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View Full Version : How to Increase CGN Membership 10x (to 1/3 million) in 1 yr?


Paladin
10-13-2009, 8:07 AM
Brainstorming thread alert! :D

Okay, we got spanked by the antis in Sacto on AB962. Time to pick ourselves up, dust ourselves off, and get in better shape for the next political fight.

IIRC, a few months ago Gene said the plan was to increase CGN membership by a magnitude (that's 10x for those in Rio Linda ;)), within one year. I don't recall hearing anyone say how to achieve that. So, let's (for a moment at least) take off our tin-foil hats (:TFH:) and put on our thinking caps and figure out how to get from here (~34,000 members) to there (1/3 of a million members).

I'll start.

1) We need members on all the big national/international gun forums to regularly post updates re what is going on in CA, CGN, and CGF. Sure, we'll get a lot of out-of-stater and former CAians as new members, but I'm also sure we'll pick up a lot of CAians too.

2) We need to divide up the state, probably county by county, and have certain members take the responsibility of keeping certain shooting ranges and gun stores stocked with CGN/CGF fliers (new ones for general promotional purposes). The gun stores and ranges I hit (I did not post on the spreadsheet since I do not like specifying where I roam -- :TFH:), were all VERY supportive, even suggesting how I could get around their own rules forbidding these sorts of activities. :cool:

Note: there may be legal restrictions on what we can do to promote CGN and CGF either separately or together due to tax regulations.

3) Personally, I like the idea of "business card fliers" (see #13 at the link in my sig line re "16 things YOU CAN DO to help pass 'Shall Issue'"). When I'm driving around and I see a parked car w/a military, hunting/fishing, or shooting related decal/bumper sticker, it usually takes me less than 2 minutes to pull over, grab a card, walk to their car and stick it under their wiper, get back in my car and be on my way again. Yet, I'd guess, the odds are 2 out of 3 that they'll visit and 50:50 that after they visit, they'll join (i.e., 1 out of 3 cards given out). They're also handy to give to others reading gun mags at newsstands, or people with whom you start talking to about guns, self-defense, 2nd A RKBA, totalitarianism, etc.

Now it is time for your ideas. Remember, time, money and effort required are always limiting factors, esp when dealing w/volunteers (i.e., us!).

rkt88edmo
10-13-2009, 8:11 AM
Start with 1 million? (ha ha ha play on the old gunshop joke)

I like the busniess card "flyer" idea. Another club I work with did this, it is much nicer than scribbling "calguns.net" on a random scrap of paper when you meet someone at the range, etc. It is easy to carry 1-3 in a wallet or a small bunch in the range bag.

.454
10-13-2009, 8:12 AM
We need to learn how to do "community organizing" if you get my drift.

rkt88edmo
10-13-2009, 8:17 AM
Also the cards are more "professional" in appearance and helps encourage the delivery of a consistent message.

gucci pilot
10-13-2009, 8:23 AM
I think the Girls of Calguns calender would bring in some members.

xxdabroxx
10-13-2009, 8:35 AM
advertising, calguns should try and do some ad sharing with other websites. If they could get another site to swap ads for a while i think that could help, but i do not know how receptive other websites would be to this.

EBR Works
10-13-2009, 8:38 AM
Free business cards are available from:

www.vistaprint.com

I had some printed up with my name, email, CalGuns user name and the CalGuns web address. I regularly hand these out to potential members and people I meet at the range. You can do any design you want and they are FREE.

I noticed at our last town hall meeting that Kestryll uses them as well.

WokMaster1
10-13-2009, 8:40 AM
I know Bill hates this idea. But I've always loved the idea of having a bunch of gunnies help out the poorer communities. Help paint a church or build a garden shed for your community center, etc. It could be in your own local community. In addition to recruiting gunnies, we should also recruit potential gunnies & educate them from all the hogwash they've been fed with all their lives.

I also love the fact that Oaklander lives in the middle of the "bad" part of Oakland. He is educating his neighbors with their rights & the responsibilities of being a gun owners.

We already have a legal division in CGF so now we need to show our PR side & show people that we are not the blood thirsty Rambo type.

Imagine seeing 20-30 folks in CG T-shirts helping a community project. Now that will be a showstopper.:D

dirtnap
10-13-2009, 8:43 AM
Free business cards are available from:

www.vistaprint.com

I had some printed up with my name, email, CalGuns user name and the CalGuns web address. I regularly hand these out to potential members and people I meet at the range. You can do any design you want and they are FREE.

I noticed at our last town hall meeting that Kestryll uses them as well.


it's only(or was last time) 4.95 for the shipping.

wildhawker
10-13-2009, 8:48 AM
Brief response due to time limitations:

Good ideas Paladin. The state is already broken into areas for localized outreach; this is the C3 program (Calguns Community Chapters). I think the forums are visible but not active, which they will be soon.

We have an effort I'll be bringing to the forum very soon, specifically an effort to reach every B&M FFL/ammo/firearms-related vendor in CA with CGN display and CGF donation box. More details to follow.

There is a lot we can do within our communities; start getting Calgunners you know of in your area together and talking in preparation of the rollout of C3. pennys dad started a thread for the LA/OC/IE District (which is the group for the 3 combined Chapters), see this thread (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=227978). Start one for your area if you're not in LA/IE/OC and rally the troops. As soon as we have the new forums up we'll open the floodgates and start prioritizing and working on projects.

There just might be a calendar; Mrs.Wildhawker and another CGNer have agreed pose *if* they retain creative... might have one in time for mid 2010 thru 2011.

Ad sharing is an area where we can use improvement, so is asking members of others forums to post our info there.

We're redoing the business cards and these should be avail in a few weeks.

-BC

Paladin
10-13-2009, 8:49 AM
advertising, calguns should try and do some ad sharing with other websites. If they could get another site to swap ads for a while i think that could help, but i do not know how receptive other websites would be to this.Thanks for reminding me of something I thought of a few days ago -- CGN/CGF advertisements in the CRPA newsletter. Sure, we're getting free advertising due to our members' articles, but an eye-catching ad couldn't hurt. Depending upon costs, an ad in a NRA magazine would be worth trying. An article written by one of us or about CGN/CGF in a NRA magazine would be even cheaper.

If IDPA, IPSC/USPSA, SASS, ICORE, and other shooting or hunting associations have newsletters, especially if they are CA specific, those could be good venues for advertising.

Kid Stanislaus
10-13-2009, 9:22 AM
I think the Girls of Calguns calender would bring in some members.

Maybe some of the girls at Dillon Precision would fib and say they're from CA!

EBR Works
10-13-2009, 9:27 AM
Maybe Wes at Ten Percent would agree to pose for a calendar targeting the Pink Pistols community. He seems to enjoy it based upon his prior posts. ;)

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=160576&highlight=photos

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g52/elrojo14/guns/jk5.jpg

Kid Stanislaus
10-13-2009, 9:32 AM
One of the SMARTEST things each of us can do is to make regular donations to Calguns. Many years ago the late Jesse Unruh, former Speaker of the CA State Assembly, was heard to say "Money is the mother's milk of politics". It was then and it is now.

EBR Works
10-13-2009, 9:35 AM
One of the SMARTEST things each of us can do is to make regular donations to Calguns. Many years ago the late Jesse Unruh, former Speaker of the CA State Assembly, was heard to say "Money is the mother's milk of politics". It was then and it is now.

+10000

Just do it!

Here: http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=108030

xrMike
10-13-2009, 10:57 AM
I think the Girls of Calguns calender would bring in some members.No good. You'd need at least 12 of 'em.

wash
10-13-2009, 11:25 AM
I wonder how we could reach out to the less computer literate out there?

Almost everyone has a phone, perhaps we could set up an automated 1-800 information line that people could call periodically to get up to speed and perhaps "register" by voice mail.

Maybe even set up to robo-call people for action alerts or something.

armandolo
10-13-2009, 11:30 AM
Problem is that people are scared of guns and think gun owners are crazy wakos. alot of folks do not even know what Calguns is. I propose a car sticker that goes on tha back windshiled that says something like "local gun owner and not a criminal. Calguns foundation" something like that.

yellowfin
10-13-2009, 12:22 PM
Problem is that people are scared of guns and think gun owners are crazy wakos. alot of folks do not even know what Calguns is. I propose a car sticker that goes on tha back windshiled that says something like "local gun owner and not a criminal. Calguns foundation" something like that.Good idea, but that requires our own people to get over their own semi-rational fear of being identified as a gun owner which is the root of the problem in the first place.

Cal-Irish
10-13-2009, 12:35 PM
Get a statement off to Nutnfancy (http://www.youtube.com/user/nutnfancy) and request his help in publicizing the cause. He has got 40k+ subscribers and his latest vid that hit youtube's front page is at 100k views in a matter of days.

And I like the general public friendly sticker idea. "Gun owner and not a criminal! CGF.com"

mmartin
10-13-2009, 12:45 PM
I think the Girls of Calguns calender would bring in some members.

yep.
so would recruiting more girls FOR calguns.
women are a huge untapped population... teach the women around you to shoot, and then sign'em up here...
megan

mmartin
10-13-2009, 12:47 PM
I know Bill hates this idea. But I've always loved the idea of having a bunch of gunnies help out the poorer communities. Help paint a church or build a garden shed for your community center, etc. It could be in your own local community. In addition to recruiting gunnies, we should also recruit potential gunnies & educate them from all the hogwash they've been fed with all their lives.

I also love the fact that Oaklander lives in the middle of the "bad" part of Oakland. He is educating his neighbors with their rights & the responsibilities of being a gun owners.

We already have a legal division in CGF so now we need to show our PR side & show people that we are not the blood thirsty Rambo type.

Imagine seeing 20-30 folks in CG T-shirts helping a community project. Now that will be a showstopper.:D

like this.
megan

mmartin
10-13-2009, 12:49 PM
There just might be a calendar; Mrs.Wildhawker and another CGNer have agreed pose *if* they retain creative... might have one in time for mid 2010 thru 2011.


dude you have no idea how fast my bellydancing shooters would sign up for this... you want us, we're in.
megan

Kestryll
10-13-2009, 12:49 PM
How to Increase CGN Membership 10x (to 1/3 million) in 1 yr?

Just for reference..

This is NOT how to get people to join.

I was eating lunch dude!!!!

:43:


http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g52/elrojo14/guns/jk5.jpg

mmartin
10-13-2009, 12:50 PM
No good. You'd need at least 12 of 'em.

you really haven't been paying attention... we're here.:cool:
megan

Kestryll
10-13-2009, 12:54 PM
my bellydancing shooters ...

I just had the most horrible flashback to bad 70's B movies.....

wildhawker
10-13-2009, 12:56 PM
Two quick points:

* any statements need to come from Kes, Ivanimal, Artherd or myself.

* we need to remember that CGF and CGN are two separate and independent orgs. Our outreach program is thru CGN.

johnny_22
10-13-2009, 12:56 PM
Opencarry.org appears on Tom's radio show many times. Calguns.net should be welcome as well. Lots of internet listeners in California, as well as in adjacent states.

mmartin
10-13-2009, 12:57 PM
1) does CGF have a "sign up to have regular monthly donations" feature?
automatically billed to your CC or paypal?

2) offer a bonus of some sort to donation subscribers - a monthly gun review, a whitepaper on reloading, a cheat-sheet on improving your accuracy, a bullet-pointed guide to talking about guns to the gun-timid.
takes a little effort to write this stuff up, but once written, it costs almost nothing to distribute, and nothing if done electronically.

3) is there a program in place to get shops / vendors / ranges to give a discount to calguns members? we give them some advertising indicating they offer a discount, they promote us with flyers in their location, customer signs up to calguns and gets a discount too... everyone wins.

megan

mmartin
10-13-2009, 12:58 PM
I just had the most horrible flashback to bad 70's B movies.....

dude we are SOOoo much cooler that that...:D
actually, I've got 4 sherrif's officers in my classes right now.
megan

Kestryll
10-13-2009, 1:03 PM
Two quick points:

* any statements need to come from Kes, Ivanimal, Artherd or myself.

* we need to remember that CGF and CGN are two separate and independent orgs. Our outreach program is thru CGN.

Both good points.

Calguns is of and for it's members but for legal and liability reasons anything that comes out as 'official' needs to come from one of us.

This shields the membership from being personally liable for something misinterpreted and protects the forum from being financially liable for something misstated.

It's kind of a legalese protection for all of us.


We really need to keep the separation between CGF and CGN both in mind and very visible.
No one wants to waste time and money paying Counsel to explain the difference in court and we definitely do not want to generate confusion that might jeopardize CGF's 501 (c)3!

I know it sounds a bit weaselly but the more we grow and step in the spotlight the more we have to watch our step and cover our backsides.
And by 'our' I mean both CGN and the members that make it happen.

wildhawker
10-13-2009, 1:03 PM
Megan, call me later this afternoon. Email me and I'll get you my phone number.

mmartin
10-13-2009, 1:16 PM
dude we are SOOoo much cooler that that...:D
megan
this, but replace the swords...
http://www.flickr.com/photos/azizasaid/
megan
ETA: ok, that didn't work (including the photos) but the link should.

Kestryll
10-13-2009, 1:18 PM
dude we are SOOoo much cooler that that...:D
actually, I've got 4 sherrif's officers in my classes right now.
megan

The first thing that popped in to my head was those cheesy movies like 'Nazi Cheerleaders'. :D

So what kind of bellydancing do you do?

Several years ago my Wife and I had a friend who did and taught informally the more traditional forms of bellydance.
Sisi helped my Wife make a traditional garment which I can not recall the name of, it almost looks like a sleeveless coat.

mmartin
10-13-2009, 1:21 PM
Megan, call me later this afternoon. Email me and I'll get you my phone number.

pm with contact email sent.
megan

mmartin
10-13-2009, 1:27 PM
The first thing that popped in to my head was those cheesy movies like 'Nazi Cheerleaders'. :D

So what kind of bellydancing do you do?

Several years ago my Wife and I had a friend who did and taught informally the more traditional forms of bellydance.
Sisi helped my Wife make a traditional garment which I can not recall the name of, it almost looks like a sleeveless coat.

love those movies, got all the ones with bellydancers. cheesy dancing but really fun costuming.

I won the Middle Eastern Dance in North America competition in 2000.

I do turkish, egyptian, arabic, american, greek. folkloric, modern and traditional styles of cabaret, folk dances from all over the middle east and north africa. american tribal style and fusion. also a bit of flamenco and hula.

basically everything from what you see at the ren faire to what you see in restaurants. mostly teaching and not performing much right now. have about 60 students active and 4 teachers besides myself in my school, and half a dozen professional performers.

have written chapters for several books on the subject too...

that's generally called a ghawazee coat or a beladi dress, but sometimes a thobe... depends on the style and nationality.

megan aka Aziza Sa'id

jdberger
10-13-2009, 1:28 PM
I just want to get this out early - I'm not posing.

I'm just not that comfortable with my body image lately - so stop asking.

On another note - I wonder if we could get ranges to hand out an CGN brocure with every lane assignment?

I'll check with Davis Street to see if they're interested. This might take a week or so - I have to wait for the friendly range guys and I won't be available this weekend.

Is there a .pdf of the CGN brocure that's available?

wash
10-13-2009, 1:33 PM
I just had the most horrible flashback to bad 70's B movies.....
I imagined Haji from Faster *****cat Kill! Kill! but that's more like go-go dancing:
http://content6.flixster.com/photo/10/81/15/10811528_gal.jpg

Kestryll
10-13-2009, 1:33 PM
Ghawazee, that was it indeed.

I remember Sisi being very adamant that bellydancing wasn't just about gyrating in a bikini and that if you could not do it and be both entertaining and attractive in a ghawazee with full sleeves you weren't doing it right.

wash
10-13-2009, 1:37 PM
I don't discriminate against the gyrating in a bikini type.

dantodd
10-13-2009, 1:38 PM
I've talked about this with Brandon before but I think we should print trigger guard tags and get gun stores to put them on their firearms display and preferably also add them to the box of any firearm sold. I know the NRA does this at the manufacturer level for national coverage but having a tag on most guns sold in CA would be a huge help. Unfortunately the fact that CGN and CGF are not the same entity will come up because it would be great if the "call to action" would lead them to both a donation page AND a "join the community" page.

I personally believe that the flyers/tags etc. should all be done through CGF with a secondary call to join the CGN community. This will allow CGF to use fundraising monies to print and distribute the documentation. It will also allow the donation page with lawsuit information etc. to be the first impression. While the forums are great if we drive membership via CGF we can control the first impression our new members get of the goals and successes of the movement much more than if the community and forum is their first exposure.

I also REALLY like the CalGuns business card idea. We could probably use zazzle or some similar site to print the cards which would keep control of the image in CGF hands and also have a built-in CGF donation with every order.

steadyrock
10-13-2009, 1:53 PM
1) does CGF have a "sign up to have regular monthly donations" feature?
automatically billed to your CC or paypal?

2) offer a bonus of some sort to donation subscribers - a monthly gun review, a whitepaper on reloading, a cheat-sheet on improving your accuracy, a bullet-pointed guide to talking about guns to the gun-timid.
takes a little effort to write this stuff up, but once written, it costs almost nothing to distribute, and nothing if done electronically.

3) is there a program in place to get shops / vendors / ranges to give a discount to calguns members? we give them some advertising indicating they offer a discount, they promote us with flyers in their location, customer signs up to calguns and gets a discount too... everyone wins.

megan

Following up on (3), could a vendor agreement be reached with some or all of the vendors here to include a CGN/CGF color flier in each order? Something small, similar to the AB 962 fliers. That is a very large distribution network we may be able to tap.

wash
10-13-2009, 1:55 PM
Vendor fliers are a great idea.

wildhawker
10-13-2009, 2:02 PM
So, another couple of quick hits:

* Additional content: we're looking at creating a single-page buckslip (like color AB962/SB585 flyer we just produced) for those instances where the additional cost of the full tri-fold is unwarranted. Tri-fold brochures will probably be refreshed at the same time we create the buckslip. We already have CGN business cards, and will be refreshing those as well. Likely will go to 2-sided for add'l info (presently 1-sided).

* I *really* like the gun hang-tag idea. For me, right now, my hangup is that there are a few fruits that need picking before this comes up to the top. That said, I'd like to make this a goal for early 2010.

* No offense to all, but I'd love to see if we can put togther a coalition of web developers to assist with some badly-needed web updates and infrastructure to support the outreach program (I think obeygiant, 8-ball, ripcurlksm etc had some great ideas here (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=227307) to build on). I'd further like to bend CGFs ear and see if they'd let us create some proposals for a landing page upgrade over there.

* First and foremost: I need some help taking the existing database of volunteers, getting it into a format we can more effectively utilize and get some people to follow up and fill in some blanks. From there we can build the programs and setup project teams.

I'd love to brainstorm this with a few savvy CGNers on a conf call.

It's time to get moving. We have bills to beat and culture to change.

SKSer
10-13-2009, 2:03 PM
the biggest obstacle ive come into with spreading calgunnery is speaking with older people, which is a large part of the gun community, who are completely computer illiterate.

EBR Works
10-13-2009, 2:14 PM
Just for reference..

This is NOT how to get people to join.

I was eating lunch dude!!!!

:43:

At least you laughed.....

mmartin
10-13-2009, 2:15 PM
Ghawazee, that was it indeed.
I remember Sisi being very adamant that bellydancing wasn't just about gyrating in a bikini and that if you could not do it and be both entertaining and attractive in a ghawazee with full sleeves you weren't doing it right.
+100 on that.
I don't discriminate against the gyrating in a bikini type.
and I'm sure they look lovely, but everything has it's place and that isn't belly dancing!
you go right ahead though, if you're inclined... :eek:
megan

mmartin
10-13-2009, 2:22 PM
* First and foremost: I need some help taking the existing database of volunteers, getting it into a format we can more effectively utilize and get some people to follow up and fill in some blanks. From there we can build the programs and setup project teams.

ConstantContact.com is easy to set up for mailing lists, you can identify teams/subteams, get people assigned to one or many, control/update contact info or allow them to, do straightforward contact mailing easily, or fancy emailing with a little work.

small cost involved, very reasonable for the power it provides. if you need help setting it up, I've got current skills. and it's very easy to teach others to use once set up, so it's not a single point of contact/bottleneck.
megan

mmartin
10-13-2009, 2:23 PM
the biggest obstacle ive come into with spreading calgunnery is speaking with older people, which is a large part of the gun community, who are completely computer illiterate.

yep, that's a population that should be addressed. megan

jdberger
10-13-2009, 2:23 PM
I like the double sided flyer and hang tag idea.

Computer illiteracy is a huge issue - however, the folks I'm running into that want to get involved figure out a way to either get to CGN or get their info from someone who's already there.

That said, I think that the hangtags should promote CGN and NOT CGF.

CGN doesn't ask for money. It's free. It's communal. It doesn't have sketchy connotations due to it's possibility of being confused with some of those "no compromise" blowhard organizations, or even worse, AHSA.

Because of all these reasons, CGN is more inviting (it's logo is even more inviting).

That said, I'd like to do a "hard push" on vendors to start including CGN materials with sales. Something along the line of Corleone "protection" without the bad accents, violence and bloodshed.

Too long, vendors have taken us for granted. They spread FUD, bash CGN and when asked to help with the cause (where it wouldn't cost them a dime) they abstain because they don't want to do anything political.

Well, there's a price for apathy.

[/militant jberger]

mmartin
10-13-2009, 2:34 PM
IThat said, I'd like to do a "hard push" on vendors to start including CGN materials with sales. Something along the line of Corleone "protection" without the bad accents, violence and bloodshed.

Too long, vendors have taken us for granted. They spread FUD, bash CGN and when asked to help with the cause (where it wouldn't cost them a dime) they abstain because they don't want to do anything political.

Well, there's a price for apathy

this stuff often works better if you're giving something rather than wanting something... so what are we going to give them for their cooperation and participation?

how about offering training materials in the interpretation of law, case law, etc. to dispell the FUD? how about a tearsheet with a short history of progressive gunrights restrictions and the legal foundations/lawsuits that undo it? how about a one-evening class in how to get your C&R, and why you want one? or other available licensing? charge a small fee or free if you make a cgf donation?

how about we make up a list of 10 reasons the ammo shop benefits from promoting CGF/N? people love lists... especially if it really IS about what they GET for doing something.

or if you're wanting something more fear based, how about a "top 10 mistakes FFLs make before an ATF/DOJ audit"? give them that in exchange for a $50 dollar donation to the fund, or in exchange for putting our flyers in the bag with purchases.

megan

AndrewMendez
10-13-2009, 2:36 PM
Get a statement off to Nutnfancy (http://www.youtube.com/user/nutnfancy) and request his help in publicizing the cause. He has got 40k+ subscribers and his latest vid that hit youtube's front page is at 100k views in a matter of days.

And I like the general public friendly sticker idea. "Gun owner and not a criminal! CGF.com"

This goes back to my YouTube idea as well! There are soooo many people that waste their lives on that site! We need to join in!

wildhawker
10-13-2009, 2:44 PM
I like militant jdberger. :43:

I like the double sided flyer and hang tag idea.

Computer illiteracy is a huge issue - however, the folks I'm running into that want to get involved figure out a way to either get to CGN or get their info from someone who's already there.

That said, I think that the hangtags should promote CGN and NOT CGF.

CGN doesn't ask for money. It's free. It's communal. It doesn't have sketchy connotations due to it's possibility of being confused with some of those "no compromise" blowhard organizations, or even worse, AHSA.

Because of all these reasons, CGN is more inviting (it's logo is even more inviting).

That said, I'd like to do a "hard push" on vendors to start including CGN materials with sales. Something along the line of Corleone "protection" without the bad accents, violence and bloodshed.

Too long, vendors have taken us for granted. They spread FUD, bash CGN and when asked to help with the cause (where it wouldn't cost them a dime) they abstain because they don't want to do anything political.

Well, there's a price for apathy.

[/militant jberger]

steadyrock
10-13-2009, 2:45 PM
this stuff often works better if you're giving something rather than wanting something... so what are we going to give them for their cooperation and participation?

how about offering training materials in the interpretation of law, case law, etc. to dispell the FUD? how about a tearsheet with a short history of progressive gunrights restrictions and the legal foundations/lawsuits that undo it? how about a one-evening class in how to get your C&R, and why you want one? or other available licensing? charge a small fee or free if you make a cgf donation?

how about we make up a list of 10 reasons the ammo shop benefits from promoting CGF/N? people love lists... especially if it really IS about what they GET for doing something.

or if you're wanting something more fear based, how about a "top 10 mistakes FFLs make before an ATF/DOJ audit"? give them that in exchange for a $50 dollar donation to the fund, or in exchange for putting our flyers in the bag with purchases.

megan

All good ideas. To add:

* How about a 10% discount on advertising rates on CGN if they include fliers in every order?

* How about a "Calguns Preferred Vendor Status" with special placement on the new front page or in the forums themselves, and a card at Christmas?

wildhawker
10-13-2009, 2:50 PM
The thought was to create a "CA gun laws basics" (purchase, transport, AW basics etc) handout so they can use it to educate their newb customers. The ranges and FFLs we've talked to have said that it would be tremendously helpful to their business.

So, boiled down, we can offer indirect but valuable customer support and a customer base as well as advertising opportunities and unparalleled communications tools.

Freedom isn't free, nor will all our efforts be. I am confident that the intrinsic value of this community will be apparent to the vast majority of store owners/operators.

this stuff often works better if you're giving something rather than wanting something... so what are we going to give them for their cooperation and participation?

how about offering training materials in the interpretation of law, case law, etc. to dispell the FUD? how about a tearsheet with a short history of progressive gunrights restrictions and the legal foundations/lawsuits that undo it? how about a one-evening class in how to get your C&R, and why you want one? or other available licensing? charge a small fee or free if you make a cgf donation?

how about we make up a list of 10 reasons the ammo shop benefits from promoting CGF/N? people love lists... especially if it really IS about what they GET for doing something.

or if you're wanting something more fear based, how about a "top 10 mistakes FFLs make before an ATF/DOJ audit"? give them that in exchange for a $50 dollar donation to the fund, or in exchange for putting our flyers in the bag with purchases.

megan

jdberger
10-13-2009, 3:01 PM
I like Megan's push/pull, too.

I'm just a little p'od right now with all the "we lost, I quit" idiots and the Corporations that couldn't be bothered to help us out by letting us put a flyer on their freakin' counter because they didn't want to get involved.

JHC! Our efforts were going to save THEM money.

nicki
10-13-2009, 3:21 PM
Calguns has done outreach, Gene and Don did a great job at the SAF GRPC 2009 in speaking to other gun groups.

When I have all the videos edited, I will ask SAF to do a blast to not only groups who were there, but also to past groups as well.

The SAF GRPC 2010 will be in San Fran, so SAF has a interest in getting the word out bigtime.

One thing I am looking at doing is doing a encore follow up webcast of the whole conference. If any of you know how to do this and have the tools to do so, send me a PM. In all honesty I am clueless.

I just covered the funding and got a competent camera person out to do the job and she is doing the post editing right now as we speak.

The campaign for liberty and other similar type groups would be a natural to do something like this.

We at Calguns don't have our hands tied by national groups, we are independent and can adjust as we need.

As Brandon says, we need regional groups to make things happen, but we also need to create what I call for a lack of a better term, the Calguns Strikeforce.

Where we can make the most difference is in primaries and in local races.

Due to term limits, one third of the assembly and one quarter of the state senate changes every election cycle.

We must try and have pro gun candidates in all primaries. It is the primaries that really decide who wins the elections.

This is where we get the most bang for our buck and our involvement.

Even if our candidate loses, winners remember who supported their opponents and smart politicians reach across to the supporters of the losers and try to bring them into their camp.

Politicians will look and even if they are anti gun, if they see that opposing us makes them ineffective in getting other things done, they will back off.

The issue of course will be opposing us will be expensive.

Eventually we will grow in size that we can influence all primaries. At that point we can wheel and deal with both Democrats and Republicans.

Gun rights activists have put too much of their eggs in the Republican basket.

Rod Wright gave a speech a few years back and his told the audience that his fellow Dem's couldn't believe gun owners were actually supporting him because he was a Black Democrat.

Something to think about.

Nicki

mmartin
10-13-2009, 3:25 PM
I like Megan's push/pull, too.

I'm just a little p'od right now with all the "we lost, I quit" idiots and the Corporations that couldn't be bothered to help us out by letting us put a flyer on their freakin' counter because they didn't want to get involved.

JHC! Our efforts were going to save THEM money.

however if we failed to sell THEM on that idea, bad on us.

if we are not able to convince them to act, we:
1) haven't scared them enough
2) helped them enough
3) shown them their upside clearly enough
4) educated them enough
5) made them feel the pain of not helping us enough.

if you can put someone DEEPLY in touch with the pain they feel now or will feel for failing to act, and then you put in front of them the path to making that pain STOP, they will take it.

carrot and stick, stick and carrot. we're really very simple...

megan

wildhawker
10-13-2009, 3:42 PM
All true, and time worked against us on this one.

however if we failed to sell THEM on that idea, bad on us.

if we are not able to convince them to act, we:
1) haven't scared them enough
2) helped them enough
3) shown them their upside clearly enough
4) educated them enough
5) made them feel the pain of not helping us enough.

if you can put someone DEEPLY in touch with the pain they feel now or will feel for failing to act, and then you put in front of them the path to making that pain STOP, they will take it.

carrot and stick, stick and carrot. we're really very simple...

megan

mmartin
10-13-2009, 3:50 PM
All true, and time worked against us on this one.

dang you mean elves aren't going to come do the work for us in the middle of the night? rats. I was SO looking forward to a full night's sleep...

still, the pain they are ABOUT to feel for not having worked with us on this one is something we can use. "see what happens when we don't all pitch in? you thought this wasn't important enough for your action, well here's what it's going to cost. and here's what you need to do to start putting things right..."
megan

wildhawker
10-13-2009, 3:54 PM
We need to approach this cautiously and strategically, especially right now.

The infrastructure to communicate with orgs/politicians/etc needs to be built.

Lots of great ideas in this thread - who can help create/execute?

dang you mean elves aren't going to come do the work for us in the middle of the night? rats. I was SO looking forward to a full night's sleep...

still, the pain they are ABOUT to feel for not having worked with us on this one is something we can use. "see what happens when we don't all pitch in? you thought this wasn't important enough for your action, well here's what it's going to cost. and here's what you need to do to start putting things right..."
megan

mmartin
10-13-2009, 3:56 PM
We need to approach this cautiously and strategically, especially right now.

The infrastructure to communicate with orgs/politicians/etc needs to be built.

Lots of great ideas in this thread - who can help create/execute?

in. wasn't really planning on sleeping anyway.
what do you need?
megan

mmartin
10-13-2009, 3:57 PM
We need to approach this cautiously and strategically, especially right now.

The infrastructure to communicate with orgs/politicians/etc needs to be built.

Lots of great ideas in this thread - who can help create/execute?

and check your pms... sent you my email... need a ph#.
megan

steadyrock
10-13-2009, 4:00 PM
We need to approach this cautiously and strategically, especially right now.

The infrastructure to communicate with orgs/politicians/etc needs to be built.

Lots of great ideas in this thread - who can help create/execute?

You know I'm in. I can do both.

1923mack
10-13-2009, 4:13 PM
Flyers are great, but if there is no content, then they are just a piece of paper. You have to get the horse before the cart. The web site is great, but as of today Calguns does not have much else. Starting local chapters is a good start. That and some other ideas discussed above and on other posts need to be implemented. Do not flood the FFL's and gun stores to soon. Get some good flyers with interesting information then send them out.

jdberger
10-13-2009, 4:16 PM
Flyers are great, but if there is no content, then they are just a piece of paper. You have to get the horse before the cart. The web site is great, but as of today Calguns does not have much else. Starting local chapters is a good start. That and some other ideas discussed above and on other posts need to be implemented. Do not flood the FFL's and gun stores to soon. Get some good flyers with interesting information then send them out.

Oh - so you think that blank flyers are a bad idea?






Back to the drawing board, Brandon....dammmit!

mmartin
10-13-2009, 4:19 PM
if you are interested in help getting the volunteer database in constantcontact, let me know. i can do that.
megan

catnipper
10-13-2009, 4:19 PM
The fight is national, period. NRA and all of the small groups like CGF need to band together. We only have so many resourses and mine are going national.

dantodd
10-13-2009, 4:20 PM
The thought was to create a "CA gun laws basics" (purchase, transport, AW basics etc) handout so they can use it to educate their newb customers.

Do we have any contact with John Machtinger? It would be really nice to have a short "How to Won a Gun and Stay Out of Jail" summary that would resonate with the FFLs as well as carry the weight of a well respected author. This could all be part of the bigger push for CGN/CGF to be the coalescing force for the 2A fight in CA. It would also be great to get him posting here.

wildhawker
10-13-2009, 4:21 PM
The fight is national, period. NRA and all of the small groups like CGF need to band together. We only have so many resourses and mine are going national.

I'd like to hear your thoughts on this - care to elaborate?

hamster
10-13-2009, 4:25 PM
Bumper sticker idea:
Gun control is being able to hit your target.
-calguns.net

wash
10-13-2009, 4:35 PM
One thing I wonder about is that I never see anyone from SAF on here but they are at the top of a lot of good lawsuits. If I ever give to a national group, they would be one I would consider. If they stuck their hand out, I would probably give but I never see it, what's the story?

On the other hand, I feel confident that my money is being put to good use by CGF.

artherd
10-13-2009, 6:21 PM
Great ideas all! Some of these are in the works already, (eg calendar is a distinct possibly, though the girls have threatened not to do it unless I pose for their own private collections... As long as it's artistic...) keep them coming.


* We are generally going to use CGN to promote CGF and not the other way around (for nonprofit reasons, this is a little cleaner.) trigger tag idea is great and is in motion.

* Working on a CGN store as we speak. Big things coming. Things I can't announce for about 1 more week...

* What we really need to do is start more effectively leveraging our extensive talent base. Kes Ivan WH and I just don't have enough hours in the day to do all of this stuff - and you want to help. Let's connect the dots!

BigDogatPlay
10-13-2009, 7:33 PM
Whatever I can do for the group, I'm in. I've been trimming other commitments back anyway, so focusing on one "good" thing makes sense for me.

ETA: That does not include appearring in a thong in a calendar, however. ;)

wash
10-13-2009, 9:13 PM
* We are generally going to use CGN to promote CGF and not the other way around (for nonprofit reasons, this is a little cleaner.) trigger tag idea is great and is in motion.
Could you point me at the person doing the tags?

I have an idea but I would like to make sure it's not stepping on any toes.

wildhawker
10-13-2009, 9:16 PM
Could you point me at the person doing the tags?

I have an idea but I would like to make sure it's not stepping on any toes.

We're all working together. Hang on to your idea for just a short time longer and we'll discuss it soon.

zhyla
10-13-2009, 9:37 PM
The best way to make pro-gun voters is to get a gun in the hands of someone who doesn't have one. I don't know if that's build parties or free shoots or what, but there's something there we're not doing.

KylaGWolf
10-14-2009, 8:18 AM
I think the Girls of Calguns calender would bring in some members.

Not if I was in it I would scare people.

Someone asked how we can boost membership. That is being addressed in the townhall meetings that Wildhawker has been putting on. There are some great ideas in how we can do that but all the ideas in the world are not going to put them in to action unless those of us on this forum get up and do the legwork for it. So see what you can do in getting a townhall meeting with Wildhawker set up and start doing what you can to spread the word.

dantodd
10-14-2009, 8:25 AM
* Working on a CGN store as we speak. Big things coming. Things I can't announce for about 1 more week...


This is probably the number one thing that should be on the list, I'm glad that it is. No matter how many great bumper sticker, T-shirt etc. ideas we have they are useless without a way to effectively distribute them to the membership and we the membership are the best way to get the name out there. 30,000 backs advertising at the range and in the field is our most effective advertising tool.

(that and TV ads during midget wrestling on UHF, or the HD equivalent)

Can'thavenuthingood
10-14-2009, 9:29 AM
* We are generally going to use CGN to promote CGF and not the other way around (for nonprofit reasons, this is a little cleaner.) trigger tag idea is great and is in motion.

* Working on a CGN store as we speak. Big things coming. Things I can't announce for about 1 more week...



I have been pushing that for sometime, CGN feeds CGF.

A Calguns.net store?
Whats up with that?

Vick

steadyrock
10-14-2009, 9:50 AM
Great ideas all! Some of these are in the works already, (eg calendar is a distinct possibly, though the girls have threatened not to do it unless I pose for their own private collections... As long as it's artistic...) keep them coming.


* We are generally going to use CGN to promote CGF and not the other way around (for nonprofit reasons, this is a little cleaner.) trigger tag idea is great and is in motion.

* Working on a CGN store as we speak. Big things coming. Things I can't announce for about 1 more week...

* What we really need to do is start more effectively leveraging our extensive talent base. Kes Ivan WH and I just don't have enough hours in the day to do all of this stuff - and you want to help. Let's connect the dots!


The greatest way to boost membership is to try anything and see what sticks. I know of many other organizations that have grown quickly and dramatically by doing just exactly that. So many great ideas in this thread. Ben's third point above will be the greatest asset to Calguns' growth - it cannot happen if only a few people are leading the charge, real dramatic growth happens in a decentralized fashion. If anyone has an idea they think can really help, the board should empower them to try it - if it has legs, it will shine and can be adopted as a formal program. If it doesn't, that will be apparent in short order and we can move on to another concept. Individual members can and should do anything and everything they think can help this organization grow.

Mitch
10-14-2009, 9:51 AM
The most effective way to increase membership (and better secure gun rights in California) is to work on reaching out to liberals, Democrats, Hispanics, soccer moms and other people who have traditionally been unfriendly or ambivalent about guns rights (and who, by the way, are increasing in numbers in this state, not decreasing).

Going after existing gun owners is nice, but most existing gun owners who are going to join anything are already members of the NRA and/or CRPA and/or GOA.

I spent a few years at gun shows in an NRA booth watching thousands of gun owners walk by. Forget about them.

AndrewMendez
10-14-2009, 9:57 AM
What if everyone just got one member to join! Then they posted it, as an incentive to look for someone!! Maybe we could have a thread dedicated to how many people they have brought to the site! Then that person, 1 member, etc!

Can'thavenuthingood
10-14-2009, 10:00 AM
Control is an issue, De-centralize is key.

Vick

wash
10-14-2009, 10:33 AM
The most effective way to increase membership (and better secure gun rights in California) is to work on reaching out to liberals, Democrats, Hispanics, soccer moms and other people who have traditionally been unfriendly or ambivalent about guns rights (and who, by the way, are increasing in numbers in this state, not decreasing).

Going after existing gun owners is nice, but most existing gun owners who are going to join anything are already members of the NRA and/or CRPA and/or GOA.

I spent a few years at gun shows in an NRA booth watching thousands of gun owners walk by. Forget about them.
I disagree.

calguns.net has ~34,000 members. How many gun owners are in this state?

We're barely scratching the surface of our biggest target group.

Mitch
10-14-2009, 10:40 AM
We're barely scratching the surface of our biggest target group.

My point is we are targeting the wrong group.

I've been down this path before.

wash
10-14-2009, 10:55 AM
If we can't target and attract gun owners how are we going to get soccer moms?

wildhawker
10-14-2009, 10:56 AM
What if everyone just got one member to join! Then they posted it, as an incentive to look for someone!! Maybe we could have a thread dedicated to how many people they have brought to the site! Then that person, 1 member, etc!

I've considered an incentive for referrals, we've kicked it around and it's on the backburner until we can figure out a way to make it work. As long as good data goes in, we should be able to do it. It would need to be more than simply quantity of signups, however. Somehow we'd have to create a way to determine x number of new users with more than y posts referred by z user in a given period.

Mitch
10-14-2009, 11:10 AM
If we can't target and attract gun owners how are we going to get soccer moms?

Effort.

Get some soccer moms on board, as well as lefties, Democrats, Hispanics, gays and all the rest, and they will probably talk to their soccer mom, lefty, Democrat, Hispanic and gay friends about gun rights, gun control and shooting. That will be more effective in securing our gun rights in this state than any other form of grassroots activity.

Almost all the traditional white male middle class conservative gun owners who are "joiners" and politically active are already active through the NRA, CRPA, etc. Getting them to join a new group would be nice but at the end of the day it won't increase grassroots activity all that much.

The traditional white male middle class conservative gun owners who aren't already active are, mostly, a lost cause. Quite a few of them are arrogant jerks.

One reason (probably the biggest reason) gun rights are on the defensive in this state is because the big gun rights organizations have made relatively little effort in doing the hard work of recruiting from non-traditional groups. Going after traditional white male middle class conservative gun owners is easier and certainly more cost-effective, so far as donations are concerned. They are the low-hanging fruit. But as a group they are on decline here in California. Outreach must be expanded. Calguns actually seems like the first organization to come along since Pink Pistols (which isn't really an organization at all) that might be really effective at doing this.

As I said, I was an NRA volunteer for a number of years active in two local Members' Councils (both of them nearly 100% traditional white male middle class conservative, except for about three or four women between them). In the middle part of this decade you would have seen me at every Orange County gun show, recruiting members and selling raffle tickets.

blackberg
10-14-2009, 11:39 AM
I am sure something like this has been suggested already, but i think we need displays at as many industry related shops as possible, similar to the the NRA displays that most gun shops have. Be it a 8.5x14 poster or a sturdy display with like a replaceable 50 sheet tearoff that people can take with them with info, or something along those lines.

-bb

steadyrock
10-14-2009, 11:42 AM
Before this thread gets any further, everybody should do this:

Stop.

We need to take a step back and make certain we are decided on why we are doing this. This thread began with a simple question: How do we get more members? A poignant followup (and one that IMO needs to be settled before we pursue the membership issue any further) is, what is the goal of increasing our membership? If you seek numbers for numbers' sake, all you'll get are numbers.

Is our goal to be able to serve more gun owners in this state with correct and useful information? Is it simply to raise the profile of the gun owning community and bring people out of the shadows? Is it to increase our power as a collective voice in the political arena? It can (and probably should) be all of these, but the Board needs to set some specific goals we can work toward. Otherwise, we will end up with 300,000 members doing mostly nothing.

Once the question of why is answered, we can then begin to re-visit the many great ideas that have been raised as to how. Certainly, community outreach and education can (and should) play key roles, but there needs to be a specific set of end targets in mind that we can gear ourselves toward.

Brandon et. al, I have some very specific organizational growth models I'd like to share with you that have worked successfully for thousands of other organizations around the world, and are very portable into this discussion. I will follow up with a PM to wildhawker to discuss some of the details of how best to share them.

mmartin
10-14-2009, 11:46 AM
target populations can be broken down into these groups:

1 those who are already in
2 those who know they want to be in are are actively looking for us
3 those who have thought about being in but aren't looking right now
4 those who think they aren't interested but can be brought around with education
5 those who are are sure they aren't interested but might be brought around
6 those who are not interested and are never going to come around.

trick one is to move people up the list.
trick two is to get more out of the people who are already in.

we've got a small percentage of highly active people, and a large percentage of mostly passive people.

good mileage to be had from activating/energizing the people who are already here but aren't doing much. high return on investment here.

good mileage to be had from finding the people who are looking for us, but don't know how to find us. (outreach) that will help bring in those that haven't thought too much about this, but are open to it. high return on invesment here

the largest pool is probably people who think they don't want what we do, but given the right exposure and education could change their minds. many women, liberals, minorities in this bucket, but it takes an investment in time and education to turn their ideas around. once turned around, they're a valuable asset because they will want to turn others around. good return on investment here, but it takes concentrated and well-planned effort over time.

people who are commitedly opposed aren't coming over no matter what we do, so they're a waste of our time to work on.

so it looks to me like three plans are needed:
1) motivate those who are here and not doing much.
2) find those who are looking for us or would be interested if we were in front of them
3) convert those that don't think they're interested.

they're different tasks and need different skills and strategies. all are valid paths to bigger membership. no point arguing over which is the 'right' or 'best', just pick one that appeals to your skills and desires, and let's make a plan for that path.

megan

jdberger
10-14-2009, 11:50 AM
Before this thread gets any further, everybody should do this:

Stop.

Otherwise, we will end up with 300,000 members doing mostly nothing.



And what else is new..... ;)


calguns.net has ~34,000 members. How many gun owners are in this state?

We're barely scratching the surface of our biggest target group.

Right.

The NRA has about 4 million members. The nation has about 80 million gun owners. Where are the other 76 million?

bomb_on_bus
10-14-2009, 11:51 AM
I was always for educating those who are lacking or have been misinformed.

Too many people out there running around with all of what they know is from the TV or what they hear on the streets etc.

I have always pushed for digging for the truths and comming up with a sound rational decision and not just jumping on the band wagon with what the neighbor, newspaper, or news network says.

Mind you I don't do that with every little thing I come across, only that which matters in my life and our nation................ oh wait that is everything!

mmartin
10-14-2009, 11:52 AM
We need to take a step back and make certain we are decided on why we are doing this. This thread began with a simple question: How do we get more members? A poignant followup (and one that IMO needs to be settled before we pursue the membership issue any further) is, what is the goal of increasing our membership? If you seek numbers for numbers' sake, all you'll get are numbers.

Is our goal to be able to serve more gun owners in this state with correct and useful information? Is it simply to raise the profile of the gun owning community and bring people out of the shadows? Is it to increase our power as a collective voice in the political arena? It can (and probably should) be all of these, but the Board needs to set some specific goals we can work toward. Otherwise, we will end up with 300,000 members doing mostly nothing.
<snip>
Brandon et. al, I have some very specific organizational growth models I'd like to share with you that have worked successfully for thousands of other organizations around the world, and are very portable into this discussion. I will follow up with a PM to wildhawker to discuss some of the details of how best to share them.

yes, and yes. want to know more about your model...
megan

wash
10-14-2009, 11:52 AM
The truth is that all groups are similar, an active core with some hangers on.

I'll take the hangers on because our core will pick up the slack.

We need numbers so that we can say to politicians that we represent x-number of people and our active core will do enough that they will have to believe it.

If we pick up 95 passive members for every 5 that contribute, we are way ahead of the game.

steadyrock
10-14-2009, 11:54 AM
yes, and yes. want to know more about your model...
megan

PM inbound.

Kestryll
10-14-2009, 11:57 AM
Before this thread gets any further, everybody should do this:

Stop.
Collaborate.
Listen.


You make some good points but dammit I couldn't help myself! :43:

radioburning
10-14-2009, 12:01 PM
I disagree.

calguns.net has ~34,000 members. How many gun owners are in this state?

We're barely scratching the surface of our biggest target group.

Calguns has had 34,000 people create accounts, but only 10,000 of them, roughly, are actually active. What would keep people from being active on their local gun forum? Do they just not care? Did they get bored? Do they feel like they don't fit in here? What's keeping all the other CA gun owners from joining calguns? Are they not computer literate? Are they just casual gun owners who don't really care about the politics surrounding guns, or gun culture? Are they the kind of gun owners that bought 1 gun years ago, "just in case", but never take it out or shoot it? Have they never heard of Calguns?

wash
10-14-2009, 12:04 PM
I'm sure you'll see similar stats for most internet forums.

Lots of lurkers, people who joined to see one thread, etc.

If we had 340,000 members with 100,000 active that would be great!

radioburning
10-14-2009, 12:04 PM
You make some good points but dammit I couldn't help myself! :43:

LOL.

jdberger
10-14-2009, 12:12 PM
so it looks to me like three plans are needed:
1) motivate those who are here and not doing much.
2) find those who are looking for us or would be interested if we were in front of them
3) convert those that don't think they're interested.

Just spitballin' here - but it's possible that some sort of reward will move the folks in (1).

People will do a lot to be considered one of the "in crowd". I know that the occasional kudos I get make me warm and fuzzy. It's nice to be acknowledged.

Rewards can be psychological (attaboys, kudos, public thanks) or material. For material rewards, we could come up with something as simple as a lapel pin, a 3%er patch, a key fob, etc. Something recognizeable to other Calgunners that distinguishes the wearer as a person who's gone above and beyond.

Thoughts?

steadyrock
10-14-2009, 12:17 PM
Just spitballin' here - but it's possible that some sort of reward will move the folks in (1).

People will do a lot to be considered one of the "in crowd". I know that the occasional kudos I get make me warm and fuzzy. It's nice to be acknowledged.

Rewards can be psychological (attaboys, kudos, public thanks) or material. For material rewards, we could come up with something as simple as a lapel pin, a 3%er patch, a key fob, etc. Something recognizeable to other Calgunners that distinguishes the wearer as a person who's gone above and beyond.

Thoughts?

Both great ideas, IMO you're on the right track here. Another motivator is simply a more visibly active core (or "in crowd" as you called it). At this point, a lot of the folks in (1) want to move toward the core but they don't know where it is or how to get there. I think we're making good progress toward defining all that.

wildhawker
10-14-2009, 12:26 PM
Boy, when you nail it you nail it. Fantastic idea.

Just spitballin' here - but it's possible that some sort
of reward will move the folks in (1).

People will do a lot to be considered one of the "in crowd". I know that the occasional kudos I get make me warm and fuzzy. It's nice to be acknowledged.

Rewards can be psychological (attaboys, kudos, public thanks) or material. For material rewards, we could come up with something as simple as a lapel pin, a 3%er patch, a key fob, etc. Something recognizeable to other Calgunners that distinguishes the wearer as a person who's gone above and beyond.

Thoughts?

mmartin
10-14-2009, 12:29 PM
Just spitballin' here - but it's possible that some sort of reward will move the folks in (1).

People will do a lot to be considered one of the "in crowd". I know that the occasional kudos I get make me warm and fuzzy. It's nice to be acknowledged.

Rewards can be psychological (attaboys, kudos, public thanks) or material. For material rewards, we could come up with something as simple as a lapel pin, a 3%er patch, a key fob, etc. Something recognizeable to other Calgunners that distinguishes the wearer as a person who's gone above and beyond.

Thoughts?

yep, yeah, exactly.
where I work we have 2 reward systems.... the High Five award, which anyone in the company can give to anyone else as a thank you... comes with a $10 gift card, and a manager's award which comes with a $150 gift card. it's funny, because really, in a month's pay, how big a bump is $10or $150? but MAN i love those gift cards, because they represent recognition of what I do. I'm trying to paper my entire cubicle with the certificates that come with them.
patch, lapel pin, their name up in a special recognition part of the website... a thank you certificat they can post at home or in their office... yep, that stuff works.
megan

bomb_on_bus
10-14-2009, 12:44 PM
I liked the 3%er idea.

steadyrock
10-14-2009, 12:45 PM
yep, yeah, exactly.
where I work we have 2 reward systems.... the High Five award, which anyone in the company can give to anyone else as a thank you... comes with a $10 gift card, and a manager's award which comes with a $150 gift card. it's funny, because really, in a month's pay, how big a bump is $10or $150? but MAN i love those gift cards, because they represent recognition of what I do. I'm trying to paper my entire cubicle with the certificates that come with them.
patch, lapel pin, their name up in a special recognition part of the website... a thank you certificat they can post at home or in their office... yep, that stuff works.
megan

Rewards do work, and jdberger's ideas are great. Ownership (meaning the ability for anybody to spark an idea, run with it, and own the results) also works. It just takes a little bit of planning to build a framework people can do that in.

mmartin
10-14-2009, 12:52 PM
3) convert those that don't think they're interested.
one of the big winners I'm seeing in people's posts is "take them shooting".
one-on-one interaction at the range with people they already know is very productive in converting anti- and non-shooters into shooters.

maybe we can have a "CGN Take an Anti- Shooting" promotion...
maybe we can have a tally board where people who've taken someone can get their name and # of people taken listed? maybe a quarterly prize for most converts? or for most converts who sign up to CGN? or donate to CGF?

and while we're at it, how 'bout "CGN Take a Woman Shooting" as well...

megan

mmartin
10-14-2009, 12:54 PM
I liked the 3%er idea.

I really do too... now that I know the history behind that. it feels important.
let's use it for folks who are really stepping up.
megan

mmartin
10-14-2009, 1:10 PM
Just spitballin' here - but it's possible that some sort of reward will move the folks in (1).

People will do a lot to be considered one of the "in crowd". I know that the occasional kudos I get make me warm and fuzzy. It's nice to be acknowledged.

Rewards can be psychological (attaboys, kudos, public thanks) or material. For material rewards, we could come up with something as simple as a lapel pin, a 3%er patch, a key fob, etc. Something recognizeable to other Calgunners that distinguishes the wearer as a person who's gone above and beyond.

Thoughts?

I direct you to this thread: http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=231194&highlight=member
Finally a Member!!!
Wow, I just have entered into the realm of "Member." No longer am I a "Junior Member."
Whew... that was a long wait.
Do I get a hat, lapel pin, maybe a cookie..?
he-he!

there is clamoring amongst the crowds for just what you're suggesting...
megan

blackberg
10-14-2009, 2:04 PM
I direct you to this thread: http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=231194&highlight=member


there is clamoring amongst the crowds for just what you're suggesting...
megan

well that other org that "does nothing for California" has different levels as well that people wear in different ways. (see my sig) :D
not everyone that has one wears it, but its there if you want to show others.
-bb

wash
10-14-2009, 2:56 PM
The rewards I'm after are legal victories but one other possibility is member titles.

Nothing fancy but I would like to be "CGF donor" or "CGF volunteer" instead of "senior member". Some people really need it like CGF board members and CGF legal council, like when some people here argue with Don Kilmer over the facts of the Nordyke case. That's good for a laugh but not really necessary.

mcsoupman
10-14-2009, 4:03 PM
It seems like a lot of our ideas are focused on the silent group that is already on our side. That is great and needed. However, I think we also need to have a strategy to target those that perceive themselves as antis because they are misinformed. I am a minister and was not really interested in gun laws till the unfortunate events of last November. I stumbled upon Calguns earlier this year and am now full fledged. My wife was an anti until this year and I even convinced her to take a handgun training course with me. We would not have been your typical gunnies, not into hunting or much outdoormanship stuff, but it did not take much for us to convert :)

I also think we need to ramp up a campaign to separate the gun from the bad guy. We all know the media loves to always portray every violent crime as a result of guns.

I think we ought to find more family oriented people of all race and economic status that are gunnies and spotlight them. Show the world were not all a bunch of knuckle draggers. Buckslips, mainstream magazine or newspaper adds with a picture of a good looking couple with some kids in their living room explaining why they support gun rights. Something that could speak to typical suburban family.

Maybe we should get the Governator to designate a "Browning Day" for schools. Our legislature seems bent on recognizing almost anyone and Browning maybe one of the most influential innovators of all time!

I love that show Locked and Loaded. It would be great to get some sort of ad time during one of those type of shows. That would easily be a good target market.

Just some thoughts!

liquidmx
10-14-2009, 4:33 PM
In regards to fliers in local gun shops...there are likely two scenarios: shops who support what Calguns is doing towards the 2nd...and those who dont care as long as business is good.

In order to get more shops involved, we need to speak with our wallets more. Once shop owners who dont care realize that its a "you scratch mine, we scratch yours" issue, they will step up too. Its not the best way to get the job done, but its more efficient than trying to convince them.

Also: I would like email updates of the important stuff. This recent AB962 ban should have gotten me at least 1-2 emails regarding the issues. I didnt get a single one. This E-letter would be a great way to inform people of the issues without them having to dig through the site. The easier it is to get information, the more people will respond.

People need to know which shops are helping and which shops dont care. I am busy with work all day and dont have time to read the 15+ pages of threads to get informed on a lot of what's going on. A crib-notes of sorts of a summary of what's happening in an important thread or an email with updates would be AWESOME. Maybe a link alongside the thread with a summary outline format of what the "meat & potatoes" are. Again, the easier it is, the more action it will get.

jdberger
10-14-2009, 4:47 PM
In regards to fliers in local gun shops...there are likely two scenarios: shops who support what Calguns is doing towards the 2nd...and those who dont care as long as business is good.

In order to get more shops involved, we need to speak with our wallets more. Once shop owners who dont care realize that its a "you scratch mine, we scratch yours" issue, they will step up too. Its not the best way to get the job done, but its more efficient than trying to convince them.

Also: I would like email updates of the important stuff. This recent AB962 ban should have gotten me at least 1-2 emails regarding the issues. I didnt get a single one. This E-letter would be a great way to inform people of the issues without them having to dig through the site. The easier it is to get information, the more people will respond.

People need to know which shops are helping and which shops dont care. I am busy with work all day and dont have time to read the 15+ pages of threads to get informed on a lot of what's going on. A crib-notes of sorts of a summary of what's happening in an important thread or an email with updates would be AWESOME. Maybe a link alongside the thread with a summary outline format of what the "meat & potatoes" are. Again, the easier it is, the more action it will get.


These are all excellent suggestions. Thanks.

We're working on a program where shops friendly to the CGN community recieve positive press. There's a huge difference between a shop that just takes the flyers and sets them in an unused corner of the counter and one that hands them out to every customer. We should support the latter.

There have been similar suggestions for an email blast system. Additionally, there are plans for an easy splash page that can take CGN'ers to the heart of an issue, and if desired, point them in the right direction. Stay tuned.

Currently, the best way to get involved is to find and participate in a local CGN Townhall (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=211631). Take a look at the Stickies in this forum.

steadyrock
10-14-2009, 5:07 PM
Once the outreach has succeeded to the point where 99.9% of people won't say "Calwho?", it would be wise to organize some "Friends of Calguns" dinners similar to the FNRA events, sponsored by CGN but with the proceeds benefiting CGF. Of course, notables like Michel, HPP, and Gene should be invited as speakers.

artherd
10-14-2009, 7:08 PM
The rewards I'm after are legal victories but one other possibility is member titles.

Nothing fancy but I would like to be "CGF donor" or "CGF volunteer" instead of "senior member".

Working on those :)

liquidmx
10-14-2009, 8:33 PM
Thanks for the link Jdberger, I will def check one out! I was also looking into the reloading thread thinking "Man, I would be down to donate some cash to calguns for someone teaching me how to reload".... thinking along the lines of Rally's, Auctions, toys for tots, etc...fundraisers basically. That kicks me right back to the notion about cards and fliers. When your at a range and you help someone and they say "hey thanks" you could easily hand them a flier and say something like "thank Calguns by supporting the right, that's how I learned".

Ultimately IMHO with the supporting of gun shops it really comes down to people sticking to their guns (pun intended). Just like people who buy American made stuff. If people didnt break down and actually held strong I bet the actions would be VERY loudly!

Can'thavenuthingood
10-14-2009, 9:27 PM
Thanks for the link Jdberger, I will def check one out! I was also looking into the reloading thread thinking "Man, I would be down to donate some cash to calguns for someone teaching me how to reload".... thinking along the lines of Rally's, Auctions, toys for tots, etc...fundraisers basically. That kicks me right back to the notion about cards and fliers. When your at a range and you help someone and they say "hey thanks" you could easily hand them a flier and say something like "thank Calguns by supporting the right, that's how I learned".

Ultimately IMHO with the supporting of gun shops it really comes down to people sticking to their guns (pun intended). Just like people who buy American made stuff. If people didnt break down and actually held strong I bet the actions would be VERY loudly!

That is a terrific idea, hand them a generic type business card with Calguns access info on it. Maybe your name or user name as an invite and intro for first post?

I like that, I can see it working.

Vick

rolo
10-14-2009, 9:36 PM
That is a terrific idea, hand them a generic type business card with Calguns access info on it. Maybe your name or user name as an invite and intro for first post?

I like that, I can see it working.

Vick

Awesome idea. The 4x4 club I'm a member of includes a stack of cards with club info and blanks for the member to fill out as a point of contact for outreach efforts.

coop44
10-15-2009, 8:25 AM
I think the Girls of Calguns calender would bring in some members.

"old farts of calguns" calender, would probably scare people off. But, how about a calender that commemorates the dates our rights have been stripped away by the legislature and the courts..

mmartin
10-15-2009, 8:30 AM
But, how about a calender that commemorates the dates our rights have been stripped away by the legislature and the courts..

ooooo.... like that! let's add calguns victories and dates to it and we've got something to show the need and show our success...
megan

jdberger
10-15-2009, 9:20 AM
Business cards....I know it's been mentioned before, but those of us who are graphically challenged might need a template.

Something simple with the Calguns.net logo, space for the user name (that can be changed when the individual places their order and maybe (as a sop to vanity) a place for their status and join date.

The reverse would have the text of the second amendment.

Can someone whip one of these up and we'll get Kes's approval?

I found myself wishing I had a stack this morning. Two cars ahead of my in the kid drop-off line had NRA stickers and I've never seen these parents before. I'd have loved to direct them to CGN.

xxdabroxx
10-15-2009, 11:07 AM
Is there anything we can do to optimize CGN on google searches, can we hide text regarding every type of firearm on the site somehow so that when its searched it will find us?

mmartin
10-15-2009, 11:18 AM
Business cards....I know it's been mentioned before, but those of us who are graphically challenged might need a template.

Something simple with the Calguns.net logo, space for the user name (that can be changed when the individual places their order and maybe (as a sop to vanity) a place for their status and join date.

The reverse would have the text of the second amendment.

Can someone whip one of these up and we'll get Kes's approval?

I found myself wishing I had a stack this morning. Two cars ahead of my in the kid drop-off line had NRA stickers and I've never seen these parents before. I'd have loved to direct them to CGN.

^^^ this. I could have handed out several dozen by now...
megan

jdberger
10-15-2009, 11:23 AM
Another tack.... (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=231744)

Leveraging out of State resources.

mcsoupman
10-15-2009, 11:23 AM
Business cards....I know it's been mentioned before, but those of us who are graphically challenged might need a template.

Something simple with the Calguns.net logo, space for the user name (that can be changed when the individual places their order and maybe (as a sop to vanity) a place for their status and join date.

The reverse would have the text of the second amendment.

Can someone whip one of these up and we'll get Kes's approval?

I found myself wishing I had a stack this morning. Two cars ahead of my in the kid drop-off line had NRA stickers and I've never seen these parents before. I'd have loved to direct them to CGN.

Is it possible to just have CGN just make 10k of them and we can distribute them? They are not that expensive to produce and the bigger the order the cheaper the per unit cost. We could probably get them down to close to what it would cost us individually to make. Plus lets be honest, professional ones look way nicer than the ones any of us could make at home. I would be willing to pitch in money for 100-200 of them for me to personally hand out.

wildhawker
10-15-2009, 11:29 AM
We already have business cards and the refresh is in process. Some [many] of the things mentioned in the thread are in the works, and I'd hate to see valuable time spent on something that's done/rolling. Probably best to take the thoughts from this thread and others and map a program for project management at this point.

Business cards....I know it's been mentioned before, but those of us who are graphically challenged might need a template.

Something simple with the Calguns.net logo, space for the user name (that can be changed when the individual places their order and maybe (as a sop to vanity) a place for their status and join date.

The reverse would have the text of the second amendment.

Can someone whip one of these up and we'll get Kes's approval?

I found myself wishing I had a stack this morning. Two cars ahead of my in the kid drop-off line had NRA stickers and I've never seen these parents before. I'd have loved to direct them to CGN.

jdberger
10-15-2009, 11:31 AM
We already have business cards and the refresh is in process. Some [many] of the things mentioned in the thread are in the works, and I'd hate to see valuable time spent on something that's done/rolling. Probably best to take the thoughts from this thread and others and map a program for project management at this point.

Can I have my name on them?

I like to feel important. :)

freonr22
10-15-2009, 11:37 AM
I think the People of the Female persuasion across the state need to be addressed/targeted. I have seen Asphodel's Threads, and if more women are involved i would assume MORE men/Families would be involved instead of, "thats what I do when she is asleep/out of town etc" just a thought.

mmartin
10-15-2009, 12:05 PM
We already have business cards and the refresh is in process. Some [many] of the things mentioned in the thread are in the works, and I'd hate to see valuable time spent on something that's done/rolling. Probably best to take the thoughts from this thread and others and map a program for project management at this point.
is this going on the core project short list?
megan

mmartin
10-15-2009, 12:07 PM
I think the People of the Female persuasion across the state need to be addressed/targeted. I have seen Asphodel's Threads, and if more women are involved i would assume MORE men/Families would be involved instead of, "thats what I do when she is asleep/out of town etc" just a thought.

this is an area that definitely needs attention. I'm putting together the draft of the Getting Women to Go Shooting tips sheet this weekend... pop over to the ladies forum and have a look (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=224318), contribute if you're interested, would love to have your thoughts on the subject while we're working on it...
megan

xxdabroxx
10-15-2009, 12:10 PM
what about putting up sign up sheets at ffl's for CGF's email alerts? I think we also need more email alerts published. It seems like it has been a while since i have received one and there has been a lot going on recently.

mmartin
10-15-2009, 12:16 PM
what about putting up sign up sheets at ffl's for CGF's email alerts? I think we also need more email alerts published. It seems like it has been a while since i have received one and there has been a lot going on recently.

+1 on this
megan

liquidmx
10-15-2009, 10:43 PM
One more thing I thought of. IF the ammo thing actually takes effect (hopefully it wont get there!) it would be a PRIME opportunity to flier EVERY single ammo dealer in CA with a very basic flier saying something to the extent of

"Has buying ammo become an inconvenience? Are you frustrated with this new law? Did you even know it existed? Are you ready to do something about it? Visit Calguns.net and join the thousands of people pushing back against anti 2nd amendment politics everyday. We need your help!"

obeygiant
10-15-2009, 11:56 PM
One more thing I thought of. IF the ammo thing actually takes effect (hopefully it wont get there!) it would be a PRIME opportunity to flier EVERY single ammo dealer in CA with a very basic flier saying something to the extent of

"Has buying ammo become an inconvenience? Are you frustrated with this new law? Did you even know it existed? Are you ready to do something about it? Visit Calguns.net and join the thousands of people pushing back against anti 2nd amendment politics everyday. We need your help!"

^^this may have some potential.

7x57
10-16-2009, 12:05 AM
There just might be a calendar; Mrs.Wildhawker and another CGNer have agreed pose *if* they retain creative...

Whoops. There goes plan "B" to photoshop in the pole and snake if they refused to pose with them.

7x57

mmartin
10-16-2009, 9:47 AM
Whoops. There goes plan "B" to photoshop in the pole and snake if they refused to pose with them.

7x57

I'm good with the snake part...
megan

wash
10-16-2009, 10:12 AM
I just signed up for the gunpal beta and I think that might be a really great way to get new members.

If it can go national for things like gunbroker auctions, that could generate a whole lot of visibility for CGF.

The new auction site could help even more.

JDoe
10-16-2009, 10:53 AM
IMHO it would be useful to collect all the ideas in one place for ease of reading.

The first post could be edited to include the ideas generated in this thread that is fast becoming quite long.

7x57
10-16-2009, 12:20 PM
I'm good with the snake part...
megan

But see, the key to fundraising is selling calendars to lonely gun-geeks, and, well, we can pretty much name our price if the models have *only* the snake to...um, never mind. ;)

7x57

Sunwolf
10-16-2009, 1:11 PM
what about putting up sign up sheets at ffl's for CGF's email alerts? I think we also need more email alerts published. It seems like it has been a while since i have received one and there has been a lot going on recently.

This^^^^