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View Full Version : San Francisco Supervisor Carol Ruth Silver on guns


Steyr_223
01-11-2010, 1:25 PM
Why don't we have more like her? I wonder if she posts here? Someone should invite her..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carol_Ruth_Silver

Her 1977 election was part of a shift toward diversity on the San Francisco Board of Supervisors; she was described as "the board's first unwed mother."[6]

She served three terms, through 1989.

She is a member of Pink Pistols and a supporter of the 2nd Amendment.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/01/08/PK111B8PKB.DTL

1985

Jan. 11: San Francisco Supervisor Carol Ruth Silver wrote an article in a national publication that said a subway rider attacked by armed criminals "has every right to shoot in self-defense." Her views were disputed quickly by San Francisco officials, including Public Defender Jeff Brown, who said Silver's ideas could provoke "a domestic arms race." In an article that she and San Francisco civil rights attorney Don Kates wrote for the Wall Street Journal, Silver also said that excess use of force by police is "regularly whitewashed," and use of force by citizens is often more effective than police action. She said later in an interview that every citizen who feels threatened by crime should have a gun in his or her home or office, and that many San Franciscans should have guns because police will not protect them. "I don't like it," said Police Chief Con Murphy. Keeping guns at home "creates more problems than it solves. It creates a false sense of security." Silver, who keeps a pistol at home and carried a gun until last year, wrote the article after hearing about the subway vigilante who shot four youths in New York.

bwiese
01-11-2010, 1:37 PM
We have good friends in unique places.

GoodEyeSniper
01-11-2010, 1:51 PM
"I don't like it," said Police Chief Con Murphy. Keeping guns at home "creates more problems than it solves. It creates a false sense of security."

Um.... And the police are what, if not a false sense of security???

anthonyca
01-11-2010, 2:21 PM
Another example of one of our friends that would be shut out by some gun lovers. We need more people like her on our side.

Glock22Fan
01-11-2010, 2:27 PM
Jan. 11: San Francisco Supervisor Carol Ruth Silver wrote an article in a national publication that said a subway rider attacked by armed criminals "has every right to shoot in self-defense." Her views were disputed quickly by San Francisco officials, including Public Defender Jeff Brown, who said Silver's ideas could provoke "a domestic arms race."
So, is Jeff Brown saying that "a subway rider attacked by armed criminals does not have any right to shoot in self-defense?"

Nose Nuggets
01-11-2010, 2:31 PM
WAOW!

"I don't like it," said Police Chief Con Murphy. Keeping guns at home "creates more problems than it solves. It creates a false sense of security."

Sorry Chief Murphy, i cant hear you over all the irony.

Roadrunner
01-11-2010, 3:13 PM
Well, this just turned my world upside down. But, then again, this is California.

Thanks

jdberger
01-11-2010, 3:24 PM
Oh...I don't know. She's probably a Democrat and just said those things because it was politically expedient....

:rolleyes:

nobody_special
01-11-2010, 3:35 PM
I suspect the political climate wasn't quite this bad 25 years ago either.

jdberger
01-11-2010, 3:44 PM
I suspect the political climate wasn't quite this bad 25 years ago either.

it was..... (http://www.crpa.org/showpages.asp?pid=1246)

(sorry I was looking for a link to the actual letter but I'm firewalled at work)

Gryff
01-11-2010, 4:23 PM
A friend of mine is SFPD SWAT. I keep asking him if they've moved over to airsoft for their primary weapons yet.

His normal response is, "Surprisingly not yet."

swhatb
01-11-2010, 4:40 PM
Why don't we have more like her? I wonder if she posts here? Someone should invite her..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carol_Ruth_Silver

Her 1977 election was part of a shift toward diversity on the San Francisco Board of Supervisors; she was described as "the board's first unwed mother."[6]

She served three terms, through 1989.

She is a member of Pink Pistols and a supporter of the 2nd Amendment.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/01/08/PK111B8PKB.DTL

1985

Jan. 11: San Francisco Supervisor Carol Ruth Silver wrote an article in a national publication that said a subway rider attacked by armed criminals "has every right to shoot in self-defense." Her views were disputed quickly by San Francisco officials, including Public Defender Jeff Brown, who said Silver's ideas could provoke "a domestic arms race." In an article that she and San Francisco civil rights attorney Don Kates wrote for the Wall Street Journal, Silver also said that excess use of force by police is "regularly whitewashed," and use of force by citizens is often more effective than police action. She said later in an interview that every citizen who feels threatened by crime should have a gun in his or her home or office, and that many San Franciscans should have guns because police will not protect them. "I don't like it," said Police Chief Con Murphy. Keeping guns at home "creates more problems than it solves. It creates a false sense of security." Silver, who keeps a pistol at home and carried a gun until last year, wrote the article after hearing about the subway vigilante who shot four youths in New York.

We should get her back in office!

Sgt Raven
01-11-2010, 5:18 PM
We should get her back in office!

That's the problem with term limits. :p

mofugly13
01-11-2010, 5:28 PM
Thanks to term limits, Chris Daly will be gone soon.

B Strong
01-11-2010, 6:34 PM
Beat ya to it Steyr:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=257870

bulgron
01-11-2010, 6:42 PM
Thanks to term limits, Chris Daly will be gone soon.

... to be replaced with someone just as bad ....

Nose Nuggets
01-11-2010, 8:23 PM
... to be replaced with someone just as bad ....

Good thing we have these elections, amirite?

otteray
01-11-2010, 9:20 PM
it was..... (http://www.crpa.org/showpages.asp?pid=1246)

(sorry I was looking for a link to the actual letter but I'm firewalled at work)

(I'll help ya with the link, 'cause it is great!)

A TALE OF GUN CONTROL IN TWO CITIES:
CRIME SOARS IN SAN FRANCISCO DESPITE GUN BANS; PLUMMETS IN KENNESAW GEORGIA, WHERE GUN POSSESSION IS MANDATORY


There’s a stark contrast between crime rates in San Francisco, California, which seeks to eliminate the civilian possession of firearms, and Kennesaw, Georgia, which requires every able bodied resident to possess a gun.

In 1982, when the City of San Francisco first tried to ban the civilian possession of firearms, the Mayor of Kennesaw wrote to then-Mayor of San Francisco, Dianne Feinstein. In his July 1, 1982 letter, Kennesaw Mayor Darvin Purdy wrote:

“our interests are common, as we are both attempting to curb crime, and as such, on behalf of the City of Kennesaw, Georgia, I hereby officially and formally request that you allow us to have your surrendered and confiscated weapons, so that we may issue them to our indigent citizens. Of course, we will make the necessary arrangements to pick them up and have them transported to us.”

Mayor Purdy’s tongue and cheek letter starkly illustrates the philosophical contrast between San Francisco and Kennesaw when it comes to the right to self defense. What is more illustrative, however, is the crime rates in those cities in the 24 years since 1982 as those different policies were enforced. Since 1982 in San Francisco, the local politicians have never met a gun control law they didn’t like. But despite the passage of dozens of local gun control ordinances and an even greater number of state laws which San Francisco asked for over the past 20 years, San Francisco’s murder and crime rates continue to soar out of control. In contrast, in Kennesaw, Georgia, where by law every resident must have a gun, crime is practically non- existent. According to Kennesaw Police Department Press Relations Officer Scott Luther, and the FBI’s Uniform Crime Report, Kennesaw is one of the top five cities in Georgia with the lowest crime rates.

A copy of the Kennesaw letter is posted at www.calgunlaws.com. An NRA lawsuit invalidated the 1982 San Francisco ordinance before the seizures could begin. San Francisco tried again just last year to ban civilian firearms. An ordinance was passed that banned the civilian possession of handguns and completely prohibited the sales or transfer of any ammunition or firearms in the city. Once again the NRA has sued the city to stop the ban from taking effect. A decision is due from the San Francisco Superior Court by June 19, 2006.

CRPA, founded in 1875, is dedicated to defending the rights of law-abiding citizens to responsibly use firearms for self-defense and the defense of their loved ones, for sport, and for all other legal activities. CRPA is the official state association of the National Rifle Association. A California non profit association, CRPA is independently directed by its own Board of Directors. CRPA's 65,000 members include law enforcement officers, prosecutors, professionals, firearm experts, the general public, and loving parents. CRPA has always worked to reduce the criminal misuse of firearms and firearms accidents, while actively promoting and organizing the competitive shooting sports and Olympic training programs in California. CRPA competitors are among the best in the world.

jdberger
01-11-2010, 9:30 PM
thanks. The link to the letter is here. (http://www.calgunlaws.com/Docs/CGL%20NEWS/0420105404Kennesaw.pdf) I've a copy hanging on the wall of my office.

M198
01-12-2010, 12:02 AM
thanks. The link to the letter is here. (http://www.calgunlaws.com/Docs/CGL%20NEWS/0420105404Kennesaw.pdf) I've a copy hanging on the wall of my office.

That's great, in spirit. Though, being such a fan of personal freedom, I don't like laws that make anything mandatory. I understand this law is mostly symbolic in nature and probably meant more as a ribbing to other cities than to actually curb their non-existent crime problems.

hoffmang
01-12-2010, 12:06 AM
I did not know about that letter. That rocks!

-Gene

Bhobbs
01-12-2010, 12:08 AM
I wonder if Feinstein ever wrote him back.

Mitch
01-12-2010, 7:35 AM
That's the problem with term limits. :p

One of many problems with term limits. What a dumb idea.

Hunt
01-12-2010, 7:39 AM
So, is Jeff Brown saying that "a subway rider attacked by armed criminals does not have any right to shoot in self-defense?"

the State knows best --Obey

Suvorov
01-12-2010, 12:30 PM
"I don't like it," said Police Chief Con Murphy. Keeping guns at home "creates more problems than it solves. It creates a false sense of security." Silver, who keeps a pistol at home and carried a gun until last year, wrote the article after hearing about the subway vigilante who shot four youths in New York.

No Chief, a "false sense of security" is believing that the cops who have a 5-6 minute response time are going to save you from a man armed with a knife standing 21 feet away who has a 4 second closure time. :rolleyes:

Steyrlp10
01-12-2010, 12:41 PM
Thanks for the interesting read!

jgaffney
01-12-2010, 1:06 PM
Try finding a gun store in SF now!

bigcalidave
01-12-2010, 1:46 PM
That Kennesaw letter was great,
This is what happened in kennesaw today :( I just noticed the coincidence.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,582874,00.html

too old for this
01-13-2010, 12:01 AM
Oh...I don't know. She's probably a Democrat and just said those things because it was politically expedient....

:rolleyes:

I'm moved here recently from New York City and find the gun laws here rather liberal compared to those in New York City which were put in place under Republican administrations. For gun lovers there are places a lot worse than California [Chicago also comes to mind.] Being pro-gun in a densely populated city is actually not politically expedient. Also, I a Democrat and proud to be one [although Republicans allowed me to make out like a bandit when I worked on Wall Street, so I love them too as well as you suckers who allowed Bush to transfer middle income wealth to us Wall Streeters]. But as a Democrat, I am very much against the anti-gun nuts in this country. Hell, got to protect all my wealth.:p

tboyer
01-13-2010, 12:21 AM
Silver helped the pinkpistols, fight against prop H, the San Francisco
handgun ban in 2005.

FastFinger
01-13-2010, 8:01 AM
Her views were disputed quickly by San Francisco officials, including Public Defender Jeff Brown, who said Silver's ideas could provoke "a domestic arms race."

Let's not forget that the arms race helped keep communism and totalitarianism at bay, prvented outright attacks on our country, and eventually lead to the fall of the USSR.

Furthermore reviewing crime reports indicates that we are in a domestic arms race already, and the bad guys - who don't abide by any rules - are winning.

Hunt
01-13-2010, 9:27 AM
I'm moved here recently from New York City and find the gun laws here rather liberal compared to those in New York City which were put in place under Republican administrations. For gun lovers there are places a lot worse than California [Chicago also comes to mind.] Being pro-gun in a densely populated city is actually not politically expedient. Also, I a Democrat and proud to be one [although Republicans allowed me to make out like a bandit when I worked on Wall Street, so I love them too as well as you suckers who allowed Bush to transfer middle income wealth to us Wall Streeters]. But as a Democrat, I am very much against the anti-gun nuts in this country. Hell, got to protect all my wealth.:p

at least you are honest in admiting you had full knowledge you were ripping off middle America, too bad our legal system doesn't provide justice for such crimes. Proud Democrat is just a feather in the cap.

Hunt
01-13-2010, 9:29 AM
Let's not forget that the arms race helped keep communism and totalitarianism at bay, prvented outright attacks on our country, and eventually lead to the fall of the USSR.

Furthermore reviewing crime reports indicates that we are in a domestic arms race already, and the bad guys - who don't abide by any rules - are winning.

place a private bounty on terrorists and narco traffickers and see how fast the problem goes away.

marshaul
01-14-2010, 8:48 AM
A friend of mine is SFPD SWAT. I keep asking him if they've moved over to airsoft for their primary weapons yet.

His normal response is, "Surprisingly not yet."
Anti-gunners are statists. Statists like armed police. Joke misses the mark.

I, on the other hand, would be happy to arm the SFPD with airsoft while encouraging the citizenry to arm themselves meaningfully.

;)

marshaul
01-14-2010, 8:51 AM
Try finding a gun store in SF now!
There is one.

gunn
01-14-2010, 12:55 PM
place a private bounty on terrorists and narco traffickers and see how fast the problem goes away.

This bounty has been around for YEARS and hasn't exactly worked out. It's up to $27M if you want to go poking around the mountains in Pakistan.
http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/topten/fugitives/laden.htm

$5.2M for this grandpa
http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/terrorists/teralumari.htm

here's a whole shopping list if you have lots of frequent flier miles and the bills are piling up...
http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/terrorists/fugitives.htm

Hunt
01-17-2010, 3:49 PM
This bounty has been around for YEARS and hasn't exactly worked out. It's up to $27M if you want to go poking around the mountains in Pakistan.
http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/topten/fugitives/laden.htm

$5.2M for this grandpa
http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/terrorists/teralumari.htm

here's a whole shopping list if you have lots of frequent flier miles and the bills are piling up...
http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/terrorists/fugitives.htm

interesting, one would expect better results.

nitrofc
01-17-2010, 4:20 PM
I'm moved here recently from New York City and find the gun laws here rather liberal compared to those in New York City which were put in place under Republican administrations. For gun lovers there are places a lot worse than California [Chicago also comes to mind.] Being pro-gun in a densely populated city is actually not politically expedient. Also, I a Democrat and proud to be one [although Republicans allowed me to make out like a bandit when I worked on Wall Street, so I love them too as well as you suckers who allowed Bush to transfer middle income wealth to us Wall Streeters]. But as a Democrat, I am very much against the anti-gun nuts in this country. Hell, got to protect all my wealth.:p

"although Republicans allowed me to make out like a bandit when I worked on Wall Street, so I love them too as well as you suckers who allowed Bush to transfer middle income wealth to us Wall Streeters".

So as a "Proud Democrat" did you short the U.S. Stock Market after Bush became President and the events of 911 unfolded....or did go you long knowing your elected officials like Barney Frank and Dodd would push the leverage of Fannie and Freddie to 100:1, later helping to create the largest failure in the Banking system since the Great Depression? :popcorn:

Let me guess.......then you went "all in" and Long last March, 2009 and now credit the current Administration for their awesome success with the TARP program by quietly purchasing shares of Firms like Goldman, BAC, Wells, and.....last but not least........JPMorgan behind the U.S. tax payers back?

Do tell!

1911_sfca
01-17-2010, 7:57 PM
Carol is a great lady. I stood shoulder to shoulder with her (actually in her garage!), Tom, and others assembling "No on Prop H" signs when we were fighting the SF Gun Ban. Unfortunately our campaign wasn't successful but I believe we vastly lowered the margin of victory for Prop H, and luckily it was overturned. Anyhow, Carol was and is a staunch supporter of the right to self defense.

1911_sfca
01-17-2010, 8:00 PM
Try finding a gun store in SF now!

Only one left -- High Bridge Arms.