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XDRoX
11-19-2009, 6:49 AM
If I am vacationing in a state that doesn't have a 10 day wait can I legally buy a gun and bring it back to CA with me. Of course I would make sure it is a CA legal firearm.

I'm guessing no, but thought I would ask anyway.

Thanks

Bruce
11-19-2009, 6:50 AM
Nope.

cqbdude
11-19-2009, 7:15 AM
I thought you can buy rifles but not hanguns..

GrizzlyGuy
11-19-2009, 7:34 AM
You can buy it, but the seller will need to ship it to an FFL here in California. The 10-day wait will apply as usual before you can pick it up.

Librarian
11-19-2009, 8:02 AM
Once again, Wiki to the rescue:
Can I BUY A GUN OUTSIDE CALIFORNIA? (http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/Can_I_BUY_A_GUN_OUTSIDE_CALIFORNIA%3F)

holasrmateo
11-19-2009, 8:03 AM
A follow on question:

I'm in the military and currently stationed in another state. It is legal for me to purchase a hand gun and it is legal here with my orders. I am however still a California resident and have no intent on changing that.

My question is, do I need to register any handgun I purchase to California? I eventually plan on moving back to California - would it make more sense to register it so it's on the books? When I do move back, is it considered importing?

Any insight would be appreciated.

Edit: Okay I reviewed the wiki answer. How then would I go about this? Could I do some complicated, California purchase (online) and have it transfered to a FLL to a state I'm in. The purchase and paper work would be documented in California and there would be no transfer between owners.

Dr Rockso
11-19-2009, 8:08 AM
A follow on question:

I'm in the military and currently stationed in another state. It is legal for me to purchase a hand gun and it is legal here with my orders. I am however still a California resident and have no intent on changing that.

My question is, do I need to register any handgun I purchase to California? I eventually plan on moving back to California - would it make more sense to register it so it's on the books? When I do move back, is it considered importing?

Any insight would be appreciated.

Military personnel on assignment in other states are, for these purposes, considered residents of the state in which they are stationed. When you come back you will have to fill out the personal importation form and pay $19 per handgun to the DOJ.

The handgun does not have to be on the list of handguns approved for sale in California, but it may not have features that would make it an "assault weapon" such as a threaded barrel or the ability to take a detachable magazine outside of the handgrip. You also cannot import 11+ round magazines into California unless you possessed them in California prior to the year 2000.

holasrmateo
11-19-2009, 8:28 AM
Military personnel on assignment in other states are, for these purposes, considered residents of the state in which they are stationed. When you come back you will have to fill out the personal importation form and pay $19 per handgun to the DOJ.

The handgun does not have to be on the list of handguns approved for sale in California, but it may not have features that would make it an "assault weapon" such as a threaded barrel or the ability to take a detachable magazine outside of the handgrip. You also cannot import 11+ round magazines into California unless you possessed them in California prior to the year 2000.

I gathered the last part - it obviously can't violate current standards. I was just curious if it would be considered importing since it would be purchased outside of California but I can't very well move back to a state I legally am still with. I suppose it's not a common situation since it would normally be illegal for a out of state resident to puchase a firearm out of state.

Edit: Is there anyway I can register with California what I buy. It may seem absurd to give the state information voulentarily but would it prempt future laws that model the idea of "no new slaves"?

Decoligny
11-19-2009, 8:36 AM
I gathered the last part - it obviously can't violate current standards. I was just curious if it would be considered importing since it would be purchased outside of California but I can't very well move back to a state I legally am still with. I suppose it's not a common situation since it would normally be illegal for a out of state resident to puchase a firearm out of state.

Edit: Is there anyway I can register with California what I buy. It may seem absurd to give the state information voulentarily but would it prempt future laws that model the idea of "no new slaves"?

If you choose to I don't see why you couldn't do the personal importer paperwork and pay the fee. You still have your home of record in California.
DOJ would be able to answer the question, you should call them.

xr650r
11-21-2009, 9:39 AM
If I have a house in each state and purchased firearms in both states (as a resident of each state, legally purchased in that respective state/date that your identification showed me to be a resident), would I have to file any paperwork to transfer a bolt action rifle (NOT a 50BMG) to California?

Mssr. Eleganté
11-21-2009, 11:09 AM
If I have a house in each state and purchased firearms in both states (as a resident of each state, legally purchased in that respective state/date that your identification showed me to be a resident), would I have to file any paperwork to transfer a bolt action rifle (NOT a 50BMG) to California?

No, you would not. Long guns are not registered in California unless they are "assault weapons" or .50 BMG rifles. (and most people aren't allowed to register any more of those).

MudCamper
07-03-2013, 5:27 PM
Once again, Wiki to the rescue:
Can I BUY A GUN OUTSIDE CALIFORNIA? (http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/Can_I_BUY_A_GUN_OUTSIDE_CALIFORNIA%3F)

I'm resurrecting this old thread intentionally.

The wiki does not answer my questions:

1) Can a person buy a firearm (handgun or long gun) in another state, if they keep the firearm in that state and never bring it home. This assumes that the state in question would allow it. Is it a violation of federal law?

2) If I own a house in another state as well as California, can I buy a firearm in that state?

3) If the answer to 2 is yes, can I bring the firearm back to California and fill out the vol reg paperwork and keep it in CA?

4) If the answer to 2 is yes, can I bring my out of state firearm with me temporarily while I visit my CA home, then bring it back to my other home in the other state, without doing any paperwork, similar to how an out of state resident could legally do this when visiting CA?

1CavScout
07-03-2013, 5:49 PM
I own a home in AZ and split time bewtween the two states, and can legally buy when I am "residing" there. Below is from the ATF website

http://www.atf.gov/content/firearms-frequently-asked-questions-unlicensed-persons

Q: What constitutes residency in a State?
The State of residence is the State in which an individual is present; the individual also must have an intention of making a home in that State. A member of the Armed Forces on active duty is a resident of the State in which his or her permanent duty station is located. If a member of the Armed Forces maintains a home in one State and the member’s permanent duty station is in a nearby State to which he or she commutes each day, then the member has two States of residence and may purchase a firearm in either the State where the duty station is located or the State where the home is maintained. An alien who is legally in the United States is considered to be a resident of a State only if the alien is residing in that State and has resided in that State continuously for a period of at least 90 days prior to the date of sale of the firearm. See also Item 5, “Sales to Aliens in the United States,” in the General Information section of this publication.
[18 U.S.C. 921(b), 922(a) (3), and 922(b)(3), 27 CFR 478.11]

Q: May a person (who is not an alien) who resides in one State and owns property in another State purchase a handgun in either State?
If a person maintains a home in 2 States and resides in both States for certain periods of the year, he or she may, during the period of time the person actually resides in a particular State, purchase a handgun in that State. However, simply owning property in another State does not qualify the person to purchase a handgun in that State.
[27 CFR 478.11]

Edit: I am not sure about your question regarding bringing the weapons into California. For me personally, I won't bring anything I purchase in AZ into CA.

1CavScout
07-03-2013, 5:58 PM
Some more from the ATF.

A person’s “State of residence” is defined by regulation in 27 CFR 478.11 as “the State in
which an individual resides. An individual resides in a State if he or she is present in a - 2 -
State with the intention of making a home in that State.” Ownership of a home or land
within a given State is not sufficient, by itself, to establish a State of residence. However,
ownership of a home or land within a particular State is not required to establish presence
and intent to make a home in that State. Furthermore, temporary travel, such as short-term
stays, vacations, or other transient acts in a State are not sufficient to establish a State of
residence because the individual demonstrates no intention of making a home in that State.

Quiet
07-03-2013, 6:36 PM
I'm resurrecting this old thread intentionally.

The wiki does not answer my questions:

1) Can a person buy a firearm (handgun or long gun) in another state, if they keep the firearm in that state and never bring it home. This assumes that the state in question would allow it. Is it a violation of federal law?

2) If I own a house in another state as well as California, can I buy a firearm in that state?

3) If the answer to 2 is yes, can I bring the firearm back to California and fill out the vol reg paperwork and keep it in CA?

4) If the answer to 2 is yes, can I bring my out of state firearm with me temporarily while I visit my CA home, then bring it back to my other home in the other state, without doing any paperwork, similar to how an out of state resident could legally do this when visiting CA?

1) A person can purchase the firearm but can not legally take possession of the firearm, until it is transferred to that person by a FFL dealer in that person's state of residence.

2) Owning property in another state, does not make you a resident of that state. See #1.

dwtt
07-03-2013, 8:18 PM
Let me answer this from my personal experience. I have a house in CA, but am a VA resident. I have a VA driver's license, registered to vote, and have a VA CCW, so VA is my state of residency. When I come back to CA, I'm back here as a visitor, though that's going to change this summer when I resume my CA residency. The answers below are based on my current status as a VA resident.

I'm resurrecting this old thread intentionally.

The wiki does not answer my questions:

1) Can a person buy a firearm (handgun or long gun) in another state, if they keep the firearm in that state and never bring it home. This assumes that the state in question would allow it. Is it a violation of federal law?
No, since your state of residency is CA, you cannot buy a gun in another state and leave it with your friend or relative. You can buy a gun in any state of the US, but have to have it shipped to a CA FFL to transfer it to you, according to federal law.

2) If I own a house in another state as well as California, can I buy a firearm in that state?
If your residency is the other state, like mine is in VA, then you can buy guns in the other state. You'll give up your CA residency, and the right to buy guns and take possession in CA, along with the high income tax that is the lifeblood of CA. If your residency remains in CA even though you bought a second home in another state, you cannot buy guns and take possession in the other state. In this case you will have to have the gun shipped back to a CA FFL to transfer to you.

3) If the answer to 2 is yes, can I bring the firearm back to California and fill out the vol reg paperwork and keep it in CA?
If you change your residency to the other state like I did, then you can buy guns and take them home in the other state. If you return to CA, you will be returning as a visitor, not as a CA resident, so you cannot sell the guns via PPT, or register them via the voluntary registration. If at a later time, you return to CA to resume residency in CA and end your residency in the other state, you can bring the guns with you and do the voluntary registration. For instance, when your contract comes to an end after 3 years of working and living in another state and you return to CA, you can bring back any of the guns you bought while a resident of the other state and be completely legal.

4) If the answer to 2 is yes, can I bring my out of state firearm with me temporarily while I visit my CA home, then bring it back to my other home in the other state, without doing any paperwork, similar to how an out of state resident could legally do this when visiting CA?
I have returned to CA with guns I bougth in VA with no paperwork. I'm a VA resident visiting my CA home and my guns stay with me and return with me to VA. Just don't bring anything that will violate CA law and you're OK.

sakosf
07-03-2013, 10:01 PM
If you had a C&R license (03FFL) you could buy a C&R firearm while visiting another state, providing the gun did not have some feature that would make the gun illegal in CA

Librarian
07-03-2013, 10:17 PM
And the sticky on this topic is http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=503873

1CavScout
07-03-2013, 10:20 PM
DWTT: You can be a resident of two states. You do not have to give up your residency in California to have residency in another state as far as the ATF is concerned.

http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/Federal_residency_requirements


Example 2. A is a U.S. citizen and maintains a home in State X and
a home in State Y. A resides in State X except for weekends or the
summer months of the year and in State Y for the weekends or the
summer months of the year. During the time that A actually resides
in State X, A is a resident of State X, and during the time that A
actually resides in State Y, A is a resident of State Y.

MudCamper
07-03-2013, 11:12 PM
Thanks for the info guys.

It's interesting that you can be a resident of 2 states, but owning a home or property is not enough to establish residency, yet it is also not a requirement. That's a pretty abiguous definition.

And all the language about "intending to make a home" is even more ambiguous.

dwtt
07-04-2013, 8:13 AM
DWTT: You can be a resident of two states. You do not have to give up your residency in California to have residency in another state as far as the ATF is concerned.

http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/Federal_residency_requirements


Example 2. A is a U.S. citizen and maintains a home in State X and
a home in State Y. A resides in State X except for weekends or the
summer months of the year and in State Y for the weekends or the
summer months of the year. During the time that A actually resides
in State X, A is a resident of State X, and during the time that A
actually resides in State Y, A is a resident of State Y.

Sorry, you've missed the point. I don't want to be a CA resident, even though I own a house in CA. I don't want to claim CA residency since there is absolutely no benefit and many liabilities to do so. The reference you provided is with regards to firearms ownership and purchasing, but there are also tax and other considerations to establishing one's residency in another state.

1CavScout
07-04-2013, 8:49 AM
Sorry, you've missed the point. I don't want to be a CA resident, even though I own a house in CA. I don't want to claim CA residency since there is absolutely no benefit and many liabilities to do so. The reference you provided is with regards to firearms ownership and purchasing, but there are also tax and other considerations to establishing one's residency in another state.

I was responding to this. Maybe I misread it. I was simply trying to make it clear that you can have residency in two states as far as the ATF is concerned.

"2) If I own a house in another state as well as California, can I buy a firearm in that state?
If your residency is the other state, like mine is in VA, then you can buy guns in the other state. You'll give up your CA residency, and the right to buy guns and take possession in CA, along with the high income tax that is the lifeblood of CA. If your residency remains in CA even though you bought a second home in another state, you cannot buy guns and take possession in the other state. In this case you will have to have the gun shipped back to a CA FFL to transfer to you."

retiredAFcop
07-04-2013, 11:24 AM
Whether or not you can legally buy a firearm in another state will mostly depend on the laws of THAT state.

I went to college in Kentucky. As a full time college student there, I was able to legally purchase firearms in Kentucky using my student ID as proof of residency, and my CA DL as proof of ID.

In some states, the spouse of a servicemember can purchase based on assignment orders, just like a servicemember, in others, only the servicemember can purchase based on assignment orders.

California law only becomes relevant when you bring the firearm into CA - it may require registration, modification (a magazine locking device may need to be added to an AR, for example), or may be banned, and magazines may be banned.

Toor95991
07-04-2013, 1:16 PM
If I am vacationing in a state that doesn't have a 10 day wait can I legally buy a gun and bring it back to CA with me. Of course I would make sure it is a CA legal firearm.

I'm guessing no, but thought I would ask anyway.

Thanks


you could bring it back. people bring nevada handguns here all the time. but i dont think its legal. you would be breaking some laws. however once it was here no one would really know you have it. unless you used it in self defense than you might get in some trouble.

MudCamper
07-04-2013, 3:29 PM
you could bring it back. people bring nevada handguns here all the time. but i dont think its legal. you would be breaking some laws. however once it was here no one would really know you have it. unless you used it in self defense than you might get in some trouble.

Your advice here is both foolish and illegal.

goober
07-04-2013, 3:40 PM
you could bring it back. people bring nevada handguns here all the time. but i dont think its legal. you would be breaking some laws. however once it was here no one would really know you have it. unless you used it in self defense than you might get in some trouble.

please do not recommend or suggest that folks break the law. your advice is either foolish or malevolent.
i saw your other thread where you asked questions regarding a firearm purchased in another state.
at no time did anyone advise what you are advocating here.

sakosf
07-04-2013, 4:31 PM
you could bring it back. people bring nevada handguns here all the time. but i dont think its legal. you would be breaking some laws. however once it was here no one would really know you have it. unless you used it in self defense than you might get in some trouble.

Do you work for Bloomberg ?

Toor95991
07-04-2013, 5:44 PM
Your advice here is both foolish and illegal.

not advice. im not telling him to do that. im telling him the truth about what many people do. im sorry. i dont want him to assume its okay. i stated it is against the law.

Toor95991
07-04-2013, 5:44 PM
Do you work for Bloomberg ?

no sir. i work for a bank.

dwtt
07-05-2013, 5:58 AM
no sir. i work for a bank.

That's great. Can you give me some money, not your money, the bank's money. I'm sure you'll be breaking the law, but it's OK because I'm a nice guy and people like me. Once the money gets into my hands, noone would know which bank it came from, so it's untracable.

Quiet
07-05-2013, 7:32 AM
That's great. Can you give me some money, not your money, the bank's money. I'm sure you'll be breaking the law, but it's OK because I'm a nice guy and people like me. Once the money gets into my hands, noone would know which bank it came from, so it's untracable.

:iagree:

Librarian
07-05-2013, 8:56 AM
Another asked and answered.