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View Full Version : Overall Length for Registered Assault Weapon


Fire4Effect
01-28-2010, 4:36 PM
Are registered assault weapons allowed to have an overall length of less than 30 inches, but not less than 26 inches?

Thanks

Quiet
01-28-2010, 4:52 PM
For a RAW, the minimum OAL is 26".
Anything shorter will make it a SBR.

Fire4Effect
01-28-2010, 5:04 PM
For a RAW, the minimum OAL is 26".
Anything shorter will make it a SBR.

That's what I thought, but I wanted to make sure.

Thanks !!

loather
01-28-2010, 5:07 PM
Thinking about shortening up your RAW? :)

IrishPirate
01-28-2010, 5:15 PM
For a RAW, the minimum OAL is 26".
Anything shorter will make it a SBR.

^this

and a note: you know you have to already have a RAW since before 2000 and you can't make one now right? I'm assuming you're talking about shortening your existing RAW and not making one and then trying to register it since that would be illegal.

DedEye
01-28-2010, 5:36 PM
and a note: you know you have to already have a RAW since before 2000 and you can't make one now right? I'm assuming you're talking about shortening your existing RAW and not making one and then trying to register it since that would be illegal.

Not quite. (http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/FAQ#I_am_in_the_Military.2C_can_I_bring_an_.22assa ult_weapon.22_into_California.3F)

For the most part accurate, but there are exceptions. (http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/FAQ#Is_it_possible_to_register_my_firearm_as_an_as sault_weapon_still.3F)

Also, I hate you. (http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/FAQ#What_is_the_minimum_overall_length_.28OAL.29_f or_a_Registered_Assault_Weapon.3F)

bwiese
01-28-2010, 5:44 PM
Do remember that due to California's People v. Rooney case, a CA rifle's overall length is measured differently than by Federal standards....

Calif: rifle's overall length must be measured with any folder stock closed.Fed: rifle's overall length can be measured with any folder stock open.

The more generous Federal rule allows a really short rifle (as long as it has 16+" bbl) plus stock to only have to be 26" min. when opened up; California does not allow that.

(And by a 'folder' stock I mean to include folders, collapsibles, telestocks, underfolders, etc.)

AJAX22
01-28-2010, 6:05 PM
Do remember that due to California's People v. Rooney case, a CA rifle's overall length is measured differently than by Federal standards....

Calif: rifle's overall length must be measured with any folder stock closed.Fed: rifle's overall length can be measured with any folder stock open.

The more generous Federal rule allows a really short rifle (as long as it has 16+" bbl) plus stock to only have to be 26" min. when opened up; California does not allow that.

(And by a 'folder' stock I mean to include folders, collapsibles, telestocks, underfolders, etc.)

The Defense atorny in Rooney should have been disbarred for screwing that case up that bad.

All he had to do was call ONE witness... or send ONE letter to the batfe...

how do you loose a case that straightforward and simple....

At least in Miller there was the excuse that there WAS no defendant or defense attorney to contest the prosecutions evidence (still not sure how that was legal)

bwiese
01-28-2010, 6:55 PM
The Defense atorny in Rooney should have been disbarred for screwing that case up that bad.

All he had to do was call ONE witness... or send ONE letter to the batfe...

how do you lose a case that straightforward and simple....



You're now seeing what happened in recent People v. James AW case.

Chuck Michel is seeking to depublish it.

It was a public defender trying to throw a Heller "Hail Mary" pass, without seeking guidance from anyone.

The future of the gun law fight is gonna have to be one of "urgent displacement" - NRA, CGF, etc. are gonna have to get good cases in early before someone comes in with bad cases/bad law that accidentally gets traction thru stupidity.

Fire4Effect
01-28-2010, 6:56 PM
Thinking about shortening up your RAW? :)

I was thinking about putting a 16" barrel on a Registered Steyr USR which would bring the OAL down to 27"

Fire4Effect
01-28-2010, 6:57 PM
Thanks for all the responses. It has been very helpful.

dantodd
01-28-2010, 7:04 PM
Do remember that due to California's People v. Rooney case, a CA rifle's overall length is measured differently than by Federal standards....

Calif: rifle's overall length must be measured with any folder stock closed.Fed: rifle's overall length can be measured with any folder stock open.

The more generous Federal rule allows a really short rifle (as long as it has 16+" bbl) plus stock to only have to be 26" min. when opened up; California does not allow that.

(And by a 'folder' stock I mean to include folders, collapsibles, telestocks, underfolders, etc.)

Someone has to develop a CA-special folding stock. One which disables the firearm, rendering it unfireable when collapsed and then when extended permits normal operation.

ETA: Actually we just need less screwed up gun laws in CA but a stock like that would be nice for the interim.

Quiet
01-28-2010, 7:45 PM
Someone has to develop a CA-special folding stock. One which disables the firearm, rendering it unfireable when collapsed and then when extended permits normal operation.

Kel-Tec SU-16A, SU-16B and SU-16CA. :whistling:

dantodd
01-28-2010, 7:47 PM
Kel-Tec SU-16A, SU-16B and SU-16CA. :whistling:

That's a little different than I had in mind. I'm pretty sure those all fold AT the action rather than a telescoping butt stock.

bigcalidave
01-28-2010, 9:32 PM
What good would it be to have a stock that folded but disabled the action?

I want a piston upper and folding stock for my RAW AR so that I can shoot it SHORT. The keltecs fold for stuffing in your backpack.

bwiese
01-28-2010, 10:22 PM
I was thinking about putting a 16" barrel on a
Registered Steyr USR which would bring the OAL down to 27"

You're golden.

Only disadvantage: if you wanted to equip your RAW with devices (say, a BB) or evil features removals to stop it from being an AW for ease of transport (you can do this with Category 3 guns, not Cat 1 or 2 'banned by name' models) the under-30" length is a problem.

bwiese
01-28-2010, 10:23 PM
I want a piston upper and folding stock for my RAW AR so that I can shoot it SHORT. The keltecs fold for stuffing in your backpack.

ParaOrdnance TTR.

Quiet
01-28-2010, 11:28 PM
ParaOrdnance TTR.
FYI.
The ParaUSA TTR (ZM-Weapons LR300) uses a delayed gas-impingment system, it's not a gas-piston.

Cokebottle
01-28-2010, 11:36 PM
That's a little different than I had in mind. I'm pretty sure those all fold AT the action rather than a telescoping butt stock.
Ahh... so you're thinking of something like a folder with a pin on the strong side that would prohibit the trigger from being pulled?

Oops... CA law would be okay with that since it would not be operable when folded.



Unless you only folded it halfway.

Ya, I don't see how such a device could be made to work with existing AR lowers.
It might be possible to modify an AK folder to block the hammer or activate the selector as soon as the buttstock release is activated.

bwiese
01-28-2010, 11:40 PM
FYI.
The ParaUSA TTR (ZM-Weapons LR300) uses a delayed gas-impingment system, it's not a gas-piston.

Yes, it's Alan Zitta ZM Weapons variant... I was just writing about its ability to be a "short system" on an AR, allowing a folder stock to be used - losing quite a bit of OAL when folded. Great travel gun.

Meplat
01-28-2010, 11:54 PM
Not all RAW's are rifles. Some are pistols.;)

bigcalidave
01-29-2010, 12:37 AM
Bill, have you seen the new rock river arms pps setup? They have a rifle length one coming this year :D :D :D

dantodd
01-29-2010, 7:49 AM
Not all RAW's are rifles. Some are pistols.;)

Is there an OAL requirement for RAW that are pistols?

bwiese
01-29-2010, 9:13 AM
Is there an OAL requirement for RAW that are pistols?

No. It's a pistol.

There has been some murkiness/worries for pistols in CA - in that they should *not* have a 16" or longer barrel.