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Robidouxs
03-10-2010, 8:13 AM
I just helped a friend complete his paperwork for his FFL C&R license. He is an American citizen, born in California, holding both Mexican citizenship and United States citizenship. Does anyone foresee any issues with ATF or local law enforcement with him possessing dual citizenship, namely Mexican citizenship?

coop44
03-10-2010, 2:25 PM
As a general rule the US does not recognize dual citizenship,though the other country may.

To become an american citizen (naturalized) you must renounce any affiliation with all foreign governments. Being born here he is an american citizen, PERIOD.

If he made (what he thinks is)his citizenship status known to the atf he may have problems, they think they have problems with fire arms going to mexico.







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littlejake
03-10-2010, 2:40 PM
From the OP it appears the person is a US Citizen by birth.

The answer to the OPs question depends on how Mexican citizenship was obtained.

As of 2007, Mexican law requires renouncement of other nationality to obtain Mexican citizenship. Prior to 2007 -- frankly I don't know what the process was.

If the person in question renounced their US citizenship to obtain Mexican citizenship -- there is a question on form 7CR about that. If the person renounced their US citizenship to gain Mexican citizenship, they are ineligible for an FFL.

There are dual nations in the US -- whose other nationality did not require that they renounce their US citizenship. I believe Israel permits this.

IMO -- it depends on what was done to obtain Mexican citizenship.

a1c
03-10-2010, 2:42 PM
As a general rule the US does not recognize dual citizenship,though the other country may.

To become an american citizen (naturalized) you must renounce any affiliation with all foreign governments. Being born here he is an american citizen, PERIOD.

If he made (what he thinks is)his citizenship status known to the atf he may have problems, they think they have problems with fire arms going to mexico.

i

Actually, it's not that simple. While the acquisition of US citizenship in theory means renouncing other citizenship, there is no such law in the books, and the US government tolerates the fact that many naturalized US citizens keep other citizenships, and even recognizes it.

From the Department of State's website:
http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1753.html

It will not be a problem for his friend. Is he a citizen of the United States? Yes. For the ATF, that's all that matters.

Not to mention, by the way, that it's perfectly legal for law-abiding aliens to own and purchase firearms in the United States, or to obtain a FFL 03 license. Hell, some of them serve in the US armed forces. So it's absolutely not an issue.

coop44
03-15-2010, 5:33 PM
Actually, it's not that simple. While the acquisition of US citizenship in theory means renouncing other citizenship, there is no such law in the books, and the US government tolerates the fact that many naturalized US citizens keep other citizenships, and even recognizes it.

From the Department of State's website:
http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1753.html

It will not be a problem for his friend. Is he a citizen of the United States? Yes. For the ATF, that's all that matters.

Not to mention, by the way, that it's perfectly legal for law-abiding aliens to own and purchase firearms in the United States, or to obtain a FFL 03 license. Hell, some of them serve in the US armed forces. So it's absolutely not an issue.

Actually it is an issue (with me), during the revolutionary war and the war of 1812 many people born here still considered themselves subjects of the british empire, and collaborated with the brits hoping to bring back british rule, at the cost of american lives. "Dual citizenship" shows a lack of commitment, in my opinion, to both countries and does neither one justice. Also it draws into question the sincerity of the oath of allegiance taken when inducted into the armed forces.

PJA
03-16-2010, 11:00 AM
My wife's two adult children (both born in California) have dual US and French citizenship (their father is French). Both kids hold both US and French Passports.
Pete

a1c
03-16-2010, 11:25 AM
Actually it is an issue (with me), during the revolutionary war and the war of 1812 many people born here still considered themselves subjects of the british empire, and collaborated with the brits hoping to bring back british rule, at the cost of american lives. "Dual citizenship" shows a lack of commitment, in my opinion, to both countries and does neither one justice. Also it draws into question the sincerity of the oath of allegiance taken when inducted into the armed forces.

Apparently the US armed forces don't have a problem with it (neither does the ATF, the DHS or the Department of State as long as you don't hold citizenship in a country that's at war with the US).

Resident aliens who take the oath in the armed forces swear allegiance to the US. It takes five years between the moment you get your green card to be able to just apply for US citizenship (3 if you marry a US citizen).

Citizenship - and I know first hand what I'm talking about here - is mostly a formality that makes your allegiance official. You feel American in your heart long before you get your passport. The citizenship ceremony is a nice and emotional moment, but for many it's just a recognition from the US government of your dedication. Many aliens feel American before they get a chance to get their US citizenship. And some US-born citizens betray their country for money.