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M14ROOKIE
01-07-2010, 12:40 PM
So..... wow

New York, NY, January 6, 2010 � In a brief detailing the "serious threat" of armed violence by extremists and extremist groups, the Anti-Defamation League (ADL) today urged the U.S. Supreme Court to ensure that states retain the right to reasonably regulate the possession of firearms by those who practice and preach racial and ethnic violence.


"We have placed the problem of armed extremism squarely before the high court," said Abraham H. Foxman, ADL National Director. "Racist and anti-government extremists often have an obsessive fascination with firearms and have shown a willingness to engage in acts of shocking and often deadly violence. We urge the Supreme Court to ensure that cities and states retain the latitude they need to keep guns out of the hands of extremists, terrorists, and violent bigots."

http://www.adl.org/PresRele/SupremeCourt_33/5684_33.htm

halifax
01-07-2010, 12:49 PM
Why should that be reserved for the states?

xxdabroxx
01-07-2010, 12:50 PM
cannot wait till mid year.

yellowfin
01-07-2010, 12:51 PM
If these people are in NY, they will hear from us about this. :mad:

bballwizard05
01-07-2010, 12:52 PM
And how do they propose to regulate firearms to those different groups without creating laws that will be overly racist and full of profiling?? If some dude is white with a bald head does he get denied? If someone with a turbin wants to buy a gun do they get denied?? And "violent bigots" no one walks in and says "damn I feel violent today, what you got in .357?"

yellowfin
01-07-2010, 12:56 PM
According to the mindset of anti gun toads in NYC, anyone who buys a gun is a dangerous person and morally equivalent to terrorists, prohibited persons, etc. That is the perspective they're writing from.

mblat
01-07-2010, 12:56 PM
And they still say that Jews are smart? Let me see..... there are bunch of extremists who want to exterminate Jews.... So, let's make sure those Jews won't have weapons to protect themselves..... because of cause those extremists will comply with the law and disarm.....

Classic.... :rolleyes:

Window_Seat
01-07-2010, 12:59 PM
The ADL's definition, if they might be real honest, of what an "extremist" is could be a person who attends Tea Party events, which is the same view of JN. Their view is about as credible as the view of a convicted felon who becomes a spokesperson for the Brady Campaign.

Erik.

bulgron
01-07-2010, 1:37 PM
I'm pretty sure that the states will retain the right to disarm people who have proven themselves to be violent people. In California, even touching someone in an unwanted way can get you slapped with charges that turns you into a prohibited person. Extremists and other such people are typically going to do way worse things than that before they ramp all the way up to gun violence. In other words, they're going to be prohibited long before they become truly murderous. And this will be true even with an incorporated 2A.

So, fortunately, the ADL actually has nothing to worry about.

The 2A is about protecting the rights of law-abiding Americans. Why can't organizations like the ADL grok that, anyway?

Bugei
01-07-2010, 1:44 PM
[QUOTE=bulgron;3604445]Extremists and other such people are typically going to do way worse things than that before they ramp all the way up to gun violence. In other words, they're going to be prohibited long before they become truly murderous. And this will be true even with an incorporated 2A.

[QUOTE]

Except that people like Secretary Napolitano will be defining who fits the term "extremist". And people like you and I fit her idea of "extremist".

-hanko
01-07-2010, 2:41 PM
Mr. Foxman needs to go here...http://www.jpfo.org/...and learn a little. Not to mention the history of the Chosen People over the last umpteen centuries;).

-hanko

bulgron
01-07-2010, 2:45 PM
Extremists and other such people are typically going to do way worse things than that before they ramp all the way up to gun violence. In other words, they're going to be prohibited long before they become truly murderous. And this will be true even with an incorporated 2A.



Except that people like Secretary Napolitano will be defining who fits the term "extremist". And people like you and I fit her idea of "extremist".

I understand the concern. What I can't believe is that the federal courts would allow Napolitano to define someone to be an extremist just because they engaged in political speech. If our country has gone that far down the road to statism, we have a lot more to worry about than just our gun rights.

yellowfin
01-07-2010, 3:07 PM
Why can't organizations like the ADL grok that, anyway?They're paid not to.

bigcalidave
01-07-2010, 3:14 PM
It's astonishing that the ADL doesn't see the hypocrisy and bigotry in their statement. We might as well start arresting people who look like terrorists (facial hair?) on sight. Search anyone fitting a vague description immediately to check for weapons and bombs!

It seems like we don't have much longer to live in a free society.

yellowfin
01-07-2010, 3:18 PM
It's astonishing that the ADL doesn't see the hypocrisy and bigotry in their statement.They're anti gun. They don't care how hypocritical or bigoted they are regards to that issue, anything is permissible so long as they're being anti gun with it. This is true of virtually all of anti gun groups or groups who support the anti gun agenda as part of their platform.

CCWFacts
01-07-2010, 6:00 PM
It's amazing why the ADL is so much in love with terrorists and various other antisemites who would be glad to kill every Jew on the planet.

Israel would cease to exist within three days if they renounced their right to armed self-defense. In fact they only exist because they have the best military in the region, together with a devastating arsenal.

If it's ok for Israelis in Israel to defend themselves using EFFECTIVE WEAPONS then it should be ok for Israelis in the US to also defend themselves with EFFECTIVE WEAPONS. There's no way you can argue for one and against the other. Israel is armed because that's the only way you can communicate with terrorists.

The bulk of terrorist attackers plan to die in their assaults. Someone who is planning to commit mass-murder and die in the act is not concerned about violating gun laws. India has strong bans on machine guns and grenades, and yet, shockingly, the Mumbai terrorists did not obey India's gun laws.

I will never support the ADL or their friends like the Jewish Federation and so on. If they want to support terrorists who want to kill them, fine, but I will have none of it for myself.

I fear that it's just a matter of time before there is a Mumbai-style attack here in LA. All the shuls / temples around here are woefully undefended. A few of the biggest have some rentacops who are going to run as fast as they can at the first sign of trouble. Most of them have either unarmed rentacops, who provide no more security than anyone else who is present, or they have no security. And this is all due to some suicidal impulse that the Jewish community can't shake.

At least the Orthodox Jews have none of these mental problems.

Hoop
01-08-2010, 8:29 AM
Being racist and/or antisemitic is NOT grounds for the usurpation of inalienable rights.


Yeah, I don't see this going anywhere in that context. In the context of keeping guns out of the hands of felons, prohibited persons what have you that isn't going away anytime soon.

I would like to know what "Hate" groups the ADL is all worried about.

"Extremist" is probably a codeword for "unhappy non-Democrat".

yellowfin
01-08-2010, 11:10 AM
I would like to know what "Hate" groups the ADL is all worried about.

"Extremist" is probably a codeword for "unhappy non-Democrat".Ding ding ding! Give the man a cigar! :cool:

It's basically the simple reinvention of the justification of gun laws that's always been used, to disarm someone undesirable. In the 1870's, it was disarming the blacks. Nobody had a problem with it, no matter who else would be screwed later as it wasn't them at the time. In 1934, it was disarming mobsters. Nobody had a problem with it, no matter who else would be screwed later as it wasn't them at the time. Now, in urban areas it's disarming conservatives. They figure 50.1% of people don't have a problem with that, as conservatives are the new group that it's somehow OK to hate.

truthseeker
01-08-2010, 11:25 AM
Seems to me that the ADL has a hidden agenda.

They want the states to still be able to keep the same gun laws we have now, but they will label them as "fighting extremism"!

mblat
01-08-2010, 11:41 AM
Seems to me that the ADL has a hidden agenda.

They want the states to still be able to keep the same gun laws we have now, but they will label them as "fighting extremism"!

No so hidden, thought.

Besides: Why do we care what ADL says, anyway? We are not all Jewish here, you know. :D

yellowfin
01-08-2010, 5:08 PM
I wish I didn't have to care what they say, but they influence a powerful voter block up here. Someone needs to call them out on this with sufficient force to sting them a bit. They're playing the minority card while endorsing Cruikshank- this needs to be painted on them with as bright and broad a mark as possible.

grunz
01-08-2010, 5:13 PM
"ADL urges SC - give states the power to keep guns out of hands of extremists"

Sounds perfectly reasonable and common sense to me... I bet a free black man, with a ballot in one hand and a gun in the other hand was a pretty extreme thing to lots folks in the south circa 1870....

Oh the irony!

Josh3239
01-08-2010, 5:21 PM
And the ADL represents all Jews? I guess Feinstein and Boxer didn't prostitute themselves out, nope, they represent all Jews. If you want conservative/pro-gun Jews perhaps you should look for the JPFO, JDL, and JTF. For a socialist country Israel allows their citizens to defend themselves to a certain degree. And the reason so many Jews are leftist is because of the right, if you look at history the right gave Jews plenty of reasons to be leftist. As for most of them being against guns, is it hard to understand that after losing millions of people to weapons that we would be a little emotional about it and try to keep violence down. No the logic isn't correct, but it isn't an unusual emotional response.

(btw, what is wrong with the ADL wanting gun rights decisions to be made by the state as opposed to the feds?)

IMO Feinstein, Boxer, the ADL are all traitors. So am I smart or does my religion stop me from being that?

And they still say that Jews are smart? Let me see..... there are bunch of extremists who want to exterminate Jews.... So, let's make sure those Jews won't have weapons to protect themselves..... because of cause those extremists will comply with the law and disarm.....

Classic.... :rolleyes:

cbn620
01-08-2010, 9:31 PM
My idea of a great "anti-defamation league" is a group of civilians with AR-15's running neo-nazis out of town. My idea of anti-defamation is allowing citizens to arm themselves against government, which historically has not been shy about defaming, or even worse enacting genocide against, ethnic minorities.

This is so backwards... It'd be like the NAACP saying they're cool with legalizing lynching.

cbn620
01-08-2010, 9:37 PM
(btw, what is wrong with the ADL wanting gun rights decisions to be made by the state as opposed to the feds?)


If that was all they wanted, it might not be so bad at face value. But unfortunately allowing the states (and their cities) to make these decisions as to who gets rights has led to Chicago, NYC and DC practically banning guns.

Unfortunately though, it gets worse, because that's not really what the ADL is saying they want. They're not arguing for states rights, they're making this argument:

Racist and anti-government extremists often have an obsessive fascination with firearms and have shown a willingness to engage in acts of shocking and often deadly violence. We urge the Supreme Court to ensure that cities and states retain the latitude they need to keep guns out of the hands of extremists, terrorists, and violent bigots.

Only problem is the government cannot, will not, and has not ever, ever been able to keep guns out of only the bad guys' hands. In fact their track record shows that when they get this goofy idea in their heads that they can do such a thing, all that ends up happening is the bad guys are the only ones who get guns. It ends up easier for the bad guys to get guns, and when no civilians have guns the government morphs into a new kind of bad guy that can do whatever it wants with no fear of reprisal.

mblat
01-08-2010, 9:50 PM
I wish I didn't have to care what they say, but they influence a powerful voter block up here. Someone needs to call them out on this with sufficient force to sting them a bit. They're playing the minority card while endorsing Cruikshank- this needs to be painted on them with as bright and broad a mark as possible.

I have to break it to you :D, but trying to get Jews votes on gun issue probably even more futile than trying to get CA vote in general.
Outside of immigrants from former Soviet block and their direct descendants there nothing, absolutely nothing can convince an average American Jew virtue of gun ownership. There is Aron Zelman, for sure........ but what membership JPFO has? Like five thousands? I wonder how many of them actually Jews.

I have no idea why it is this way. American Jews I've met are generally smart and well educated...... but when it comes to politics in general and gun issues in particular it is like a spell was cast on them.

sreiter
01-08-2010, 10:00 PM
It's amazing why the ADL is so much in love with terrorists and various other antisemites who would be glad to kill every Jew on the planet.

Israel would cease to exist within three days if they renounced their right to armed self-defense. In fact they only exist because they have the best military in the region, together with a devastating arsenal.

If it's ok for Israelis in Israel to defend themselves using EFFECTIVE WEAPONS then it should be ok for Israelis in the US to also defend themselves with EFFECTIVE WEAPONS. There's no way you can argue for one and against the other. Israel is armed because that's the only way you can communicate with terrorists.

The bulk of terrorist attackers plan to die in their assaults. Someone who is planning to commit mass-murder and die in the act is not concerned about violating gun laws. India has strong bans on machine guns and grenades, and yet, shockingly, the Mumbai terrorists did not obey India's gun laws.

I will never support the ADL or their friends like the Jewish Federation and so on. If they want to support terrorists who want to kill them, fine, but I will have none of it for myself.

I fear that it's just a matter of time before there is a Mumbai-style attack here in LA. All the shuls / temples around here are woefully undefended. A few of the biggest have some rentacops who are going to run as fast as they can at the first sign of trouble. Most of them have either unarmed rentacops, who provide no more security than anyone else who is present, or they have no security. And this is all due to some suicidal impulse that the Jewish community can't shake.

At least the Orthodox Jews have none of these mental problems.

granada hills, 1999 - day care center

sreiter
01-08-2010, 10:05 PM
I have to break it to you :D, but trying to get Jews votes on gun issue probably even more futile than trying to get CA vote in general.
Outside of immigrants from former Soviet block and their direct descendants there nothing, absolutely nothing can convince an average American Jew virtue of gun ownership. There is Aron Zelman, for sure........ but what membership JPFO has? Like five thousands? I wonder how many of them actually Jews.

I have no idea why it is this way. American Jews I've met are generally smart and well educated...... but when it comes to politics in general and gun issues in particular it is like a spell was cast on them.

well, no one EVER accused me of being a typical jew, or for that matter most people dont know think i am either......

FYI - you obviously dont remember the JDL chairmen planing on killing a congressmen and blowing up a mosque http://www.rense.com/general17/jewsplantokillUS.htm

1 degree of separation, by pure happenstance, the only time i ever ate in cantors that guy came up to me and tried to recruit me to join the org (NOT help in any thing illegal) - i declined on GP - i think i still have his card somewhere

mblat
01-08-2010, 10:15 PM
well, no one EVER accused me of being a typical jew, or for that matter most people dont know think i am either......

FYI - you obviously dont remember the JDL chairmen planing on killing a congressmen and blowing up a mosque http://www.rense.com/general17/jewsplantokillUS.htm

1 degree of separation, by pure happenstance, the only time i ever ate in cantors that guy came up to me and tried to recruit me to join the org (NOT help in any thing illegal) - i declined on GP - i think i still have his card somewhere

<shrugs> Please..... I am fully aware that it is impossible to make an observation that applies to all members of large group of people. And there are what? six+ million Jews in US?
As far as I know this site has substantial Jewish membership, for example. However, statistically speaking American Jews:
1. Vote democrat
2. Anti-gun.

Neither positions make sense politically, financially or security wise.

sreiter
01-08-2010, 10:26 PM
<shrugs> Please..... I am fully aware that it is impossible to make an observation that applies to all members of large group of people. And there are what? six+ million Jews in US?
As far as I know this site has substantial Jewish membership, for example. However, statistically speaking American Jews:
1. Vote democrat
2. Anti-gun.

Neither positions make sense politically, financially or security wise.

<shrugs> missed my point completely -

i agree with #1 (for the life of me i cant figure out why, since they a usually business owners you'd think they want a gov that helps their causes)

dont know about #2 .. i guess i dont spend enough time around too many in general. Anyone i hang with has the same interests as me, so any jew i know, including my family (brother was a golden gloves boxer, and a LEO for 25 years) are into the same things i am - MMA, guns, bikes, girls

"Neither positions make sense politically, financially or security wise"

beats the $h!t outta me too

Mulay El Raisuli
01-09-2010, 7:43 AM
Quoting Ajax22:

"NO GUN FOR YOU!!!!"


Funny...as....hell!!!!!

Tell me, did you put up a Festivus Pole this season?


The Raisuli

dawgcasa
01-09-2010, 7:58 AM
And they still say that Jews are smart? Let me see..... there are bunch of extremists who want to exterminate Jews.... So, let's make sure those Jews won't have weapons to protect themselves..... because of cause those extremists will comply with the law and disarm.....

Classic.... :rolleyes:

Yet in Israel everyone has mandatory service in the military and many are armed in public. Remember the stories of terrorists coming into cafes in Israel with guns and facing a bunch of guns firing back at them? That's why they mostly do suicide bombs now. The blast takes out everyone in the zone in an instant guns or no guns. They found walking in with guns blazing was less effective since the terrorists typically got shot by someone armed among the victims before they could kill too many people. The ADL needs to talk to their brethren in Israel about how a armed society deals with terrorists and an unarmed society is victimized by terrorists. Ironic.

Cnynrat
01-09-2010, 8:15 AM
Wonder what Alan Gura thinks of this pronouncement. Having been born in Israel he probably has a different view than the typical American Jew.