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lauranben
01-27-2010, 7:51 PM
I want to buy a Styer AUG A3 but I am unsure if anyone makes a type of MAG lock for this gun? Does anyone have any idea if they do? Thanks for the help.

Josh3239
01-27-2010, 7:54 PM
On the ban list, can't have it. Look up MSAR E4 and MSAR STG556.

lauranben
01-27-2010, 8:39 PM
I thought since it wasn't an A1 or A2 version it would be ok since it's a new model. Well thanks for the heads up. Love the sunshine state. I'll check out the the types you listed.

jchen76@gmail.com
01-27-2010, 9:13 PM
If interested talk to these guys for MSAR rifle:
http://www.ratworxusa.com/default.asp
They sell Cali compliant (bullet button) MSAR rifles. On sale too $1050

Lateralus
01-27-2010, 9:19 PM
Radd also makes a maglock for the MSAR series IIRC. Sorry, I don't remember exactly which models it works with.

K5Cruiser
01-27-2010, 11:06 PM
Although you cannot have a Steyr AUG here in CA, you can have a Steyr USR. Riflegear has mag locks available for them.
http://www.riflegear.com/p-560-raddlock-msar-stg-556.aspx

yourotherleft
01-28-2010, 11:00 AM
No, cannot have it here in Calif, unless Steyr change the name to whatever other than AUG. Are you listening Steyr? Guess not. My dealer just talked to them during SHOT show, the name stays. In the mean time, call ratworx for msar.

ScorpioVI
01-28-2010, 11:36 AM
I saw a USR at the SF Gun Show a few months back, was tempted to pick it up.

Sicarius
01-28-2010, 11:43 AM
Yeah... it says A3 but it's too close for my comfort. I wouldn't wanna be the first one to try it against the state of CA. The name AUG is banned so that's all it takes to sway me. USR is the only actual steyr that you can get on the aug platform.
Kevin

patriot_man
01-28-2010, 4:58 PM
stg556 > aug

way better parts put into the stg and pretty good triggers vs steyrs

Rekrab
01-28-2010, 6:33 PM
Those guns are incredibly beautiful.

A Cali Legal AUG style rifle makes me tingly in the trousers.

The only thing that would make me happier is a Cali legal FN P90 >.>

Lateralus
01-28-2010, 6:35 PM
Those guns are incredibly beautiful.

A Cali Legal AUG style rifle makes me tingly in the trousers.

The only thing that would make me happier is a Cali legal FN P90 >.>

Have you seen the PS90?

Rekrab
01-28-2010, 7:53 PM
Yes, but the long barrel makes it look silly.

bondmid003
01-28-2010, 8:40 PM
From what I've heard, the customer service from the folks at Ratworx is outstanding. When I get back from deployment, I'm probably going to pick up a railed E4 model.

Josh3239
01-28-2010, 9:49 PM
Ratworx was very helpful with me when I ordered my STG several years ago. They also have dealer discounts if you are an 03 FFL. MSAR's customer service is amazing, Dave Robertson who is their go to gunsmith there is awesome. The guy has developed a reputation of fixing your rifle, throwing some extra mags and stuff in the box and sending it back to your house within a week. Dave offered free upgrades to my Gen 1 STG and offered (not free) to upgrade it to an E4. Both companies are awesome.

VickG818
01-29-2010, 4:40 AM
I wanted one too but cant have it in cali. This is the next best thing to it. The best part is it takes ar 15 mags and shoots 556x45,7.62x39,545x39 and 6.8 SPC. It turnes everyones heads at the range lol:D

http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m206/lex818420/IMG_1285.jpg

lauranben
01-29-2010, 9:56 PM
Thanks for the help ordered a MSAR stg today.

ScorpioVI
02-03-2010, 3:52 PM
Who makes this?



I wanted one too but cant have it in cali. This is the next best thing to it. The best part is it takes ar 15 mags and shoots 556x45,7.62x39,545x39 and 6.8 SPC. It turnes everyones heads at the range lol:D

http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m206/lex818420/IMG_1285.jpg

jchen76@gmail.com
02-03-2010, 3:56 PM
For current MSAR owners. Is it PITA to switch from Cali raddlock to standard configuration?

Josh3239
02-03-2010, 4:27 PM
For STG556s it isn't bad. The release is similiar to an AK. It is a paddle style and you have very little room to work with. You need to fit the spring inside the release, keeping the spring in the proper orientation (like an AR15 dust cover spring) and then push the screw through the stock, spring and release. I've constantly switched back and forth for going out of state, it is constant trial and error that doesn't take more than 5 minutes. It helps to use a punch as a slave pin.

If you have an E4 I believe you are SOL. I spoke to Radd about it, he made it sound like that is not doable.

jchen76@gmail.com
02-03-2010, 4:38 PM
Thanks. The E4's can take AR style mags, but if it can't be un-neutered easily when I leave the state, guess the STG556 is the way to go.

gun toting monkeyboy
02-03-2010, 4:40 PM
Does the STG556 take AR mags?

Josh3239
02-03-2010, 4:45 PM
Btw all, I'd strongly suggest a 20'' barrel otherwise you'll need to find a way to extend the overal length of the rifle.

Also, Ratworx is still having their sale: http://www.ratworxusa.com/default.asp

Thanks. The E4's can take AR style mags, but if it can't be un-neutered easily when I leave the state, guess the STG556 is the way to go.

Correct. As of now Raddlocks are installed at the factory. Radd said something about a special tool for installing and uninstalling or something. If you really want to do it I'd suggest pming Radd.

STG556 is a fantastic rifle. If you ever move out of state MSAR with convert it to an E4 for a small fee.

Does the STG556 take AR mags?

The two MSAR models are the STG556 which takes STG and AUG mags and the E4 which takes AR style mags.

VickG818
02-03-2010, 7:20 PM
Does the STG556 take AR mags?

The newest One. Its called the MSAR E4

titan
02-03-2010, 7:35 PM
You can get the 16" barrel you just can't have it assembled in CA.

CHS
02-03-2010, 7:54 PM
Btw all, I'd strongly suggest a 20'' barrel otherwise you'll need to find a way to extend the overal length of the rifle.


You mean like with one of these:

http://riflegear.com/p-562-raddlock-msarsteyr-barrel-extension-3.aspx

:)

Josh3239
02-03-2010, 8:29 PM
Yes, or a fake can that sits on the muzzle. STG muzzle devices aren't easy to take off, they aren't permanently attached but it is close enough with the checknut and red loctite.

titan
02-03-2010, 9:32 PM
Yes, or a fake can that sits on the muzzle. STG muzzle devices aren't easy to take off, they aren't permanently attached but it is close enough with the checknut and red loctite.

thats why i just leave my disassembled, and shoot it in AZ, helps to have family there:D

tonelar
02-22-2010, 4:29 PM
Shame about the Steyr AUG A3/ you'd think Stag Arms would be proud enough toput THEIR OWN names on it.

Ah well... I'd like one 'cause it'd make a neat way to carry my AUG's spare barrel assemblies, heheh.

CHS
02-22-2010, 8:24 PM
Shame about the Steyr AUG A3/ you'd think Stag Arms would be proud enough toput THEIR OWN names on it.


Huh?

Steyr AUG A3's are made in the USA by Sabre Defence. Stag Arms has nothing to do with them.

And for the record, Sabre Defence has their name on the guns. But they are still Steyr AUG's.

tonelar
03-08-2010, 8:45 AM
Thanks BD, My mistake- made by Sabre Defense. Got it.

Pvt. Cowboy
03-08-2010, 8:48 AM
stg556 > aug

way better parts put into the stg and pretty good triggers vs steyrs

Er, no. Hardly.

Group B
03-08-2010, 9:04 AM
How come I never hear anything about the TPD AXR?

tonelar
03-10-2010, 3:51 AM
It is supposedly being produced still. Although I wonder what effect the Sabre Defence AUG/A3 SA USA has on it's market share...

pTa
03-10-2010, 4:06 PM
Sabre Defence has their name on the guns. But they are still Steyr AUG's.

What? They would not be Styer AUG's anymnore then right? Theyd be Sabre Defense Steyr AUG's.

stg556 > aug

way better parts put into the stg and pretty good triggers vs steyrs

Er, no. Hardly.

+1 Tell 'im Private!

Quiet
03-11-2010, 2:56 PM
What? They would not be Styer AUG's anymnore then right? Theyd be Sabre Defense Steyr AUG's.

It's kinda like how the H&K/Wilcox Industries deal went through.

Wilcox Industries is making the H&K MR-556 and MR-762 in the USA, but they're still considered made by H&K.

6172crew
03-11-2010, 5:29 PM
The A3 uses the same maglock as the AUG clones. It just has to be fitted with the help of a few had tools.

tonelar
03-12-2010, 7:27 PM
It's kinda like how the H&K/Wilcox Industries deal went through.

Wilcox Industries is making the H&K MR-556 and MR-762 in the USA, but they're still considered made by H&K.

Are they stamped "Mfg by: Heckler and Koch"? Or are they stamped "Mfg by: Wilcox Ind"?

Quiet
03-12-2010, 10:44 PM
Are they stamped "Mfg by: Heckler and Koch"? Or are they stamped "Mfg by: Wilcox Ind"?

H&K

tonelar
03-12-2010, 11:16 PM
The two MSAR models are the STG556 which takes STG and AUG mags and the E4 which takes AR style mags.
The MSAR rep told me the magazines weren't interchangeable. So AUG and STG mags will interchange?


It's kinda like how the H&K/Wilcox Industries deal went through.
Wilcox Industries is making the H&K MR-556 and MR-762 in the USA, but they're still considered made by H&K.
They're "considered made by H&K" because they are not marked "Mfg'd by Wilcox".

On a lark, I called and asked for professional opinions regarding how the new A3 would be described on paper.

Not one has thought to list Steyr under Make. So far, everyone says Make is the manufacturer's name.

Josh3239
03-13-2010, 12:16 AM
The MSAR rep told me the magazines weren't interchangeable. So AUG and STG mags will interchange?

AUG mags will go in an Gen 4 STG556 (current production). STG556 mags will not go into an AUG. MSAR's new AR style mags will go in an AR15, AUG A3, MSAR E4 or any other firearm that accepts AR style mags. I am sure there is a simple mod to do it. My STG is a Gen 1, the Gen 1's actually don't accept AUG mags, but all I have to do is shave a small amount of plastic with a dremel in 4 different places and AUG mags will go in. IIRC Dave at MSAR offered to upgrade mine for free to a Gen4, I declined the offer.


Not one has thought to list Steyr under Make. So far, everyone says Make is the manufacturer's name.

I really don't want to argue this with you but I will drive one last point home. Do you think it would be wise to run around with a lower that is marked Colt AR15? There is a very good reason no one on CGN has ever had a laser or an actual engraving of the pony or AR15 put on their lower, there is a very good reason no one has ever marked their 80% AK build AK47. The legal minds on here like HoffmanG and BWiese both recommended against that back when the AK craze started. There is a very good reason for this. But if you want to try it, then good luck finding a dealer who is willing to transfer an AUG style rifle that is marked "Steyr AUG".

tonelar
03-13-2010, 5:47 AM
Tanx Josh,

That mag compatibility makes sense. The STG I saw had a fwd assist (so that had to be one of the 1st Gens). Like I said earlier, if the STG would have accepted my Steyr 24" barrel, I'd have bought one.

As far as running around with a Steyr marked receiver goes; I don't wanna be the test case for anything.
However;
A Steyr USA retailer says that of the 20-something AUG A3's they've sent into Cali, about half were sold to Cali civilians (even were willing to email me info for some ffls who they shipped to). Mebbe I'll let one of them be the guinea pig.

And for the record; there are an awful lot of Colt marked ARs running around these days. They're made by Walther in Germany, right?

Quiet
03-13-2010, 7:51 AM
Last time I checked (last year), the new USA made Saber Defense/Steyr AUGs are marked Steyr AUG-A3/SA.

It's on the edge and I would not risk possessing one in CA.

Josh3239
03-13-2010, 4:59 PM
And for the record; there are an awful lot of Colt marked ARs running around these days. They're made by Walther in Germany, right?

Yes but those are off list. I am talking about AR15s that are actually marked "Colt AR15" which is on the list, certain Colt models are not but "Colt AR15" is absolutely on the ban list. Nor will you see AK style rifles bearing the name "AK47" engraved on it.

,
A Steyr USA retailer says that of the 20-something AUG A3's they've sent into Cali, about half were sold to Cali civilians (even were willing to email me info for some ffls who they shipped to). Mebbe I'll let one of them be the guinea pig.

Well no one ever said a gunstore is a good place to gather info. I wonder how many of those customers are federal or California law enforcement officers.

dexter9659
03-13-2010, 5:39 PM
As I recall, the Steyr AUG was never listed by the DOJ, making it legal to purchase. The original DOJ assault weapon ID list read "Steyer AUG". Steyer is not Steyr, which according to the courts would make the Steyr legal. However this being said, the DOJ added a * to the document later which stated "*Spelling of “Steyer” in the statute is a typographical error." I believe if you had unlimited funds you "could" win in court, though I wont be the one to attempt such a feat. I do not know of any AUG assault weapons charges ever being brought up in Cali, perhaps because of this reason (though I am just speculating here).

Actually I would like to see someone produce a "Steyer AUG" in the exact spelling and sell them in Cali just to see what the CA DOJ does.

tonelar
03-13-2010, 7:37 PM
Yes but those are off list. I am talking about AR15s that are actually marked "Colt AR15" which is on the list, certain Colt models are not but "Colt AR15" is absolutely on the ban list. Nor will you see AK style rifles bearing the name "AK47" engraved on it.

My mistake the colt I see walking around is the "Colt M4". So by having a different "model name" they're okay?

A couple examples come to mind. Named in the 89 ban by make and model is the HK 91. Is the HK 911 a named AW? Second point is the Saiga... both are made by Izmash yet the banned one is listed as a Kalashnikov USA Saiga and the one all these daredevils are buying is a Russian American Armory Saiga. They are risk taking right?


Well no one ever said a gunstore is a good place to gather info. I wonder how many of those customers are federal or California law enforcement officers.

I was told half of the 20 something sales to Cali were LE. So, that leaves 10, right? And my info was from a distributor not a gun store.

Quiet
03-14-2010, 8:30 AM
My mistake the colt I see walking around is the "Colt M4". So by having a different "model name" they're okay?

A couple examples come to mind. Named in the 89 ban by make and model is the HK 91. Is the HK 911 a named AW? Second point is the Saiga... both are made by Izmash yet the banned one is listed as a Kalashnikov USA Saiga and the one all these daredevils are buying is a Russian American Armory Saiga. They are risk taking right?

The Roberti-Roos AWB created Category 1 assault weapons.
The Kasler list created created Category 2 assault weapons.

Both categories of assault weapons lists firearms classified as assault weapons by make/model.

If the exact make/model is not listed, then it is not considered a Category 1 or 2 assault weapon.

From your examples...
The (make) H&K (model) HK-91 is listed as a Category 1 assault weapon.
However, the (make) H&K (model) HK-911 is not listed as a Category 1 assault weapon, due to the model number not matching what's listed.

The (importer) Kalashnikov USA (model) Saiga is listed as a Category 2 assault weapon.
The (importer) European American Arms and (importer) Russian American Arms (model) Saiga is not listed as a Category 2 assault weapon, due to the make/importer not matching what's listed. The importer is often used in lieu of the manufacturer.

There are CA FFL dealers that will not transfer HK911 or RAA Saiga, due to not being comfortable with transfering firearms that have slight marking variations then what is listed. And there have been incidents in which RAA Saigas have been confiscated as assault weapons by LEOs.

Technically, it appears that the (make) Steyr (model) AUG-A3/SA does not meet the exact wording for what's listed as a Category 1 assault weapon (Steyr AUG).

But, you still run the risk of having it confiscated as a make/model listed assault weapons.
So, unless you have $50000+ saved away to use for legal fees, it is not recommended to try and acquire one in CA when there are alternatives (MSAR STG556 and MSAR E4) that are less risky.

tonelar
03-15-2010, 2:02 AM
by Make you're meaning Manufacturer, right?
the receiver I saw had "MFG BY SABRE DEFENCE IND LLC Nashville, TN" on it.

People run the risk of having anything confiscated... it hinges on the attitude and intelligence of LEO making the stop. Just as important is the gun owner's attitude and responsibility. As more and more agencies and DAs across Cali are educated by us (and of course) the Calgunners that came before us. These unlawful confiscations and arrests will become a thing of the past.
http://www.pjs-steyraug.com/00728.jpg
I'm confident that this weapon was not in existence at the times of the Category 1 and Category 2 AW lists and if configured properly won't get a second glance from any interested parties. Seriously with all the MSARs running around, do you think anyone is really going to take the time to read it up close and personal? AND if they do, what are the odds they'll be stupid enough to not know what "Manufactured by Sabre Defence" means in regards to the Make of a firearm?

Anyways, I appreciate that this forum has really well read and intelligent members. Also, I like how the Calif Gunny community looks out for each other. If I wasn't so certain, I'd wait a couple years for things to cool down in the wake of a favorable SCOTUS decision regarding 2A incorporation (or my transfer into the SFFD Arson Squad, haha).