PDA

View Full Version : Anyone go from Tactical to KISS?


Standard
11-04-2009, 8:43 AM
Anyone ever simplify from a tactical style rifle back to a KISS type rifle?
I just did, and I think I like it a lot better...I went from a barebones build to a build with rail, VFG, BUIS, Red dot, magnifier, etc, back to a plastic handguard, carry handle and that's it (with MOE stock and grip).
Anyone else ever do this? I don't know why exactly, but I like it a lot more this way (for now, probably).

zman
11-04-2009, 8:47 AM
That's the beauty of the AR platform.

1811
11-04-2009, 8:49 AM
I think missiontrails did...

robairto
11-04-2009, 8:51 AM
All mine are quite basic rifles. I find it interesting that people remove the front grips and install a 4 sided rail and then put grip panels on to cover the
rails. Soooo yes. I like my rifles and and firearms pretty basic.

hoffman259
11-04-2009, 9:19 AM
I have a kiss and a tacticool. Love shooting both.

Bigballaizm
11-04-2009, 9:35 AM
I have a kiss and a tacticool. Love shooting both.

Me too, I like to change it up sometimes...

Vin496
11-04-2009, 9:41 AM
I went from a full tacticool to a simple light setup. I liked the looks of all that stuff, but after I went out shooting a few times. I realized I didn't care for all the extra baggage.

Standard
11-04-2009, 9:42 AM
I went from a full tacticool to a simple light setup. I liked the looks of all that stuff, but after I went out shooting a few times. I realized I didn't care for all the extra baggage.

That's how I felt too.

cmaynes
11-04-2009, 9:46 AM
I personally feel that it is a purpose issue-

things like Aimpoints, ACOG's or EOTechs have definite advantage if you are needing to acquire the fastest sight picture possible- But they are not a necessity for a range rifle.

Rail systems are the same sort of thing- If you have no interest in attaching a light or laser, they are added weight and cost that is purely cosmetic- If you like the way they look, great- but they obviously don't give that much performance unless they are allowing a good barrel to be free-floated.

1911whore
11-04-2009, 9:59 AM
all that crap hanging off the rifle is ONLY useful for people that actually use the rifle to protect life, or as a tool in their profession. To mall ninjas that are in abundance these days it is simply a waste of money. Use the rifle as you will fight with it.

MudCamper
11-04-2009, 10:09 AM
Anyone ever simplify from a tactical style rifle back to a KISS type rifle?
I just did, and I think I like it a lot better...I went from a barebones build to a build with rail, VFG, BUIS, Red dot, magnifier, etc, back to a plastic handguard, carry handle and that's it (with MOE stock and grip).
Anyone else ever do this? I don't know why exactly, but I like it a lot more this way (for now, probably).

Yup. I tried a VFG, a laser, an optic that required batteries. Hated all of it. Simple is good. And lightweight. And doesn't need batteries. And I've always loved the AR sight picture.

Standard
11-04-2009, 10:23 AM
The only downside I see to running the carry handle instead of my reddot is fast target acquisition, but I highly doubt I will ever be using my rifle in a gunfight any time soon anyways.
Too much SHTF fantasy :)

Grumpyoldretiredcop
11-04-2009, 10:43 AM
I used to have all the tacticool caca hung on my AR's, but as my back hurts more, the more KISS I go... :D

GuardianArmament
11-04-2009, 10:45 AM
I spent allot of money on my first AR built. Vltor CASV, Aimpoint, Surefire M900, etc... I took shooting for a weekend and hated it. To much crap for what I need. It looked great but did not function for the range. I am in the process of building my wife a new rifle with stock handguards and a detachable carry handle. I was a Marine from 95-2000 and we didn't have optics then. I still qualified expert at 500 yards with iron sights.

OutlawDon
11-04-2009, 10:59 AM
A resounding YES from me...at least conceptually in my head for now as I don't own one anymore. That will change soon. ;)

I had an AR for awhile and played with and bought all kinds of various add-on combinations for it. Ended up selling it a few months ago out of boredom. Now, I have the BRD again but this time, it's going to be a KISS style AR for me. I want something light, simple, and quick. I'll use my bolt action rifle for longer precision shooting if need be. I guess it's the "been there done that" mentality and I'm over the whole tacticool thing. I am going be to a more of a purist this time and enjoy the simplicity of the platform. To some, KISS can mean a retro build or a build where simplicity and functionality is the name of the game....no extraneous BS although a simply flashlight or red dot could be added. I'm in the latter part of this thinking.


This is very similar to the idea of what I intend to build, except I'll run a fixed BUIS (Larue, DD or Midwest Industries) and a Vortex FH.

"Everything you need, and nothing you don't" should be the standard motto.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2622/3753411557_bf6f10b800_o.jpg

someR1
11-04-2009, 11:17 AM
all that crap hanging off the rifle is ONLY useful for people that actually use the rifle to protect life, or as a tool in their profession. To mall ninjas that are in abundance these days it is simply a waste of money. Use the rifle as you will fight with it.

IMO a tacticool AR15 is very useful for home defense. For example: collapsible stock for tight corners/spaces, flashlight when all the lights are off, foregrips for stability,and rail handguards for anything else!

But, to each his own!!

secretasianman
11-04-2009, 1:59 PM
I like the quad rails with handguards since it gives you options to go tacticool or not. I currently have a red dot on top with BUIS and plan on attaching a side sling mount. Might add magnifier for the red dot... Not sure. If I wanted to I can attach a bipod on the bottom. It's all about options...

The collapsible stock is nice because I can adjust it to better fit me or a friend if I let someone else shoot my AR.

Choices...

johnrunner89
11-04-2009, 3:11 PM
I love my KISS stag model 1. With all the bells and whistles added to most AR's I see these days, a whole other rifle can be built! or ALOT of ammo can be purchased instead.

When i first got my Remington 870 I dressed it up wth a telescoping stock, pistol grip, tri-rail forend, laser, flashlight and VFG, and sling. It took me one range trip to find out it was pretty much useless unless I was in battle lol I now have the orginal stock on it but left the tri-rail forend cause I like attacthing a flashlight to it.

WeekendWarrior
11-04-2009, 3:14 PM
WWRTW

johnrunner89
11-04-2009, 3:39 PM
So where does a Rifle go from KISS to Tacticool?

For instance, I have a 20"AR with an Ace skeleton rifle length stock, a YHM rifle length free float tube (railed on top only), Miad Grip, two stage trigger, and a Burris AR-332 rifle scope. I think of this as a KISS rifle because of its Plain Jane appearance, and that its doesn't have stuff like lights or lasers, or a vertical foregrip on it - but it does have a number of aftermarket parts on it. Thoughts?

My thought is that it isn't KISS lol My idea of a KISS rifle is standard plastic handguards, iron sights only and a standard telescoping stock or fixed butt stock.

supermario
11-04-2009, 3:59 PM
IMO a tacticool AR15 is very useful for home defense. For example: collapsible stock for tight corners/spaces, flashlight when all the lights are off, foregrips for stability,and rail handguards for anything else!

But, to each his own!!

+1, I have a simple Kiss Ar but if there were an earthlquake, a nice light on your rifle would be a big plus considering, power could be out for days. Especially if you live in an area where bad people think they can do what they want. I think I am going to put a flashlight on my rifle now. I will keep the irons though.

hotwls13
11-04-2009, 4:16 PM
ALL of my firearms are PURPOSE BUILT. From my Beretta shotgun, Tikka T3 .243 to my Stag AR.

No EXTRA fancy stuff, just built for a specific job.

My Stag AR has a Model 3H Upper (Flat-top) and I have a Bushnell Elite 3200 3-9x40 scope, 6-point stock and 2-stage trigger. This is my Coyote hunting AR and it is very light and great for trapsing through bush.

My next AR will be something with open sights only, but I haven't decided if I am going to go RRA NM Upper or another Flat-top with flip up sights (probably the NM). It will be built on my Sun-Devil lower, A2 stock and 2-stage trigger.

Super Spy
11-04-2009, 4:20 PM
I have a basic AR so far only with iron sights and not much else. I'd like to put some type of red dot on it but that's it. I'm not even sure about the red dot as the price of a decent reflex is more than my upper cost.....

mls343
11-04-2009, 4:31 PM
The premise around the AR/M16 system was to be a light weight, functional, low recoil, and accurate platform. For me, all of my AR's are KISS. I mainly use mine for backpacking and plinking. Rarely do I shoot anything past 300 yards. While one of my AR's sports a rail, all of them are under 7lbs and are configured to be light weight and functional.

For me, the less stuff you have configured, the less weight and less stuff that can go wrong.

I put my money on buying ammo and knowing how and where she shoots.

Practice, practice, and more practice.

Just my $0.02

FeuerFrei
11-04-2009, 4:40 PM
I used to have one of my first AR's w/16' barrel fully pimped out. I went nuts with the ad-on gear.
I turned it into a hog. Not good for carry.
It now has only standard sights that are using "night sight" inserts and factory furniture plus MMG.
Now she has a firm and trim figure again and will are talking about a long term relationship. ;)

Unforgiven
11-04-2009, 5:28 PM
How about you build your rifle the way you want and not bust balls because someone else likes a cool looking rifle. Some guys like fast cars, nice Harleys and cool looking guns. Not everything is about function.

Rob454
11-04-2009, 5:30 PM
I was doing that to a SKS. Ended up bringing it back to as it was.
My buddy did it to a AK. Ended up bringing it back to stock condition. Likes it better now also

SuperSet
11-04-2009, 5:48 PM
OEM looks nice and clean but you buy added capabilities with added equipment.

Vinz
11-04-2009, 5:56 PM
yep thats whats nice about bARbies....you can switch it up as needed. Dark out, put on the light. Going long range put on the ACOG. Feel lazy put on a bipod. Going out to dinner with Ken, put on the pumps. LOL.

All mine go both ways.
vinz

supermario
11-04-2009, 6:00 PM
This is exactly what my LMT looks like and i love it, but i was thinking of added the rail and flashlight. I love this rifle becus its very light and handy. Especially compared to my Sig556. I guess if i add the rail and light, there goes the lightweight huh:rolleyes:

http://i644.photobucket.com/albums/uu165/supermariov/lmtm4.jpg

Adrien
11-04-2009, 6:01 PM
I don't have a "BR" yet, but when I finally decide to buy/build one I'm probably going to go the KISS route.

Adrien

Standard
11-04-2009, 6:01 PM
How about you build your rifle the way you want and not bust balls because someone else likes a cool looking rifle. Some guys like fast cars, nice Harleys and cool looking guns. Not everything is about function.

Calm down, I wasn't busting anyone's balls. I was stating my experience. I never said I didn't like tactical rifles, I said I thought it was interesting that I went from plain to practical and back.
Welcome to the forum :rolleyes:

8200rpm
11-04-2009, 7:03 PM
Adding a bunch of ***** to a gun just because you think it LOOKS cool is RICE...

http://badmod.com/wp-content/gallery/08232009-badmods/honda-ricer.jpg

Gofasterdammit
11-04-2009, 7:15 PM
I ditched the quad rail, forward grip, and UBR stock for a MOE fore grip and a CTR stock, me likey much better.

slagusmc
11-04-2009, 7:25 PM
I have several AR15s. Some are set up as KISS type, others have more gear added to them. I love using aimpoint optics on my of my builds, for 200 yrds and under, they are awesome. I also like having lights on my weapons, however I have switched out several of my large Surefire 951 series with the X200/x300 series lights to save weight. I dont like using VFGs even though they look cool, not my prefered method. Lasers are retarded unless u have a PEQ2 and PVS14s,lol. My $0.02... My completely stock bare bones AR15s are only the ones that I havent had the money to upgrade yet,lol

secretasianman
11-04-2009, 8:56 PM
When we add the stuff to our guns it's usually for a functional purpose unlike what most rice-boys do.

HK Dave
11-04-2009, 9:00 PM
I like KISS... tactical just got too friggin heavy for me.

russ69
11-04-2009, 9:08 PM
If you can master an iron sight plain rifle, you'll have no problem shooting any rifle or scope combo. Iron sights are still more reliable than scopes, the gap may be closer than 30 years ago but iron sights are pretty robust.

Thanx, Russ

tankerman
11-04-2009, 9:15 PM
I replaced the fixed front sight with a folding one, didn't like seeing it when looking through the EoTech. Never bought into that whole co-witness thingy, seems to me it goes against one of the strong points of a holo-sight, that you don't have to have perfect grip on the weapon, or perfect cheek weld to make a hit, as long as you can see the dot your GTG.

Never could justify spending $300+ on a quad rail that to looks to me like nothing more than a glorified flashlight holder.

Greg-Dawg
11-04-2009, 9:34 PM
I'm keeping mine KISS. Maybe I'll add an ACOG later and that would be it.

paratroop
11-05-2009, 5:19 AM
the trick is to have a tactical build, that transforms into a kiss build rapidly. that way whatever you may need it for, its good to go. or just get two of everything and keep one simple, and one "dressed up to party"

rc50cal
11-05-2009, 11:11 AM
I have one of each. Although my tacticool AR does not have nearly as much tacticoolness as many other ARs around here.

reidnez
11-05-2009, 1:30 PM
I took all my tacticool stuff off, except for the Aimpoint. Replaced the rails with Magpul handguards. It's a reasonable 7.5 lbs loaded and I could not be happier with it.

I think most people come to the same conclusion when they realize that their "handy little carbine" somehow weighs about as much as a Garand. :eek:

The DRis
11-05-2009, 5:31 PM
all that crap hanging off the rifle is ONLY useful for people that actually use the rifle to protect life, or as a tool in their profession. To mall ninjas that are in abundance these days it is simply a waste of money. Use the rifle as you will fight with it.



Wow, yet another great thread on Calguns.... :rolleyes: Can't even get past the first page without crap being spewed. So I take it, "1911Whore" that your a gun collector not a gun shooter.

Me, I'm a gun shooter. My weapons, yes they are weapons, are used as such and functional as such. No i'm not a high speed operator or SWAT or even military. But according to the 2A I have every right to have and use what the military has. I have my weapons to protect my family, and my country should the need arise. They are not "range toys" as I will assume yours are, or even "safe queens". They get used and tested until they prove themselves.

I am sick and tired of all these people who think differently dogging "mall ninjas" or overusing the word "tacticool". You feel big now? You feel like yoru winning this pissing match because you are dissing others?

Everyone is different. Label me a mall ninja, hell if I care.

The DRis
11-05-2009, 5:33 PM
How about you build your rifle the way you want and not bust balls because someone else likes a cool looking rifle. Some guys like fast cars, nice Harleys and cool looking guns. Not everything is about function.

Well said.

The DRis
11-05-2009, 5:36 PM
I have several AR15s. Some are set up as KISS type, others have more gear added to them. I love using aimpoint optics on my of my builds, for 200 yrds and under, they are awesome. I also like having lights on my weapons, however I have switched out several of my large Surefire 951 series with the X200/x300 series lights to save weight. I dont like using VFGs even though they look cool, not my prefered method. Lasers are retarded unless u have a PEQ2 and PVS14s,lol. My $0.02... My completely stock bare bones AR15s are only the ones that I havent had the money to upgrade yet,lol



My standard length Tango Down VFG is used as a hand stop for quick aquisition. Reason I stayed with the full length and didn't get the stubby is because it is battery storage for my light. It is "improper" to use the VFG with a pistol grip hold. Some like it that way, but the newer method is just to use it as a hand stop. YMMV though, and to each their own.

dchang0
11-05-2009, 5:41 PM
I went tacticool (overboard), then down to practical-tactical (after a few courses taught me what works and what doesn't), then am going back up towards a 3-gun competition build.

I would not go KISS except when required, such as CMP Service Rifle, but even those hide quite a bit of goodies under a plain exterior.

In the end, accuracy at speed does matter, and having a nice free-floated barrel is a must, ruling out any kind of true KISS build for me.

Vin496
11-05-2009, 5:56 PM
Wow, yet another great thread on Calguns.... :rolleyes: Can't even get past the first page without crap being spewed. So I take it, "1911Whore" that your a gun collector not a gun shooter.

Me, I'm a gun shooter. My weapons, yes they are weapons, are used as such and functional as such. No i'm not a high speed operator or SWAT or even military. But according to the 2A I have every right to have and use what the military has. I have my weapons to protect my family, and my country should the need arise. They are not "range toys" as I will assume yours are, or even "safe queens". They get used and tested until they prove themselves.

I am sick and tired of all these people who think differently dogging "mall ninjas" or overusing the word "tacticool". You feel big now? You feel like yoru winning this pissing match because you are dissing others?

Everyone is different. Label me a mall ninja, hell if I care.

Why all the anger?

No crap is being spewed, it's just opinions.

The DRis
11-05-2009, 5:57 PM
Why all the anger?

No crap is being spewed, it's just opinions.

Did you not read what I quoted?

Vin496
11-05-2009, 6:20 PM
Did you not read what I quoted?

Yeah I read what you quoted. Your response was a little heavy handed.

FNG TJ
11-05-2009, 6:23 PM
i've got one of each :D

J_Rock
11-05-2009, 6:30 PM
A major misconception when it comes to railed handguards.

"Rails add needless weight to the weapon."

False.Some rails like DD M4 and lite rails are the same weight or lighter than double shield handguards, remember there are aluminum panels under the plastic.. If you buy poor quality rails then yes they will be significantly heavier. Most rails only add a few ounces to the rifle.

Besides being able to bolt stuff on they:

-Freefloat the barrel preventing POI shifts and aiding in accuracy
-Increase cooling by providing ventilation unlike dbl shield HG which actually trap heat against your barrel. Rails also act like a heat sink.

supermario
11-05-2009, 6:36 PM
A major misconception when it comes to railed handguards.

"Rails add needless weight to the weapon."

False.Some rails like DD M4 and lite rails are the same weight or lighter than double shield handguards, remember there are aluminum panels under the plastic.. If you buy poor quality rails then yes they will be significantly heavier. Most rails only add a few ounces to the rifle.Besides being able to bolt stuff on they:

-Freefloat the barrel preventing POI shifts and aiding in accuracy
-Increase cooling by providing ventilation unlike dbl shield HG which actually trap heat against your barrel. Rails also act like a heat sink.


Thats good to know. Would you say that the DD Lite rails are the best and lightest?

Ruiner
11-05-2009, 6:40 PM
All my guns are configured for their respective purpose. I absolutely HATE the way a VFG looks on any rifle, but my carbine sports one because I find it beneficial to me for that particular rifle's purpose.

BroncoBob
11-05-2009, 6:50 PM
The only downside I see to running the carry handle instead of my reddot is fast target acquisition, but I highly doubt I will ever be using my rifle in a gunfight any time soon anyways.
Too much SHTF fantasy :)

Exactly, I love my long range rifles. I have both the tactical but I have more with stainless steel varmint barrels. My favorite is my Stag 6H with a 24" tube. A couple of weekends ago I got my 6H dialed in at 300 meters what a rush that is.

Standard
11-05-2009, 7:09 PM
Exactly, I love my long range rifles. I have both the tactical but I have more with stainless steel varmint barrels. My favorite is my Stag 6H with a 24" tube. A couple of weekends ago I got my 6H dialed in at 300 meters what a rush that is.

I was there :D

tankerman
11-05-2009, 7:53 PM
-Freefloat the barrel preventing POI shifts and aiding in accuracy.
Good point for a long range rifle. The POI is not going to shift so much as to matter on carbine designed for short range use. On a long range rifle, there's no need for a laser or flashlight, so round tube works fine.

dchang0
11-05-2009, 8:57 PM
Thats good to know. Would you say that the DD Lite rails are the best and lightest?

esskay pointed out to me that the DD M4 rail is actually lighter than their AR Lite rail by about 1oz. (12" rifle length models compared head to head).

. The POI is not going to shift so much as to matter on carbine designed for short range use.

I was getting a 2MOA POI shift running a "short-range" carbine in 2-point sling prone position. 2MOA is a lot at any range, short, medium, or long. The discovery prompted me to immediately upgrade to a rifle-length free-float quad rail so that I can get the sling attachment way out front and completely free of the barrel.

Seesm
11-05-2009, 9:07 PM
I was SOOO tactical in my head (prior to building any of my "Sport Utility Rifles") then I checked my budget and went simple... BUt now that money is a little better I want to stay simple... KISS!!

missiontrails
11-05-2009, 9:14 PM
As simple as I could keep it, without loosing the "feel." Comtemplating selling it though in order to build a Mega billet matched upper/lower setup rifle.
http://members.cox.net/dehlers/CMMG-M4.jpg

This one has more rounds through it, but does not have quite the "feel" that I like.
http://members.cox.net/dehlers/cmmg2.jpg

mccolm323
01-09-2010, 11:32 AM
What Complete Upper would you rec. For a KISS gun? I have a JD Lower and am looking for the upper.

Mssr. Eleganté
01-09-2010, 11:59 AM
I used to be all tactical...

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1luLRXKoJM8/R9-7wp_G5fI/AAAAAAAAC18/kIvaTpEreaQ/s400/clevelandSWAT1.jpg

but then decided I like KISS better...

http://www.legendaryhalloween.com/image-files/gene-simmons-destroyer-costume.jpg

Sam .223
01-09-2010, 1:31 PM
i built one of each so when i want to shoot with a KISS rifle i'll use that instead of my tacticool build.

-hanko
01-09-2010, 3:24 PM
How about you build your rifle the way you want and not bust balls because someone else likes a cool looking rifle. Some guys like fast cars, nice Harleys and cool looking guns. Not everything is about function.
This, in Spades.

What I do not understand (but I can't criticize) is Harley riders who buy basically buy the same bike, dress alike, and ride together to express their free-spirited "independence".

-hanko

-hanko
01-09-2010, 3:47 PM
Wow, yet another great thread on Calguns.... :rolleyes: Can't even get past the first page without crap being spewed. So I take it, "1911Whore" that your a gun collector not a gun shooter.

Me, I'm a gun shooter. My weapons, yes they are weapons, are used as such and functional as such. No i'm not a high speed operator or SWAT or even military. But according to the 2A I have every right to have and use what the military has. I have my weapons to protect my family, and my country should the need arise. They are not "range toys" as I will assume yours are, or even "safe queens". They get used and tested until they prove themselves.

I am sick and tired of all these people who think differently dogging "mall ninjas" or overusing the word "tacticool". You feel big now? You feel like yoru winning this pissing match because you are dissing others?

Everyone is different. Label me a mall ninja, hell if I care.
Mmmm, seems like maybe a little bitty nerve or two has been touched

"Tactical" and "mall ninja" always relate to your ACTIONS, not your WEAPONS.

Just a few thoughts that might prevent an MI in the future...

Your weapons may be range toys, safe queens, or used as "weapons to protect my family, and my country should the need arise". Having been on board here since the forum started, I can assure you that nobody gives a flying flip, as long as you're happy with what you have.

More important, this is the internet. It's not the real world. If you wish to be a mall ninja or operator, that's fine with everybody else on calguns.net. You're not a mall ninja until you actually wear the trauma plates that will stop a .308 on a 100 yd. shot to your back...not even close. You fail as an operator since you haven't mentioned mission critical or high-speed/low drag. If you wish to be both or neither, that's your prerogative and we're fine with that too.

I don't find a "pissing match" on this thread until your post. To slightly misquote a fair playwright, "Thou doth protest too much, methinks". If you want to whine about a post on the internet, you need a lot more practice.:)

Relax & enjoy your weekend & your weapons. ;)

-hanko

supersonic
01-09-2010, 4:51 PM
I used to be all tactical...

but then decided I like KISS better...

http://www.legendaryhalloween.com/image-files/gene-simmons-destroyer-costume.jpg

The God of Thunder: "I said "OH YEAH!!!!""

RMTactical
01-09-2010, 11:35 PM
I have both. Why settle for one?

Lagduf
01-10-2010, 12:28 AM
i built one of each so when i want to shoot with a KISS rifle i'll use that instead of my tacticool build.

This is what I plan on doing.

My first AR build will just be a plinker. It's just an A2 upper w/ 20" barrel. Pistol Grip, Stock, and Handguards are OD Green though. I'm debated about that for some time. I hope it's still KISS :)

For my second AR I just want 16" barrel, flat top upper, back up rear sight/fixed front sight, and a Eotech holosight. Probably going with a shorter fixed stock. I do want a forward grip, but that's about it. I don't think that's too tacticool. Not sure what rail system to get. Is there some handguard/rail system I can get that only has a picatinny rail on the bottom?

bombadillo
01-10-2010, 1:01 AM
I think that people are under the assumption that KISS has to be a bone stock rifle with plastic handguards, standard stock, and irons only. Something with an aimpoint/Eotech, and BUIS, a CTR/VLTOR, sling, and an Ergo grip is still KISS IMO. Nothing on there is extravagant. I start saying its tacticool when you add heavy rails that aren't holding anything, or just going with something like UTG quad rails and adding cheap tapco garbage or junk brand plastic crap with lights, lasers, and fake products just for the look. I like simplistic but functional rifles.

My mutt rifle consists of sun devil lower, A2 buttstock, JP15 upper, A2 front sight, GG&G MAD flip up BUIS, Mark AR 4-12x40 scope, Geissele SSA trigger, and makes a heck of a rifle. It shoots well, its light, I can take off the scope with the flip of a lever, and use irons all day long, and it serves every purpose. The only tacticool thing on it is a badger tac-latch which I hate because when I carry it by sling, it digs into my chest.

Tacticool is worthless junk products that do nothing but make uneducated people about AR's ooh and aah at the range. Built for nothing but wow factor.

Standard
01-10-2010, 7:58 AM
I have both. Why settle for one?

Funds :(
I plan to have one of each, eventually.

ChrisO
01-10-2010, 10:01 AM
I went ultimate kiss, I had a tricked out AR that was really fun but I decided to get a AK just because it was in fact just the opposite almost as KISS as can be :) I love it!

RyanX
01-10-2010, 3:16 PM
I have two ARs one 16" and a 20" kiss, I like the kiss for its simplicity. What I really want, and cant find is a Canadian C7(their m16) front sight because it has two rails on the side and one on the bottom. It's like KISS+..

Dangerous1
01-10-2010, 4:01 PM
Don't you just have to unbolt things off of your rail to make it a "KISS"? What's the big deal like as if it's a religion or something lol?

rolex87
01-10-2010, 6:24 PM
My 16" will have a rail for versatility, I like the VFG's feel and I'd like to add a light but there's no way the light will be going to the range, there is just no need for it. It will also get a red dot for a better sight picture in case I need it in a home emergency. The collapsible stock will help with close quarters. When it comes to my future 20" build, I want to go very simple, a2 stock, plastic handguards, iron sights etc...so I have a place for both...

bombadillo
01-10-2010, 6:27 PM
consider instead of doing plastic handguards, a straight free floated tube instead. Still very light, but versatile and you can do a lot with it. The rifle length VTAC handguard is one of my personal faves as its just round and simple but you can attach rails and its free floated for slightly better accuracy.

Dangerous1
01-10-2010, 6:30 PM
My 16" will have a rail for versatility, I like the VFG's feel and I'd like to add a light but there's no way the light will be going to the range, there is just no need for it. It will also get a red dot for a better sight picture in case I need it in a home emergency. The collapsible stock will help with close quarters. When it comes to my future 20" build, I want to go very simple, a2 stock, plastic handguards, iron sights etc...so I have a place for both...

Honestly, depending on what gear you've got, it doesn't weight THAT much.

This is a very popular setup that many of you probably run...
AFG 0.177 lbs.
Viking Tactics light mount 0.101 lbs.
SureFire G2 LED w/batteries 0.268 lbs.

That's just a little over 1/2 a pound. You might as well keep the light on and train like you fight.

Dragunov
01-10-2010, 10:13 PM
My thought is that it isn't KISS lol My idea of a KISS rifle is standard plastic handguards, iron sights only and a standard telescoping stock or fixed butt stock.

This is my Idea of KISS also.
The "carrying handle" with irons.
The telescoping buttstock only because my young daughter will want to shoot it. Personally, I don't like them and prefer the original fixed stock.

Plastic standard handguard is a must for me. I don't like forward pistol grips period and find the standard handguard much better for my style of shooting.

With a rifle this light, a sling is a MUST!

Flashlights? Not needed unless you're skulking around at night with your AR (Think Dale on "King of the Hill).

I probably would keep a low light scope around, but not on the rifle.
Eotech, but not on the rifle unless hunting.

No bi-pods either.

MudCamper
01-10-2010, 10:25 PM
Don't you just have to unbolt things off of your rail to make it a "KISS"?

The irony of that statement! If it's got a rail (a big bulky heavy unecessary replacement for the handguard) then it's not simple. But if you like that big heavy uncomfortable rail, have at it.

Dangerous1
01-10-2010, 10:30 PM
The irony of that statement! If it's got a rail (a big bulky heavy unecessary replacement for the handguard) then it's not simple. But if you like that big heavy uncomfortable rail, have at it.

How much do you think a carbine with a rail weighs? :rolleyes:

bombadillo
01-10-2010, 11:03 PM
DD lites are very light and so are a handful of others. Just for the sake of being simple, you don't have to sacrifice in other areas.