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View Full Version : Does a Tacstar 870 side saddle violate 537e(a)?


SteveH
01-03-2010, 10:08 AM
Since it covers all of the serial number and most of the model/brand number?

sac550
01-03-2010, 11:30 AM
No. 537e is a specific intent crime. Unless you are putting it on with the intent to hide the make/model you are fine.

Matt C
01-03-2010, 11:46 AM
No. 537e is a specific intent crime. Unless you are putting it on with the intent to hide the make/model you are fine.

Actually the way the law is written you would only have to have to knowingly possess an item with the serial number covered. Make/model don't seem to be an issue. However I don't know of any case where a person has been charged for covering the SN of an item they legally own, the law is obviously intended to prevent people from trading in stolen goods and I doubt it is enforceable otherwise.

For reference: 537e. (a) Any person who knowingly buys, sells, receives, disposes of, conceals, or has in his or her possession any personal property from which the manufacturer's serial number, identification number, electronic serial number, or any other distinguishing number or identification mark has been removed, defaced, covered, altered, or destroyed, is guilty of a public offense

ETA: There may have been a case where the SN was removed (completely, apparently) from the firearm (for whatever reason, probably to facilitate a crime but it isn't clear) and the person was charged under 537e. This was in conjunction with a bunch of other charges for unrelated offenses and was not really contested as far as I can tell. Maybe somebody with better access to a law library can look.

artherd
01-03-2010, 1:25 PM
Absence of Evidence is not Evidence of Absence.

Kharn
01-03-2010, 1:53 PM
Mesa Tactical's side saddle's milled out so you can see the serial number. Plus its an aluminum unit, much sturdier than the plastic ones.

bigcalidave
01-03-2010, 5:41 PM
You should be allowed to do whatever you want to your own personal property, including covering and removing a manufacturers serial number. Mounting anything on the rail of most plastic frame pistols will cover the serial number, there are accessories for many guns that will cover the serial number... TO THE SUPREME COURT WITH THIS!!!

crackerman
01-03-2010, 9:00 PM
Mesa Tactical's side saddle's milled out so you can see the serial number. Plus its an aluminum unit, much sturdier than the plastic ones.

My understanding for that after talking to them at SHOT SHOW was so the could go after the LE market for inventory purposes.

Most of us would have no problem id'ing our own shotguns vs potentially hundreds for a big department.

Swatter911
01-04-2010, 8:20 AM
My tac-light covers the serial number on my G21. IMHO applying 537e in these situations is a stretch. How hard is it to remove the side saddle if you wanted to see the serial number on your 870?

SteveH
01-04-2010, 1:12 PM
My tac-light covers the serial number on my G21. IMHO applying 537e in these situations is a stretch. How hard is it to remove the side saddle if you wanted to see the serial number on your 870?

Requires tools.

Kharn
01-04-2010, 2:02 PM
My understanding for that after talking to them at SHOT SHOW was so the could go after the LE market for inventory purposes.

Most of us would have no problem id'ing our own shotguns vs potentially hundreds for a big department.And the NFA market.

Wildhawk66
01-04-2010, 2:03 PM
An interesting side note to this is the fact that many, many 870's currently in use as police department duty weapons have a side saddle installed that covers the serial number. I would guess that most are department issue, but I'm sure that a number are supplied by the officer.

Is there a police exemption listed somewhere for this section? If not, this might be an angle to consider if defending against prosecution of this section.

SteveH
01-04-2010, 2:24 PM
An interesting side note to this is the fact that many, many 870's currently in use as police department duty weapons have a side saddle installed that covers the serial number. I would guess that most are department issue, but I'm sure that a number are supplied by the officer.

Is there a police exemption listed somewhere for this section? If not, this might be an angle to consider if defending against prosecution of this section.

IME when the police install a TACSTAR side saddle they either engrave the serial number on the side saddle or on the receiver just infront of the loading port. I picked up two police trade in 870's that were set up that way.

Turo
01-04-2010, 2:30 PM
I seem to remember one of the UOC guys that used some aluminum tape to cover his gun's serial number in case some LEO got nosey and wanted to unlawfully run the serial number. I don't think anything ever came of it, or if it was ever an issue.