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View Full Version : ffls, AOWs and cruisers.


dantodd
02-05-2010, 5:21 PM
Can an FFL receive a shotgun and swap out the stock for a pistol grip and then transfer it just like a factory-made cruiser?

Blue
02-05-2010, 5:34 PM
Can an FFL receive a shotgun and swap out the stock for a pistol grip and then transfer it just like a factory-made cruiser?

I don't think so.

Hopi
02-05-2010, 5:42 PM
No, because it had at one time a buttstock, making it a 'long gun'....

That's why you need to be 21 yrs old to purchase a cruiser, as it has never had a buttstock instlled it falls into the 'other' category compared to 'long gun'...

dantodd
02-05-2010, 5:44 PM
No, because it had at one time a buttstock, making it a 'long gun'....

That's why you need to be 21 yrs old to purchase a cruiser, as it falls into the 'other' category compared to 'long gun'...

So that would apply to any buttstock even if it was before it was ever transferred to an individual? Interesting.

Hopi
02-05-2010, 5:51 PM
So that would apply to any buttstock even if it was before it was ever transferred to an individual? Interesting.

Yep. If it comes from the manufacturer with a buttstock, it is a 'long gun'.

dantodd
02-05-2010, 5:54 PM
Yep. If it comes from the manufacturer with a buttstock, it is a 'long gun'.

So, can an 07 manufacture a cruiser off of someone else's long gun? Would they have to engrave their own info and model number?

I'm sure you know where I'm going with this, which is an AOW short-barreled cruiser.


The SxS discussion in the AOW thread got me thinking....

Hopi
02-05-2010, 6:07 PM
So, can an 07 manufacture a cruiser off of someone else's long gun? Would they have to engrave their own info and model number?

I'm sure you know where I'm going with this, which is an AOW short-barreled cruiser.


The SxS discussion in the AOW thread got me thinking....

There is a long thread with most of this stuff covered, if you have a couple of hours to dig thru it....but...

I believe an 07 can do that. But why not buy a cruiser and cut the barrel after you get your stamp? The cost would probably be similar to the 07 scenario.

One problem with the cruiser is the mag extension will limit the barrel shortening unless you mod the pump/extension.

How short do you want to go?

Also remember that C and R guns are eligible for SBS, and SBR status. ;)

ke6guj
02-05-2010, 6:13 PM
Yep. If it comes from the manufacturer with a buttstock, it is a 'long gun'.
This. If it was a shotgun, it will always be "a firearm made from a shotgun" and can't ever be an AOW.

So, can an 07 manufacture a cruiser off of someone else's long gun? Would they have to engrave their own info and model number?"cruiser" is not a legal term, so yes, an 07 could manufacture something called a "cruiser" from an existing shotgun, but it would still be a shotgun.

I'm sure you know where I'm going with this, which is an AOW short-barreled cruiser.


The SxS discussion in the AOW thread got me thinking....



There is a long thread with most of this stuff covered, if you have a couple of hours to dig thru it....but...

I believe an 07 can do that. But why not buy a cruiser and cut the barrel after you get your stamp? The cost would probably be similar to the 07 scenario.
but as I think dantodd is refering to is that there are no factory PG-only SxS or O/U "cruiser shotguns" that you could use as a host gun.

Also remember that C and R guns are eligible for SBS, and SBR status. ;)not if ATF is currently taking the position that making it voids C&R status.

ChrisO
02-05-2010, 6:18 PM
A person under 21 would be able to add a PG to a regular shotgun right?

50 Freak
02-05-2010, 6:18 PM
Can an FFL receive a shotgun and swap out the stock for a pistol grip and then transfer it just like a factory-made cruiser?

Careful what you post here....don't want anyone informing the LE's that you you are attempting to do something illegal...:p:TFH::43:

To answer your question.

If a FFL were just to switch out the shotgun's buttstock to a pistol grip. As long as he is not materially changing the gun (ie, shortening the overall length to it is under 26 inch...I think was the magic number, or the barrel under 18 inches) there should be no problem. As the shotgun is still in the books as a shotgun/longun, whether or not it comes with a buttstock or a PG.

Getting a FFL to do it is often times the difficulty.

Question, why don't you just buy the shotgun as is and switch it out yourself? PG's are typically $20-40 bucks and it's cool to have the options for both configurations.

wash
02-05-2010, 6:28 PM
"cruiser" is not a legal term, so yes, an 07 could manufacture something called a "cruiser" from an existing shotgun, but it would still be a shotgun.

Do you mean long gun?

ke6guj
02-05-2010, 6:29 PM
A person under 21 would be able to add a PG to a regular shotgun right?yes.


Question, why don't you just buy the shotgun as is and switch it out yourself? PG's are typically $20-40 bucks and it's cool to have the options for both configurations.because he is trying to figure out how to get a "pg-only" host gun (that isn't considered a shotgun) so that it can be AOW'ed without it being considered an SBS per federal law.

ke6guj
02-05-2010, 6:30 PM
Do you mean long gun?

I mean "firearm made from a shotgun"

Hopi
02-05-2010, 6:40 PM
not if ATF is currently taking the position that making it voids C&R status.

Huh? When did that happen?

On that note, does CA require the gun to be C and R according to federal standards or just 50 yrs or older to be eligible for SBS/SBR?

Quiet
02-05-2010, 8:35 PM
Huh? When did that happen?
AFAIK...
Last year.
BATFE started to require a CA DOJ Dangerous Weapons Permit prior to making a C&R shotgun/rifle into a SBS/SBR.

ke6guj
02-05-2010, 11:48 PM
Huh? When did that happen? as mentioned, last year.

On that note, does CA require the gun to be C and R according to federal standards or just 50 yrs or older to be eligible for SBS/SBR?CA says the following,

12020(7) Any firearm or ammunition that is a curio or relic as defined in Section 478.11 of Title 27 of the Code of Federal Regulations and which is in the possession of a person permitted to possess the items pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto. Any person prohibited by Section 12021, 12021.1, or 12101 of this code or Section 8100 or 8103 of the Welfare and Institutions Code from possessing firearms or ammunition who obtains title to these items by bequest or intestate succession may retain title for not more than one year, but actual possession of these items at any time is punishable pursuant to Section 12021, 12021.1, or 12101 of this code or Section 8100 or 8103 of the Welfare and Institutions Code. Within the year, the person shall transfer title to the firearms or ammunition by sale, gift, or other disposition. Any person who violates this paragraph is in violation of subdivision (a).so, that would be any listed C&R SBS/SBR (even less than 50-years old) or any 50+ year old C&R SBS/SBR.