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ChrisO
12-21-2009, 10:39 AM
Carrying concealed is just a misdemeanor correct? A non prohibitive one at that right? Just wondering as it seems like a lot of members here have implied about carrying concealed without a permit. Not that I want to or am going to just wondering if anyone here is nuts enough to do it.

paul0660
12-21-2009, 10:46 AM
It's all here:

http://law.onecle.com/california/penal/12025.html

You are generally correct, but it isn't a slap on the wrist misdemeanor.

ChrisO
12-21-2009, 10:52 AM
It seems as a lot of members here have mentioned it in a sarcastic way...

Quiet
12-21-2009, 12:22 PM
Carrying an unloaded registered handgun concealed without a permit is a misdemeanor.
Carrying a loaded registered handgun concealed without a permit is two misdemeanors.
Carrying an unloaded unregistered handgun concealed without a permit is a felony.
Carrying a loaded unregistered handgun concealed without a permit is one felony and one misdemeanor.

bigcalidave
12-21-2009, 12:28 PM
And it's doubtful that people are being sarcastic. or "nuts". Some people live in counties here where it's not possible to be legally licensed to carry, but possess the desire to protect themselves or their families. "Better to be judged by twelve than carried by six"

bushmaster_bob
12-21-2009, 12:31 PM
....."Better to be judged by twelve than carried by six"

hah. Good one...I like that. :cheers2:

Liberty1
12-21-2009, 12:31 PM
Search for LUCC. A better option for now.

sfpcservice
12-21-2009, 12:38 PM
Carrying an unloaded registered handgun concealed without a permit is a misdemeanor.
Carrying a loaded registered handgun concealed without a permit is two misdemeanors.
Carrying an unloaded unregistered handgun concealed without a permit is a felony.
Carrying a loaded unregistered handgun concealed without a permit is one felony and one misdemeanor.

I think you can add another Misdemeanor/felony to that if you wander into a school zone.

Peter W Bush
12-21-2009, 12:55 PM
Carrying an unloaded registered handgun concealed without a permit is a misdemeanor.
Carrying a loaded registered handgun concealed without a permit is two misdemeanors.
Carrying an unloaded unregistered handgun concealed without a permit is a felony.
Carrying a loaded unregistered handgun concealed without a permit is one felony and one misdemeanor.

That one depends on your lawyer. It could also be one misdemeanor.

Does anyone know if someone convicted of these is a prohibited person?

Quiet
12-21-2009, 1:11 PM
Two of my friends have been charged with carrying a concealed handgun without a permit.

In the late-1990s, friend #1 was arrested by the Los Angeles Sheriff Department.
He was in a vehicle at the time of contact. Handgun was loaded and holstered IWB.
He was arrested and was released after 8 hours in jail.
He was charged with four misdemeanors.
#1 carrying concealed handgun without a permit [PC 12025(a)(2)]
#2 loaded firearm in public [PC 12031(a)(1)]
#3 concealed handgun without a permit in a vehicle [PC 12025(a)(3)]
#4 loaded firearm in a vehicle in public [PC 12031(a)(1)]
He had no money for an attorney and got a public defender.
A deal was made and he plead "no contest".
He was convicted of charges #1 and #2. Charges #3 and #4 were dropped.
He paid $1200 in fines and recieved 5 years probation (conditions of probation was can not possess firearms or ammunition)
His handgun (Russian Makarov) was confiscated and destroyed.

In early-2000s, friend #2 was arrested by the Riverside Sheriff Department.
He was in a vehicle at the time of contact. He was in the process of moving from one residence to another at the time of contact. Handgun was loaded placed in a box located on the back seat of the vehicle.
He was arrested and had released after 3 days in jail.
He was charged with a felony and a misdemeanor.
#1 unregistered handgun concealed without a permit in a vehicle [PC 12025(a)(3)]
#2 loaded firearm in public [PC 12031(a)(1)]
His dad got an attorney and spent around $15,000 in legal fees.
A deal was made and he plead "no contest".
He was convicted of charge #2. Charge #1 was dropped.
He recieved 5 years of probation (conditions of probation was can not possess firearms or ammunition)
The handgun (Colt M-1911A1) was returned to his dad (registered owner).

The Director
12-21-2009, 1:13 PM
Two of my friends have been charged with carrying a concealed handgun without a permit.

In the late-1990s, friend #1 was arrested by the Los Angeles Sheriff Department.
He was in a vehicle at the time of contact. Handgun was loaded and holstered IWB.
He was arrested and was released after 8 hours in jail.
He was charged with four misdemeanors.
#1 carrying concealed handgun without a permit [PC 12025(a)(2)]
#2 loaded firearm in public [PC 12031(a)(1)]
#3 concealed handgun without a permit in a vehicle [PC 12025(a)(3)]
#4 loaded firearm in a vehicle in public [PC 12031(a)(1)]
He had no money for an attorney and got a public defender.
A deal was made and he plead "no contest".
He was convicted of charges #1 and #2. Charges #3 and #4 were dropped.
He paid $1200 in fines and recieved 5 years probation (conditions of probation was can not possess firearms or ammunition)
His handgun (Russian Makarov) was confiscated and destroyed.

In early-2000s, friend #2 was arrested by the Riverside Sheriff Department.
He was in a vehicle at the time of contact. He was in the process of moving from one residence to another at the time of contact. Handgun was loaded placed in a box located on the back seat of the vehicle.
He was arrested and had released after 3 days in jail.
He was charged with a felony and a misdemeanor.
#1 unregistered handgun concealed without a permit in a vehicle [PC 12025(a)(3)]
#2 loaded firearm in public [PC 12031(a)(1)]
His dad got an attorney and spent around $15,000 in legal fees.
A deal was made and he plead "no contest".
He was convicted of charge #2. Charge #1 was dropped.
He recieved 5 years of probation (conditions of probation was can not possess firearms or ammunition)
The handgun (Colt M-1911A1) was returned to his dad (registered owner).

Awesome write up dude.

bigcalidave
12-21-2009, 1:14 PM
Why were both your friends searched?

Quiet
12-21-2009, 1:19 PM
Why were both your friends searched?

Suspicion of DUI.



Friend #1 had been illegally carrying concealed on purpose. Thought he would never get caught. He had been carrying for around 2 years before getting arrested.

Friend #2 had no intention of illegally carrying concealed. He was packing belongings into boxes, because he was moving to another apartment. He did not properly transport the handgun, because he was in a hurry and didn't think it would be an issue.

bigcalidave
12-21-2009, 1:26 PM
So your friends cases are barely relevant to the question? If you posted that to discourage people from carrying concealed without a license it should at least be mentioned that they weren't doing the best job of staying out of trouble. Even your story is shady, I can understand the pat down when drunk friend number 1 volunteers to get out of his car for a field sobriety test, but drunk friend number 2? Why did they search the box in his back seat? More to the story still. Not being drunk and driving would have helped them, not looking and acting like a criminal will almost certainly keep you from being searched.

Quiet
12-21-2009, 1:36 PM
So your friends cases are barely relevant to the question? If you posted that to discourage people from carrying concealed without a license it should at least be mentioned that they weren't doing the best job of staying out of trouble. Even your story is shady, I can understand the pat down when drunk friend number 1 volunteers to get out of his car for a field sobriety test, but drunk friend number 2? Why did they search the box in his back seat? More to the story still. Not being drunk and driving would have helped them, not looking and acting like a criminal will almost certainly keep you from being searched.

Neither friend had been drinking.
LEOs cited "erratic driving" for pulling the vehicles over. Both stops occurred at night.

Friend #1 was not driving and was a 1 of 4 people in the vehicle. All four people were removed from the vehicle and searched (told it was "standard operating procedure"). A lawyer could have challenged his case about being an illegal search. But, he had no money for a lawyer. I feel why the stop occurred was a case of having the wrong colored skin and being in an upper social class neighborhood.

Friend #2 was driving. LEOs searched his vehicle after passing sobriety test. He consented to search because he thought there was nothing illegal in vehicle.

ChrisO
12-21-2009, 1:37 PM
I know about LUCC I was just wondering about people doing this. I didn't mean to say people are crazy for doing it. I just thought you would get a more serious charge for it if caught. Seems like a lot of people admitted to doing it on the forum, That does not seem wise to me. The LUCC to me is pretty pointless I usually have a pistol in my camelbac locked up when I go places in my truck but besides that it's not very practical for a SD situation unless you have time wich most the time you don't.

bigcalidave
12-21-2009, 1:40 PM
Neither friend had been drinking.
LEOs cited erratic driving for pulling them over.
Friend #1 was not driving and was a 1 of 4 people in the vehicle.

I'm not trying to judge your friends or anything, but friend #1 shouldn't have allowed them to search him when they were pulled over just for the erratic driving and he wasn't driving. And I'd like to hear how #2 got his car searched, lemme guess, " mind if I search your car? "

Meplat
12-21-2009, 1:59 PM
It all depends on where you live. In the urban south and the bay area they will push it to the limit. In the rest of CA they will cut a little or even a lot of slack.

I have been "caught" three times before I finally got my CCW. Never a problem, allowed to go on my way With my gun. No record, no hair, no tattoos, no attitude, no problem. Don't try this at home, if home is SF!

ChuckBooty
02-14-2010, 12:26 PM
It all depends on where you live. In the urban south and the bay area they will push it to the limit. In the rest of CA they will cut a little or even a lot of slack.

I have been "caught" three times before I finally got my CCW. Never a problem, allowed to go on my way With my gun. No record, no hair, no tattoos, no attitude, no problem. Don't try this at home, if home is SF!

Sorry to bump an old thread like this but....if you don't mind telling us, why and how were you "caught"?

IrishPirate
02-14-2010, 12:31 PM
Search for LUCC. A better option for now.

that really only helps in instances like bank robberies or similar situations where you have a few moments to get to your locked container, open it, load your gun, and be ready to shoot. It's completely useless for muggings and split second self defense.

of course, it doesn't draw the attention of LEO's and pissy business owners like UOC does, but i guess it's a decision each person has to make for themselves.

bodger
02-14-2010, 12:47 PM
And it's doubtful that people are being sarcastic. or "nuts". Some people live in counties here where it's not possible to be legally licensed to carry, but possess the desire to protect themselves or their families. "Better to be judged by twelve than carried by six"


Definitely.
I have been "caught" carrying loaded and concealed and let go. Not in CA, and it was 20 years ago.

anthonyca
02-14-2010, 1:09 PM
I'm not trying to judge your friends or anything, but friend #1 shouldn't have allowed them to search him when they were pulled over just for the erratic driving and he wasn't driving. And I'd like to hear how #2 got his car searched, lemme guess, " mind if I search your car? "

I don't know about these two cases but, I do know that not giving consent to search will not always make LEOs not search. The proliferation of voice recorders and video cams have helped us in this area.

ErikTheRed
02-14-2010, 3:42 PM
I am fortunate enough to live in a county (Yuba) that is CCW-friendly (shall-issue). However, if I didn't, I will admit right here and now for everyone to read---- I WOULD CARRY CONCEALED WITHOUT A PERMIT IF I FELT IT WAS NECESSARY TO PROTECT MYSELF OR MY FAMILY. And in some instances in the past, I have. I will not let the extreme radical anti-gun lawmakers decide whether or not I can defend myself. I don't think this is "nuts", I believe its pretty damn smart. Let them press all the charges they want, but if I was able to defend myself on the street, at least I'd be alive to defend myself in court. I'm ok with that.

bigcalidave
02-14-2010, 3:46 PM
I don't know about these two cases but, I do know that not giving consent to search will not always make LEOs not search. The proliferation of voice recorders and video cams have helped us in this area.

That's true, but a good lawyer can fix the resulting charges. Hanging out with people that get in a lot of trouble, or are constantly harassed by cops, you shouldn't carry without a license. Obviously. A normal citizen will likely NEVER be asked to be searched.

Who bumped this necro

butch952
02-14-2010, 4:56 PM
I believe that the two together loaded and concealed misdemameanors are enhanced into a felony

Beelzy
02-14-2010, 5:22 PM
I believe that the two together loaded and concealed misdemameanors are enhanced into a felony

No, that isn't correct.

To the OP: You are correct....if done properly. ;)

Theseus
02-14-2010, 5:38 PM
I think you can add another Misdemeanor/felony to that if you wander into a school zone.

626.9 Is, under normal circumstances, a felony wobbler. However, it can become an automatic felony if:

1. The person has been previously been convicted of a felony or any crime made punishable by Chapter 1 (commencing with section 12000) of Title 2 of Part 4.

2. Is a prohibited person.

3. If you are also charged with a violation of 12025 that is being charged as a felony.

Mstrty
02-14-2010, 7:37 PM
that really only helps in instances like bank robberies or similar situations where you have a few moments to get to your locked container, open it, load your gun, and be ready to shoot. It's completely useless for muggings and split second self defense.
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/attachment.php?attachmentid=30278&d=1249874900
I have no legal experience you need to seek legal counsel before before implementing any of this: Read if you choose. It is not legal advice.

Option 1: Carrying loaded gun in position "5" = .3-.5 second to shot fired (best way of defence on a daily basis but very unpractical it will also get shot by a East Palo Alto Cop.) Illegal unless in course of defending your life or that of someone else.:D

Option 2: Carrying loaded gun in OWB holster = 1 second average to first shot fired. ( an easy way to carry but will draw unnecessary attention to you). Illegal in California unless you are in a Federal/State/Local government club.:D

Option 3: Carry gun unloaded and locked in a backpack or purse type device. (Very slow 5-30 seconds. Better than going home to get your gun when an insane person is shooting their way to you but not there yet.

Illegal unless you are going to and from necessary location.

12026.2(b) In order for a firearm to be exempted under subdivision
(a), while being transported to or from a place, the firearm shall
be unloaded, kept in a locked container, as defined in subdivision
(d), and the course of travel shall include only those deviations
between authorized locations as are reasonably necessary under the
circumstances. I might try and find a lawyer that might argue with the economy the way it is "self defence at high crime areas are reasonably necessary under the circumstances". :43:

Option 4: Leave gun locked in safe at home. (unGodly slow draw time. 5+ minutes to get gun and return to area where friends or family are still held up or dead at gunpoint in a attempt to defend for their life. Totally legal however not practical.:eek: