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View Full Version : JD Machine BB Tool Legality


Phireglass
11-07-2009, 6:41 PM
Ok at the gun show today i came across the JD Machine booth and they had these new BB magnetic caps, the caps had a small rod in the middle to activate the BB, when you have this thing connected it functions just like a normal mag release. My question is when this thing is installed, even though they call it a tool wouldn't that make it part of the magazine release itself? Thus making it non CA compliant?

sytfu_RR
11-07-2009, 6:46 PM
You are correct, I believe the only to use this legally, would either:

A: Have 22LR upper installed prior to sticking it on.

B: Install it when in a free state and remove it prior to entering Kali, thus restoring the original mag lock.

However I saw him marketing it to many people, and didn't seem like he mentioned any of that. Also I believe I watched him stick it into BB locked OLL rifles and demonstrate its mag releasing capability. :eek::eek::eek::eek:

Phireglass
11-07-2009, 6:48 PM
Hah I know he did the same with me! He also wanted 20 bucks, too much to make your rifle really shady

Nxd9ar15xcrL
11-07-2009, 6:54 PM
I saw it too. it's worthless. the gun he had it on was a featerless with a monsterman grip. why does it need a BB in any case.

WORTHLESS

IsaacGlass
11-07-2009, 7:52 PM
I saw a booth at Cow Palace show selling these, seller quoted " These are legal and I have my lawyer drafted a legal disclaimer to go with each magnetic bullet button tool " I feel sorry for those who bought one thinking they're legal.

ke6guj
11-07-2009, 8:05 PM
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=238857

bwiese
11-07-2009, 8:10 PM
I have heard of this - KD and JDMT may be shipping them.

These caps can trigger AW status and just basically make a big magcatch button out of a BB.

If someone can kindly give me via PM JDMachine Tool and Kaiser Defense contact numbers, I want to talk with them on Monday.

shark92651
11-07-2009, 10:00 PM
I saw it too. it's worthless. the gun he had it on was a featerless with a monsterman grip. why does it need a BB in any case.

WORTHLESS

Did you think that perhaps he was demonstrating it on a featureless rifle to avoid manufacturing an Assault Weapon at the show?

ke6guj
11-07-2009, 10:05 PM
yah think?

ChrisO
11-07-2009, 11:18 PM
He would be would have been manufacturing a AW in any case every if it's a MMG with a bullet button and he put in a high cap mag you can not put a high cap mag in a locked mag rifle regardless of it having a pistol grip or not.

high_revs
11-07-2009, 11:38 PM
With the complex PRK laws, it's so easy to get busted. I would thought the seller of this would/should explicitly say featureless only. But if it was featureless, what's the point of using it at all? The only thing I can think of it you switch uppers and suddenly you have a forward pistol grip and a flash hider, and you need to be BB compliant at that point (removing the magnet). Or you go out of state and don't want to deal with the removal of the BB button and become free state setup, even if it only takes a couple of minutes to do.

sytfu_RR
11-07-2009, 11:51 PM
With the complex PRK laws, it's so easy to get busted. I would thought the seller of this would/should explicitly say featureless only. But if it was featureless, what's the point of using it at all? The only thing I can think of it you switch uppers and suddenly you have a forward pistol grip and a flash hider, and you need to be BB compliant at that point (removing the magnet). Or you go out of state and don't want to deal with the removal of the BB button and become free state setup, even if it only takes a couple of minutes to do.

Well the practical use of such an item would be for someone who either swaps a 22LR upper and or goes out of state frequently with their mag locked rifle. Then it would be a quick conversion and they're GTG. assuming they don't install until after the upper is swapped to 22LR or they're in a free state.

*edited to add* however the seller at the show doesn't advertise them in this manner.

ChrisO
11-07-2009, 11:53 PM
Like I said in above post I believe having a Mag lock on a featureless AR is a big no no "ridiculous" but I you cant have high caps in a BB equipped AR regardless of configuration.

Jicko
11-08-2009, 12:42 AM
Like I said in above post I believe having a Mag lock on a featureless AR is a big no no "ridiculous" but I you cant have high caps in a BB equipped AR regardless of configuration.

WRONG. Mag lock on a featuresless AR is OK! As long as you DO NOT use hi-cap mag.

-------------------

Anyways....

NONE of these "products" are "certified"! ANY of these "products" you are using, you are ON YOUR OWN!

You need to UNDERSTAND what you are getting yourself into BEFORE getting into this OLL scene. YOU need to UNDERSTAND and TEST your "products" and OLL-build to MAKE SURE that you are compliant of CA-AW-laws.... it is YOUR S in the jail if you do not comply with CA-AW-laws (ie. if you push the button and the magazine drop and you have an AW configuration!!).

You cannot blame ANY products. There are MANY out there, some of definitely more iffy than others.... do you own homework....

Some people are just out there making a quick bucks.... if you don't do your homework and pick the wrong thing.... or use it the wrong way..... again, it is YOUR S.....

Jpach
11-08-2009, 2:19 AM
He would be would have been manufacturing a AW in any case every if it's a MMG with a bullet button and he put in a high cap mag you can not put a high cap mag in a locked mag rifle regardless of it having a pistol grip or not.

Well if the alleged magnet tool thing is also on the MMGd and BBd rifle then it would not be a problem as the BB would be rendered into a normal mag release with the sketchy JD tool

ChrisO
11-08-2009, 9:31 PM
Well if the alleged magnet tool thing is also on the MMGd and BBd rifle then it would not be a problem as the BB would be rendered into a normal mag release with the sketchy JD tool


True, I just thought I saw somewhere that having a BB on a AR with MMG makes it a AW regardless because it is mag locked and you can not put the high capacity mags into a locked mag weapon even without the PG sorry if I was wrong guys not trying to spread FUD just making sure.

shark92651
11-08-2009, 9:39 PM
Would the OP please edit his posts to remove any reference to "JD Machine" in regards to this MAG MAGNET product unless you have proof that JD Machine is manufacturing/promoting/selling these. From what I understand they have nothing to do with this product other than the guy selling them was NEXT TO their booth.

Thread on the MAG MAGNET, with posts from the mfg, can be found here:
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=238857

ShelbyGT500
11-08-2009, 9:45 PM
Would the OP please edit his posts to remove any reference to "JD Machine" in regards to this MAG MAGNET product unless you have proof that JD Machine is manufacturing/promoting/selling these. From what I understand they have nothing to do with this product other than the guy selling them was NEXT TO their booth.

Thread on the MAG MAGNET, with posts from the mfg, can be found here:
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=238857

this.

The JDMT owner seems like a good guy ontop of the OLL scene...

robsolo
11-09-2009, 2:22 PM
JD is in fact selling them in their shop in San Diego FYI.

Phireglass
11-09-2009, 6:06 PM
Would the OP please edit his posts to remove any reference to "JD Machine" in regards to this MAG MAGNET product unless you have proof that JD Machine is manufacturing/promoting/selling these. From what I understand they have nothing to do with this product other than the guy selling them was NEXT TO their booth.

Thread on the MAG MAGNET, with posts from the mfg, can be found here:
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=238857

The man selling them was in fact at the JD counter with them right in front of their CalGuns lowers and as someone else posted I guess they got em at their shop too now I dont remember if they were manufacturing em themselves. but JD was definitely promoting them

anniepoks
11-09-2009, 8:32 PM
dont fall for the banana on the tail pipe!
pass the good word for those who might be misled!
nope nope nope! - not legal. dedicated .22 upper yes.

Purple K
11-09-2009, 9:15 PM
Just another snake oil salesman trying to make a fast buck.

shark92651
11-09-2009, 9:34 PM
I'll have to ask Rob about this the next time I talk to him. Interesting, we sell the Prince50 "Wonder Wrench" for $6 which is effectively the same type of product, but I don't call it the "RifleGear Wonder Wrench" ;) I don't recall this level of concern over the wonder wrench, although I remember there was some raised. Either of these products is legal if used properly by someone that understand exactly what constitutes a legally configured centerfire rifle. You would be amazed at how many people to this day think it is OK to unscrew the set screw on a Prince50 since they "are using a tool".