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bakokid
11-15-2009, 2:44 PM
i was wondering what if any consequences are there for a company thats out of state for sending hi cap mags into cali.
jw

Dr Rockso
11-15-2009, 2:59 PM
Nothing wrong with sending magazine parts. Sending assembled magazines to non-exempt persons is illegal and the DOJ could go after the sender even if they are out of state.

C.G.
11-15-2009, 2:59 PM
I am not sure, but if you send them as rebuilt kits, in another words, in magazine parts rather than assembled magazine, then no consequences.

Full Clip
11-15-2009, 3:09 PM
Parts is parts, magazines is magazines.
Nothing wrong with sending parts.

Librarian
11-15-2009, 5:21 PM
i was wondering what if any consequences are there for a company thats out of state for sending hi cap mags into cali.
jw

Indeed, parts is parts - but importing a complete large-capacity mag may be a misdemeanor or a felony (it's called a 'wobbler', and one can't necessarily predict how it would be prosecuted.)
12020. (a) Any person in this state who does any of the following
is punishable by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year
or in the state prison:

(2) Commencing January 1, 2000, manufactures or causes to be
manufactured, imports into the state, keeps for sale, or offers or
exposes for sale, or who gives, or lends, any large-capacity
magazine.
DOJ can attempt to prosecute out of state vendors.

jello2594
11-15-2009, 5:25 PM
What if someone goes to Las Vegas, purchases high-capacity magazines, disassembles them, and brings them as parts back to CA, and only uses parts to repair existing magazines?

That should be ok, I think.

Seesm
11-15-2009, 5:30 PM
Jello that would be legal...

B Strong
11-15-2009, 5:44 PM
What if someone goes to Las Vegas, purchases high-capacity magazines, disassembles them, and brings them as parts back to CA, and only uses parts to repair existing magazines?

That should be ok, I think.

It's legal to acquire repair parts for your high-caps, it's legal to have those parts shipped to you, and it's legal to bring those parts in yourself.

Quser.619
11-15-2009, 7:10 PM
Can't wait until this ridiculousness is gone for good from this state. Of course the moment we get it overturned, the Federal Govt will probably make it nationwide

bwiese
11-15-2009, 8:04 PM
Indeed, parts is parts - but importing a complete large-capacity mag may be a misdemeanor or a felony (it's called a 'wobbler', and one can't necessarily predict how it would be prosecuted.)
DOJ can attempt to prosecute out of state vendors.

Yes, or they can order cease & desist and threaten suit, which they would likely win.

You can't hang outside in one state and inject illegal products to illegal customers in the other state. California and New Jersey have "long arm" laws that allows criminal & civil remedies against nonresidents if they've had sufficient contact/nexus with California and have reasonable knowledge of illegality.

Hunter4life1990
11-15-2009, 11:06 PM
what about how some companies send completed magazines to cali residents on accident,ie ordered a parts kit but they sent a full mag by mistake or sumthin.what does the recipient do with the completed mag? make a ten rounder or can we legally just keep them because we did nothing illegal?

bwiese
11-15-2009, 11:22 PM
what about how some companies send completed magazines to cali residents on accident,ie ordered a parts kit but they sent a full mag by mistake or sumthin.what does the recipient do with the completed mag? make a ten rounder or can we legally just keep them because we did nothing illegal?

Grey area. Hope you have proof that you did NOT order a hicap magazine.

I myself would not verbally order disassembled hicap mag parts; I'd fax or mail a written request for the parts. That way, even if confusion or investigation occurs, there's a clear request from you for legal disassembled product.

Most mag sellers of even moderate intelligence will not ship hicaps to California except to those with hicap mag permits. If you found a misshiped one, disassemble it and immediately return it to vendor with a letter of protest.

I have heard of one stupid idiot selling parts to Californians on Calguns but shipping hicaps instead - I really wonder about this guy being dumb or an entrapper. I believe he has been banned now.

The usual accidental route is the single mag accompanyiing an AK or FAL non-gun "parts kit" - where the $5/hr monkey pulling them from the shelf forgets that the mags need to be removed/disassembled before shipping to CA.

Decoligny
11-16-2009, 7:13 AM
what about how some companies send completed magazines to cali residents on accident,ie ordered a parts kit but they sent a full mag by mistake or sumthin.what does the recipient do with the completed mag? make a ten rounder or can we legally just keep them because we did nothing illegal?

I would immediately disassemble the magazine into the parts kit that you originally ordered. If the cops didn't show up with the FedEx guy to arrest you upon reciept, then they probably aren't investigating a crime. If you have the original order printed out from the website, and you disassemble immediately, you are doing your best to comply with the spirit of the law, because you did not attempt to import a hi-cap magazine.

jamesob
11-16-2009, 11:56 AM
Indeed, parts is parts - but importing a complete large-capacity mag may be a misdemeanor or a felony (it's called a 'wobbler', and one can't necessarily predict how it would be prosecuted.)
DOJ can attempt to prosecute out of state vendors.

the problem i see is with the very first part " any person within the state "

The Director
11-16-2009, 12:08 PM
If the cops didn't show up with the FedEx guy to arrest you upon reciept, then they probably aren't investigating a crime.

Oh please. What a ridiculous scenario. We're trying to guide the guy in the legal way of doing things but making it sound like the swat team is going to show up because of a problem with a magazine order borders on total FUD.

Decoligny
11-16-2009, 12:38 PM
Oh please. What a ridiculous scenario. We're trying to guide the guy in the legal way of doing things but making it sound like the swat team is going to show up because of a problem with a magazine order borders on total FUD.

Lay off the caffiene a little bit, it's making you jumpy. :eek:

Maybe I should have said "Since the cops didn't show up", instaed of "If the cops didn't show up". :rolleyes:

I was simply trying to point out that he shouldn't be all that concerned with the whole "Oh No, am I going to jail!!!!!" scenario, just because he was on the receiving end of an erroneous shipment.

I was in no way stating that there will be, or that there has ever been all that much police interest or "hoopla" surrounding the erroneous shipment of a hi-cap magazine to someone who ordered a parts kit.

Hunter4life1990
11-16-2009, 12:43 PM
im not saying that i would keep them in the hicap state,i was curious of what would happen to the people legally who clearly ordered a dissassembled parts kit(with printed receipt and all stating that it was supposed to be a kit) and recieved a fully assembled mag.

The Director
11-16-2009, 2:33 PM
Lay off the caffiene a little bit, it's making you jumpy. :eek:

Maybe I should have said "Since the cops didn't show up", instaed of "If the cops didn't show up". :rolleyes:

I was simply trying to point out that he shouldn't be all that concerned with the whole "Oh No, am I going to jail!!!!!" scenario, just because he was on the receiving end of an erroneous shipment.

I was in no way stating that there will be, or that there has ever been all that much police interest or "hoopla" surrounding the erroneous shipment of a hi-cap magazine to someone who ordered a parts kit.

Okay, I'll let you off with a warning this time. :D:p

inbox485
11-16-2009, 2:36 PM
Indeed, parts is parts - but importing a complete large-capacity mag may be a misdemeanor or a felony (it's called a 'wobbler', and one can't necessarily predict how it would be prosecuted.)
DOJ can attempt to prosecute out of state vendors.

While I wouldn't care to test it, the law applies the penalty to the importer not the exporter. I don't think the law could apply to the out of state exporter due to the letter of the law and the lack of jurisdiction.

I would immediately disassemble the magazine into the parts kit that you originally ordered. If the cops didn't show up with the FedEx guy to arrest you upon reciept, then they probably aren't investigating a crime. If you have the original order printed out from the website, and you disassemble immediately, you are doing your best to comply with the spirit of the law, because you did not attempt to import a hi-cap magazine.

Again, while I myself don't care to test a CA judges adherence to the letter of the law, simply receiving a hi-cap magazine is not illegal. If you took no action to solicit it, you committed no crime, and you have no obligation to disassemble or destroy it.

inbox485
11-16-2009, 2:44 PM
im not saying that i would keep them in the hicap state,i was curious of what would happen to the people legally who clearly ordered a dissassembled parts kit(with printed receipt and all stating that it was supposed to be a kit) and recieved a fully assembled mag.

Legally, nothing. But since we don't live in a state that respects the rule of law, lets explore reality. Realistically, you run the risk of being maliciously persecuted by our legal system, and all it would take is another judge willing to turn a blind eye to our state's laws. Even if you eventually win on appeal, you will have pissed tens of thousands of dollars down a black hole called lawyer fees.