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View Full Version : Adjusting sights on Mosin Nagant M44


Robidouxs
02-20-2010, 10:13 AM
Today I tried competing in a high power shooting competition. I had to exit the match before the main event began since my sights were off considerably. My rifle was sighted in at 100 yards with the bayonet extended and also folded into the stock. The elevation in both situations was perfectly level. The issue is that where ever I would aim the sights, the fired round would be approximately 4-5 feet to the left of where I was aiming at the target. Any advice as to the tools needed or other information as how to adjust the sights would be greatly appreciated.

Crusader Matt
02-20-2010, 10:28 AM
For adjusting windage on a Mosin, basically i've always heard you have to use a hammer and punch to drift the front sight (if you're shooting left, move it to the left). A little crude, but it works.

This article will help as well
http://www.surplusrifle.com/shooting/mosinsights/index.asp

It mentions basically what I just said and also mentions a Mosin Nagant front sight adjustment tool that you can buy, unfortunately it doesnt work on M44's.

Hope that helps.

Milsurp Collector
02-20-2010, 10:54 AM
For adjusting windage on a Mosin, basically i've always heard you have to use a hammer and punch to drift the front sight (opposite the direction you want it to hit, so in your case, if you're shooting left, move it right). A little crude, but it works.

This article will help as well
http://www.surplusrifle.com/shooting/mosinsights/index.asp

It mentions basically what I just said and also mentions a Mosin Nagant front sight adjustment tool that you can buy, unfortunately it doesnt work on M44's.

Hope that helps.


Almost correct, if it is shooting to the left you have to drift the front sight to the left to zero the sights.

Crusader Matt
02-20-2010, 1:37 PM
Almost correct, if it is shooting to the left you have to drift the front sight to the left to zero the sights.

Corrected. Thank you. I sincerely apologize for my mistake :o I try hard not to spread misinformation. I always get it mixed up though even after checking the logic in my head. This is why I have it written down when i go to the range.

Lucky Scott
02-20-2010, 1:46 PM
4 - 5 feet!
Yikes!!!!

trautert
02-20-2010, 2:16 PM
The rifle was zeroed okay at 100 yards, bayonet extended and retracted, and then was shooting 4-5 feet off in windage at 100 yards when you showed up to shoot a competition?
Did you happen to drop it on the muzzle, or use it as a pry bar or something between sighting in and the match?

bigstick61
02-20-2010, 3:53 PM
I've tried drifting the sight on this and other weapons I do not have the sight tool for, and I can never seem to get it right. It's always off one way or the other, which I guess is not surprising given how imprecise the method is. The M-44 and the Steyr M95 are the only weapons I own that I have not been able to find front sight tools for (although I have yet to find out if it will be needed on the Steyr).

JAGACIDA
02-20-2010, 3:56 PM
Did you happen to purchase the rifle with the claim it was zeroed at 100 yards? 4 to 5 feet at 100 yards puts it into the tomato stake category. Take it to an indoor range and bench shoot it at 25 yards, this equates to about the same rise and fall at 100 yards. It should give you a better understanding of your gun.

cgmoe
02-20-2010, 4:08 PM
if aftermarket sights are allowed in the competition, you should consider getting some mojo sights . They are kinda pricey, but I think they are well worth it. I have them on my M39 and love them.

Robidouxs
02-21-2010, 2:45 PM
The rifle was zeroed okay at 100 yards, bayonet extended and retracted, and then was shooting 4-5 feet off in windage at 100 yards when you showed up to shoot a competition?
Did you happen to drop it on the muzzle, or use it as a pry bar or something between sighting in and the match?

The rifle was never truly zeroed in the first place. What I meant to say is that we attempted to zero the rifle at 100 yards and found that the elevation was on target 100%. The issue is that when the sight was pointed down range, it would shoot 4-5 feet left of where the round was supposed to impact.

Robidouxs
02-21-2010, 2:47 PM
I've tried drifting the sight on this and other weapons I do not have the sight tool for, and I can never seem to get it right. It's always off one way or the other, which I guess is not surprising given how imprecise the method is. The M-44 and the Steyr M95 are the only weapons I own that I have not been able to find front sight tools for (although I have yet to find out if it will be needed on the Steyr).

It was suggested at the range that I move the front sight 5/16 of an inch to compensate for the problem.

Robidouxs
02-21-2010, 2:49 PM
Did you happen to purchase the rifle with the claim it was zeroed at 100 yards? 4 to 5 feet at 100 yards puts it into the tomato stake category. Take it to an indoor range and bench shoot it at 25 yards, this equates to about the same rise and fall at 100 yards. It should give you a better understanding of your gun.

Thankfully I did not purchase the rifle on this claim alone. It is likely that it might have fallen out of zero when it was shipped through USPS.

Milsurp Collector
02-21-2010, 3:30 PM
I have an Arisaka Type 38 that shot way to the left. I tried drifting the front sight to the left with a punch but it would not budge. Even if it did it would have been difficult to precisely adjust the front sight by whacking it with a hammer and punch.

I bought a front sight pusher http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=16152/Product/FRONT_SIGHT_PUSHER and got the front sight to move. It also allows precise adjustment because it pushes the sight a small and constant amount with each turn, rather than a random amount from hitting it with a hammer and punch.

AngryPossum
02-21-2010, 4:22 PM
I have an Arisaka Type 38 that shot way to the left. I tried drifting the front sight to the left with a punch but it would not budge. Even if it did it would have been difficult to precisely adjust the front sight by whacking it with a hammer and punch.

I bought a front sight pusher http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=16152/Product/FRONT_SIGHT_PUSHER and got the front sight to move. It also allows precise adjustment because it pushes the sight a small and constant amount with each turn, rather than a random amount from hitting it with a hammer and punch.

So this particular model will work with different rifles? Have you tried it with others?

Milsurp Collector
02-21-2010, 7:55 PM
So this particular model will work with different rifles? Have you tried it with others?

I only tried it on that one rifle, it's the only one I've had to correct so far.

As much as I dislike Mitchell's Mausers, if I needed to adjust a Mauser sight I would get the front sight tool Mitchell's sells http://www.mauser.org/accessories/index.htm

lelandEOD
09-13-2011, 5:53 PM
I've got a Hungarian M44 with the same problem. I fired five shots from 100 yards at a NRA high power target and when I walked down to take a look, I could see the paper somehow got peppered by fragments hitting from an oblique angle. It took me a second to realize that 4 of the five shots landed one the steel pole that supports the target frames at the range. WOW! First off, I'm glad that my grouping was tight enough to hit a 3" pole, but quite upset that I was at least 2.5 feet from my point of aim.

I noticed when I bought this M44 that the front sight post was knocked "hard over" to the left. I assumed it had been dropped as it was hanging off the sight base by almost 50%. I took a mallet and centered it and headed for the range today. Well, now I know why the sight post was shoved all the way over to the left.

This just doesn't seem right to me. My mind can think of no reason why I should need such a gross amount of travel to get the irons centered over the bore. Has anyone else ever experienced a "reeeeally" out of whack Nagant? I love this rifle and was somewhat bummed to see it so far off.


Ideas?

tlivingd
09-14-2011, 8:02 PM
I can't remember if my Romanian m44 has it, but both my russian 91/30's have an indexing mark between upper and lower portions of the front sight. To where the motherland zeroed it out. Check to see if yours has these. Also before I put the scope on my 91/30, the front sight was loose and I could move it side to side with my finger. I went thru 2 boxes of 203gn Barnaul before noticing the sight, my shoulder however noticed.

My m44 will shoot much differently with the bayonet extended and with it folded. I'm not sure if you were told it was the same from the seller or you've verified it yourself. If the seller told you, I'd check it myself.

CDFingers
09-15-2011, 4:19 AM
A special sight tool is not necessary. Here is a range technique: you use a spent 7.62x54r case, as it has a big rim. Put a cloth or pad on the cement table to protect your wood, then lay the rifle down its left side with the front of the barrel over the cement of the table--if you're drifting the sight to the left; any totally solid surface will work; a wooden table absorbs quite a bit of the hammer force, so you might try it on an ammo box or something like that.
You place the rim of the spent case between the barrel and the female part of the dovetail the front sight sits in. If the rim touches the male part of the dovetail, you won't be able to move the sight.

If you're right handed, you hold the brass punch in your left hand and use two fingers to steady the case and the barrel. The other fingers hold your punch. I use a piece of brass rod and a fairly heavy hammer, as I let the mass of the hammer do the work rather than me whacking it hard.

With most of my Mosins, it takes a pretty good whack to loosen the dovetail. On two I've had to put Liquid Wrench on it the day before a range trip to help it slide.

So, you check first with your eye where the dovetail lies. Then you whack it and see if it moved. Note: a very small movement of the sight moves the point of impact quite a bit, so go slowly.

The rim of the case makes solid contact with the table top, and the punch makes solid contact with the male half of the dovetail, so there is very efficient transfer of energy from the hammer to the male half of the dovetail.

Best of luck.

CDFingers