefer if they were manufactured here in the old U.S. by american hands but then the price would be 40% more expensive...

Jon
03-29-2006, 1:02 AM
If price were no concern?? I'd have me a walk-in safe. :D

Seriously, I know I'll be purchasing a quality safe in the future, but not before I buy a house/condo. So, one of the Home Depot specials for me.

snobordr
04-11-2006, 12:52 PM
Just a thought, saw these guys at a show in Reno last year, maybe 2004.

www.visialiasafes.com

I have not looked into safes extensively yet, but from what I saw, this was a quality product.