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View Full Version : Pro CCW OC Sheriff Candidate Fundraising Event With Sheriff Joe Arpaio on 11/5/09


jont92619
11-02-2009, 8:05 PM
Come out and support Pro CCW OC Sheriff Candidate Bill Hunt at his Fundraising Event With special guest Sheriff Joe Arpaio on 11/5/09. It's being held at the Phoenix Club in Anaheim. Visit www.billhuntforsheriff.com for more info.


Below is Bill Hunt's stance on the CCW as shown in the issues section of his web site.

"It is my belief that the Sheriff should be in the business of protecting people's rights, not restricting them. I will issue concealed weapons permits (CCW) to any applicant who is a law abiding resident of the county, meets state mandated requirements and is not prohibited by law from possessing a firearm. I will depoliticize the process and establish an annual audit to review each application to ensure the process is unbiased, non-political and equitable."

"I consider personal protection sufficient to meet the standard of good cause."

toopercentmlk
11-02-2009, 8:09 PM
So is he assuming gaining 100% support by the 2a upholding community will out weigh loosing 100% of the anti-constitution drones?

CWM4A1
11-05-2009, 9:48 AM
Since this is in OC and not LA, yes.

lumwilliam
11-05-2009, 10:25 AM
For Sheriff Joe Arpaio fans down in San Diego, he's doing another event for sheriff candidate Jay Lasuer this Friday 11/6. Jay is equally pro CCW. His website is www.sheriffjay.com. He needs our help, as the sitting sheriff, Bill Gore is very anti gun.

GuyW
11-05-2009, 1:14 PM
For Sheriff Joe Arpaio fans down in San Diego, he's doing another event for sheriff candidate Jay Lasuer this Friday 11/6. Jay is equally pro CCW. His website is www.sheriffjay.com. He needs our help, as the sitting sheriff, Bill Gore is very anti gun.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?p=3319746#post3319746

bwiese
11-05-2009, 1:17 PM
The RKBA cause is not well-served with a yahoo like Joe Arpaio trying to front for it.

Those paired with him should expect some mud to stick as more comes out about Arpaio - he's about one step or less ahead of the Feds.

CWM4A1
11-05-2009, 1:18 PM
And I sincerely hope that both OC and SD will have pro-RKBA Sheriff after 2010 election!

KylaGWolf
11-05-2009, 1:23 PM
Well not a big sheriff Joe fan so I will pass on the events. Makes me think twice about LaSuer as well right now.

Kestryll
11-05-2009, 1:36 PM
So is he assuming gaining 100% support by the 2a upholding community...

Not by aligning himself with a nutcase like Arpaio.

Bye Bye Bill Hunt.

wildhawker
11-05-2009, 2:07 PM
Hopefully the same holds true for Jay.

lazuris
11-05-2009, 2:47 PM
why the hate for Joe. The guy rocks, got rid of the illegals, cleaned up the crime in phoenix. Phoenix is like disneyland for law abiding citizens. What's wrong with that?

bwiese
11-05-2009, 2:51 PM
why the hate for Joe. The guy rocks, got rid of the illegals, cleaned up the crime in phoenix. Phoenix is like disneyland for law abiding citizens. What's wrong with that?

He did not "get rid of" the illegals. Yes, it's a convenient and popular concept. He's busted quite a few, and others just went further underground.

Crime exists plentifully in Phoenix, and he ignores some matters for grandstanding duty.

Any cop that uses his office/staff to threaten LE actions against county supervisors adjusting his budget, or for people who write about him in the newspaper, needs to be hung.

Moscow's trains ran on time, too, under Stalin. And the depots were very, very clean.

stormy_clothing
11-05-2009, 2:59 PM
All I can say is a lifelong friend distinguished navy pilot and agent for US customers and Border patrol knows him personally and respects the man so whatever the fed is claiming he did wrong he must have done alot of right and thats the way the world should be more right than wrong

bwiese
11-05-2009, 3:04 PM
All I can say is a lifelong friend distinguished navy pilot and agent for US customers and Border patrol knows him personally and respects the man so whatever the fed is claiming he did wrong he must have done alot of right and thats the way the world should be more right than wrong

Al Capone was nice to his mother.

I'd've thought a buncha RKBA folks would understand "liberty" and see what we're going thru here in CA, and see he's just pulling other crap (i.e, outside the field of guns) in AZ. Any sheriff that arrests/attacks reporters or superivising city council could certainly work in some 3rd world country.

stormy_clothing
11-05-2009, 3:22 PM
Being good and doing good are separate issues, sheriff joe has done alot of good and some bad just like most people. he seems nuts to me but it thats what it takes to get it done.

I blame criminals for the lack of freedom more than I blame the people who impinge on it to fight them.

bwiese
11-05-2009, 3:25 PM
I blame criminals for the lack of freedom more than I blame the
people who impinge on it to fight them.

That's why we have a big overbearing gov't.

I'm not afraid of criminals.

I am afraid of Big G.

Kestryll
11-05-2009, 3:51 PM
why the hate for Joe. The guy rocks, got rid of the illegals, cleaned up the crime in phoenix. Phoenix is like disneyland for law abiding citizens. What's wrong with that?

All I can say is a lifelong friend distinguished navy pilot and agent for US customers and Border patrol knows him personally and respects the man so whatever the fed is claiming he did wrong he must have done alot of right and thats the way the world should be more right than wrong

Since you asked....

Richard Post was a paraplegic inmate arrested in 1996 for possession of marijuana and criminal trespass. After some time in a cell he complained to the guards that his catheter was full. He flushed the toilet several times in order to get their attention. Instead of giving him medical care the guards strapped him into the restraint chair so tightly that they broke his neck. The event, caught on video, shows guards smiling and laughing while Post is being injured. Because of his injuries, Post has lost much of the use of his arms, he is now a quadriplegic. Post settled his claims against the Sheriff's office for $800,000.

In 2006, inmate Ambrett Spencer, who was incarcerated for drunk driving and was nine months pregnant with a baby girl, complained of severe stomach pains and asked for medical attention. The infirmary nurse, who had no prenatal training, believed the pain was not an emergency. It was two hours before an ambulance was called for Spencer, who in the meantime had passed out from severely low blood pressure and lost so much color that the EMT who arrived at the scene said he knew she was "not getting enough blood to [her] organs and skin." At the hospital -- four hours after first reporting pain -- Spencer gave birth to a dead daughter, Ambria Renee. It was determined that Spencer's pain had been caused by placental abruption, internal bleeding resulting in loss of blood to the baby, which babies can usually survive if the mother is taken to the hospital and labor is quickly induced.

Scott Norberg, a former Brigham Young University football wide receiver, who died while in custody of the Sheriff's office. Arpaio's office repeatedly claimed Norberg was also high on methamphetamine, but a blood toxicology performed post-mortem was inconclusive. During his internment, evidence suggests detention officers shocked Norberg several times with a stun-gun. According to an investigation by Amnesty International, Norberg was already handcuffed and face down when officers dragged him from his cell and placed him in a restraint chair with a towel covering his face. After Norberg's corpse was discovered, detention officers accused Norberg of attacking them as they were trying to restrain him. The cause of his death, according to the Maricopa County medical examiner, was due to "positional asphyxia". Sheriff Arpaio investigated and subsequently cleared detention officers of any criminal wrongdoing.


Brian Crenshaw was a legally blind and mentally disabled inmate who suffered fatal injuries while being held in Maricopa Country Jail.

Brian Crenshaw refused to show his identification card in a lunch line, was savagely beaten by guards and left in his cell for six days without medical treatment. Despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary, Arpaio insists Crenshaw suffered ruptured intestines, a broken neck, several broken toes, and extensive internal bleeding from “falling off a bunk” a little over four feet high.

Crenshaw's family filed a lawsuit against Arpaio and his office, which resulted in an award of $2 million. As in the Scott Norberg case, it was alleged that Arpaio's office destroyed evidence in the case. In the Crenshaw case, the attorney who represented the case before a jury alleged digital video evidence was destroyed.


Deborah Braillard was a diabetic inmate who was denied her insulin for over two days. When her constant moaning became too much for her cellmates to bear, the guards moved her to an empty cell where she could writhe in pain alone. She died in the hospital.

Mentally handicapped Charles Agster, who weighed only a hundred and thirty-two pounds, was arrested on loitering charges after refusing to leave a convenience store. He was taken into the prison hogtied and wrenched so tightly into a restraint chair that he died within minutes. Although Arpaio admits no wrongdoing, he refuses to let the family of Charles Agster see the surveillance footage of their son being put into the restraint chair.

Yeah, TORTURE.




And let's not forget this, apparently it's not just the Feds who like to raid the wrong house and kill your dog...
In 2004, the Maricopa County Sheriff's Office SWAT team led a raid on an Ahwatukee home in a gated subdivision, looking for illegal weapons. No illegal weapons were found, but during the raid, the house burned down, SWAT officers forced a dog back into the building where it subsequently died, and an armored vehicle rolled into a neighbor's parked car as a result of brake failure.

How much does this cost taxpayers?
The appeals court awarded 635,000 dollars to Flanders, 30% of which Arpaio had to pay personally. The Norberg family received an 8.5 million dollar settlement on their son’s behalf. Michael Manning, the attorney for the Norberg family, is suing on behalf of Braillard’s son and father for 20 million dollars. The family of Charles Agster is seeking 25 million. Maricopa County paid Post 850,000 dollars for his injuries and the Crenshaw family is suing as well.
That would be $54,985,000.00

55Million dollars and 4 or 5 lives, yeah, that's worth it.. :rolleyes:

RomanDad
11-05-2009, 3:54 PM
This is the NEXT scandal thats about to hit Joe Arapio and the MCSO....

An MCSO deputy/bailiff during a court hearing, walked over to the Defendant's table, (while counsel was addressing the court) sifted through the Defense Attorney's files (Privileged confidential attorney work product) takes a file OUT of the folder and calls a fellow deputy over to XEROX it....


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UIoyJ-LyAaE


FWIW , I need a primer on Youtube embedding for Calguns-

Brianguy
11-05-2009, 4:30 PM
This is the NEXT scandal thats about to hit Joe Arapio and the MCSO....

An MCSO deputy/bailiff during a court hearing, walked over to the Defendant's table, (while counsel was addressing the court) sifted through the Defense Attorney's files (Privileged confidential attorney work product) takes a file OUT of the folder and calls a fellow deputy over to XEROX it....


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UIoyJ-LyAaE


FWIW , I need a primer on Youtube embedding for Calguns-

WOW! I thought a judge was GOD in their courtroom. This judge didn't have control over a darn thing.

RomanDad
11-05-2009, 4:34 PM
WOW! I thought a judge was GOD in their courtroom. This judge didn't have control over a darn thing.



The Deputies should be immediately relieved of their positions, and the Judge needs to take up charity work, because the law isn't her strong suit. Unfortunately, this seems to be par for the course in MCSO... A hostile culture has crept into the department that seems to be flowing from Arapio.

Shotgun Man
11-05-2009, 5:13 PM
The defense atty did a poor job. I give her slack for not noticing the theft-- even though her client was trying to tip her off-- because she was focused on the sentencing hearing. But once on notice, in an concise, articulate, directed manner, she has to scream bloody murder.

Demand that copies of document be surrendered back to her, name names, forcefully state what happened on the record, demand the deputy explain his conduct.

Ask for sanctions. Demand that his supervisor appear before the court immediately to be advised of the deputy's conduct.

RomanDad
11-05-2009, 5:18 PM
The defense atty did a poor job. I give her slack for not noticing the theft, even though her client was trying to tell her this, because she was focused on the sentencing hearing. But once on notice, in a calm, articulate, directed manner, she has to scream bloody murder.

Demand that copies of document be surrendered back to her, name names, forcefully state what happened on the record, demand the deputy explain his conduct.

Ask for sanctions. Demand that his supervisor appear before the court immediately to be advised of the deputy's conduct.

She was clearly ASTONISHED by what had just happened... And her reaction was akin to watching E.T. beam himself into the Court Room, expose himself, and then beam himself back out.... This is just something that NEVER HAPPENS, and to have it happen makes you say to yourself "Am I in an alternate universe?"

I would have been astonished too, but I would have probably screamed "WHAT THE &%^$ ARE YOU DOING?!?!?!" But given the Judge's attitude that would have probably ended up with ME facing contempt charges....

In the end, she handled things fairly well... The officer had to face a hearing (which got weird too). But it is now garnering national attention....

http://www.heatcity.org/2009/10/detention-officer-tries-to-explain-why.html

HowardW56
11-05-2009, 5:39 PM
Aligning with Sheriff Joe Wacko does not sound like a winning strategy to me...

That's something like an endorcement from Sarah Palin....

KylaGWolf
11-05-2009, 8:27 PM
why the hate for Joe. The guy rocks, got rid of the illegals, cleaned up the crime in phoenix. Phoenix is like disneyland for law abiding citizens. What's wrong with that?

Do a search on this forum for another threat about how Joe is. Sorry I do not think someone that has deputies STEAL papers out of a file in court a good guy. He is being investigated for abuse of office. While I am anti illegal immigration, and tough on crime I am not for having my deputies put a man in a restraint chair and break his neck in the process. Not giving a diabetic medication so they die. Or letting a pregnant woman hemorage. Oh not to mention you speak out against said sheriff and you will find yourself being harassed and false charges and the like.

Gray Peterson
11-05-2009, 10:23 PM
Do a search on this forum for another threat about how Joe is. Sorry I do not think someone that has deputies STEAL papers out of a file in court a good guy. He is being investigated for abuse of office. While I am anti illegal immigration, and tough on crime I am not for having my deputies put a man in a restraint chair and break his neck in the process. Not giving a diabetic medication so they die. Or letting a pregnant woman hemorage. Oh not to mention you speak out against said sheriff and you will find yourself being harassed and false charges and the like.

FBI Color of Law (http://www.fbi.gov/hq/cid/civilrights/color.htm)

And

18 USC 242:

Whoever, under color of any law, statute, ordinance, regulation, or custom, willfully subjects any person in any State, Territory, Commonwealth, Possession, or District to the deprivation of any rights, privileges, or immunities secured or protected by the Constitution or laws of the United States, ... shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than one year, or both; and if bodily injury results from the acts committed in violation of this section or if such acts include the use, attempted use, or threatened use of a dangerous weapon, explosives, or fire, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and if death results from the acts committed in violation of this section or if such acts include kidnaping or an attempt to kidnap, aggravated sexual abuse, or an attempt to commit aggravated sexual abuse, or an attempt to kill, shall be fined under this title, or imprisoned for any term of years or for life, or both, or may be sentenced to death.

Call it a belief, but I believe that Mr. Arpaio knows and is directing his deputies to kill people. I of course support due process (something he didn't afford his victims), but the day that he, along with his deputies who have killed people, has a needle in his arm (which is less than he deserves) under a federal execution order (sentenced by judge and jury), I will dance a jig.

I can't believe any of you buy into his bull**** about "cracking down on illegals". "America's Toughest Sheriff" is america's most murderous sheriff, and for Bill Hunt to say that he's his "mentor"....sorry. If I was a voter in Orange County, I would not vote for either the incumbent or Bill Hunt. At least Sheriff Hutchens, as far as I know, doesn't support torture, second amendment issues aside.

wildhawker
11-05-2009, 10:57 PM
It's interesting that 2 candidates in 2 counties who essentially base their campaigns on the grassroots support of the CCW issue have aligned themselves with Sheriff Joe. More interesting will be to see how the voters respond.

glbtrottr
11-06-2009, 7:31 AM
Here's how the OC Weekly with its healthy amount of readership responded...

http://blogs.ocweekly.com/navelgazing/a-clockwork-orange/sheriff-joe-arpaio-bill-hunt/

RomanDad
11-06-2009, 9:44 AM
Here's how the OC Weekly with its healthy amount of readership responded...

http://blogs.ocweekly.com/navelgazing/a-clockwork-orange/sheriff-joe-arpaio-bill-hunt/

Isnt OCWeekly the free rag they have at my barber, that has all the ads for Marijuana and hookers in the back?


Not exactly an audience Im too worried about losing on 2nd amendment issues.

1BigPea
11-06-2009, 9:48 AM
Here's how the OC Weekly with its healthy amount of readership responded...

http://blogs.ocweekly.com/navelgazing/a-clockwork-orange/sheriff-joe-arpaio-bill-hunt/


We all know you are against hunt...I dont really care what ocweekly thinks either.

MasterYong
11-06-2009, 11:56 AM
The RKBA cause is not well-served with a yahoo like Joe Arpaio trying to front for it.

Those paired with him should expect some mud to stick as more comes out about Arpaio - he's about one step or less ahead of the Feds.

Yeah I'm in Maricopa county right now on business... and as best as I can tell Joe Arpaio is either absolutely loved or extremely hated. In some cases his methods seem appropriate, in others he crosses the line of directly violating citizen's rights just because he wears a badge. He treats his job as sheriff like he's the only lawman in an old-west town.

To quote Judge Dredd: "I AM THE LAW!!!" :D

I'm not sure it's a good idea for anyone in CA politics to align themselves with Mr. Arpaio- pro-2A or not he's just too polarized for CA.

benelli shooter
11-06-2009, 12:03 PM
We need just laws.
We need just punishments for breaking those laws.

Unfortunately, our laws are not just.
Therefore, we get guys like Joe Arpaio to punish unjustly.

Joe Arpaio is a symptom of a disease.

EBWhite
11-06-2009, 12:04 PM
Not by aligning himself with a nutcase like Arpaio.

Bye Bye Bill Hunt.

Wow, I'd like to know where your head is. I wish my boss was Sheriff Arpaio and not the current one...Nice to see we still have good people in office that punish inmates like they should be.

JaMail
11-06-2009, 12:09 PM
Wow, I'd like to know where your head is. I wish my boss was Sheriff Arpaio and not the current one...Nice to see we still have good people in office that punish inmates like they should be.


wow, the fact that you can confuse torture and punishment to such a degree is scary.

Kestryll
11-06-2009, 12:09 PM
Wow, I'd like to know where your head is. I wish my boss was Sheriff Arpaio and not the current one...Nice to see we still have good people in office that punish inmates like they should be.

Here's where my head is at.

I'm a bit surprised you'd want to torture and kill prisoners to be honest, I guess it's just 'punishment....

Richard Post was a paraplegic inmate arrested in 1996 for possession of marijuana and criminal trespass. After some time in a cell he complained to the guards that his catheter was full. He flushed the toilet several times in order to get their attention. Instead of giving him medical care the guards strapped him into the restraint chair so tightly that they broke his neck. The event, caught on video, shows guards smiling and laughing while Post is being injured. Because of his injuries, Post has lost much of the use of his arms, he is now a quadriplegic. Post settled his claims against the Sheriff's office for $800,000.

In 2006, inmate Ambrett Spencer, who was incarcerated for drunk driving and was nine months pregnant with a baby girl, complained of severe stomach pains and asked for medical attention. The infirmary nurse, who had no prenatal training, believed the pain was not an emergency. It was two hours before an ambulance was called for Spencer, who in the meantime had passed out from severely low blood pressure and lost so much color that the EMT who arrived at the scene said he knew she was "not getting enough blood to [her] organs and skin." At the hospital -- four hours after first reporting pain -- Spencer gave birth to a dead daughter, Ambria Renee. It was determined that Spencer's pain had been caused by placental abruption, internal bleeding resulting in loss of blood to the baby, which babies can usually survive if the mother is taken to the hospital and labor is quickly induced.

Scott Norberg, a former Brigham Young University football wide receiver, who died while in custody of the Sheriff's office. Arpaio's office repeatedly claimed Norberg was also high on methamphetamine, but a blood toxicology performed post-mortem was inconclusive. During his internment, evidence suggests detention officers shocked Norberg several times with a stun-gun. According to an investigation by Amnesty International, Norberg was already handcuffed and face down when officers dragged him from his cell and placed him in a restraint chair with a towel covering his face. After Norberg's corpse was discovered, detention officers accused Norberg of attacking them as they were trying to restrain him. The cause of his death, according to the Maricopa County medical examiner, was due to "positional asphyxia". Sheriff Arpaio investigated and subsequently cleared detention officers of any criminal wrongdoing.


Brian Crenshaw was a legally blind and mentally disabled inmate who suffered fatal injuries while being held in Maricopa Country Jail.

Brian Crenshaw refused to show his identification card in a lunch line, was savagely beaten by guards and left in his cell for six days without medical treatment. Despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary, Arpaio insists Crenshaw suffered ruptured intestines, a broken neck, several broken toes, and extensive internal bleeding from “falling off a bunk” a little over four feet high.

Crenshaw's family filed a lawsuit against Arpaio and his office, which resulted in an award of $2 million. As in the Scott Norberg case, it was alleged that Arpaio's office destroyed evidence in the case. In the Crenshaw case, the attorney who represented the case before a jury alleged digital video evidence was destroyed.


Deborah Braillard was a diabetic inmate who was denied her insulin for over two days. When her constant moaning became too much for her cellmates to bear, the guards moved her to an empty cell where she could writhe in pain alone. She died in the hospital.

Mentally handicapped Charles Agster, who weighed only a hundred and thirty-two pounds, was arrested on loitering charges after refusing to leave a convenience store. He was taken into the prison hogtied and wrenched so tightly into a restraint chair that he died within minutes. Although Arpaio admits no wrongdoing, he refuses to let the family of Charles Agster see the surveillance footage of their son being put into the restraint chair.


This is the work environment you really want?

WOW.



And let's not forget this, apparently it's not just the Feds who like to raid the wrong house and kill your dog...
In 2004, the Maricopa County Sheriff's Office SWAT team led a raid on an Ahwatukee home in a gated subdivision, looking for illegal weapons. No illegal weapons were found, but during the raid, the house burned down, SWAT officers forced a dog back into the building where it subsequently died, and an armored vehicle rolled into a neighbor's parked car as a result of brake failure.

How much does this cost taxpayers?
The appeals court awarded 635,000 dollars to Flanders, 30% of which Arpaio had to pay personally. The Norberg family received an 8.5 million dollar settlement on their son’s behalf. Michael Manning, the attorney for the Norberg family, is suing on behalf of Braillard’s son and father for 20 million dollars. The family of Charles Agster is seeking 25 million. Maricopa County paid Post 850,000 dollars for his injuries and the Crenshaw family is suing as well.
That would be $54,985,000.00

55Million dollars and 4 or 5 lives, yeah, that's worth it.. :rolleyes:

GuyW
11-06-2009, 12:21 PM
I don't claim any insight into Bill Hunt's thoughts or connection to Sheriff Joe - but similar to my post re Jay La Suer, I sincerely doubt that Mr. Hunt knows about or endorses everything that Sheriff Joe has purportedly done, or that the Sheriff's Deputies have done.....or that he would allow such actions in OC.

.

EBWhite
11-06-2009, 2:44 PM
Don't ever listen to any of the left wing garbage put out by Amnesty International....

And until you work in a custody setting, please don't talk about treatment of inmates, they get stuff handed to them. Also, I'd bet to beleive that these families and the media totally twisted these stories

Ron Sallinger
11-06-2009, 4:37 PM
I have met Bill Hunt and also attended this event last night and do not believe Bill agrees with everything Joe does. Bill is a very approachable guy and is a straight talker. I look forward to him taking office next year. Good luck Bill you got my vote

Kestryll
11-06-2009, 6:13 PM
Don't ever listen to any of the left wing garbage put out by Amnesty International....
You might want to know what you're referring to before making a statement.
All of these come from existing litigation Arpaio LOST in court not some amnesty website.

So don't assume that facts can be summarily dismissed because you like the guy...

And until you work in a custody setting, please don't talk about treatment of inmates, they get stuff handed to them.
Yeah, like MASSIVE CHECKS due to criminal actions by Maricopa County Sheriffs.
And don't tell me not to talk about it, when people are crippled or killed in the jails that serve US we ALL have an obligation to talk about it.
And to fix it.


Also, I'd bet to beleive that these families and the media totally twisted these stories
Really?
So they twisted and lied enough that the courts awarded 55 MILLION DOLLARS in damages?

I suppose the media and the families fabricated the video tape showing some of these events occurring?
What about the illegal action video taped in the court that was shown in this thread?
Also fabricated???

Kestryll
11-06-2009, 6:16 PM
I have met Bill Hunt and also attended this event last night and do not believe Bill agrees with everything Joe does.

Sorry but this is a seriously lame excuse.

If you are going to have someone endorse you than you have a duty to know who they are and what they espouse.

If you can not do that simple level of research you have no business being in ANY office.

As far as I am concerned Hunt shot himself in the groin on this one and lost any support I'd give him.

cadurand
11-06-2009, 6:43 PM
It is absolutely amazing how some of us here are OK with a Law Enforcement LEADER doing "some bad things" as you put it.

We should never be OK with that. Ever. The truth is you all probably don't care since the bad things, so far, aren't happening to you or someone you know.

People have rights, even in jail. You should never lose sight of that.

HowardW56
11-06-2009, 6:45 PM
Don't ever listen to any of the left wing garbage put out by Amnesty International....

And until you work in a custody setting, please don't talk about treatment of inmates, they get stuff handed to them. Also, I'd bet to beleive that these families and the media totally twisted these stories

Which jail do you work in?

KylaGWolf
11-06-2009, 10:38 PM
Don't ever listen to any of the left wing garbage put out by Amnesty International....

And until you work in a custody setting, please don't talk about treatment of inmates, they get stuff handed to them. Also, I'd bet to beleive that these families and the media totally twisted these stories

I have worked with those that have been involved in the criminal justice system. And no it was not in a line of social work. I am not sure what sickens me more those that work in the system and think what he does OK or those that just have no clue and blindly vote him in. I am far from a bleeding heart liberal either. And I think those examples are bit more than propaganda from Amnesty International since all those cases ended up in lawsuits that cost the county money. I will agree in some prison settings there seems to be a oh he/she is a victim mentality. But we don't have to go the other way either. Sheriff Joe is being investigated for wrong doing his deputies routinely break the law the recent example is a good one. No matter how you want to spin it what he is doing is wrong. Or how about he has a person's house raided just because they had the guts to speak out against him. Oh wait raid city hall after they didn't bow down to him. I am the first to admit our criminal justice system has a hell of a lot of flaws but why make it worse with people like Sheriff Joe.

dustoff31
11-07-2009, 9:11 AM
Sheriff Joe is being investigated for wrong doing his deputies routinely break the law the recent example is a good one. No matter how you want to spin it what he is doing is wrong.

Perhaps we should wait for the investigation to conclude before convicting him? Yes, he has had a number of civil judgements against him. CIVIL judgements not criminal judgements. How many civil judgements has any major LE agency had to pay out.

Let the investigation proceed and let the chips fall where they may.



Oh wait raid city hall after they didn't bow down to him. I am the first to admit our criminal justice system has a hell of a lot of flaws but why make it worse with people like Sheriff Joe.

I take it you are talking about the Mesa City Hall here. The truth is that Arpaio told the City of Mesa, I know you have illegal aliens working for the city. Get rid of them. The city said no, or as you put it, "refused to bow down to him."

Arpiao then conducted a raid. And guess what he found. Illegals cleaning the offices of the Mayor and Chief of Police. That would of course be Chief George Gascon, who is now the Chief in the illegal alien sanctuary city of San Francisco.

Asphodel
11-07-2009, 10:04 PM
Its sad but true.......I read the comments of those here who support Mr Arpiao's policies and procedures, and then remember the old newsreels of the cheering German crowds who enthusiastically supported Chancellor Hitler's policies and procedures.

It would appear that Mr Arpiao has positioned himself to appeal to the same aspects of so-called 'human nature' which Herr Hitler so effectively exploited, many years ago. That really should be considered utterly unacceptable, in America, today.

It seems that the so-called 'veneer of civilisation' can be rather thin, on some people.

Have a look at the sheer number of videos regarding Mr Arpiao's department and personnel, which various people have placed on the 'You tube' internet programme.......yes, some or all of the videos might have been faked.....I wouldn't know how to tell that, one way or the other......but if they are 'factual' video, they are a truly damning indictment of Mr Arpiao's 'regime'.

Added on edit:

A bit over ten years ago, when the internet discussion groups were a 'new experience' for many of us, I participated on a particular technical discussion site. One of the other regular participants identified himself as a small-business owner in Mr Arpaio's area, and commented rather bitterly on the 'climate of corruption' which he saw there, such as deputies commonly 'shaking-down' small-business people for 'donations'.

He claimed that some number of small-business people had surreptitiously filmed and recorded evidence of criminal actions by Mr Arpiao's deputies, and sent copies to trusted friends out of state, as a form of 'blackmail', the threat being to publish that evidence if the 'Arpaio gang' further victimised those small business people or their friends.

(an example might be that of a store owner, when a deputy tried on a pair of very expensive Nocona boots, liked them, handed the store owner a $5 bill, and said something to the effect of 'that covers the Sheriff's office special discount on those boots, right?.......and the store owner had reason to suspect that 'something bad' would happen to him, if he refused that 'deal')

Yes, I know, thats purely 'hearsay'.....it did seem to have a 'ring of plausibility', tho.

cheers

Carla

Ron Sallinger
11-08-2009, 10:40 AM
Sorry but this is a seriously lame excuse.

If you are going to have someone endorse you than you have a duty to know who they are and what they espouse.

If you can not do that simple level of research you have no business being in ANY office.

As far as I am concerned Hunt shot himself in the groin on this one and lost any support I'd give him.

Keystryl.....And the candidate that your forum has fielded is who? Who have you put up? Who are you going to vote for? Jack Anderson.....Sandra? :rolleyes: This site is simply another I hate Bill Hunt site. There is another one just like it called CalCCW. Story is the same (as well as the mods/staff)..........bash any pro-ccw candidate for the slightest infraction and then gripe and complain of how crappy the gun laws are in california. :rolleyes:

It's your typical small-minded mentality that cant see the bigger picture. Who knows maybe its because you own the site and you think that you have some huge sway over the voters in OC (Got news for you..........you dont). There were hundreds of people at the fundraiser who see the man for who he is..........imperfect. Does he make mistakes? Yes. Is he perfect? No. The man has a good platform and solid base that keeps growing by the day and he understands that he cant be everything to everyone. If you dont want to help then just get out of the way and stop bashing the only pro-ccw candidate in the race.

Last thing, there are many like me who have had it with forums like this who make it their life work to cause divisions between gun-owners and prevent any meaningful reform in california. We have had it with people like you and will simply factor you, and forums like it, out of the equation and work with groups like SafeOC in getting Hunt elected. Hey, but I'm sure there are plenty of people who appreciate what you do here. Sandra can be counted amoung them.

Please deactivate my account......there are actual pro-ccw sites out there like USCCA and warriortalk that have members here in OC who will work to get a good candidate like Bill Hunt elected.

Ron W. Sallinger
179 S. Jameson
Orange, Ca. 92866
(949) 290-0720
ron.sallinger@yahoo.com

wildhawker
11-08-2009, 11:13 AM
Ron, I'm sure Kes will oblige.

You have 2 posts here (total, both supporting Bill Hunt) in the same number of months yet have the audacity to impugn the integrity of a man that works hard for and has dedicated much of his life to restoring CA to a pro-gun state, simply for pointing out his distaste for Hunt's associating with Joe Arpaio? How laughable.

I'd like to point out that the man you call "small-minded" is a Director of two major organizations that work tirelessly to improve California's gun culture, keep innocent CA gun owners out of jail and [productively] fight the anti-gun laws here in this state. I'm not sure what sort of influence your local CCW crusade thinks it has with the "bigger picture" but I assure you that Orange County will be forced to live with whatever law enforcement administrator it elects long after shall-issue CCW comes to CA through the courts.

Excuse me if I am unconcerned about the [not] "many like you" who are looking for a forum to further their single-issue campaigns. We're a bit more interested in the "bigger picture".

ETA: What is your role with the Bill Hunt campaign? It seems that posting about the fundraisers and creating duplicate accounts on other forums are your life's work. It stands to reason that you are here as a campaign plant seeking to troll for support and drag members to some irrelevant forum to increase grassroots support for candidate Hunt.

Mr. Sallinger saying that we do not allow Bill Hunt supporters to post here is entirely incorrect. Mr. Salinger was actually banned last year long before Mr. Hunt was in the picture. The reason he was banned is because he was bashing law enforcement and being confrontational and disrepectful to fellow members. He was warned repeatedly but took no heed to said warning. His user name at that point was Ciderbite (for those interested in taking a look at his previous posts).

When Mr. Sallinger signed up again a few weeks ago it was obvious as to who he was. So he was banned again. Not for being a Bill Hunt supporter but because of what he had done in the past. It should be obvious to anyone reading his last post that his only interest in stirring the pot. Hunt supporters are more than welcome to post here as long as it's done in a courteous and respectful manner.

Mr. Sallinger and I spoke on the phone once and have exchenged a number of e-mails. The e-mails were equally inflammatory as his post above.

As evidence that we are not banning members simply for being Hunt Supporters, there is a member who goes by the handle "Reloader". He posted either yesterday or today in this same thread. He is still an active member.

So yes, the user "William Monroe" aka Ron Sallinger aka Ciderbite will be banned again, but not for being a Bill Hunt Supporter. He is being banned for what he did last year and for continuing to do nothing but stir the pot.

On that note, this thread will be closed. It has done nothing but cause grief to myself and the rest of the staff. Anyone who has any interest in starting a Bill Hunt thread is welcome to do so but they will be closely monitored to ensure it does not turn into a flame fest.

Those of you who are interested in contacting Mr. Sallinger may do so.

Thank you,

PS. It would be kind of hard for Banana to "be a man" as SHE is lacking the necessary body parts.

A couple pieces of additional information on why Mr. Sallinger was previously banned. He allowed other individuals (one of which had also been banned for similar reasons) to post to the site using his forum ID. He had previously been banned from californiaccw.org (User ID: Woolybear) for having an offensive picture in his avatar and refusing to remove it. Kinda funny that he is suddenly big on people using their real names when he in the past hasn't.

bwiese
11-08-2009, 11:58 AM
Last thing, there are many like me who have had it with forums like this who make it their life work to cause divisions between gun-owners and prevent any meaningful reform in california.

Hell Calguns is about stopping incompetency in the gun politics world.

Part of that means being poltiically aware enough that someone as radioactive as Joe Arpaio will not be perceived well in California.

Bill Hunt may indeed be a fine guy. I'm sure he's better than Hutchens, who has many issues.

But it's unwise of Hunt or LaSeur to hitch their new horse to wagon with an overload of tarnished baggage (Arpaio, history, etc.). As more Arpaio news emerges he will alienate more votes than he will bring in. Yeah, he'll get the far right and lose everyone else - same problems the CA REpublicans have, which explains their whopping electoral success today.

Ron Sallinger
11-08-2009, 1:58 PM
Ron, I'm sure Kes will oblige.

You have 2 posts here (total, both supporting Bill Hunt) in the same number of months yet have the audacity to impugn the integrity of a man that works hard for and has dedicated much of his life to restoring CA to a pro-gun state, simply for pointing out his distaste for Hunt's associating with Joe Arpaio? How laughable.

I'd like to point out that the man you call "small-minded" is a Director of two major organizations that work tirelessly to improve California's gun culture, keep innocent CA gun owners out of jail and [productively] fight the anti-gun laws here in this state. I'm not sure what sort of influence your local CCW crusade thinks it has with the "bigger picture" but I assure you that Orange County will be forced to live with whatever law enforcement administrator it elects long after shall-issue CCW comes to CA through the courts.

Excuse me if I am unconcerned about the [not] "many like you" who are looking for a forum to further their single-issue campaigns. We're a bit more interested in the "bigger picture".

ETA: What is your role with the Bill Hunt campaign? It seems that posting about the fundraisers and creating duplicate accounts on other forums are your life's work. It stands to reason that you are here as a campaign plant seeking to troll for support and drag members to some irrelevant forum to increase grassroots support for candidate Hunt.

Oh no, another "director" of "two organizations"..........yawn. Which ones? I kid you not, you guys on these forums think that throwing a self-given title around impresses people. Or maybe you think it gives you some sort of street cred to go ahead and run the only pro-ccw sheriff out of the campaign because he had a fumdraiser with Joe. If Keyster is the director of two "major organization" why doesnt he (or you) post his real name? Why the lack of transparency on these forums? Whats to hide? Oh wait, I'll give the standard answer ......... "those that need to know who I am, do". :rolleyes: I forgot how the "pro-ccw" forums run. Everyone is a director of something and has been involed in getting some law passed that has "helped gun-owners" somewhere :rolleyes:. Now if you or keyster wants to show up at an event, introduce yourself, and ask a question to Bill Hunt then you may get some respect. But if your not man enough to question Hunt in person you have no business saying it online.

As for duplicate accounts...........nope. Wrong. Thats actually my real name. I prefer to use my real name (and address/phone number/email) on all forums and not hide behind a fictious one like you. I also donate on a regular basis, show up at events and actively influence people that I can. Sorry, I'm not a "director" of anything. I'm just a ER Nurse who is tired of seeing law abiding citizens be the victims of violent crime.

Last thing, not trolling for people to go to CalCCW. I was banned there for being a Bill Hunt supporter. The owners/mods over there are a bunch of douchebags. Who knows maybe they are the same ones here. Hard to tell at this point


Ron W. Sallinger
179 S. Jameson
Orange, Ca. 92866
(949) 290-0720
ron.sallinger@yahoo.com

Mike Dicta
11-08-2009, 2:04 PM
Wow. Class act. With Joe and you behind Hunt, he's a sure winner.

Oh no, another "director" of "two organizations"..........yawn. Which ones? I kid you not, you guys on these forums think that throwing a self-given title around impresses people. Or maybe you think it gives you some sort of street cred to go ahead and run the only pro-ccw sheriff out of the campaign because he had a fumdraiser with Joe. If Keyster is the director of two "major organization" why doesnt he (or you) post his real name? Why the lack of transparency on these forums? Whats to hide? Oh wait, I'll give the standard answer ......... "those that need to know who I am, do". :rolleyes: I forgot how the "pro-ccw" forums run. Everyone is a director of something and has been involed in getting some law passed that has "helped gun-owners" somewhere :rolleyes:. Now if you or keyster wants to show up at an event, introduce yourself, and ask a question to Bill Hunt then you may get some respect. But if your not man enough to question Hunt in person you have no business saying it online.

As for duplicate accounts...........nope. Wrong. Thats actually my real name. I prefer to use my real name (and address/phone number/email) on all forums and not hide behind a fictious one like you. I also donate on a regular basis, show up at events and actively influence people that I can. Sorry, I'm not a "director" of anything. I'm just a ER Nurse who is tired of seeing law abiding citizens be the victims of violent crime.

Last thing, not trolling for people to go to CalCCW. I was banned there for being a Bill Hunt supporter. The owners/mods over there are a bunch of douchebags. Who knows maybe they are the same ones here. Hard to tell at this point


Ron W. Sallinger
179 S. Jameson
Orange, Ca. 92866
(949) 290-0720
ron.sallinger@yahoo.com

MasterYong
11-08-2009, 2:35 PM
Oh no, another "director" of "two organizations"..........yawn. Which ones? I kid you not, you guys on these forums think that throwing a self-given title around impresses people. Or maybe you think it gives you some sort of street cred to go ahead and run the only pro-ccw sheriff out of the campaign because he had a fumdraiser with Joe. If Keyster is the director of two "major organization" why doesnt he (or you) post his real name? Why the lack of transparency on these forums? Whats to hide? Oh wait, I'll give the standard answer ......... "those that need to know who I am, do". :rolleyes: I forgot how the "pro-ccw" forums run. Everyone is a director of something and has been involed in getting some law passed that has "helped gun-owners" somewhere :rolleyes:. Now if you or keyster wants to show up at an event, introduce yourself, and ask a question to Bill Hunt then you may get some respect. But if your not man enough to question Hunt in person you have no business saying it online.

As for duplicate accounts...........nope. Wrong. Thats actually my real name. I prefer to use my real name (and address/phone number/email) on all forums and not hide behind a fictious one like you. I also donate on a regular basis, show up at events and actively influence people that I can. Sorry, I'm not a "director" of anything. I'm just a ER Nurse who is tired of seeing law abiding citizens be the victims of violent crime.

Last thing, not trolling for people to go to CalCCW. I was banned there for being a Bill Hunt supporter. The owners/mods over there are a bunch of douchebags. Who knows maybe they are the same ones here. Hard to tell at this point


Ron W. Sallinger
179 S. Jameson
Orange, Ca. 92866
(949) 290-0720
ron.sallinger@yahoo.com

Wuzza?

http://www.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/board

:gene:

wildhawker
11-08-2009, 2:37 PM
Since you don't care to research before you post, the two organizations are Calguns, Inc. and Calguns Foundation, the latter having filed a suit to challenge the may-issue CCW permit policies of two CA Sheriffs. In case you're not aware of the case, please see this link (http://www.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/news/71-saf-calguns-challenge-arbitrary-denial-of-right-to-bear-arms-in-california).

I flew to SoCal in late August and drove to 5 engagements in 5 cities in 1.5 days to discuss pro-RKBA grassroots efforts with many dedicated activists. Where were you?

Didn't see you at the Fish & Game Commission meeting in Woodland on the lead ammo ban expansion either. Busy that day?

Paul's name isn't a secret (again, that would require a simple Google search, but that seems to be a bit much). He chooses to not place it in his signature but has never hidden behind his username as you apparently have in the past. My name is below, but in case you don't get that far it is Brandon Combs.

I'm having difficulty understanding if your goal is to be insulting or effective. With friends like you, Bill Hunt surely needs no enemies.


Oh no, another "director" of "two organizations"..........yawn. Which ones? I kid you not, you guys on these forums think that throwing a self-given title around impresses people. Or maybe you think it gives you some sort of street cred to go ahead and run the only pro-ccw sheriff out of the campaign because he had a fumdraiser with Joe. If Keyster is the director of two "major organization" why doesnt he (or you) post his real name? Why the lack of transparency on these forums? Whats to hide? Oh wait, I'll give the standard answer ......... "those that need to know who I am, do". :rolleyes: I forgot how the "pro-ccw" forums run. Everyone is a director of something and has been involed in getting some law passed that has "helped gun-owners" somewhere :rolleyes:. Now if you or keyster wants to show up at an event, introduce yourself, and ask a question to Bill Hunt then you may get some respect. But if your not man enough to question Hunt in person you have no business saying it online.

As for duplicate accounts...........nope. Wrong. Thats actually my real name. I prefer to use my real name (and address/phone number/email) on all forums and not hide behind a fictious one like you. I also donate on a regular basis, show up at events and actively influence people that I can. Sorry, I'm not a "director" of anything. I'm just a ER Nurse who is tired of seeing law abiding citizens be the victims of violent crime.

Last thing, not trolling for people to go to CalCCW. I was banned there for being a Bill Hunt supporter. The owners/mods over there are a bunch of douchebags. Who knows maybe they are the same ones here. Hard to tell at this point


Ron W. Sallinger
179 S. Jameson
Orange, Ca. 92866
(949) 290-0720
ron.sallinger@yahoo.com

HowardW56
11-08-2009, 2:37 PM
Keystryl.....And the candidate that your forum has fielded is who? Who have you put up? Who are you going to vote for? Jack Anderson.....Sandra? :rolleyes: This site is simply another I hate Bill Hunt site. There is another one just like it called CalCCW. Story is the same (as well as the mods/staff)..........bash any pro-ccw candidate for the slightest infraction and then gripe and complain of how crappy the gun laws are in california. :rolleyes:

It's your typical small-minded mentality that cant see the bigger picture. Who knows maybe its because you own the site and you think that you have some huge sway over the voters in OC (Got news for you..........you dont). There were hundreds of people at the fundraiser who see the man for who he is..........imperfect. Does he make mistakes? Yes. Is he perfect? No. The man has a good platform and solid base that keeps growing by the day and he understands that he cant be everything to everyone. If you dont want to help then just get out of the way and stop bashing the only pro-ccw candidate in the race.

Last thing, there are many like me who have had it with forums like this who make it their life work to cause divisions between gun-owners and prevent any meaningful reform in california. We have had it with people like you and will simply factor you, and forums like it, out of the equation and work with groups like SafeOC in getting Hunt elected. Hey, but I'm sure there are plenty of people who appreciate what you do here. Sandra can be counted amoung them.

Please deactivate my account......there are actual pro-ccw sites out there like USCCA and warriortalk that have members here in OC who will work to get a good candidate like Bill Hunt elected.

Ron W. Sallinger
179 S. Jameson
Orange, Ca. 92866
(949) 290-0720
ron.sallinger@yahoo.com

3 Posts and you're here insulting us....


Sorry buddy, but you don't know ****.....

Ron Sallinger
11-08-2009, 4:12 PM
Since you don't care to research before you post, the two organizations are Calguns, Inc. and Calguns Foundation, the latter having filed a suit to challenge the may-issue CCW permit policies of two CA Sheriffs. In case you're not aware of the case, please see this link (http://www.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/news/71-saf-calguns-challenge-arbitrary-denial-of-right-to-bear-arms-in-california).

I flew to SoCal in late August and drove to 5 engagements in 5 cities in 1.5 days to discuss pro-RKBA grassroots efforts with many dedicated activists. Where were you?

Didn't see you at the Fish & Game Commission meeting in Woodland on the lead ammo ban expansion either. Busy that day?

Paul's name isn't a secret (again, that would require a simple Google search, but that seems to be a bit much). He chooses to not place it in his signature but has never hidden behind his username as you apparently have in the past. My name is below, but in case you don't get that far it is Brandon Combs.

I'm having difficulty understanding if your goal is to be insulting or effective. With friends like you, Bill Hunt surely needs no enemies.

No actually, with forum members like this who needs gun control inc. Geesh, the guy has a fundraiser and the first thing you guys do is start tearing Hunt apart for having Joe as a speaker there. Go back and read some of the posts. The only people being insulting and divisive are a couple of members on this forum bad mouthing Hunt. Understand this.........the guy isnt perfect. No one is. Including you Brandon. However, he does support a shall issue county. How many other candidates are pro-ccw let alone shall issue? I'll answer........zero. Lets stop bashing the guy and start supporting him. If you dont like Joe, or what he has done in the past, then chalk it up as a youthful indiscretion on Hunt's part and move on. Joe is not running for office. Bill Hunt is.

As for you making it down here in August....great. Thank you for doing that. We need all the help we can get. Like I said before, I am an ER Nurse and work nights (7PM-730AM). I have to request time off to make events like that 30 days in advance. However, I have been to plenty of fundraisers for people running for office in Orange and Orange County. These are people who support 2nd amendment causes. Just because the event isnt labeled as such doesnt mean there wont be an impact on our rights in the community.

Last thing.......People are well aware of who I am on different forums. They see me as abrasive and and forthright (Funny, all my patients appreciate my candor and honesty. Not so in politics). That leads to the reason for all the screen names. I have various screen names because they banned Ron Sallinger. That forced me to log in using a different screen name (and i duly placed my real name in the sig line) which got me banned again :D. I am not one who likes to hide behind a computer. I also have no problem with people calling me or stopping by (call first) and discussing there concerns with me. However, I havent had any takers yet :D. Which goes back to ....... if you cant say it in public dont say it online.

Ron W. Sallinger
179 S. Jameson
Orange, Ca 92866
(949)290-0720
ron.sallinger@yahoo.com

bwiese
11-08-2009, 4:51 PM
No actually, with forum members like this who needs gun control inc.

Dude, folks in this forum, working with the NRA, brought about multiple CA revolutions in gunrights including downsizing the DOJ firearms group, 200+K new black rifles, bypassing the approved handgun roster, etc. CGF has succesfully defended 20 some assault weapons and hicap mag cases.

I think you're either a noob to the gunrights fight or you're a GOC member.

And we weren't attacking Bill Hunt. H'e's probably a good guy. I'm sure he's better than Hutchens.

We were merely attacking his wisdom of chooising Joe Arpaio... "Hi, I'm Joe Smith and I'm running for State Treasurer. I'm endorsed by Bernie Madoff." is the functional equivalent.

Joe Arpaio does NOT play well in CA, even in OC. Hunt will lose more votes than he gains.

HowardW56
11-08-2009, 5:03 PM
People are well aware of who I am on different forums. They see me as abrasive and and forthright

(Funny, all my patients appreciate my candor and honesty. Not so in politics).

That leads to the reason for all the screen names. I have various screen names because they banned Ron Sallinger. That forced me to log in using a different screen name (and i duly placed my real name in the sig line) which got me banned again :D.

Which goes back to ....... if you cant say it in public dont say it online.



The first line is accurate, you are abrasive, forthright, and foolish, and rude...

Your patients are in a position of need, they need you, we don't need your abusive self-righteous attitude.

Maybe you don't understand what "Banned" means, if you have been banned, you aren't welcome. Using another name is just a method for a person who isn't welcome to attempt a fraud and sneak back in...

YOu can discuss almost anything online, learn to accept it when people disagree with you...

U2BassAce
11-08-2009, 5:56 PM
The first line is accurate, you are abrasive, forthright, and foolish, and rude...

Your patients are in a position of need, they need you, we don't need your abusive self-righteous attitude.

Maybe you don't understand what "Banned" means, if you have been banned, you aren't welcome. Using another name is just a method for a person who isn't welcome to attempt a fraud and sneak back in...

YOu can discuss almost anything online, learn to accept it when people disagree with you...

+100

glbtrottr
11-08-2009, 6:21 PM
Please deactivate my account......

Have the mods had a chance to indulge the lad yet? Wait - they must be busy helping collect money for real problems to be pursued by...say...Mr. Gura?

The owners/mods over there are a bunch of douchebags.

How do you really feel? (Does Kes have an opinion? )

If Keyster...

Did you mean Kestryll? Because according to the Urban Dictionary, here's what I can't imagine you called the owner of the website: 1. keyster 22 up, 3 down - a verb for storing contraband in your rectum, common in prison

I was banned there for being a Bill Hunt supporter.

All those of you who disagree and think it had a little bit to do with Ron's charming personality, raise your hand and say "AYE"

http://pentictonvees.podbean.com/wp-content/blogs/33093/uploads/Raiseyourhands.jpg


This site is simply another I hate Bill Hunt site

Oh! And what did this site do all those years before Bill Hunt decided to run?

It's your typical small-minded mentality that cant see the bigger picture.

You mean this Big Picture, Ron?

http://991.com/newGallery/Elton-John-The-Big-Picture-204455.jpg

I'm going to disagree. I just don't think the mods are die hard Elton John fans like you are, Ron.

They see me as abrasive and and forthright (Funny, all my patients appreciate my candor and honesty. Not so in politics).

Not just politics. Do you think abrasiveness wins votes? What about forthrightness? Clue: think this one *very carefully*

Oh no, another "director" of "two organizations"..........yawn.

wait - what have you done? Let's see...

"I'm just a ER Nurse who is tired of seeing law abiding citizens be the victims of violent crime."

No, you give nurses a bad name. You're just an abrasive windbag bully full of hot air obsessed with the CCW candidate of your choice, insulting and unwelcome. Didn't your parents teach you how to be part of a community?

We have had it with people like you and will simply factor you, and forums like it, out of the equation and work with groups like SafeOC in getting Hunt elected.

Oops - my mistake. I guess not.

then chalk it up as a youthful indiscretion on Hunt's part and move on.

stop bashing the only pro-ccw candidate in the race.

Yup - we want someone who continually commits youthful indiscretions, or supports the polarizing Arpaio, or many other faults...to run our county's Sheriff's Department. I have a standing paycheck bet with anyone who will take it that Hunt will not get elected, and no one has taken me up on it. Get a clue: there will be other candidates, and will announce when ready.

However, he does support a shall issue county.

So do I, but it doesn't mean I'm going to get elected for Sheriff...and neither will Hunt, for that matter.


Which of these do you like best?

http://www.romancingsingapore.com/articlefiles/thumbnail_58744banned.jpg

http://www.bomb-omb.com/images/manhunt2_banned.jpg

http://www.airwarriors.com/forum/customavatars/avatar20712_1.gif


And my fave,

http://www.davidsfunnyfarm.com/images/ars_ibtl.jpg

Mike Dicta
11-08-2009, 7:31 PM
The sad fact is that (especially after Joe's 'amusing' speech for him) Bill Hunt is unelectable in Orange County.

Ron Sallinger
11-08-2009, 7:51 PM
Dude, folks in this forum, working with the NRA, brought about multiple CA revolutions in gunrights including downsizing the DOJ firearms group, 200+K new black rifles, bypassing the approved handgun roster, etc. CGF has succesfully defended 20 some assault weapons and hicap mag cases.

I think you're either a noob to the gunrights fight or you're a GOC member.

And we weren't attacking Bill Hunt. H'e's probably a good guy. I'm sure he's better than Hutchens.

We were merely attacking his wisdom of chooising Joe Arpaio... "Hi, I'm Joe Smith and I'm running for State Treasurer. I'm endorsed by Bernie Madoff." is the functional equivalent.

Joe Arpaio does NOT play well in CA, even in OC. Hunt will lose more votes than he gains.

Hey, great Joe probablly wasnt the best speaker to get to speak. But it shouldn't kill the message that Bill is trying to get out. I'm tired of seeing gun owners in california apologize for who they are. Bill is really making this issue a major plank in his campaign and all I am seeing is people on forums like this go after him with both barrels. What gives?

As for being a GOC member........have not been a part of the GOC. I'm sure that was meant as an insult though. You would of hit a sore spot if you called me a Yankees fan:D.

If you think Hunt made a mistake by having Joe as a speaker then draft a letter and send it to him. Let him know. He'll probablly reach out for you. Both he and his wife are very approachable and are genuinely good people that are concerned for the well being of the community. I would ask that you to reach out to him and let him know your concerns. It sure beats just talking about it online. I plan on drafting an email and sending it to his campaign tommorrow and sending him this link to let him know there are people who are upset about Joe being in OC. I will let you know his response.

Ron Sallinger
11-08-2009, 7:52 PM
The sad fact is that (especially after Joe's 'amusing' speech for him) Bill Hunt is unelectable in Orange County.

I disagree

Ron Sallinger
11-08-2009, 8:35 PM
[QUOTE=glbtrottr;3334280]Have the mods had a chance to indulge the lad yet? Wait - they must be busy helping collect money for real problems to be pursued by...say...Mr. Gura?

How do you really feel? (Does Kes have an opinion? )


Did you mean Kestryll? Because according to the Urban Dictionary, here's what I can't imagine you called the owner of the website: 1. keyster 22 up, 3down - a verb for storing contraband in your rectum, common in prison

All those of you who disagree and think it had a little bit to do with Ron's charming personality, raise your hand and say "AYE"


Oh! And what did this site do all those years before Bill Hunt decided to run?



You mean this Big Picture, Ron?


I'm going to disagree. I just don't think the mods are die hard Elton John fans like you are, Ron.



Not just politics. Do you think abrasiveness wins votes? What about forthrightness? Clue: think this one *very carefully*



wait - what have you done? Let's see...



No, you give nurses a bad name. You're just an abrasive windbag bully full of hot air obsessed with the CCW candidate of your choice, insulting and unwelcome. Didn't your parents teach you how to be part of a community?



Oops - my mistake. I guess not.





Yup - we want someone who continually commits youthful indiscretions, or supports the polarizing Arpaio, or many other faults...to run our county's Sheriff's Department. I have a standing paycheck bet with anyone who will take it that Hunt will not get elected, and no one has taken me up on it. Get a clue: there will be other candidates, and will announce when ready.



So do I, but it doesn't mean I'm going to get elected for Sheriff...and neither will Hunt, for that matter.


Which of these do you like best?


And my fave,



well Lloyd........it is Lloyd isnt it? Lloyd are you really this brave in real life or just when your online? I can see your busy bashing Hunt on this site as well. When I mentioned douchebag......... not only the mods came to mind but also you. And as for your bet. That would be illegal Lloyd. Seriously, think about what you are saying..............Your on an online forum betting on politics. Are you joking? You have a problem with Bill Hunt having Joe speak at a fundraiser but your openly, and illegally, betting on politics. However unwise and unpopular it was to have Joe speak at the fundraiser it is considered free speach and protected by the constitution and Bill of Rights. WHAT YOU ARE ENGAGING IN IS CALLED A CRIME. Big difference pal. Dont believe me ask Mr. Gura.

Honestly Lloyd, I hope you dont carry a gun. If you are so easily swayed to engage in illegal activity on an online forum you cant be trusted with a CCW permit. Now, I am willing to chalk your emotional rant as a youthful (even though you are not) indiscretion, and let it go. You should be as forgiving to Bill.

As for my parents raising me........... I showed Dad this thread. They couldnt be prouder :D.

Ron W. Sallinger
179 S. Jameson
Orange, Ca. 92866
(949) 290-0720

Mike Dicta
11-08-2009, 8:42 PM
It's odd how those who ask for their account to be deleted keep returning. And, Ron, sadly I am correct. Bill will get the Minuteman vote and that's about it. It might seem all powerful in a chest thumping sort of way to say what he does and align himself with those he has, but that's not how one wins elections.

Ron Sallinger
11-08-2009, 8:45 PM
It's odd how those who ask for their account to be deleted keep returning. And, Ron, sadly I am correct. Bill will get the Minuteman vote and that's about it. It might seem all powerful in a chest thumping sort of way to say what he does and align himself with those he has, but that's not how one wins elections.

I respectfully disagree sir.

Big O
11-08-2009, 8:46 PM
Wow... Just wow.

Big O
11-08-2009, 8:50 PM
I respectfully disagree sir.
Hey, no reason to start now, you're on a roll here.

glbtrottr
11-08-2009, 9:33 PM
Ron, you're a conspiracy theorist, man. Give it a rest. First I'm Greg Block, then I'm a banana, then I'm Lloyd...you're so confused! Have you been taking your meds?

you really this brave in real life or just when your online?

That sounds taunting and threatening, and I scare easy. I'm not that brave. You scare me. You truly do. It's defending myself and my loved ones from unstable people like you that is *so* important to me, which is why this election is so important and we can't leave it in the hands of amateurs.

Being as offensive as you are to all who disagree with you would make a good number of reasonable people wonder why *you* should be allowed to carry a firearm. You have a history of agressive behavior that long precedes your latest cause...Any reasonable Sheriff, Bill Hunt, Sandra Sue, or the next Sheriff of the County, should look at actions in their entirety before issuing a firearms permit. How do you think an issuing Sheriff would look upon your actions online, Ron? I know - I've asked. You give people pause.

Here's the reason you were thrown off of Calccw, and I anticipate you'll be thrown off here and other forums:

http://www.calccw.com/Forums/announcements-orange-county/11957-lawsuit-brought-former-sheriff-s-lt-bill-hunt-thrown-out-3.html

"Mr. Sallinger saying that we do not allow Bill Hunt supporters to post here is entirely incorrect. Mr. Salinger was actually banned last year long before Mr. Hunt was in the picture. The reason he was banned is because he was bashing law enforcement and being confrontational and disrepectful to fellow members. He was warned repeatedly but took no heed to said warning. His user name at that point was Ciderbite (for those interested in taking a look at his previous posts).

When Mr. Sallinger signed up again a few weeks ago it was obvious as to who he was. So he was banned again. Not for being a Bill Hunt supporter but because of what he had done in the past. It should be obvious to anyone reading his last post that his only interest in stirring the pot. Hunt supporters are more than welcome to post here as long as it's done in a courteous and respectful manner.

Mr. Sallinger and I spoke on the phone once and have exchenged a number of e-mails. The e-mails were equally inflammatory as his post above.

As evidence that we are not banning members simply for being Hunt Supporters, there is a member who goes by the handle "Reloader". He posted either yesterday or today in this same thread. He is still an active member.

So yes, the user "William Monroe" aka Ron Sallinger aka Ciderbite will be banned again, but not for being a Bill Hunt Supporter. He is being banned for what he did last year and for continuing to do nothing but stir the pot.

On that note, this thread will be closed. It has done nothing but cause grief to myself and the rest of the staff. Anyone who has any interest in starting a Bill Hunt thread is welcome to do so but they will be closely monitored to ensure it does not turn into a flame fest.

Those of you who are interested in contacting Mr. Sallinger may do so.

Thank you,

PS. It would be kind of hard for Banana to "be a man" as SHE is lacking the necessary body parts."

When I mentioned douchebag......... not only the mods came to mind but also you.

I take it you're typical of Bill Hunt supporters? You seem to be speaking on behalf of the group quite a bit, and affiliated with SafeOC, right? Is this what your group is like? You want attention. You want to be somebody. I get that. Sadly, internet forums give you an impression of having an audience. You genuinely give our cause a bad name. It's people like you that the newspapers want to write about.

And as for your bet. That would be illegal

Sue me.

However unwise and unpopular it was to have Joe speak at the fundraiser

Yup, it was. It's those unwise decisions that we don't want in the County of Orange Sheriff's Department. It seems that unwise decisions and those who make them run in packs these days.

It's not about you, Ron, or Kestryll, or Wildhawker, or anyone else you care to insult, or me. It's about Bill Hunt. We were respectfully sharing opinions, and as usual, you have to make it personal.

Please go back and hide in your cave, troll...

Kestryll
11-08-2009, 10:12 PM
*sigh*
I spend an evening with my Wife and when I log on I find this...

Ron, I could respond to any number of your points such as this being a 'hate Bill Hunt' site (honestly I don't care one way or the other about him) or any of the other tripe you've spewed.

But to what point?

You're not 'forthright' you're obnoxious.
You're not 'abrasive' you're a jerk.
And frankly the only thing that pointing out the inconsistencies, paranoid delusions and outright lies in your posts would do is give you more time and more exposure.
Now why would I want to give a yoyo like you a bigger soapbox?

Let me put this simply for you and then your juvenile attitude is going to not be welcome here okay?

Being in a position such as Sheriff means you are the FINAL link in the chain of command.
You have to know all that is said in your name and all abot those that you chose to have represent you.
Bill Hunt only has two options here.
Either he knew about Arpaio and his criminal activities and chose to ally himself with him anyway or he did not know and was incredibly negligent in his research before asking someone to speak for him.

In either scenario Bill made a massive error.

I'll leave you with two questions, or more appropriately you'll leave us after two questions.
First off, what do you really think your childish namecalling and overall obnoxious behavior has done to help Bill Hunt and his candidacy with the thousands or tens of thousands of members here?
Did you help him or hurt him, did you make allies and friends or alienate and antagonize?

Secondly, you seem not only okay with but proud of being removed multiple times from many forums.
Does this not strike you as odd that one community after another has shunned you and refused to associate with you?
You claim that all of the online forums are to blame yet every day hundreds of thousands of people manage to log on to various forums and never have a problem.
But you do, and you chose to blame the forums and their communities rather than look at the one common element in all of it.
You.
So do you look to the common element and see the problem or continue to delude yourself by blaming everyone else for your words and actions?


Goodbye Ron, take your desperate need to be relevant and heard elsewhere until you learn to converse and discuss like something other than a juvenile thug.

PS: If you truly showed your behavior in this thread to your parents and they felt anything other than shame much about you becomes incredibly clear.

Kestryll
11-08-2009, 10:30 PM
It's been posted several times on this forum but just for Ron I'll post it yet again.

My name is Paul T. Nordberg, as you can see in my profile I live in Reseda in Los Angeles City and County.
My email address is open for all to see and contact me through and quite a few members here have my direct cell phone number.

I don't hide.

Nor do I care that you loose your slings and arrows at me, catching them is part of the job.

However I am offended and angered at your complete and total ignorance in insulting and baseless dismissal of the members of this forum who have worked harder and done more to protect and restore our 2nd Amendment rights than darn near any other group I've ever seen.

You've been thrown off forums, they've stood on the ground in the hearings, court rooms and legislative sessions.
You've spewed garbage on the internet, they have spent days on the phone, sending letters and emails and even speaking in person to legislators to stop bad bills from becoming law.

You can call me a douche bag, and you might even be right.
But damned if you're fit to wipe the dirt off the shoes of the members of this forum.

Big O
11-08-2009, 10:39 PM
I was wondering how long it was going to take before someone shoveled that huge piece of yesterday's lunch outta here.

JTecalo
11-08-2009, 10:53 PM
that dude has some serious design flaws, bounce him

OrangeCountyCCW
11-09-2009, 7:42 AM
Mr. Sallinger is not "affiliated" with SAFE OC and does not speak for SAFE OC.

Thank you.

OrangeCountyCCW
11-09-2009, 8:02 AM
First, SAFE OC appreciates the fine work of this site and its moderators. We thank each and every one for the opportunity to post about CCW and the Sheriff's race here.

Second, it has been distressing to see so much focus on the flaws of -- not a candidate -- but of a *speaker* at a candidate's event. But at the same time, I can understand that some have strong feelings about Joe Arpaio and they are exercising their First Amendment rights here. I respect that. I do suggest that anyone who is concerned that Bill Hunt would violate their constitutional rights simply contact him directly and ask. As has been said here, he is very approachable.

Third, SAFE OC, once again, is an independent PAC. We have many contributors and have raised thousands of dollars to defeat Hutchens; however, no one contributor speaks for the PAC. Only its board does.

Thank you,
SAFE OC

bwiese
11-09-2009, 8:51 AM
SafeOC..

Thanks for the report; many of us are well aware no campaign would employ anyone like Ron Sallinger.

As we unfortunately know, campaigns in California are not often focused on gun issues - and the ones that are are usually running against us.

That means we're an issue "riding" on a freindly candidate that not only needs us, but others, to win. We also know that pro-gun issues don't kill a candidate as long as he's OK in his district on other matters.

IMHO Joe Arpaio doesn't play well for Californians even in Orange County - which is already undergoing a demographic shift and is not the same OC as it was 10-15 years ago. Yes, OC does have a subset of voters with whom certain issues bandied about by Arpaio will resonate - but I think there's a huge risk he'll drive WAY more away than bring in, and *lack* of Arpaio support will not hurt Mr Hunt in anyway.

Bottom line: I just don't want Arpaio to give Hutchens any "ammo".

Kestryll
11-09-2009, 9:02 AM
Mr. Sallinger is not "affiliated" with SAFE OC and does not speak for SAFE OC.

Thank you.

Just for the record, I never even considered that he was affiliated with or speaking on behalf of SAFE OC.

I've not seen anything that would ever lead me to think SAFE OC would condone that kind of behavior.

Kestryll
11-09-2009, 9:13 AM
Second, it has been distressing to see so much focus on the flaws of -- not a candidate -- but of a *speaker* at a candidate's event. But at the same time, I can understand that some have strong feelings about Joe Arpaio and they are exercising their First Amendment rights here. I respect that. I do suggest that anyone who is concerned that Bill Hunt would violate their constitutional rights simply contact him directly and ask. As has been said here, he is very approachable.

I wanted to address this point because I think more has been made of this than was actually said.

My concern is much the same as Bill's, Arpaio is a person who has a track record that is not stellar and is currently under investigation.
Having an association with him grants Hutchens a tool to use against him, especially in light of Corona having been investigated as well.

Most of us, whether we live in OC or not, are eager to see Hutchens collecting unemployment in the very near future so we become concerned when something looks as though it might prevent that.

I bear no ill will for Mr. Hunt or his campaign at all.
I do however think having Arpaio speak was an error in judgment both on a personal level in that I think Arpaio is not much better than the criminals he incarcerates and on a political level as he is so polarizing and divisive.

glbtrottr
11-09-2009, 9:27 AM
...it has been distressing to see so much focus on the flaws of -- not a candidate -- but of a *speaker* at a candidate's event....I do suggest that anyone who is concerned that Bill Hunt would violate their constitutional rights simply contact him directly and ask. As has been said here, he is very approachable.

Mr Hunt is indeed approachable. And he may be in fact a nice guy.

We have actually tried to focus on his flaws as well, and he has not responded...in person or otherwise. His choice of an Arpaio fundaiser is only the latest in his demonstration of poor judgement.

Bill seems to continue to have many apologists here, but so far, his silence continues. From violating constutitional rights, to his background, reasons for lawsuits, he simply makes one poor choice after another. Case in point: this thread was started to promote his alignment wit Arpaio, and lives on...

If I was running for office, and asked for Adolf Hitler to sponsor my campaign and show up to a fundraising event to speak on my behalf...I would be, by extension, implying that he represents me and I do him, in his beliefs...in totality given its context. Arguing about the brand of Adolf's favorite oven or discussing favorite methods of torture isn't the larger issue.

I'm not running for office. Bill is. I applaud that you are successfully raising money against Hutchens.

Arpaio may not be Adolf, but he's a fine example of how simply because we identify with a smidge of his beliefs (CCW, Open Carry), the overall net of Arpaio's service is a far greater negative. You don't like the Arpaio comparison with Adolf? Let's see: racism, torture, murder, burning down property, hints of a master (race) nationality, being above the law, etc...is this what Hunt is about?

By having him speak on his behalf, Bill virtually shouts that he espouses those same beliefs. This includes human torture, destruction and suppresion of evidence, burning down homes, and the broken down lives of Richard Post, Ambrett Spencer, Scott Norberg, and Brian Crenshaw...not to mention millions of dollars spent given misconduct and murder. The racism Arpaio displays against Mexicans is plain for all to see. Burning down the house in Ahwatukee is very telling of his policing style.

This is the same kind of paranoid, blitzkrieg policing that we worry about with Mike Hillman at OCSD and his ilk while the CCW capers took place in the County Board of Supervisors. Sending in SWAT to quell protesters under color of law and spying on the sups is not beyond the current administration...and by aligning himself to Arpaio's beliefs, Bill is telling us that he's also OK with Arpaio's practices...in some ways far worse than even the current administration displays.

If Bill resonates with Arpaio, he may be far worse. We've already seen Bill's documented propensity to display preferential treatment and willingness to derail investigations such as in the Stevens and Haidl cases, to mention a few. He simply continues to display poor judgement, year after year, as recent as last week. Do you really believe the OC general public will want to elect him?

Lastly, I have a host of emails from Jay Laseur and he has been candid and diligent about posting on in this forum - class act, though a number of us raised eyebrows on his Arpaio choices. Bill Hunt posted in this forum before. Having to chase Bill Hunt sounds counterproductive and out of touch. If he wants the constituency, he should have simply posted here, rather than have his minions do it for him.

p.s.: Having had family in Auschwitz, and spending a good amount of my formative years in Mexico, Arpaio's positions are particularly offensive.

CalCCW03
11-09-2009, 11:43 AM
Well done folks. It seems that even the organization he supposedly "spoke" for (SafeOC) wants nothing to do with him either. Keep up the good work guys! :)

Foulball
11-09-2009, 1:30 PM
Great post glbtrottr.

+1 !!!!!!

Asphodel
11-11-2009, 12:36 PM
Well, you'll remember the old Will Rogers line, 'all I know is what I read in the papers', right?

So.....I'm commenting 'from a distance' and on a purely 'theoretical' level.

That said, there is a very significant difference between the desert areas of Arizona and the coastal areas of California.

If a police agency in any coastal California area allows a 'war zone' attitude or mentality to develop and prevail, in which some number of residents are......or believe they are.....perceived as 'the enemy', on grounds of ethnicity or poverty, the potential for tragedy is all too obvious.

Unlike Arizona desert, the wooded areas of California provide a capability for 'revenge', with simple, cheap incendiary devices, in the 'long hot summer' and 'Santa Ana' wind conditions.

Now, I've no way to know whether any of the horrific wild-fires which have happened in California recently were caused by criminals, as a 'terror' technique........but it would seem rather obvious that the potential exists, wouldn't it?

The obvious theoretical issue, then, is that whomever has the responsibility for leadership in public-safety agencies here in California would face a very different situation that that which appears to be the case in Arizona. (again, I can't really 'know' that.....I speak only of 'appearances')

Here in California, would-be 'criminal gangs', or simply individuals motivated by 'revenge' for alleged wrongs, hold a potentially horrific 'trump card', should they be sufficiently motivated...or have become sufficiently 'psychotic'..... to employ it.

It reasonably follows, then, that the alleged 'extremism' in 'law enforcement' which we read about in Arizona, would be a disastrous policy, if followed in California.

What, then, would be prudent and rational public policy?

I don't know, but some group of responsible people really must find ways to develop such policy, lest we see further horrific 'internal warfare' in future. (the phrase 'civil war' is a mis-nomer.....possible, even probable homicide, and substantial loss of property by opportunistic arson is the very antithesis of 'civil')

cheers

Carla

dustoff31
11-11-2009, 2:55 PM
Well, you'll remember the old Will Rogers line, 'all I know is what I read in the papers', right?

So.....I'm commenting 'from a distance' and on a purely 'theoretical' level.

That said, there is a very significant difference between the desert areas of Arizona and the coastal areas of California.

If a police agency in any coastal California area allows a 'war zone' attitude or mentality to develop and prevail, in which some number of residents are......or believe they are.....perceived as 'the enemy', on grounds of ethnicity or poverty, the potential for tragedy is all too obvious.

You mean like what currently exists in LA, Richmond, Oakland, etc? Or for that matter most any major metropolitan area.

Unlike Arizona desert, the wooded areas of California provide a capability for 'revenge', with simple, cheap incendiary devices, in the 'long hot summer' and 'Santa Ana' wind conditions.

Now, I've no way to know whether any of the horrific wild-fires which have happened in California recently were caused by criminals, as a 'terror' technique........but it would seem rather obvious that the potential exists, wouldn't it?

The obvious theoretical issue, then, is that whomever has the responsibility for leadership in public-safety agencies here in California would face a very different situation that that which appears to be the case in Arizona. (again, I can't really 'know' that.....I speak only of 'appearances')

Here in California, would-be 'criminal gangs', or simply individuals motivated by 'revenge' for alleged wrongs, hold a potentially horrific 'trump card', should they be sufficiently motivated...or have become sufficiently 'psychotic'..... to employ it.

It reasonably follows, then, that the alleged 'extremism' in 'law enforcement' which we read about in Arizona, would be a disastrous policy, if followed in California.

What, then, would be prudent and rational public policy?


I do not think that a policy of "Let's not upset the criminals, they might get angry and behave like criminals," is the right answer.

But I do agree that Arpiao is probably way too rich for California blood.

bwiese
11-11-2009, 4:21 PM
But I do agree that Arpiao is probably way too rich for California blood.

Any 'richness' Arpaio has is illegally gotten gains thru use of power.

I'm betting Joe Arpaio will be in jail and/or not a sheriff + early "no comment" retirement within 3 years.

dustoff31
11-11-2009, 5:45 PM
Any 'richness' Arpaio has is illegally gotten gains thru use of power.

I'm betting Joe Arpaio will be in jail and/or not a sheriff + early "no comment" retirement within 3 years.

That's why the investigation needs to be done. If he's truly dirty, he must suffer the consequences. I'm not an Arpiao sycophant.

But doing unpopular and frankly, some dumb things doesn't necessarily mean they are illegal. If that were the case, most everyone would be in jail for something or another.

Asphodel
11-11-2009, 5:55 PM
Well, Bill, I'd agree that Mr Arpaio is about as bad a 'bad example' as might be found.

It really should be incomprehensible that he has any 'supporters' at all, other than those who are located where they must live in fear of him and his men.

My comment above about the relative vulnerability of California has to do with the greater likelihood of individuals who were subjected to extreme abuses becoming obsessed with a 'desire for revenge', and the relative ease with which truly horrific revenge may be taken by someone who is sufficiently obsessed or motivated.

It should be obvious enough that anyone here who replicated Mr Arpaio's methods would be very likely to produce some quantity of such alienated, obsessed, or possibly psychotic, individuals.

Past that, tho, the apparent 'social value structure' of those who support the class of abuse for which Mr Arpaio has become infamous is a tragedy in its own right.

What influences could have led modern Californians (who, in theory, are more sophisticated and better educated than the generality of the old Ku Klux Klan membership of, say, the 1920's) into such a 'social value structure'?

cheers

Carla

dustoff31
11-11-2009, 6:07 PM
It really should be incomprehensible that he has any 'supporters' at all, other than those who are located where they must live in fear of him and his men.

Just for the record, I live three counties away. I have absolutely nothing to fear from Arpiao, nor my own county sheriff for that matter.