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View Full Version : KCBS News Rpt: Vallejo Cuts PD to the Bone, Residents Want CCWs


Paladin
12-16-2009, 7:40 PM
Be sure to listen to the 48 sec audio clip, which is different from the below, at:
http://www.kcbs.com/topic/play_window.php?audioType=Episode&audioId=4237703

In that audio clip, some unidentified "Know-Nothing" asserts that issuing more CCWs will increase crime and that will require even more police. :rolleyes: Of course, the reporter does not challenge that statement even though in every state that has passed Shall Issue, violent crime rates subsequently decrease.

http://www.kcbs.com/More-Cuts-for-Vallejo-PD/5910157

Cuts to Police Force in Vallejo Worries Many Residents

http://imgsrv.kcbs.com/image/kcbs/UserFiles/Image/police(1).jpg
VALLEJO, Calif. (KCBS) -- Some residents of bankrupt Vallejo may be looking to protect themselves after the city continued with the layoff of police officers yesterday. The number of applications for concealed weapons permits has doubled this year.

Seven officers lost their jobs on Tuesday, and another 15 could be laid off in July, the start of the next fiscal year. That would bring Vallejo's police force down to 90, for a city of 125,000.

"The crime levels in Vallejo are similar to Oakland, and actually our crime rate is higher than Richmond, and they have about twice as many officers as we have. The City of Oakland has a little over 800 officers," said Vallejo Police Lt. Abel Tenorio.

Because of this, he's seen the number of applications for concealed weapons permits double in the last year.

It's still under a dozen, but the process is an expensive and lengthy one that residents clearly feel is now worth it.

"Obviously they're concerned for their safety with the lack of visible officers out on the street," said Tenorio. "They want to do it legally if they can, carry a concealed weapon when they're out and about in the city."

With fewer officers, he says residents will have to wait up to six hours before an officer can respond to a home burglary, and as far as investigating those crimes, they're not a priority anymore.

Vinz
12-16-2009, 7:47 PM
My co worker lives there and he hopes for something to come up he thinks Vallejo is in deep do do.

I asked him how about a volunteer police force? He believes the Sheriff or CHP would take over if it came down to it.

vinz

bigcalidave
12-16-2009, 7:58 PM
6 hours to respond to a burglary? Investigating not a priority? What's the point? Are the cops in vallejo reduced to simply driving around and trying to stop people from shooting eachother in the streets? Why even have police if they can't do anything anymore! I hope the people that live there figure this situation out quick. How is it acceptable for them to have an expensive / hard to get CCW and no police... I thought solano county was impossible to get a CCW in anyways..

Anyone who lives there should just leave.

Unit74
12-16-2009, 8:13 PM
Property crimes are not priority. Simple as that. The deed has been done. Stuff is gone and there is n't a damn thing that can be done "right now." It can and will have to wait.


Crimes against persons do take priority. And from the sounds of the article, they have a crime wave of priority calls.

mecam
12-16-2009, 8:19 PM
6 hours to respond to a burglary?

I hope that's not the case if Triple A Gun Shop gets broken into. :mad:

CCWFacts
12-16-2009, 8:19 PM
Why even have police if they can't do anything anymore!

Exactly. It's hard to see the point of even having 90 cops in Vallejo. At some point, they are so few in number that they're irrelevant.

I hope people there start suing the city over CCW issuance. The city can't afford to fight those lawsuits.

How is it acceptable for them to have an expensive / hard to get CCW and no police...

Nothing about CCW has any connection to common sense or public safety in California.

cortayack
12-16-2009, 8:57 PM
I heard the police taping people on Columbus Street today......I believe thats where their priority is........giving tickets! :pinch:

DRM6000
12-16-2009, 8:59 PM
that is nuts. only 90 officers for 125,000 residents?

the city i work in, san rafael, has 55,000 residents and the last officer i talked to said there are over 80 officers in the dept. plus, the crime rate is nothing compared to vallejo.

i feel bad for the residents of vallejo. what can they do?

GuyW
12-16-2009, 9:06 PM
i feel bad for the residents of vallejo. what can they do?

...roll over and die like good peasants....meanwhile, their ever-so-smart social betters will continue mucking up the city....
.

Purple K
12-16-2009, 9:30 PM
Equally as serious is that they've reduced the number of Firefighters in Vallejo by more than 50% since their budget problems started. Fires and medical emergencies won't wait more than a few precious minutes. But it's all O.K. for the dirtbags that still get their "gubment" checks every month. :mad:

Paladin
12-16-2009, 9:40 PM
I heard this news story on KCBS while driving this afternoon. Actually, they aired two different versions: a long one and a short one. After reading the article and thinking about the aired stories, one thing struck me: in none of them does the PD rep express anti-CCW sentiments. I wonder if Vallejo will accept self-defense or something just slightly above (the good ol' "avid shooter" category :p), as acceptable GC given the lack of LE resources. This might be something worth investigating, esp if you live in Vallejo.

If, in the unlikely case that something major doesn't change before then (e.g., the sheriffs office takes over Vallejo LE duties), Vallejo would be a prime candidate to target w/pro-CCW fliers, etc after a Sykes win.

GuyW
12-17-2009, 9:29 AM
Equally as serious is that they've reduced the number of Firefighters in Vallejo by more than 50% since their budget problems started. Fires and medical emergencies won't wait more than a few precious minutes. But it's all O.K. for the dirtbags that still get their "gubment" checks every month. :mad:

??

Ummm, as I recall, Vallejo is in financial trouble because the City Council agreed to overpay police and firemen, as to direct salary and pension benefits.....is that your understanding?

Also, cities don't typically pay welfare costs....

....so, who are the dirtbags getting gubmit checks??

.

The Director
12-17-2009, 9:45 AM
I'm loving that 25 year old picture of a cop car they dug up....mid 80s Crown Vic...is that the best they could do???? Sheesh. What reporting.

MidnightSon117
12-17-2009, 11:23 AM
Could have been worse, Plymouth Reliant, anyone?
http://www.armory.com/~saiyajin/reliant-squad.jpg

:D

Steyrlp10
12-17-2009, 11:36 AM
I'm not happy for the cops or firemen in my town. They have a hard enough job to do, so it doesn't help when politics are thrown into the mix.

We've had a new City Manager almost annually, so that will give you an idea of how well the Council understands simple math. I always thought that if you have $XXX, you shouldn't spend $XXXXXXXXXX. My neighbors and I did the best we could at the voting polls, but I'm sure you know how that went...

As for crime, I'm glad I know how to shoot if I have to protect my family while some of the other people on the block will wait patiently as sheeple, hoping the response time of the VPD is good on that day...

Sgt Raven
12-17-2009, 11:53 AM
Could have been worse, Plymouth Reliant, anyone?
http://www.armory.com/%7Esaiyajin/reliant-squad.jpg

:D

Could be worse, could have been a Matador, or as my Po-Po friends called them Mat-A-Dogs. :p

djbooya
12-17-2009, 12:01 PM
I hope that's not the case if Triple A Gun Shop gets broken into. :mad:

Well, the Feds and DOJ would get involved with this too.

ilbob
12-17-2009, 12:05 PM
There is only so much money. the city wasted it on extravagant pensions for city employees and other unnecessary things so now the residents are going to pay through the nose.

Hopefully the residents will take out their anger on their public officials at the ballot box.

HAVOC5150
12-17-2009, 12:19 PM
I grew up in Vallejo, my Mom and Grandpa still live there. Every time I go there it reminds me how glad I am that I got out of there. Carrying a gun concealed is a pain in the a** so I don't usually, but when I go there I always have one on me.

Several months ago my Moms house was Burged and she caught the POS coming out of her front door. My mom detained her and called the police, they responded and arrested the POS. Took her to jail the DA opted to not prosecute. Sounds like a slam dunk conviction to me, (s) exiting the house with the property, victim catches (s) cops come and arrest (s) can't get much better than that other than a signed admission.

My room mate is a Vallejo Officer and he hates it now. They can't keep up with all the calls, he says they are swamped and the criminal element from Richmond is starting to show up in Vallejo more and more to sell they dope and commit crimes.

VPD was the agency that everyone wanted to work for when I started in LE, now its like rats fleeing from a sinking ship, I feel really bad for the guys and girls that work there.

HowardW56
12-17-2009, 12:44 PM
90, for a city of 125,000


Wow, Torrance has 149,000 residents and has 240 police officers

bigstick61
12-17-2009, 12:51 PM
One of the last nights I was residing in Vallejo there was a blackout and we got a call from a friend who had been out and about when that happened that there were people fighting in the streets and other stuff going on downtown, so those of us in the house loaded rifles and pistols and waited until the power went back on. We went to bed kind of late and about 2:45 in the morning we heard a loud bang donwstairs and found the front door broken. One of the hinges was busted off the other nearly off, and the door was cracked and the lock busted. We called the cops and no one ever came, not even to take our report. That city also has some real corruption issues, as others have mentioned, related to the unions. There are some streets where one would not want to go at night unarmed, the laws be damned. Not a nice place to live at all.

djbooya
12-17-2009, 12:57 PM
Wow, Torrance has 149,000 residents and has 240 police officers

Fremont has about 164 active police officers for 200,000+ residents

http://www.fremontpolice.org/alarm/faq.html

Some info in the above link about national averages and what cities should have based on those.

MidnightSon117
12-17-2009, 1:45 PM
Could be worse, could have been a Matador, or as my Po-Po friends called them Mat-A-Dogs. :p

Hahaha man...you dug deep for that car!

Ding126
12-17-2009, 1:50 PM
90 officers for 125k people divide by 3 shifts, reduce by office personnel subtract injured personnel and divide by square miles= not much coverage

I hope they issue CCW's in Solano County ie Vallejo

stormy_clothing
12-17-2009, 3:26 PM
cucamonga has the same issue, unless money is to be made or someones shooting there is a 4 hour period for police to check out suspicious activity or burglaries.

meanwhile both the PD station and the mall where 4 officers are stationed both a 1/2 mile away have some much needed nap time to catch up on.

paladin4415
12-17-2009, 6:12 PM
There is only so much money. the city wasted it on extravagant pensions for city employees and other unnecessary things so now the residents are going to pay through the nose.

90 people broke the city with salary and benefit costs? What the heck did the city give them?

cortayack
12-17-2009, 6:31 PM
90 people broke the city with salary and benefit costs? What the heck did the city give them?


HA,HA.....You need to caught up on the news! Thats the current police force after more lay-offs last week! And its being said more are likely to come in the near future....Maybe I should go for a CCW. :cool:

sierratangofoxtrotunion
12-17-2009, 6:53 PM
90 people broke the city with salary and benefit costs? What the heck did the city give them?

The thousands of other people employed by the city, accumulated over time by their hiring and retiring.

Calm Down
12-17-2009, 7:00 PM
90 people broke the city with salary and benefit costs? What the heck did the city give them?



They receive approx. $55 per hour, per officer, which factors in intermediate or advanced P.O.S.T certs. The officers pay 9% of their salary into their retirement (PERS) for 3% at age 50. Medical and dental are comparable as to most Nor Cal employers.

For the crap that is dealt with there, they are not over paid. The news constantly misleads people by stating that police/fire consume 80% of the city budget leading people to believe employees from those departments are overpaid. Vallejo has little tax base. With the closing of Mare Island in the 90ís, the amount of legitimate money in the city dropped. Residential housing boomed in Vallejo from 2002-2007; however houses are not where significant tax bases come from. Industry is where the tax base is.

Though the city spent several million to revitalize its downtown area, it failed. The farmers market held once a week in the summer is not enough to do anything. The city furthered its economic woes by allowing Wal-Mart to move Ĺ mile north, into American Canyon (Napa County) and build a Super Wal-Mart. What money could have stayed in Vallejo and other money that could have flowed into Vallejo, all went to Napa County. Marine World has filed for bankruptcy and is a disgusting place. Itís like a giant baby sitting park for the bastard children of Vallejo whose parents see it as money well spent to purchase a season pass to the park so as not to have to supervise their children for eight months out of the year.

Purple K
12-17-2009, 8:45 PM
??

Ummm, as I recall, Vallejo is in financial trouble because the City Council agreed to overpay police and firemen, as to direct salary and pension benefits.....is that your understanding?

Also, cities don't typically pay welfare costs....

....so, who are the dirtbags getting gubmit checks??

.

If you can't see the relationship between Municipalities cutting Police and Fire services and the increases in entitlement programs, you're too blind to shoot. And for you to insinuate that Police Officers and Firefighters are dirtbags is disgusting!

KylaGWolf
12-17-2009, 8:55 PM
My co worker lives there and he hopes for something to come up he thinks Vallejo is in deep do do.

I asked him how about a volunteer police force? He believes the Sheriff or CHP would take over if it came down to it.

vinz

Vinz Vallejo has been in deep do do for YEARS. When I had to go to the Vallejo Juvenile Probation Department to work I always wanted to be out of there by dark and that was in an OK part of town. I don't see CCW happening in Solano County unless things have changed since I lived up there (I left in 2000).

CCWFacts
12-17-2009, 9:56 PM
90 people broke the city with salary and benefit costs?

It used to be more than 90, but yes, that's what happened. The police, fire and other city employee unions.

What the heck did the city give them?

Vast commitments in pensions, healthcare for life, salary, overtime, on and on...

Yes, Vallejo was BKed by its public employees unions, particularly fire and police. It's part of the wonderful Democratic party machine which is also trying to BK the state itself.

Seesm
12-17-2009, 11:03 PM
If they allowed shall issue in m town I would be cool if they cut the force in half or totally as they can not get to me fast enough to help me if I need help.

NorCalMama
12-17-2009, 11:12 PM
Typical move... spread the word that they are understaffed, Johnny Q Public is sca-rewed, and without more MONEY they will take 6 HOURS to help out crime victims, if at all. Freaking disgusting!

And just a note, if I were a criminal in Vallejo, I'd be doing a tap dance right now because the IDIOT cop just made it clear that there won't be anything done if someone gets robbed, or worse for that matter.

Saym14
12-17-2009, 11:45 PM
they are bankrupt becuase the POLICE UNION bribed the city council for raises and retirement plans that cost too much.

fourdoorchevelle
12-18-2009, 5:02 AM
jeez they weren't to busy to ticket me for TINTED windows a couple of weeks ago :rolleyes:

armandolo
12-18-2009, 6:03 AM
... "Know-Nothing" asserts that issuing more CCWs will increase crime and that will require even more police. ...

Yes because, one day you are a law abiding citizen and another day you will be like " HUH, now that I conveniently have a gun with me I'll just shoot someone."

WAY TO GO IDIOT. :mad:


and 6 hr wait... I'll be decomposing by then.

Window_Seat
01-15-2010, 7:43 AM
Figured I'd bring this back... Listening to KTVU this AM, and saw that another 5 Officers have to be let go this week, 12 are looking for jobs because of it, and some demotions are going to be happening tomorrow.

While watching this thing, one clip that they show is of a female officer in a jog with an AR (forget the good looking lady officer, check out that AR!!), and this rifle has what looks like a HC Mag attached. I suppose I should have paid better attention to the issue, but are LEOs allowed to have high cap mags without the BB? If so, this is one of my biggest complaints regarding the assault on the 2A, and I'm hoping that the up & coming cases will put an end to "they can defend themselves with what they "need", but we can't".

Of course, the main issue WRT this topic would be that the city should issue more CCWs to residents and make "self defense & protection" sufficient GC because of the layoffs.

Erik.

OlderThanDirt
01-15-2010, 10:55 AM
Vast commitments in pensions, healthcare for life, salary, overtime, on and on...

You got that right. Health care for life is a crime. Old people should do their duty and just die. Overtime? Why do people think that they are entitled to more money if they work their life away? Salary? How quaint. They should just have a barracks and mess hall for the police, and give them a small expense account.

All seriousness aside, the problem stems from the way some local government retirement benefits are calculated. The fact that someone can retire on 90+ percent of their salary, in many cases before age 50, and have that 90 percent based on their bloated peak salary plus overtime, is a joke and completely unsustainable. In many cases, people (i.e., govmint workers) are getting far more than their base salary in retirement simply because they camped out on the job in their final year. Vallejo is just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to unsustainable spending by local government. A lot more cities, and maybe even counties will go bankrupt before this is over.

Untamed1972
01-15-2010, 11:02 AM
I think these issues just help to point more and more to that fact that it is simply unreasonable and unrealistic to continue to deny people the right to defend themselves by the gov't claming they will do it for you. There simply is just not enough tax money available to provide for a police force capable of doing that.

This model has been tried and it's failing miserably......time to try something else. Time to move back towards a model of people taking responsibilty for themselves and their communities and quit expecting the gov't to take care of us.

RangemasterP226
01-16-2010, 8:11 AM
Figured I'd bring this back... Listening to KTVU this AM, and saw that another 5 Officers have to be let go this week, 12 are looking for jobs because of it, and some demotions are going to be happening tomorrow.

While watching this thing, one clip that they show is of a female officer in a jog with an AR (forget the good looking lady officer, check out that AR!!), and this rifle has what looks like a HC Mag attached. I suppose I should have paid better attention to the issue, but are LEOs allowed to have high cap mags without the BB? If so, this is one of my biggest complaints regarding the assault on the 2A, and I'm hoping that the up & coming cases will put an end to "they can defend themselves with what they "need", but we can't".

Of course, the main issue WRT this topic would be that the city should issue more CCWs to residents and make "self defense & protection" sufficient GC because of the layoffs.

Erik.


Is this a serious question?

Gray Peterson
01-16-2010, 8:45 AM
they are bankrupt becuase the POLICE UNION bribed the city council for raises and retirement plans that cost too much.

This is a complete falsehood. See below:

They receive approx. $55 per hour, per officer, which factors in intermediate or advanced P.O.S.T certs. The officers pay 9% of their salary into their retirement (PERS) for 3% at age 50. Medical and dental are comparable as to most Nor Cal employers.

For the crap that is dealt with there, they are not over paid. The news constantly misleads people by stating that police/fire consume 80% of the city budget leading people to believe employees from those departments are overpaid. Vallejo has little tax base. With the closing of Mare Island in the 90ís, the amount of legitimate money in the city dropped. Residential housing boomed in Vallejo from 2002-2007; however houses are not where significant tax bases come from. Industry is where the tax base is.

Though the city spent several million to revitalize its downtown area, it failed. The farmers market held once a week in the summer is not enough to do anything. The city furthered its economic woes by allowing Wal-Mart to move Ĺ mile north, into American Canyon (Napa County) and build a Super Wal-Mart. What money could have stayed in Vallejo and other money that could have flowed into Vallejo, all went to Napa County. Marine World has filed for bankruptcy and is a disgusting place. Itís like a giant baby sitting park for the bastard children of Vallejo whose parents see it as money well spent to purchase a season pass to the park so as not to have to supervise their children for eight months out of the year.

GuyW
01-16-2010, 9:02 AM
This is a complete falsehood. See below:

Pensions of 3% x number of years x highest year' salary (and various and asundry tricks to game the system), AND the high salaries, are completely unsustainable (pensions of 90-110+% of salary) - the CA taxpayers cannot AFFORD this lunacy.

(Going forward, lets think about government pensions with a cap of 25% of average salary...., and tied to the real world pay scales)

The fact that this is perhaps the weakest city in CA detracts not one bit from the above conclusions.

...and police and fire unions back/oppose politicians (and spend significant $) in local races to get their way is SOP.

.

yellowfin
01-16-2010, 9:05 AM
Has anyone in the meantime gotten a CCW from Vallejo? Or even tried?

Roadrunner
01-16-2010, 5:37 PM
cucamonga has the same issue, unless money is to be made or someones shooting there is a 4 hour period for police to check out suspicious activity or burglaries.

meanwhile both the PD station and the mall where 4 officers are stationed both a 1/2 mile away have some much needed nap time to catch up on.

The last time I was there, I saw cops driving around Victoria Gardens with their Segways or burning gas in cars.

Carsgunsandchics
01-16-2010, 6:50 PM
I think it started in the early 90's with Vallejo laughing about Mare Island closing. They were not worried at all about the impact. All they could think about was all that free property they were going to get. It was just a big public stroke session. I'm so happy that I moved from there in 1999.