PDA

View Full Version : CHP forcibly removing residents and confiscating guns in New Orleans


karldotcom
09-08-2005, 10:24 PM
KABC just showed the CHP mutual aid team forcibly remove a lady that said she didnt want to leave her house in New Orleans. They also confiscated her revolver.

Arent those officers sworn to uphold the constitution? And are they operating under LA. Governor Blanco's authority?

So, in the State of California, they are not allowed to force someone out of their homes as a brush fire approaches, but in another state under someone else's authority, are allowed to forcibly evict someone from their private house without an arrest warrant and confiscate their firearm under Mayor Nagin's unconstitutional order.

I saw an explanation by Judge Napolitano on Fox News stating that the Mayor didnt have the authority to force people from their homes, that it was illegal without an arrest warrant.

Any Comments?

UPDATE - Found a short version of the story I watched

California Highway Patrol officers swarm homeowner, force her evacuation and confiscate her gun (http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?section=nation_world&id=3428024)

Click Forced Evacuations under related links

Technical Ted
09-08-2005, 10:59 PM
Part of THE LOUISIANA HOMELAND SECURITY AND EMERGENCY ASSISTANCE AND DISASTER ACT

Got all this from the LA state legislature website.

http://www.legis.state.la.us/lss/lss.asp?doc=85673

The mayor of NO is considered the parish president of NO.

§727. Powers of the parish president; penalties for violations

A. Each political subdivision within this state shall be within the jurisdiction of and served by the Military Department, office of homeland security and emergency preparedness, for purposes of homeland security and emergency preparedness and by a parish homeland security and emergency preparedness agency responsible for emergency or disaster mitigation, preparedness, response, and recovery.

B. Each parish president is hereby authorized and directed to establish an office of homeland security and emergency preparedness for the respective parish.

C. Each parish president shall maintain a homeland security and emergency preparedness agency which, except as otherwise provided under this Chapter, has jurisdiction over and serves the entire parish.

D. A local disaster or emergency may be declared only by the parish president, except as otherwise provided in this Chapter. In that event, the state of emergency shall continue until the parish president finds that the threat of danger has been dealt with to the extent that emergency conditions no longer exist. The state of emergency may be terminated by executive order or proclamation, but no state of emergency may continue for longer than thirty days unless extended by the parish president. The state of emergency or disaster may be terminated by the governor, a petition signed by a majority of the surviving members of either house of the legislature, or a majority of the surviving members of the parish governing authority. The document terminating the state of emergency or disaster may establish a period during which no other declaration of emergency or disaster may be issued. All executive orders or proclamations issued under this Subsection shall indicate the nature of the emergency, the area or areas which are or may be affected, and the conditions which brought it about. Any order or proclamation declaring, continuing, or terminating a local disaster or emergency shall be given prompt and general publicity and shall be filed promptly with the office of emergency preparedness and the office of the clerk of court.

E. Notwithstanding any other provision of this Chapter, when the parish president declares a local disaster or emergency within such subdivision the parish president shall carry out the provisions of this Chapter. Nothing contained herein shall be construed to confer upon the parish president any authority to control or direct the activities of any state agency. When the disaster or emergency is beyond the capabilities of the local government, the parish president shall request assistance from the state office of emergency preparedness. The declaration of a local emergency will serve to activate the response and recovery program of the local government.

F. In addition to any other powers conferred upon the parish president by the constitution, laws, or by a home rule charter or plan of government, such authority may do any or all of the following:

(1) Suspend the provisions of any regulatory ordinance prescribing the procedures for conduct of local business, or the orders, rules, or regulations of any local agency, if strict compliance with the provisions of any ordinance, order, rule, or regulation would in any way prevent, hinder, or delay necessary action in coping with the emergency.

(2) Utilize all available resources of the local government as reasonably necessary to cope with the local disaster or emergency.

(3) Transfer the direction, personnel, or functions of local departments and agencies or units thereof for the purpose of performing or facilitating emergency services.

(4) Subject to any applicable requirements for compensation, commandeer or utilize any private property if he finds this necessary to cope with the local disaster.

(5) Direct and compel the evacuation of all or part of the population from any stricken or threatened area within the boundaries of the parish if he deems this action necessary for mitigation, response, or recovery measures.

(6) Prescribe routes, modes of transportation, and destinations in connection with evacuation within the local government's jurisdiction.

(7) Control ingress and egress to and from the affected area, the movement of persons within the area, and the occupancy of premises therein.

Powers of the governor:
http://www.legis.state.la.us/lss/lss.asp?doc=85670

§724. Powers of the governor

A. The governor is responsible for meeting the dangers to the state and people presented by emergencies or disasters, and in order to effectuate the provisions of this Chapter, the governor may issue executive orders, proclamations, and regulations and amend or rescind them. Executive orders, proclamations, and regulations so issued shall have the force and effect of law.

B.(1) A disaster or emergency, or both, shall be declared by executive order or proclamation of the governor if he finds a disaster or emergency has occurred or the threat thereof is imminent. The state of disaster or emergency shall continue until the governor finds that the threat of danger has passed or the disaster or emergency has been dealt with to the extent that the emergency conditions no longer exist and terminates the state of disaster or emergency by executive order or proclamation, but no state of disaster or emergency may continue for longer than thirty days unless renewed by the governor.

(2) The legislature, by petition signed by a majority of the surviving members of either house, may terminate a state of disaster or emergency at any time. This petition terminating the state of emergency or disaster may establish a period during which no other declaration of emergency or disaster may be issued. Thereupon, the governor shall issue an executive order or proclamation ending the state of disaster or emergency.

(3) All executive orders or proclamations issued under this Subsection shall indicate the nature of the disaster or emergency, the area or areas which are or may be affected, and the conditions which have brought it about or which make possible the termination of the state of disaster or emergency. An executive order or proclamation shall be disseminated promptly by means calculated to bring its contents to the attention of the general public and, unless the circumstances attendant upon the disaster or emergency prevent or impede it, promptly filed with the Military Department, state of Louisiana, office of emergency preparedness, and the secretary of state.

C. The declaration of an emergency or disaster by the governor shall activate the state's emergency response and recovery program under the command of the director of the state office of homeland security and emergency preparedness.

D. In addition to any other powers conferred upon the governor by law, he may do any or all of the following:

(1) Suspend the provisions of any regulatory statute prescribing the procedures for conduct of state business, or the orders, rules, or regulations of any state agency, if strict compliance with the provisions of any statute, order, rule, or regulation would in any way prevent, hinder, or delay necessary action in coping with the emergency.

(2) Utilize all available resources of the state government and of each political subdivision of the state as reasonably necessary to cope with the disaster or emergency.

(3) Transfer the direction, personnel, or functions of state departments and agencies or units thereof for the purpose of performing or facilitating emergency services.

(4) Subject to any applicable requirements for compensation, commandeer or utilize any private property if he finds this necessary to cope with the disaster or emergency.

(5) Direct and compel the evacuation of all or part of the population from any stricken or threatened area within the state if he deems this action necessary for the preservation of life or other disaster mitigation, response, or recovery.

(6) Prescribe routes, modes of transportation, and destination in connection with evacuation.

(7) Control ingress and egress to and from a disaster area, the movement of persons within the area, and the occupancy of premises therein.

...and as far as private property and the US Constitution goes, this ruling came out of the SCOTUS a little while ago:
http://calguns.net/groupee/forums/a/tpc/f/545600176/m/33710389521

bwiese
09-08-2005, 11:32 PM
Yup. The thing is, 'martial law' may not have been really declared and chief of police may be acting like he has those powers. Just caught a brief wind of this on Nightline as I was making a sandwich.

And I bet some/many of these cops rounding up folks and taking guns consider themselves 'pro gun'.

This is why I think cops are useless pieces of scum.

If N.O. cops don't resign and are taking innocent folks guns while on their own property, they should be shot in the heart.

I hope to goodness some NOPD get some nice 308s and are strung up from power poles in functioning neighborhoods where residents have prepared themselves and are comfortable staying.

I can see this possibly happening in my city (EQ + flood in parts of SJ but with other areas unscathed) where I could be relatively nicely set up on my hill but .gov tries to force me to evacuate.

Sorry, I won't go quietly into that bus to the SJ Arena, cops; I can always find someone to care for my cat and be willed my assets.

That's the nice thing about not having kids. You can only kill me once and it'll take a lot of y'all to get it done.

THREATS OF ANY SORT ARE NOT ALLOWED.
THEY WILL BE REMOVED FROM THE BOARD.
CONTINUED USE OF ANY FORM OF THREAT AN GET YOU REMOVED FROM THE BOARD.

Balance of fear is only way to maintain freedom.

Balance of fear is the tool of the weak and cowardly.


Bill Wiese
San Jose

artherdGROUPEESUCKS
09-09-2005, 12:35 AM
This is bad, really bad.

I've mirrored the clip on the CDglobal servers: http://cdglobal.net/nola/25022023432.avi

Mike Searson
09-09-2005, 12:39 AM
Well, Mr Balls you registered your assault weapons like a good subject...don't you think that would be known in advance?

Did you register them as .50 caliber weapons, too?

Now they'll know you could "in theory" hit them from a long way off. Oh wait a minute...there's links on the internet saying you can shoot down aircraft with those things.

If martial law were declared, do you think officer friendly will knock and announce? Do you not think that it will come up on a screen ahead of time..."Oh, Mr Weise...owns several AR15's, a Barret M82A1 and some FAL's...he's also been quoted on an anti cop militant internet forum as being a resistor who wants retribution on our families. Send in the little bird with the miniguns."
"Littlebird"?
"OH, S**T, right, the 50...better call in the bradleys"

I realize that lot's of folks talk tough till they have to actually stand in the door. This is just the internet and not to take it too seriously, but for a supposedly smart guy, whom I have referred people to for legal advice, etc...you don't have a lick of common sense at times.

Do you have a link to back this up?:
You can only kill me once and it'll take a lot of y'all to get it done.
Are you saying that with the cigar dangling from your mouth going: "See coppah...you'll never take me alive...nyeah nyeah".

How many men did you kill with your JavaVirtualMachine before you lost count?

How many times have you been shot? Most gunshot wounds are barely noticeable at first...those headshots really get your attention...real disconcerting to wake up in a hospital when your last memory is lining a man up in your sights.

Remember everyone...us Soldiers and Marines only know how to shoot...we're not walking death machines like computer programmers from the peninsula. They read about this stuff on the internet and can copy and paste links.

This post is really beneath you, Bill.

I honestly don't care what you think of me or my friends and relatives who wear a badge or a uniform. We give you the right to run your mouth like a spoiled child because you claim you don't like the living conditions of this state.

I hate the laws, too; and like you, I respect them. I'm selling off all my property in this state and moving to where a man can live like a freeman. You choose to live here...pity, because it sounds like you don't enjoy it very much.

You had one bad run in with a cop and therefore all cops are bad...what's that you said about anecdotal evidence?

For the record...I do not agree with what is going on in New Orleans. I choose not to live among the sheeple in apartment complexes and I am considered a whacko because I keep 30 days supply of food, water, and other supplies to take care of my family. Don't put yourself in that situation if you can avoid it.

Seems to me, if you believed your own bulls**t you'd be worried about some "jack booted thugs" paying you a visit for running your suck like this.

artherdGROUPEESUCKS
09-09-2005, 12:51 AM
Mike, I would shoot a criminal entering my residence armed with the intent to do me serious bodily harm, as I hope for your sake you would as well.

They better check the armour on the Bradley as well, I think M2AP can defeat it out of bwise's M82A1.

Now that you mention it, I've got an M82A1 also. And about 500 rounds for it.

Mike Searson
09-09-2005, 12:57 AM
Yes, I would.

Someone enforcing an illegal law may be a criminal.

I just wouldn't go shooting my mouth off on an internet forum about killing cops and having my relatives kill their children.

Despite our debates...I think Bill is an ok guy...just a bit of a pompous *** that needs a reality check every now and then.

Didn't you guys grow up with brothers and get into fistfights? Still brothers, right?

If you're a cop hater as well:
Put the N word in place of "Cop" in Bill's post and tell me how comfortable that makes you.

Nevermind...if you hate cops, God knows what you think of people of color.

bwiese
09-09-2005, 1:02 AM
No Mike, I'm not a gamer. I don't play Recon or whatever it is. When I'm at the screen I'm usu coding, etc.

But, damn, if I'm gonna be run out of my own home, I'll make sure there's a stack of bodies in/near the doorway. Since they're metro cops, not military, they're (statistically) likely to be relatively poor shooters. In a disaster, they can't send SWAT/etc everywhere.

'Little birds' w/Gatlings will never be used for things like this - politically untouchable. It's the two or three 30-yr old scared cops with unclear directions overreacting, rousting folks, and not knowing when comamnds/authority are legitimate or not, and making big assumptions.

In an extrordinary situation like LA/NO, where everything's lost or near-lost, it's time to stand up and fight. Probably futile, probably I end up in a box, but hell, I mighta ended up there anyway. I can certainly help the state pension plan along by reducing some overhead.

I give some words of wisdom here regarding CA law just to keep good folks out of the cooler, and follow those stupid laws during a regular existence. All bets are off when it's a situation like last week/this week in LA.

And the nice thing of it is, you notice it's the local COPS in LA doing the rousting, NOT the Army/NG/etc - the latter are there for rescue and transportation, not evictions.

For the record, NO cops are the lowest of the low. Very high conviction rates for bribery, drug dealing, etc. One NOPD cop was caught killing a witness to a crime. Per capita criminality by NOPD in ordinary times is much higher than that of average citizenry - based on convictions alone (and not un-caught crimes).

And no, I've never really had a bad run-in with a cop. They don't hassle me, I've got short hair, pressed shirt, shiny shoes and Armor-All'd tires on my truck.

I just don't like idiots assuming martial law exists due to some wisecrack assumption of a politician, then going out and rousting perfectly functional, prepared people from functional homes - and taking their guns.

When you're a rights violator, you deserve to die.

Good on you for moving out of CA though. Unfortunately for what I do I kinda need to be around here, and my 76yr old mom is also on the peninsula, along with my GF. Austin TX would be nice but it's not quite the tech concentration of Silicon Valley.


Bill Wiese
San Jose

bwiese
09-09-2005, 1:06 AM
Originally posted by Mike Searson:
I just wouldn't go shooting my mouth off on an internet forum about killing cops and having my relatives kill their children.

I live my life publicly and have no shame for my opinions.

Didn't you guys grow up with brothers and get into fistfights? Still brothers, right?


Nope. Only child. Folks took one look and said 'No more!'.

If you're a cop hater as well:
Put the N word in place of "Cop" in Bill's post and tell me how comfortable that makes you.
Nevermind...if you hate cops, God knows what you think of people of color.

Folks of color were born that way. They don't hurt me.

Cops often choose to be cops because of financial incentives that pay them at rates their skills could far from garner in the private sector.

There are quite a few good cops, esp the ones that come out of the military. But the bulk I've seen - combined with union pressure to be democrats, esp in metro areas - leave me with nothing but scorn.

Bill Wiese
San Jose

artherdGROUPEESUCKS
09-09-2005, 1:20 AM
bwise may have gone over the edge threatening the children of criminals...

Then again, if these officers want a war, I will bring them a war.

I do have a brother, we've had scuffles, but never an allout fist-fight. And not to put too find a point on it, to this date, he has not tried to KILL ME either.

Lastly, I have nothing but the highest respect for law enforcement. Infact a friend of mine is a CA leo in NO right now. I hope he is not part of this...


Your race strawman is utterly illogical. YES, if the niggers, the spics, the wasps, the crackers, whoever instead of the cops were trying to place me in imminent threat of death or severe bodily harm, you're damned right I'll execute every one of them.

Yes, I would.

Someone enforcing an illegal law may be a criminal.

I just wouldn't go shooting my mouth off on an internet forum about killing cops and having my relatives kill their children.

Despite our debates...I think Bill is an ok guy...just a bit of a pompous *** that needs a reality check every now and then.

Didn't you guys grow up with brothers and get into fistfights? Still brothers, right?

If you're a cop hater as well:
Put the N word in place of "Cop" in Bill's post and tell me how comfortable that makes you.

Nevermind...if you hate cops, God knows what you think of people of color.

Mike Searson
09-09-2005, 1:24 AM
Corrupt cops aside...you don't live in New Orleans so they have no bearing on you.

How many police officers do you think have military training? San Jose PD recruits heavily from the Military. There is an amazing cross section of Marines, Rangers, SpecialForces guys, and even a former ParaRescue guy in Bay area Law Enforcement.
Many of them have seen action in Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. Some of them still go back with the reserves and other DoD assignments.

I will be more than happy to send you pictures of a buddy of mine who is an AirForce doorgunner doing rescue ops in Nawlins...Blackwater even has their littlebirds down there helping out.

Do you really think they would not get preemptive authorization to use bradleys or miniguns on a registered assault weapon owner who has 50 caliber antiaircraft guns holed up in his compound?

I'll bet those nice folks at Waco thought the same thing.

You really should go for a ride-along some night, Bill...it might open your eyes to the reality these guys have to deal with.

Inflammatory posts like that are worse than admitting you own 2 dozen unregistered AK's.
You have said that CalDOJ and other LEO agencies monitor this forum.

You and I don't like the laws but we respect them, we obviously took different routes in 1999...I got rid of my AW's because I don't believe in registration. You registered yours and are now on a list.

I've been pulled over a few times...I get handshakes, a "Semper fi", even a salute...now and then. There are dirty cops out there, but in my experience, California has some of the most professional law enforcemet people I've ever met.

Relook at Austin..Colorado...hell...I'm predicting the future of tech outsourcing is going to be our heartland as opposed to India.
More and more companies are getting smart and leaving California...real estate's too high, regulations too severe, cost of living is insane. And the people are just plain...f****d!

I just hope I can sell the last house before the bubble pops!


Oh, and if anybody ever went after any of my friend's kids...I'd skin them alive and eat their liver.

Mike Searson
09-09-2005, 1:44 AM
Originally posted by bwiese:
Nope. Only child. Folks took one look and said 'No more!'.
Explains the narcissism. http://calguns.net/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

If you're a cop hater as well:
Put the N word in place of "Cop" in Bill's post and tell me how comfortable that makes you.
Nevermind...if you hate cops, God knows what you think of people of color.

Folks of color were born that way. They don't hurt me.

OK, thought you were an engineer...apparently you don't think to well in the abstract.

So...according to your logic...every cop on the face of the earth hurts you and is bad. This is how you can lambaste them as you do behind your monitor.

So when a klansman says "I got beat up by every black person I've met...therefore they are scum" you feel he has a right to that opinion?

I could say "Cops are born that way"...same with "Marines,Soldiers, etc".

Cops often choose to be cops because of financial incentives that pay them at rates their skills could far from garner in the private sector.

This is a joke...do you have any idea what cop salaries are? Not as high as what you might think...I don't know a single cop that got into it for the "high pay"...I've stayed away from it only because I make so much more money in the private sector.

There are quite a few good cops, esp the ones that come out of the military. But the bulk I've seen - combined with union pressure to be democrats, esp in metro areas - leave me with nothing but scorn.


I do not know one cop in the US that votes democratic...and off the top of my head I would have to say that list entails around 500 acquaintences, students, immediate family members, and close friends.

Sounds like you know/hang with the wrong people.

Police administrators are another story...and if that's where you're confused...I can see it...those types are more politician than cop and well...california politicians are scum for the most part. Those are not the types who will pull you over, serve a warrant, etc. They are the types that polish their chairs with their asses.

I don't know...I find these posts offensive about killing children and family members of people who only want to help others. Sorry you don't see it that way...guess it's just another differnce between those of us from the Warrior Caste and those who are not.

bwiese
09-09-2005, 2:44 AM
Originally posted by Mike Searson:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by bwiese:
Nope. Only child. Folks took one look and said 'No more!'.

Explains the narcissism. http://calguns.net/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Narcissism? I don't love myself enough to sign up for a job for a cushy state pension.


</div></BLOCKQUOTE>OK, thought you were an engineer... apparently you don't think to well in the abstract.

So... according to your logic...every cop on the face of the earth hurts you and is bad. This is how you can lambaste them as you do behind your monitor.[/quote]

Given that over 50% of 'crime' that cops are working on these days is the irrelevant & already-lost drug war, we can in effect say that 1/2 our cops are useless. I don't want to pay for these folks, I don't want to pay for the drug war, etc. In many states cops fight a war against guns (NYC, NJ especially). Federal monies, taken from me in CA, can get redirected to other states. So even other states' cops concern me, yes.

So when a klansman says "I got beat up by every black person I've met...therefore they are scum" you feel he has a right to that opinion?


No one's volunteered to be black, Chinese, Cambodian, etc. And they don't get a lifetime 90+% pension at 50years old for being that way.

do you have any idea what cop salaries are? Not as high as what you might think...I don't know a single cop that got into it for the "high pay"...I've stayed away from it only because I make so much more money in the private sector.

In CA metro areas, a sgt can get near $100K area. Plus, HE IS A MILLIONAIRE IF HE JUST SHOWS UP... retire at 50+ with 90+% salary and full health benefits and with expected 30 year further lifespan, there has to be over $1+ million in the bank to feed that sluice.

Combined with other public employees we're creating a two-tiered society: public folks w/pensions and private sector folks (those who are forced to support these public folks) without pensions. Public sector folks need to be exposed to market risk.

I do not know one cop in the US that votes democratic... and off the top of my head I would have to say that list entails around 500 acquaintences, students, immediate family members, and close friends.

You may be out in the sticks, and different demographics. Cops in bay area vote at least 60+% democrat. What about all those bastards in uniform that stood behind Grey Davis holding up assault weapons when he signed SB23???

of people who only want to help others.
Let's see how willing they are to 'help others' when we re-do state pension plans so they are defined contribution (401K style) instead of defined benefit.

And if you're a cop that does anything involving nonviolent use of firerams (i.e., busting folks for unreg'd AWs or CCW etc) you have less-than-zero support from me, you have active hatred as I'm forced to pay money to you to have you violate my rights.

Bill Wiese
San Jose

Mike Searson
09-09-2005, 7:00 AM
If you are going to throw out a percentage of cops voting democratic, please post a link to that statistic.

Or is it just something else you're pulling out of your ***?

As far as demographics...I'm talking about every cop I've ever met. I've lived in 7 other states and in 4 other parts of this one...my entire world is not the SF peninsula.

dave3006
09-09-2005, 7:04 AM
I think what Mike does not realize is that he is part of the pathetically incompetent GOVERNMENT that is bungling things like 9/11 and New Orleans and on a daily basis steals our money and rights. I frankly don't care WHICH branch you belong to. You are government and you suck at what you do. You guys like to hide behind statements like "that wasn't us that ____, it was the state, feds, ect".

I am not buying it. You all are incompetent and should resign in mass to show your disgust with a broken system.

American's grossly overpay for the quality of gov't they receive.

P.S. I would never enforce unconstitutional laws for a paycheck. I can't be bought.

Mike Searson
09-09-2005, 7:05 AM
I don't work for the government, dave.

And I don't hide behind anything...much less a screen name.

dave3006
09-09-2005, 7:39 AM
I honestly don't care what you think of me or my friends and relatives who wear a badge or a uniform.

Newsflash - if you get paid by the excessive taxes stole from my paycheck, you work for the gov't.

Governments are the most incompetent entities on planet earth.

Mike Searson
09-09-2005, 7:41 AM
i work in the private sector, ****head.

Governments are the most incompetent entities on planet earth.

That's about the only thing you've said that makes sense.

dave3006
09-09-2005, 7:55 AM
You said you "wear a badge". You must be one of those fat rent-a-cops then. That is hot.

Mike Searson
09-09-2005, 8:04 AM
I honestly don't care what you think of me or my friends and relatives who wear a badge or a uniform.
Obviously you are a product of the california public school system.

Zip up your pants, your IQ is showing, ********

dave3006
09-09-2005, 8:15 AM
Rent-a-cop, put down your walkie talkie and keep cheerleading for the police. I am sure they will take that into consideration when you submit your application for the academy.

Mike Searson
09-09-2005, 8:25 AM
Is that the best you can do, milquetoast?

karldotcom
09-09-2005, 8:41 AM
California Highway Patrol officers swarm homeowner, force her evacuation and confiscate her gun (http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?section=nation_world&id=3428024)

Click Forced Evacuations under related links

50 Freak
09-09-2005, 8:48 AM
Okay cool down everyone.

First we are getting of the subject. Second, there is no need for name calling here. Both Mike and Bill, you guys are respected members here. SHOW IT.

Question...Was marshall law declared in NO? If so by who? Does this person have the authority to do so. Was it declared by that pinhead mayor. Notice the National Guard / army have refused to "clear" homes, it is only being done by the LE's. What's that got to say to you?

Mike, the people on this board have a problem seeing CA Highway Patrol "taking" down a 60 + year old lady in her own freaking house. Granted she had a 50 year old (looked like a 38) pistol in her hand. They had M-16's, and body armor. A Chiper weighing about maybe 250 tackled this little old lady IN HER OWN FREAKING KITCHEN, WHEN SHE WAS TALKING TO THE NEWS REPORTER...

What was her crime. She didn't want to go??? I was watching the new report when it happened. And I can tell you, her neighborhood was dry as a bone, houses were still standing and it looked okay. If it were that dangerous for her to stay, why the hell were the newsreports walking the street freely?

I'll have to agree with Bill on this one. I respect LE's, but the minute they start busting in my house to lead me to a center "for my own good" That is the moment I choose to not listen to the "law" and respond by returning fire. I'm not a SEAL or even a military guy, but I've been in situations where I've had to return fire (and no, not on some video game either), and I know myself enough to confidently say, I'd be sending some of them home in body bags. Which is a shame because basically they would be obeying illegal orders.

Mike Searson
09-09-2005, 8:53 AM
Thanks 50

What's going on in New Orleans is tragic. It's tough to second guess what anyone will do. Maybe that's why I choose to live on the side of a mountain...so these problems don't land on my door.

It still does not give anyone the right to advocate the murder of the children of policemen.

Thankfully, I know mouthbreathers like Dave are the minority on this board.

imported_1911_sfca
09-09-2005, 9:11 AM
Mike, thanks for some fresh air of reason in here. Sometimes I am ashamed to be on this forum.. People start getting wrapped up in conspiracy theories and anti-government paranoia. This is a gun board, not a government sucks board or a cops are overpaid morons board. Thank you.

imported_dadoody
09-09-2005, 9:23 AM
I don't blame the cops and soilders. They're just doing their jobs as tools of the state.

Though this worries me. And how can anyone fight? The military and the police are much better armed. The only way we can hold off oppressive government intervention is by holding out in numbers.

Anyways, here's the weird thing:
They took their sweet *** time responding to this crisis, yet are now forcibly evacuation those who can survive on their own, rather than focus on the people on who need the help and stopping the trouble makers.

I don't blame the Federal government as much as I blame the incompetent MAYOR of New Orleans and GOVERNOR who took her sweet *** time federalizing the state.

That they be confiscating firearms from people who aren't doing any harm is what I consider troubling.

50 Freak
09-09-2005, 9:33 AM
I don't blame the cops and soilders. They're just doing their jobs as tools of the state.

Though this worries me. And how can anyone fight? The military and the police are much better armed. The only way we can hold off oppressive government intervention is by holding out in numbers.

I don't know about that, Some of us have pretty "nice" collection. Only thing I'm lacking is a C-130 with 20mm chain guns, but I'm working on that and should have it in a month or two http://calguns.net/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Also remember, it was the NO police that was going around asking to borrow guns. Also it was the Burbank PD that had to "borrow" those ARs from B&B guns during that bank robbery. I don't think the LE's are typically as well armed as we think they are. Not in comparison to some of us.

Also, look at what kind of problems we are having in the sand box right now. And that is in a state like 10 times smaller than the whole US. I think the military would definitely have their hands full if it was a SHTF situation and they had to enforce marshall law across the country. Plus, if it was an unjust marshall law, I'd like to believe our boys in uniform will refuse to obey orders. Remember they swore to uphold the constition not fight because some politician's ego or what not. Quite a different story when you are having to fight against people who are your neighbors, brothers, parents.

Anyways, here's the weird thing:
They took their sweet *** time responding to this crisis, yet are now forcibly evacuation those who can survive on their own, rather than focus on the people on who need the help and stopping the trouble makers.

What's even more weird is that pinhead mayor first said it was okay to return home then later that day or next day (don't remember when exactly) said everyone should evacuate. Again, I ask, WAS MARSHALL LAW DECLARED? And if so, by who?

Did Bill really advocate killing LE's kids? Doesn't sound like him. But hey I agree, some kids now a days need it. Teach them some manners. http://calguns.net/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif http://calguns.net/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif http://calguns.net/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Kestryll
09-09-2005, 10:00 AM
Enough is enough.

While I understand that we are all concerned and in some cases angered by what is going on in N.O. there is a limit to what is acceptable on this Board.
So far this thread has violated quite a few of the rule of the board, threats, language and name-calling just to name a few.
Since this is a topic of very high interest to the shooting community it is somewhat understandable but still inexcusable. Rather than take any direct action towards anyone I am merely editing posts at this time. This is due to the unprecedented violation of our rights occurring at this time, it needs to be addressed and not forgotten.

Normally I try to do things by PM but since everyone is airing their laundry…

Bill, as stated in the edit of your post threats of any nature are strictly forbidden. You can dislike or hate cops as much as you like but you cannot threaten them or their families on this board. This is non-negotiable.
On a personal note independent of my statements as a Moderator, you mention living your life publicly and without shame. When you threaten innocents such as the Wives and children of another you are no better than the terrorist filth we are fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan and should feel very ashamed.

Mike, no matter the context profanity and name-calling is also not allowed.
Unfortunately you are going to find this kind of anger and attitude towards NOPD on almost every gun board out there. Many people were assuming that in this type of event the LEOs and Military personnel would refuse an order to disarm Americans at gunpoint. N.O. is proving that assumption wrong. Sadly I would have to agree that as much as I support our Military and street cops should they try to violate my Constitutional rights by illegally disarming me I would be inclined to resist with force.

Dave I have no idea what your position is in this other than instigator, I have seen nothing other than trying to ‘pick a fight’ in your posts in this topic. If you care to add anything informative feel free, if not remember what Granny always said “If you can’t say anything nice…”

Since this topic is beginning to get back online and becoming more civilized I will not close it as I was intending, please justify my faith in the members of this board.


As to the topic at hand. If this is not slammed back hard, and I mean Federal charges, lawsuits, people removed from office and denounced loudly and publicly, then this will stand with the SCOTUS ruling on private property rights as an equal or greater sign of the end of our Country.
The loss of the ability to own land and to own weapons to defend that land relegates us to the status of feudal serfs. That can not be tolerated.

Mike Searson
09-09-2005, 10:09 AM
Kes,

I apologize for my profanity.
I will not type out four letter words in the future.

I do have no sympathy for anyone who harms a child or threatans it, though.

I think there is more to the story of NO than what we hear and see in soundbytes...

Kestryll
09-09-2005, 10:29 AM
Originally posted by Mike Searson:

I do have no sympathy for anyone who harms a child or threatans it, though.
Ageed! Every one of us has a duty to protect innocents regardless, and children definitly qualify.

I think there is more to the story of NO than what we hear and see in soundbytes...
This is so much more often the case.

bg
09-09-2005, 11:05 AM
Sorry, I won't go quietly into that bus to the SJ Arena, cops; I can always find someone to care for my cat and be willed my assets.
If I've learned anything it's not a good idea to
be sheep herded into an arena. One has only to look at past history both early and late.

Take Rome for instance, not much chance making it out of there. You know lions and tigers and bears..Recently the soccer arena in Afghanistan when the Taliban were the head chingos.
Once you were brought there, it was curtains.

Now it's NO. Where once they had a pretty decent
arena, that soon turned into a rancid pressure
cooker. Whats bad about this NO deal is all the
gang members that have been moved to other
parts of the country due to evac.

Should cops come wanting my firearms, I don't
know which way I'll go. It'll be the hardest
decision I'll most likely make. Everything
will be in a mercurial state. I just hope
and try to vote to keep this from not happening.

50 Freak
09-09-2005, 11:11 AM
I do have no sympathy for anyone who harms a child or threatans it, though.
Ageed!

Every one of us has a duty to protect innocents regardless, and children definitly qualify.

Not LE's according to the US supreme court. Sorry, I have to point that out.

Bruce
09-09-2005, 11:23 AM
A lot of people think along the same line as Mr. Wiese. They want to fight out a Constitutional issue on the spot rather than in the courts. Fortunately or unfortunately, depending on who you listen to, the SCOTUS continues to duck the 2nd Amendment issue.
IIRC, N.O. is in the jurisdiction of the Fed Court that has held the 2nd is an individual right. Nagin et al should be hauled in there for civil rights violations. However, it's hard to sue if you're dead from a shootout with the cops. And guess what the "official" version will be since "dead men tell no tales"

artherdGROUPEESUCKS
09-09-2005, 11:50 AM
When some lackey is busting into my house with an AR, it is TOO DAMN LATE to write my senator!

I'm just as dead from a shootout with armed invaders as I would be from a *slaughter* by roaving looters.

The latter would be a slaughter indeed because I'd been robed of the only effective means of self-defense.

Heads need to roll from this. I hope you can see that mike. I hope that you can see that your 'friends' who are over there doing this are not your friends at all.

And that they too would sentence you to death.

stealthmode
09-09-2005, 12:10 PM
people should bury the stuff they dont want confiscated anyway.

maxicon
09-09-2005, 12:30 PM
Should cops come wanting my firearms, I don't know which way I'll go. It'll be the hardest decision I'll most likely make.

I've given this a lot of thought over the years, and there's only 1 conclusion that makes sense to me.

You can't fight off the police with force without dying or being seriously injured. It's just not possible - they're never going to back down in the face of opposing force. A "cold, dead hands" policy is basically suicide by cop.

Now, I can understand people being willing to defend their basic rights with force, but ultimately, if they kill you, you've lost it all anyway. If you survive, you've got the chance of getting back your rights, freedom, and guns.

I also understand some people consider this cowardice, and would rather die than give in, and that's fine for them. I'm not ready to make that move - where there's life, there's hope.

Note that I've got a wife and 2 kids, so fighting off the cops from my house is not in their best interests, just like getting myself killed isn't. I'm going to be able to protect them better if I'm alive, even if they've taken my guns.

I might react differently if it were a case of armed insurrection against an oppressive government, but that's not what's happening in NOLA, regardless of how it looks.

Anybody who got themselves killed standing down LEOs in NOLA might be considered a martyr to some people (kind'a like Randy Weaver), but there's no way I'd go down that path.

YMMV, as always!

max

RRangel
09-09-2005, 12:41 PM
Well this debate is very heated. It's locked for now.

Update:

I'm posting this for all to read. We have a policy at Calguns.net. We're adults here.
I like to give people the benefit of the doubt, but last week I had to actually ban someone.

I don't like to do that, but if that's what it takes to keep the board civil then so be it. Please be civil here. That's all I ask.