PDA

View Full Version : Legality of handgun in locked container inside school zone by employee.


devilinblack
11-13-2009, 5:50 PM
The way I understand it, handguns are okay inside school zones if unloaded and in a locked container while going to and from the range, to and from a friends house, or in my district's case if stopping by the district office to use the ATM in the parking lot. My question is this: as a district employee if I planned to go to the range after work would I be okay keeping the handgun inside a locked container secured in my car?

It's not that big of a deal to go home and then to the range, I was just curious about the legality of doing this to save some time/gas.

Thanks in advance.

hollabillz
11-13-2009, 6:00 PM
If you leave it in your car, ULCC, I'm pretty sure it's okay to take anywhere. As soon as you take it out, you need to be going to one of the designated places.

bwiese
11-13-2009, 6:18 PM
1. I'm not sure, I'll let someone else speak up, but locked/unloaded.
schoolzone exemptions may involve "transport thru" as opposed to
"daily destination". In addition, you'd be on school property as
opposed to school zone.

2. Even if the above were not a concern, you might well have an
*employment* restriction.

Librarian
11-13-2009, 6:23 PM
1. I'm not sure, I'll let someone else speak up, but locked/unloaded.
schoolzone exemptions may involve "transport thru" as opposed to
"daily destination". In addition, you'd be on school property as
opposed to school zone.

2. Even if the above were not a concern, you might well have an
*employment* restriction.

I'm pretty sure that 'on school property' is only exempted for LEO and CCW holders and a few others - passing by is OK, even passing through might be successfully argued, as driving through a campus, or picking up your student from his/her school by waiting in a parking lot or drive through.

But one reason I never got in the habit of carrying a trunk gun is that I was a student for four years recently, and my wife is a teacher; I couldn't figure out how to legally carry onto school grounds.

GrizzlyGuy
11-13-2009, 6:33 PM
I'm pretty sure that 'on school property' is only exempted for LEO and CCW holders and a few others - passing by is OK, even passing through might be successfully argued, as driving through a campus, or picking up your student from his/her school by waiting in a parking lot or drive through.

Yes, that is 626.9(f):

"(f) (1) Any person who violates subdivision (b) by possessing a
firearm in, or on the grounds of, a public or private school
providing instruction in kindergarten or grades 1 to 12, inclusive,
shall be punished by imprisonment in the state prison for two, three,
or five years."

Note that subdivision (b) is the school zone prohibition ("Any person who possesses a firearm in a place that the person knows, or reasonably should know, is a school zone...")

But... Since the locked container exemption applies to (b), then it seems that you wouldn't 'violate subdivision b' if it were in the locked container, and (f) would then not come into play(?).

http://law.onecle.com/california/penal/626.9.html

devilinblack
11-13-2009, 6:53 PM
"School zone" means an area in, or on the grounds of, a public
or private school providing instruction in kindergarten or grades 1
to 12, inclusive, or within a distance of 1,000 feet from the
grounds of the public or private school.

A district office complex with no classrooms that does not provide instruction to any children would not be covered by this then, would it?

I'm on good terms with the superintendent, but not good enough to go asking for written permission for anything gun related. There's just no telling how some people might react to that and I happen to like my job security.

cr250chevy
11-13-2009, 6:57 PM
so then school zone doesn't apply to a college, for example say.... Sacramento State?- sorry not trying to thread jack.

Librarian
11-13-2009, 7:17 PM
so then school zone doesn't apply to a college, for example say.... Sacramento State?- sorry not trying to thread jack.

Right - the 'zones' apply only to K-12, but the 'on-campus' restrictions apply at all levels.

Librarian
11-13-2009, 7:36 PM
But... Since the locked container exemption applies to (b), then it seems that you wouldn't 'violate subdivision b' if it were in the locked container, and (f) would then not come into play(?).

http://law.onecle.com/california/penal/626.9.html

For that, you'd have to argue that the legislature really didn't mean to say it was a 3-5 year felony rap to bring a gun onto campus.

There are lots of sloppy spots in PC. Sometimes a good lawyer can take advantage. It's my guess this isn't one of those times.

cr250chevy
11-17-2009, 10:46 PM
Right - the 'zones' apply only to K-12, but the 'on-campus' restrictions apply at all levels.
ok i understand now, thanks very much!

Rumpled
11-17-2009, 11:14 PM
IIRC, There is also the handgun transportation restriction. You can't just carry a handgun around - you can only go to and from the range. Some think you can't even stop for gas.
Sorry, can't remember code right now.

Cokebottle
11-17-2009, 11:27 PM
IIRC, There is also the handgun transportation restriction. You can't just carry a handgun around - you can only go to and from the range. Some think you can't even stop for gas.
Sorry, can't remember code right now.
I'd like to see that code section.

UOC, while currently inadvisable, IS legal outside of a GFSZ.
Why would secured, locked storage in a vehicle be any different?

bigcalidave
11-17-2009, 11:57 PM
IIRC, There is also the handgun transportation restriction. You can't just carry a handgun around - you can only go to and from the range. Some think you can't even stop for gas.
Sorry, can't remember code right now.

Huh?? Where did that come from? That's the highly questionable law for transporting a registered assault weapon.

five.five-six
11-18-2009, 12:04 AM
Right - the 'zones' apply only to K-12, but the 'on-campus' restrictions apply at all levels.


so... preschool is ok?

Cokebottle
11-18-2009, 12:21 AM
so... preschool is ok?
The 1000ft GFSZ only applies to K-12.

However, you cannot carry onto the property of a preschool, night school, adult school, college, or university.
There are exceptions including LEO, armored car, written permission from the superintendent, etc....

But the locked container, for both handgun and rifle, covers you on the GFSZ area outside of the perimeter of the school.

Non-connected school property (the statute specifies college/university) must be posted to indicate the firearms restriction.

pullnshoot25
11-18-2009, 12:28 AM
I'm pretty sure that 'on school property' is only exempted for LEO and CCW holders and a few others - passing by is OK, even passing through might be successfully argued, as driving through a campus, or picking up your student from his/her school by waiting in a parking lot or drive through.

But one reason I never got in the habit of carrying a trunk gun is that I was a student for four years recently, and my wife is a teacher; I couldn't figure out how to legally carry onto school grounds.

Park off campus and take a shuttle!

pullnshoot25
11-18-2009, 12:30 AM
The 1000ft GFSZ only applies to K-12.

However, you cannot carry onto the property of a preschool, night school, adult school, college, or university.
There are exceptions including LEO, armored car, written permission from the superintendent, etc....

But the locked container, for both handgun and rifle, covers you on the GFSZ area outside of the perimeter of the school.

Non-connected school property (the statute specifies college/university) must be posted to indicate the firearms restriction.

WRONG! You CAN carry into or onto a preschool, that is not K-12. Night/adult school is a grey area, as that is not K-12 AFAIK. Depends on the location I guess.

Cokebottle
11-18-2009, 12:50 AM
WRONG! You CAN carry into or onto a preschool, that is not K-12. Night/adult school is a grey area, as that is not K-12 AFAIK. Depends on the location I guess.
I'm trying to find the statute... I saw it when I was looking up statutes on the "locked container" thread and it was very specific.

Again... I (and the OP) am not talking about the 1000ft perimeter area... we are referring to actual property.

Carnivore
11-18-2009, 1:17 AM
I am assuming you are an employee. If so you might want to check to see you won't get fired for having a gun on any campus. Where I live I worked for the school district. If you had a gun on any district controlled land it was grounds for instant termination regardless of reason for having it, where it was or what control it was under (I.E. locked container etc..).

Just saying check into it but I would just leave it at home an pick it up after you are done at the school/office but your call.

Decoligny
11-18-2009, 7:28 AM
For that, you'd have to argue that the legislature really didn't mean to say it was a 3-5 year felony rap to bring a gun onto campus.

There are lots of sloppy spots in PC. Sometimes a good lawyer can take advantage. It's my guess this isn't one of those times.

This section is not sloppy at all. Section (c)(2) says that if the firearm is in a locked container you are not in violation of section (b). Section (f) says if you violate Section (b) you do time. No violation of Section (b) = no jail time.

Decoligny
11-18-2009, 7:32 AM
IIRC, There is also the handgun transportation restriction. You can't just carry a handgun around - you can only go to and from the range. Some think you can't even stop for gas.
Sorry, can't remember code right now.

And some people believe in the Easter Bunny.

The code is PC 12026.2 and it deals with transportation of a handgun by pretty much every means other than in a motor vehicle, and lists specific destinations required to meet the exemption.

PC 12026.1 specifically exempts transport in a motor vehicle in a locked secure container, with NO limitations on destination listed at all.

Seesm
11-18-2009, 7:34 AM
God forbid if the OP was also able to save the lives of everyone on campus when a badguy or girl storms onto the scene with a hammer and sickle and plans for everyone. :)

GrizzlyGuy
11-18-2009, 8:08 AM
For that, you'd have to argue that the legislature really didn't mean to say it was a 3-5 year felony rap to bring a gun onto campus.

There are lots of sloppy spots in PC. Sometimes a good lawyer can take advantage. It's my guess this isn't one of those times.

I think the legislature's intent was to provide for a harsher sentence if the gun was illegally on the school grounds, where the "risk" to students is higher, vs. hundreds of feet from the school grounds where the risk to them is lower.

A sloppier spot in the PC would be the 12025 exemptions. 12026.1 is absent of destination/purpose/direct-route provisions, but it does begin by saying "Section 12025 shall not be construed to prohibit any citizen...from transporting or carrying any pistol..." I think a DA would argue that storing the gun in your car for an entire work day isn't really "transporting or carrying" in the sense meant by the legislature, and go after you that way.

Personally, I wouldn't do this unless I had "written permission of the school district superintendent, his or her designee, or equivalent school authority" (from 626.9) to take 626.9 out of the way and establish, implicitly or preferably explicitly, a 'lawful purpose' for having the gun on school grounds.

Cokebottle
11-18-2009, 9:43 AM
God forbid if the OP was also able to save the lives of everyone on campus when a badguy or girl storms onto the scene with a hammer and sickle and plans for everyone. :)
+1

Gun free zone = Target rich environment.

ZRX61
11-18-2009, 10:30 AM
Related news:
Security guard was stabbed in campus at AVC yesterday.. They used to be a police dept, but didn't actually have the correct accredation..