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oaklander
02-02-2010, 12:39 AM
Note that I am the person that "declined to be named." Like just about everything else in this article, he got that part wrong. I wanted him to also talk to Gene, and Gene called him - but Chip never called back.

Please go here and add your comments:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article/article?f=/c/a/2010/02/01/BA9U1BR2EL.DTL

Law to limit ammunition before Oakland council

Chip Johnson

Tuesday, February 2, 2010

Any new public policy measure undertaken to reduce, regulate or limit access to the guns and ammunition that have contributed to the loss of human life across the nation's urban landscape is a step in the right direction.

Toward that end, the Oakland City Council tonight is expected to weigh the merits of an ordinance that would impose license and regulatory requirements on the sellers of ammunition in the city.

Under the new proposal, anyone who purchases ammunition would be required to provide a thumbprint.

If approved, the city's chief of police would have the power to approve all new firearms dealers and impose strict rules on ammunition storage and record-keeping, matching existing state laws on handgun ammunition.

Similar laws have already been passed in a number of California cities, including Richmond, Berkeley and San Francisco.

While Oakland city officials should expect to receive some heat from the Bay Area gun lobby, this is one local ordinance that should take no great political debate to resolve.

Of course elected officials have the duty to enact laws to promote the safety of citizens, and it has nothing to do with someone's right to bag a deer in Wisconsin or go duck hunting wherever it is that duck hunters go.

It also doesn't bar the constitutional right to bear arms in the protection of home, life and property. It's not about gun ranges or target practice, skeet shooting, dude ranch weekends or fast-draw competitions.

This is about the very real-life carnage that has taken place in Oakland and dozens of other U.S. cities since the early 1980s.

Oakland has recorded more than 600 homicides since 2005, the overwhelming majority of them carried out with firearms. The city has one of the highest per capita homicide rates in the nation.

Now if someone were looking for an urban setting with explosive violence to test out a new wave of strict gun laws, Oakland really would be the Model City.

A member of Calguns, an organization that educates citizens about gun rights and enters "strategic litigation" to protect gun owners, said he planned to attend the meeting but declined to be identified.

He argued that even as Oakland has but one licensed firearms dealer, a sworn Oakland police officer who does not sell to the general public, the city has not seen a drop in crime over the last 20 years.

That may be so, but in New York, the strictest gun laws in the nation and a police department push to remove weapons from the street have shown remarkable results.

It is that level of weapons regulation that Oakland and other crime-besieged cities like it should be moving toward.

If Oakland Mayor Ron Dellums was ever looking for a national issue on which to leave his mark, he has all the ammunition he needs for one in his own backyard.

There is no denying the strength of the gun lobby on national policy - there are dead bodies strewn across the urban landscape as testament to that success. But there is no reason for the council to hesitate from enacting this public safety measure.

Under existing U.S. gun laws, it's obviously no problem for anyone with the cash and desire to purchase just about any weapon they want to buy, but if more cities adopted laws to limit the ammunition, maybe it would make a difference in a half-dozen cases a year.

oaklander
02-02-2010, 12:40 AM
Here's my comment, correcting him:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article/comments/view?f=/c/a/2010/02/01/BA9U1BR2EL.DTL&plckFindCommentKey=CommentKey:7e8b9b7e-8eb5-4509-aaf2-a60ec001dfbe#CommentKey:7e8b9b7e-8eb5-4509-aaf2-a60ec001dfbe

Cokebottle
02-02-2010, 12:45 AM
Didn't want to create an ID to log in and comment, but I gave you a thumbs up.

oaklander
02-02-2010, 12:46 AM
Thanks bro!

Didn't want to create an ID to log in and comment, but I gave you a thumbs up.

b.faust
02-02-2010, 12:54 AM
Right on man.

I really can't stand that rag, but for some reason I read it anyway.

I really appreciate you speaking up, and completely understand why you didn't want go give "Chip" your name. I wouldn't have either.

That jab about Wisconsin, sheesh. I'm from Wisconsin. We do more than deer hunt. Hell we tip cows and make cheese.

Did I mention I really can't stand sfgate?


B.

Tweak338
02-02-2010, 12:54 AM
They really think this will stop ammo from being sold in alley's out of a trunk?

Cokebottle
02-02-2010, 1:01 AM
They really think this will stop ammo from being sold in alley's out of a trunk?
No kidding.

There's one source for ammo right now and crime is out of control.
So a law that prohibits MORE people from selling ammo is going to REDUCE crime?

Don't think so.

thedrickel
02-02-2010, 1:02 AM
Oak - you better have your trollin boots on tomorrow night. :)

wildhawker
02-02-2010, 1:06 AM
"They" are entirely out of touch with reality and base their worldview on untruths and platitudes.

oaklander
02-02-2010, 1:06 AM
LOL,

I actually did give Chip my name, but I did ask that our conversation be off the record so that he could get an official quote from Gene.

Gene then called him, but Chip did not have the courtesy to call back, apparently.

Right on man.

I really can't stand that rag, but for some reason I read it anyway.

I really appreciate you speaking up, and completely understand why you didn't want go give "Chip" your name. I wouldn't have either.

That jab about Wisconsin, sheesh. I'm from Wisconsin. We do more than deer hunt. Hell we tip cows and make cheese.

Did I mention I really can't stand sfgate?


B.

creampuff
02-02-2010, 1:16 AM
I posted a comment. I am "cmmg".

Whiskey84
02-02-2010, 1:57 AM
What a tool. Way to be, Oak. :thumbsup:

oaklander
02-02-2010, 2:24 AM
Interestingly, he IMMEDIATELY pulled the race card during the interview.

He said, "you know I'm black, don't you." To which I replied, "well, I live in Sobrante Park (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sobrante%20park)." This was followed by a period of silence as he realized that he had just lost his assumed moral superiority over me.

ETA: Chip has since called me and personally apologized for doing this - see my post later in the thread.

bigcalidave
02-02-2010, 2:34 AM
I can't wait to hear about the meeting tomorrow (today?). Why can't the media use their brains? Just once?

Gray Peterson
02-02-2010, 2:55 AM
Let me sum it up: Chip Johnson=douche.

edwardm
02-02-2010, 3:57 AM
It might have also been fun to ask him:

"What does race have to do with it?" Loaded question, goes well off-point, but it's fun to let so-called journalists have enough rope to hang themselves.



Interestingly, he IMMEDIATELY pulled the race card during the interview.

He said, "you know I'm black, don't you." To which I replied, "well, I live in Sobrante Park (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sobrante%20park)." This was followed by a period of silence as he realized that he had just lost his assumed moral superiority over me.

Ford8N
02-02-2010, 3:58 AM
Interestingly, he IMMEDIATELY pulled the race card during the interview.

He said, "you know I'm black, don't you." To which I replied, "well, I live in Sobrante Park (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sobrante%20park)." This was followed by a period of silence as he realized that he had just lost his assumed moral superiority over me.

That was totally unnecessary to the subject:wacko:. The guy is a racist.

SPROCKET
02-02-2010, 4:49 AM
Strangely enough my SFGate login quit working one day out of the blue. I would guess that's a common occurrence for those that don't share their moderators political sentiments.

I lived in the "Ghost Town" part of West Oakland for a number of years. I'm pretty sure if you got rid of all guns tomorrow the folks down there would be killing each other with rocks and sticks. The thing I always found amusing was the great efficiency with which the city handed out street sweeping tickets. Yet for some reason they couldn't do anything about the crack dealers that worked they same damn corners year after year...

GrizzlyGuy
02-02-2010, 4:54 AM
Wow, could this article have been any more biased?

There is no denying the strength of the gun lobby on national policy - there are dead bodies strewn across the urban landscape as testament to that success.

:mad:

Their recent story on UOC (http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/scavenger/detail?entry_id=56281) was far more balanced. This guy obviously has an agenda and/or a big chip on his shoulders.

GrizzlyGuy
02-02-2010, 5:12 AM
Interestingly, he IMMEDIATELY pulled the race card during the interview.

He said, "you know I'm black, don't you." To which I replied, "well, I live in Sobrante Park (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sobrante%20park)." This was followed by a period of silence as he realized that he had just lost his assumed moral superiority over me.

Since he has already played the race card, maybe someone should suggest he watch these videos:

No Guns for Negroes (Part One) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nckgyfGbdnU)

No Guns for Negroes (Part Two) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2g7TbxkJuqA)

JPFO has this available on DVD (http://www.jpfo.org/filegen-n-z/ngn-download-view.htm). Maybe order some DVDs and send them to him and each member of the Oakland city council?

geeknow
02-02-2010, 5:31 AM
Oak,

Thanks to you, and the rest of TRP for taking point and dealing with these folks....

As always, you guys make us all look smarter.


g

johnny_22
02-02-2010, 6:23 AM
Chip wrote a very positive article about Patrick McCullough for City Council. Patrick being the man who defended his life in his driveway at home.

http://articles.sfgate.com/2008-02-12/bay-area/17139376_1_police-officers-oakland-city-council-patrick-mccullough

Guess, guns and ammo are OK for some, but, not us.

xxdabroxx
02-02-2010, 6:45 AM
don't i remember certain people saying specifically NOT to speak to the media?

rkt88edmo
02-02-2010, 7:07 AM
Interestingly, he IMMEDIATELY pulled the race card during the interview.

He said, "you know I'm black, don't you." To which I replied, "well, I live in Sobrante Park (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sobrante%20park)." This was followed by a period of silence as he realized that he had just lost his assumed moral superiority over me.

You should have told him that you weren't going to bring it up because he was doing a pretty good job of passing :P

That may be so, but in New York, the strictest gun laws in the nation and a police department push to remove weapons from the street have shown remarkable results.

Ummm sure, where are the backup stats on that. NY has gotten a whole lot better from what I hear, but I think just plain old cleaning up had a lot to do with it.

12gauge12
02-02-2010, 7:08 AM
Chip is an idiot. Worst written article ever

oaklander
02-02-2010, 7:27 AM
No, we said "leave it to the experts. . ."

LOL

:p

don't i remember certain people saying specifically NOT to speak to the media?

oaklander
02-02-2010, 7:40 AM
He is getting trounced in the comments by something like 25 to 1.

I will now take this article, print it out (including the comments) and present it to the Oakland City Council tonight for entry into the record.

There's always a method to my madness.

IGOTDIRT4U
02-02-2010, 7:52 AM
He is getting trounced in the comments by something like 25 to 1.

I will now take this article, print it out (including the comments) and present it to the Oakland City Council tonight for entry into the record.

There's always a method to my madness.

Wouldn't hurt to maybe print the article from the other situation where he backed a person who had to use a gun. Show that he is at least inconsistent.

"Chip wrote a very positive article about Patrick McCullough for City Council. Patrick being the man who defended his life in his driveway at home.

http://articles.sfgate.com/2008-02-1...ick-mccullough

Guess, guns and ammo are OK for some, but, not us. "

Dirk Tungsten
02-02-2010, 8:08 AM
Interestingly, he IMMEDIATELY pulled the race card during the interview.

He said, "you know I'm black, don't you."

What the hell? in what context did he say this and how did he think it was relevant?

Barbarossa
02-02-2010, 8:10 AM
unbiased reporting is great!

Any new public policy m to reduce, regulate or limit access to the guns and ammunition is a step in the right direction.

I don't car what the reporters opinion is, where is the news and facts?

Cokebottle
02-02-2010, 8:18 AM
unbiased reporting is great!

I don't car what the reporters opinion is, where is the news and facts?
That concept was lost on journalism teachers in the 70s.

It went from "who, what, when, where"
To "who, what, when, where, why, how can we sensationalize this"

Jaxpire
02-02-2010, 8:44 AM
I don't car what the reporters opinion is, where is the news and facts?

I was thinking the same thing. It is so sad we so much of this.

Roadrunner
02-02-2010, 9:06 AM
This is just an observation, but isn't it interesting that large cities with large populations of so called minorities seem to be more apt to have strict controls or even bans on firearms? Los Angeles, Oakland, New Orleans, Washington D. C., Chicago, they are all hell bent on taking guns away from their citizens. Granted I realize that places like Berkley are just as bad, however, it just seems odd that politicians, who are minorities seem obsessed with disarmament of their citizens.

7x57
02-02-2010, 9:14 AM
This is just an observation, but isn't it interesting that large cities with large populations of so called minorities seem to be more apt to have strict controls or even bans on firearms? Los Angeles, Oakland, New Orleans, Washington D. C., Chicago, they are all hell bent on taking guns away from their citizens. Granted I realize that places like Berkley are just as bad, however, it just seems odd that politicians, who are minorities seem obsessed with disarmament of their citizens.

I have not missed the fact that if the 2A is a right binding on the states, the left's theory from other contexts is that a law which has a racially biased result as a mere incident without malice is still unconstitutional.

I kind of want to revisit that subject with them after McDonald and some subsequent case law. :43:

Affirmative-action based firearms training and subsidies for low-income and minority gun purchases, anyone? :rofl:

7x57

oaklander
02-02-2010, 9:19 AM
He just brought it up out of the blue!

It was amazing.

What the hell? in what context did he say this and how did he think it was relevant?

wildhawker
02-02-2010, 9:30 AM
Affirmative-action based firearms training and subsidies for low-income and minority gun purchases, anyone? :rofl:

7x57

Would generally have to be income-based criteria, but highly likely we see subsidies and/or govt training programs for things such as, say, carry permits. The more burden they place on the permit process, the more the government will be providing the services (directly or via contractors). I'll make the same prediction for FFL transfers/PPTs.

Roadrunner
02-02-2010, 9:31 AM
Interestingly, he IMMEDIATELY pulled the race card during the interview.

He said, "you know I'm black, don't you." To which I replied, "well, I live in Sobrante Park (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sobrante%20park)." This was followed by a period of silence as he realized that he had just lost his assumed moral superiority over me.

When people drop the race card around me, that can be a deal killer. To me, it's a form of intimidation, and I won't be intimidated.

BigDogatPlay
02-02-2010, 9:33 AM
Well I still have a login at sfgate... and the following was duly posted.

Chip Johnson wrote....

Any new public policy measure undertaken to reduce, regulate or limit access to the guns and ammunition that have contributed to the loss of human life across the nation's urban landscape is a step in the right direction.

Can Chip point out for us any laws that limit the access of law abiding citizens to firearms or ammunition, anywhere, that have had that positive effect.

Chip also, it seems, is either a bit lazy or he simply doesn't care about learning anything about the other side of the question since he won't return calls from those on the other side of the question. Lazy or doesn't care... is that why we are supposed to believe in what he writes?

Granted he is a columnist, not a hard news reporter, so the rules are different as relates to forcing his opinion into a story. But doggone it, if you are going to present an idea at least have the testicular fortitude to present both sides of the issue.

aileron
02-02-2010, 9:34 AM
There is no denying the strength of the gun lobby on national policy - there are dead bodies strewn across the urban landscape as testament to that success. But there is no reason for the council to hesitate from enacting this public safety measure.



Is that opinion or news?

obeygiant
02-02-2010, 9:35 AM
He is getting trounced in the comments by something like 25 to 1.

I will now take this article, print it out (including the comments) and present it to the Oakland City Council tonight for entry into the record.

There's always a method to my madness.

As of 10:30am this document contains all of the comments posted.

Law to Limit Ammunition Before Oakland Council-comments (http://www.scribd.com/doc/26270726)

madmike
02-02-2010, 9:36 AM
Un-****ing-believable!!!

I can't wait to hear about the council meeting!

-madmike.

oaklander
02-02-2010, 9:41 AM
ETA: 2/2/1010 - Chip has called me to apologize and I have accepted his apology.

The more I think about Chip pulling the race card, the more angry I get. I therefore just now sent the following email to "Chip."


Chip,

Please note that I am now speaking as Kevin Thomason, Attorney at Law, and not as a Board Member of the Calguns Foundation.

Please review the comments to your recent editorial in favor of the new proposed Oakland Oakland gun control laws.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article/article?f=/c/a/2010/02/01/BA9U1BR2EL.DTL

You will note that they:

1) completely refute your position with actual facts, and;

2) are running over 50 to 1 against your position.

Also, when you were speaking with me yesterday in preparation for this article, you stated "you know I am a black man, don't you?" I found this quite offensive, as my race and your race have absolutely nothing to do with this issue. The next time we speak, I will hope that you don't stoop to pulling the "race card" to bolster whatever position you are trying to assert.

That's like me saying "you know I grew up in a trailer park, with an alcoholic father, don't you?" as if my seriously underprivileged "trailer trash" background somehow makes my points "stronger."

It does not.

Again, I urge you to attend the City Council meeting tonight, and hear more reasoned and rational discourse on this topic. Perhaps your next article will then actually contain some facts, rather than platitudes.

xxdabroxx
02-02-2010, 9:46 AM
GET 'EM!

Lone_Gunman
02-02-2010, 9:50 AM
Dang. I'm glad you're on our side.

7x57
02-02-2010, 10:01 AM
The more I think about Chip pulling the race card, the more angry I get.

You are entirely justified in taking offense. The purpose of such things is to bully.

But it does not simply injure the person bullied. Among other things, the abuse of such arguments greatly weakens them in cases where they are actually relevant. If everything is about race, nothing is. Cry wolf too many times and no one will listen when you really do have a problem that needs discussing.

7x57

yoteassasin
02-02-2010, 10:01 AM
this is sooo awesome go get'em oak and sick'em boys

BroncoBob
02-02-2010, 10:02 AM
The more I think about Chip pulling the race card, the more angry I get. I therefore just now sent the following email to "Chip."


Excellent response to the race card comment.

oaklander
02-02-2010, 10:09 AM
Yup,

He's probably never been called out on it. . .

It will be interesting to see how he replies to my email. . .

SJgunguy24
02-02-2010, 10:11 AM
I really want to be there but i'm taking my welding certs today and tomarrow and i'll be in class from 5-8pm. If I could weasel out I would but I need this cert so I can get back to work. I can't stand the thought of more gun restrictions, but I also can't stand being on unemployment.

My comment:D
thenoname2/2/2010 11:04:20 AM

I have a couple of questions for anybody who supports this law.
Who commits the gun crimes in Oakland?
I'll take a guess that most if not all of the gun crimes are commited by people who couldn't legally own a firearm in the first place.
Where do prohibited people buy their guns and ammo?
I take another guess, i'll bet it's not an FFL. I don't think they fill out a 4473 form, or bother to file DROS with the CADOJ. I don't think they wait 10 days either.
What are criminals?
1. (Law) a person charged with and convicted of crime
2. a person who commits crimes for a living
Ok so this tells me that they do not follow laws to begin with, since they ARE criminals and they do commit CRIMES.
Why would anybody want a law that restricts themselves from being able to get what they need to defend themselves?
My last comment, if you think your family is worthless and don't care what happens to them. Support gun restrictions.
Me, my family is worth fighting for.

SJgunguy24

oaklander
02-02-2010, 10:18 AM
Exactly. Black leaders in the 1960 were literally willing to put their lives on the line for what they believed in. So were the white college kids who went to the South to back them up.

What we have now are weak imitations of the old-school black leaders.

Most people don't know this, but I actually wrote my law school entrance essay on Malcolm X. We were supposed to write about who we most admired in the 20th century, and he is who I chose.

Dude was badass.

You are entirely justified in taking offense. The purpose of such things is to bully.

But it does not simply injure the person bullied. Among other things, the abuse of such arguments greatly weakens them in cases where they are actually relevant. If everything is about race, nothing is. Cry wolf too many times and no one will listen when you really do have a problem that needs discussing.

7x57

7x57
02-02-2010, 10:42 AM
E
What we have now are weak imitations of the old-school black leaders.


I think it's worse than that in many cases, but perhaps for tactical reasons I should leave that line of argument to the black conservatives who call a lot of them overseers who keep the intellectual plantation system running.


Most people don't know this, but I actually wrote my law school entrance essay on Malcolm X. We were supposed to write about who we most admired in the 20th century, and he is who I chose.

Dude was badass.

I have only read his autobiography, and no doubt have less admiration for him than you, but he is certainly more interesting than the simplistic 'black muslim rebel' picture. Assuming his autobiography is reasonably reliable (which I don't know either way, and Alex Haley cured me of assuming honesty in such matters), he was a very bright boy who could have taken great advantage of more intellectual opportunities, had they existed.

I believe the part of his autobiography that I respect the most is the part where later in life he abandons Elijah Muhammed's made-up version of Islam that he was quite deeply committed to because it didn't fit the facts. That's a rare display of intellectual integrity--most of us do not venture to make such fundamental shifts.

A somewhat odd and abstract point to make central to such a colorful life, but I'm just that way. It speaks to the man and affects how the rest of the biography should be read.

7x57

1BigPea
02-02-2010, 10:57 AM
Yup,

He's probably never been called out on it. . .

It will be interesting to see how he replies to my email. . .


Nice work Oak, looking forward to his response! Pulling the "race card" was completely unnecessary, and the article he wrote was incompetent.

oaklander
02-02-2010, 11:02 AM
That's the part that I liked too. He went to Mecca and saw people of ALL races worshiping Allah. This was the genesis of his epiphany.

I believe the part of his autobiography that I respect the most is the part where later in life he abandons Elijah Muhammed's made-up version of Islam that he was quite deeply committed to because it didn't fit the facts.

7x57

Cokebottle
02-02-2010, 11:05 AM
2) are running over 50 to 1 against your position.
And not only that...

Even the "thumbs up, thumbs down" is running almost 15:1 in your favor.

lockwrench
02-02-2010, 11:06 AM
While Oakland city officials should expect to receive some heat from the Bay Area gun lobby,....



Just once I would like to see "civil rights activists" instead of "gun lobby."

7x57
02-02-2010, 11:21 AM
That's the part that I liked too. He went to Mecca and saw people of ALL races worshiping Allah. This was the genesis of his epiphany.

Exactly. It didn't take a genius to understand that EM was selling a lie, because after all it is fairly obvious if you learn enough about historical Islam (and while I have severe problems with it, that certainly is not one)--but it took a big man to verbalize it, accept it, and pursue the consequences after investing much of his life in it. It's the intellectual honesty that I think is really exceptional.

You know, I get in big trouble in conservative circles for saying those nice things about Malcolm X. :D But, well, if I could not follow the small consequences of the logic of the biography when he dared to follow a much more difficult line, I'd not look very big, would I?

And just to veer our heading a point or so toward the RKBA, he was dead right about the right to arms being inalienable for blacks if it is inalienable for any citizen, too. :D

7x57

biofire
02-02-2010, 1:27 PM
I live in Oakland, emailed Chip Johnson, for whatever good that will do, but I thought it was interesting that he failed to mention when and where the meeting will be held. I may not make it, but can someone give me that info?

tba02
02-02-2010, 1:38 PM
I live in Oakland, emailed Chip Johnson, for whatever good that will do, but I thought it was interesting that he failed to mention when and where the meeting will be held. I may not make it, but can someone give me that info?

See http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=264610

Roadrunner
02-02-2010, 2:02 PM
Just once I would like to see "civil rights activists" instead of "gun lobby."

Liberal socialist progressives will never equate civil rights to the second amendment. "Gun lobby" is the knee jerk catch phrase for evil people, while "civil rights activist" are those in "the struggle". Just listen to people like Amy Goodman on "Democracy Now" to get the spin on what does and doesn't qualify as a civil rights issue to progressives.

sepiid
02-02-2010, 3:22 PM
my sarcastic response

I think the one and only gun store owner in oakland should be brought up on charges for providing all of these guns and amunition to the gangbangers and criminals on the street of oakland. /s

Seriously do people actually think that dirtbags get the stuff in a legal manner?

dantodd
02-02-2010, 3:25 PM
my sarcastic response

That is actually an excellent point. I think it might actually get the boards attention.

How do you expect this law to reduce crime in Oakland? There is only one gun shop in Oakland and it is owned by a police officer. Are you suggesting that an Oakland police officer is actually arming the bad guys in the city? If not what difference will the ordinance make?

oaklander
02-02-2010, 3:27 PM
Chip does not have the cohones to reply to my email in which I called him out for trying to play the race card when he interviewed me.


I live in Oakland, emailed Chip Johnson, for whatever good that will do, but I thought it was interesting that he failed to mention when and where the meeting will be held. I may not make it, but can someone give me that info?

wildhawker
02-02-2010, 3:27 PM
That is actually an excellent point. I think it might actually get the boards attention.

How do you expect this law to reduce crime in Oakland? There is only one gun shop in Oakland and it is owned by a police officer. Are you suggesting that an Oakland police officer is actually arming the bad guys in the city? If not what difference will the ordinance make?

Agreed, this is a very pointed and relevant point that should be very visibly and vocally noted.

Glock22Fan
02-02-2010, 3:50 PM
Good luck, all you guys and gals up north who plan to attend this meeting.

Go get 'em.

Okota
02-02-2010, 5:19 PM
Gave you a thumbs up, Oak. I wish I could be there but it falls on my brothers federal LEO "birthday". I can't stand when there's no race issue until some jackass makes it a race issue.

tombinghamthegreat
02-02-2010, 9:32 PM
That article wasn't biased:rolleyes:

pitchbaby
02-02-2010, 10:24 PM
They really think this will stop ammo from being sold in alley's out of a trunk?

I just don't get this line of thinking other than to say... I don't think this city council really cares whether or not they make a difference... they just want to "look" like they are making a difference.

Dubels
02-02-2010, 10:55 PM
No kidding.

There's one source for ammo right now and crime is out of control.
So a law that prohibits MORE people from selling ammo is going to REDUCE crime?

Don't think so.


All it is going to do is allow for price gouging.

thedrickel
02-02-2010, 11:00 PM
All it is going to do is allow for price gouging.

OH ****! Did somebody say . . .



krinker plinker?!?!?

nobody_special
02-03-2010, 12:36 AM
Well done, Oaklander. You're going after this one like a bulldog.

Unfortunately I doubt it'll make any difference with the city council. :P

oaklander
02-03-2010, 12:50 PM
OK,

Just got off the phone with Chip Johnson, and he called me to personally apologize for his statements and demeanor during my interview.

He's a big man for doing this, and I respect him for it.

Yup,

He's probably never been called out on it. . .

It will be interesting to see how he replies to my email. . .

dantodd
02-03-2010, 12:53 PM
OK,

Just got off the phone with Chip Johnson, and he called me to personally apologize for his statements and demeanor during my interview.

He's a big man for doing this, and I respect him for it.

Wow! That is excellent to hear. Maybe he will add you to his rolodex for info on future articles he is assigned in the firearms space. You should invite him out shooting.

oaklander
02-03-2010, 12:56 PM
He actually told me that he would like to continue to use me as a source, and that he will try to make his future articles more fair. I think the fact that the public comments on his most recent article are 100 to 1 against his position must be sinking in.

Wow! That is excellent to hear. Maybe he will add you to his rolodex for info on future articles he is assigned in the firearms space. You should invite him out shooting.

dantodd
02-03-2010, 1:06 PM
He actually told me that he would like to continue to use me as a source, and that he will try to make his future articles more fair. I think the fact that the public comments on his most recent article are 100 to 1 against his position must be sinking in.

I used to be a corporate spokesman and getting in the Rolodex as a subject matter source/expert is a huge coup. If anyone else does an article on that subject and asks him if he knows anything he'll pass you along and it starts to grow geometrically "He told two friends....."

curtisfong
02-03-2010, 1:12 PM
He actually told me that he would like to continue to use me as a source.

Well done. This exactly the sort of progress needed. Fighting the legislature directly is impossible. Fighting the legislature in the courts is nearly impossible. Fighting the legislature in the *popular media* (yes, even the "liberal" media) is the only viable long term strategy. California will ultimately go the way the voters go. The voters go where the media tells them to go.

oaklander
02-03-2010, 1:23 PM
Thank you, yes, this is a win for us. A small win, but a win nonetheless. . .

:)

I used to be a corporate spokesman and getting in the Rolodex as a subject matter source/expert is a huge coup. If anyone else does an article on that subject and asks him if he knows anything he'll pass you along and it starts to grow geometrically "He told two friends....."

curtisfong
02-03-2010, 1:24 PM
A small win


I think its a bigger win than you think (for reasons I outlined above ;))

oaklander
02-03-2010, 1:33 PM
Ah, you are right - now that I think about it!!!

I think its a bigger win than you think (for reasons I outlined above ;))

MidnightSon117
02-03-2010, 1:49 PM
OK,

Just got off the phone with Chip Johnson, and he called me to personally apologize for his statements and demeanor during my interview.

He's a big man for doing this, and I respect him for it.

Good he apologized and over the phone. What bothers me is the reason he thought was okay to say that in the first place. I see an underlying problem to begin with, which he needs to resolve before he puts his foot in his mouth again. If he keeps up with that knee-jerk race card flop, apologies soon won't be enough. I hope he explained why, besides just apologizing.

Thanks for taking the fight to him, Kevin!

madmike
02-03-2010, 2:50 PM
Excellent that he would apologize. Now that the air is clearer between you two, maybe you can help each other out on this and future issues.

-madmike.

dantodd
02-03-2010, 4:40 PM
Good he apologized and over the phone. What bothers me is the reason he thought was okay to say that in the first place. I see an underlying problem to begin with, which he needs to resolve before he puts his foot in his mouth again. If he keeps up with that knee-jerk race card flop, apologies soon won't be enough. I hope he explained why, besides just apologizing.

Thanks for taking the fight to him, Kevin!

I don't know. There is a lot of FUD out there about gun owners. White, Racist, Red-necked, Male. I can see where someone subjected to that stereotype over a lifetime can think that a white gun owner confronting them might be harboring racist feelings. It is wrong and inappropriate but it is not inexplicable. I would need more than a single episode of playing "the race card" before I were willing to condemn the man for it.

Oaklander, whether via shock or strategy, handled it perfectly. He defused the situation when it came up and directed the discussion back to the topic at hand and followed up later AFTER the article was written and comments were in. This was much better than completely derailing the interview and ruining any chance of trust by becoming confrontational during the interview.

Well done and let's build on the olive branch that was extended.

oaklander
02-03-2010, 5:47 PM
Thanks for saying that, there's generally a method to my madness. . .

:D

ETA: Chip and I are now friends on Facebook.

Oaklander, whether via shock or strategy, handled it perfectly. He defused the situation when it came up and directed the discussion back to the topic at hand and followed up later AFTER the article was written and comments were in. This was much better than completely derailing the interview and ruining any chance of trust by becoming confrontational during the interview.

Well done and let's build on the olive branch that was extended.

Cokebottle
02-03-2010, 6:08 PM
Excellent that he would apologize. Now that the air is clearer between you two, maybe you can help each other out on this and future issues.
Invite him to the CGN/UOC BBQ!

Seriously... introduce him to some of the people that he fears most!

Steyr_223
02-03-2010, 7:18 PM
Perhaps you should invite Chip to the next Shoot and Q at Chabot or maybe take him to the next Cow Palace show. Seeing the diversity of our community may increase his enlightenment.

Congrats on turning this into to a win!

Rod

oaklander
02-03-2010, 9:35 PM
Thanks!

:grouphug:

Perhaps you should invite Chip to the next Shoot and Q at Chabot or maybe take him to the next Cow Palace show. Seeing the diversity of our community may increase his enlightenment.

Congrats on turning this into to a win!

Rod