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Robidouxs
01-12-2010, 12:42 PM
One of my buddy's is getting ready to head to the range this Thursday and is concerned about transporting the pistol from his residence to the range, he will be passing through multiple school zones.

The pistol will be unloaded and locked in a case but placed in the open bed of the pickup truck.

My main question is that since the pistol is in a locked container and is not in the passenger compartment is the transportation legal even though the bed of the truck is open to the air.

My second question in regards to transporting in a pickup truck; is pistol ammunition required to be in a locked container and is it allowed to be in the bed of the truck or in the passenger compartment.

SJgunguy24
01-12-2010, 12:48 PM
Just put the case on the seat next to you. The case is locked so don't worry about it. You can have the mags loaded and in the case, just don't have any loaded mags in the firearm itself.
I wouldn't put my handgun in the back of an open bed pick up truck. Somebody could walk up and grab it.
No the ammo doesn't need to be locked up, only the gun itself. If you have 1 lock to go through to get to your gun then it's legal.
A car trunk is locked= a locked container. Range bag that is locked= locked container. The range bag can be on your lap, as long as it's locked your legal.

IrishPirate
01-12-2010, 12:51 PM
Just put the case on the seat next to you. The case is locked so don't worry about it. You can have the mags loaded and in the case, just don't have any loaded mags in the firearm itself.
I wouldn't put my handgun in the back of an open bed pick up truck. Somebody could walk up and grab it.

ditto
i wouldn't put it in the bed for the simple reason that you don't know what could happen to it. It's perfectly fine for it to be back there from a legal standpoint, but it's not smart practice IMHO. As long as it's in a locked container it's ok to transport through school zones. Ammo can be in the same locked container, just not loaded into the gun.

tombinghamthegreat
01-12-2010, 1:38 PM
It might be advisable to put it in a backpack with a cheap lock so it is less likely to be stolen. Don't leave it in the back, someone might steal it.

dfletcher
01-12-2010, 3:18 PM
One of my buddy's is getting ready to head to the range this Thursday and is concerned about transporting the pistol from his residence to the range, he will be passing through multiple school zones.

The pistol will be unloaded and locked in a case but placed in the open bed of the pickup truck.



A few weeks ago I was driving down South Van Ness in SF, hit the stop light just under the overpass where you take a right and hook on to the South 101 & North 80 connector - area with the homeless folks holding signs, walking through traffic, making nice for some spare change. I watched as one of the fellows with a sign walked by a pick up truck stuck in traffic and reached into the bed - came up with a bundle of bananas and walked off with it.

I don't know what the legal solution is, but I would never put a gun in an open pick up truck bed.

otteray
01-12-2010, 6:28 PM
Get a locking tonneau hard cover or heavy secured tarp if you have to transport your guns in the bed.
I have a locking car rooftop carrier "pod" that I keep in my truck bed for just such circumstances when transporting those worried friends to the shooting range... Common and dirt cheap if purchased used.
Personally, my handguns are locked up in a bag in the cab with the ammo, not in the back bed.

Decoligny
01-12-2010, 6:49 PM
Come on folks. We're talking about transporting a pistol here. You can lock it in a metal cash box as long as it's unloaded and carry it on your lap, LEGALLY.

As long as it is unloaded, and locked in a secure container, it is perfectly all right to carry your pistol to the range up front, on your lap, under the seat, behind the seat, duct taped to your forehead, ALL are legal methods of transport.

GrizzlyGuy
01-12-2010, 6:50 PM
Since the gun is in a locked container, it is legal whether it is in the bed of the truck or in the passenger compartment.

The ammo can legally be anywhere (except in the gun): in the same locked container, in the bed, in the cab. It doesn't need to be in a locked container.

If the ammo is kept out of view, that might reduce the drama-factor of a LEO encounter.

ETA: If the mags are loaded, keep them in the locked container as well. Or unload them.

wildhawker
01-12-2010, 7:06 PM
Since the gun is in a locked container, it is legal whether it is in the bed of the truck or in the passenger compartment.

The ammo can legally be anywhere (except in the gun): in the same locked container, in the bed, in the cab. It doesn't need to be in a locked container.

If the ammo is kept out of view, that might reduce the drama-factor of a LEO encounter.

ETA: If the mags are loaded, keep them in the locked container as well. Or unload them.

For clarity, it might be useful to use the term "filled" mags or "mags containing ammunition". There are probably better ways of phrasing that, but those are what come to mind.

gadjeep
01-12-2010, 7:11 PM
Get a locking Tonto hard cover or heavy secured tarp if you have to transport your guns in the bed.
I have a locking car rooftop carrier "pod" that I keep in my truck bed for just such circumstances when transporting those worried friends to the shooting range... Common and dirt cheap if purchased used.
Personally, my handguns are locked up in a bag in the cab with the ammo, not in the back bed.

Another advantage of this is if you get in an accident (God forbid) your very valuable and cherished firearms won't go flying off to who knows where. Don't ask me how I know this...

bodger
01-12-2010, 8:01 PM
I carry my long guns in the bed of my truck in a locked container that is also chained to the carry racks. Prevents a snatch and dash at a stoplight.

Handguns, filled mags not in the weapon, in a locked container in the cab, all ammo out of sight.

I think that's good to go.

racinginthestreets
01-12-2010, 11:31 PM
Just put the case on the seat next to you. The case is locked so don't worry about it. You can have the mags loaded and in the case, just don't have any loaded mags in the firearm itself.
I wouldn't put my handgun in the back of an open bed pick up truck. Somebody could walk up and grab it.
No the ammo doesn't need to be locked up, only the gun itself. If you have 1 lock to go through to get to your gun then it's legal.
A car trunk is locked= a locked container. Range bag that is locked= locked container. The range bag can be on your lap, as long as it's locked your legal.

I don't believe one can have the mags loaded and in the locked gun case. I believe some case law exists that has led to a conviction for a person who is driving with a locked gun case and has loaded magazines next to the gun.

Sinixstar
01-12-2010, 11:45 PM
If he has room behind the seat in his truck - i'd say put it there. Not on the seat next to you.

The last time i read the law - it said if there is no area where it could be locked outside of the passenger compartment, it needs to be in a place that is not easily accessible to the driver. On the seat next to you does not really qualify there. The glove box is also explicitly prohibited.

I would say under the seat on the passenger side, or if the seat of the truck flips forward so you can get back there - put it back there. I would be hesitant to leave it open-air in the bed of the truck.

DedEye
01-13-2010, 12:15 AM
For future reference, all of your questions are answered here (http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/FAQ#How_do_I_legally_transport_a_handgun.3F).

SJgunguy24
01-13-2010, 1:48 AM
I don't believe one can have the mags loaded and in the locked gun case. I believe some case law exists that has led to a conviction for a person who is driving with a locked gun case and has loaded magazines next to the gun.

From the CHP website.


I will be traveling to California and want to carry my weapon. I currently have a concealed weapon permit. How can I legally transport my weapon while driving through the state?
California law does not recognize concealed weapon permits from other states; therefore, they would not be held valid. If you wish to transport a handgun during your California visit, it should be carried unloaded in a locked container. In the absence of a suitable container, you may secure the unloaded handgun in the locked trunk of a passenger car. Ammunition may be kept in the same container or trunk, but the handgun must remain unloaded with no rounds in the cylinder and no loaded magazines in the magazine well.

If you have additional questions, contact the California Department of Justice at 916-227-3703.

GrizzlyGuy
01-13-2010, 5:44 AM
For clarity, it might be useful to use the term "filled" mags or "mags containing ammunition". There are probably better ways of phrasing that, but those are what come to mind.

Thanks, I'll try to remember that. It will be a tough vernacular habit to break!

Decoligny
01-13-2010, 7:02 AM
I don't believe one can have the mags loaded and in the locked gun case. I believe some case law exists that has led to a conviction for a person who is driving with a locked gun case and has loaded magazines next to the gun.

180 degrees off the mark on this one.

The case law says exactly the opposite. See "People v. Clark (1996) 45 Cal.App.4th 1147, 53 Cal.Rptr.2d 99".

It states specifically, "under the commonly understood meaning of the term "loaded," a firearm is "loaded" when a shell of cartridge has been placed into a position from which it can be fired;"

Sheepdog1968
01-13-2010, 7:53 AM
Since you're going to use a locked container, how about you make it a locked toolbox.

tombinghamthegreat
01-13-2010, 2:06 PM
The last time i read the law - it said if there is no area where it could be locked outside of the passenger compartment, it needs to be in a place that is not easily accessible to the driver. On the seat next to you does not really qualify there. The glove box is also explicitly prohibited.


FUD. You can have the locked container with ammo right in your lap since it would not violate people vs clark nor pc12025

Army
01-13-2010, 7:47 PM
Get a locking Tonto hard cover ....
"Tonneau" cover.

Serious implications to have an iconic Native American bolted to your truckbed :D

bodger
01-13-2010, 8:18 PM
"Tonneau" cover.

Serious implications to have an iconic Native American bolted to your truckbed :D


Lone Ranger cover.
Put a mask on your rifle.

rabagley
01-13-2010, 9:58 PM
Okay, so here's an interesting variant. What if I was to put together a variant of the SmartCarry holster that went over the gun and had a lockable zipper such that the unloaded gun and filled magazine were fully enclosed by the case?

Could I legally wear that locked case under my shirt and tucked into my pants?

Would that constitute a California-legal "locked, unloaded, concealed carry" situation? In the car? Walking around doing your shopping?

otteray
01-14-2010, 4:58 AM
"Tonneau" cover.

Serious implications to have an iconic Native American bolted to your truckbed :D

Very good. Ya got me fair and square.

GrizzlyGuy
01-14-2010, 6:05 AM
Okay, so here's an interesting variant. What if I was to put together a variant of the SmartCarry holster that went over the gun and had a lockable zipper such that the unloaded gun and filled magazine were fully enclosed by the case?

Could I legally wear that locked case under my shirt and tucked into my pants?

Would that constitute a California-legal "locked, unloaded, concealed carry" situation? In the car? Walking around doing your shopping?

Per Gene's posts here (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=163061&highlight=LUCC) and here (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showpost.php?p=3560901&postcount=17), and Librarian's post here (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showpost.php?p=2260581&postcount=153), that sounds like a legal means of LUCC. You would need to be making use of one or more concealed carry exemptions in 12026 (http://law.onecle.com/california/penal/12026.html) through 12027 (http://law.onecle.com/california/penal/12027.html). Exercising your 4A and 5A rights as needed would minimize the chance of someone splitting hairs about the applicability of those exemptions in various situations.

See also this thread (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=235940) and this one (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=169348) for more ideas and examples for LUCC containers. More background info in this FAQ section (http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/FAQ#How_do_I_legally_transport_a_handgun.3F).

Anothercoilgun
01-14-2010, 9:33 PM
This just hit me. What if you do not have a trunk per se. What about Blazers, SUVs and the like? Where would one justify where the trunk ends. Yes it may begin with the tale gate but that eventually blends into the car and can be accessed from within the vehicle.

Off hand I would say, the back tale gate area under the mate of Blazers and SUVs are a no fly zones to place an unloaded firearm without a locked container. But has there been any cases one way or the other?

Army
01-15-2010, 11:03 AM
This just hit me. What if you do not have a trunk per se. What about Blazers, SUVs and the like? Where would one justify where the trunk ends. Yes it may begin with the tale gate but that eventually blends into the car and can be accessed from within the vehicle.

Off hand I would say, the back tale gate area under the mate of Blazers and SUVs are a no fly zones to place an unloaded firearm without a locked container. But has there been any cases one way or the other?
Does not apply to long guns. Handguns & AW's (per 1000' GFSZ) simply must be in a locked container.

Once they are locked up, they can be anywhere in the vehicle that's available.