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View Full Version : AB962 Phone Poll, FAX & Letter Tally Results


jont92619
10-12-2009, 4:43 PM
I just called the Governor's office to request the results for the phone poll, FAX and letter tally for AB 962. I was told that It might be privileged and protected information as it is used to help the Gov come to a decision etc.

I stressed that I was only looking for numbers pro & con, not actual communications or names. I was told I still may not be able to get the info but should submit a public records act request.

Anyone have any experience with this? Know if it is protected info?

++++ Update+++

I have sent the request to the Governor's office.

Shotgun Man
10-12-2009, 4:45 PM
I just called the Governor's office to request the results for the phone poll, FAX and letter tally for AB 962. I was told that It might be privileged and protected information as it is used to help the Gov come to a decision etc.

I stressed that I was only looking for numbers pro & con, not actual communications or names. I was told I still may not be able to get the info but should submit a public records act request.

Anyone have any experience with this? Know if it is protected info?

I'm surprised anyone picked up the phone. It is Columbus Day-- a state holiday.

bodger
10-12-2009, 4:46 PM
LOL! just check the dumpsters behind the Statehouse!

orangeusa
10-12-2009, 4:51 PM
They said the Harvey Milk total was 100,000 (CNN - link was on this site), and mostly for VETO. And it passed!!!

That was probably the janitor who answered the line!!!! :)

gregorylucas
10-12-2009, 5:19 PM
I wouldn't think that the actual numbers are protected, I'm positive that peoples names/locations are. This kind of guard makes me think of two possibilities 1) Just a knee jerk response from the person answering the telephone or 2) The governor's office is going to try and keep the information secret so people don't know how much opposition there was to AB962 and treat us like mushrooms.

Greg

HondaMasterTech
10-12-2009, 5:23 PM
LOL! just check the dumpsters behind the Statehouse!

No no no, they burned the evidence.

KylaGWolf
10-12-2009, 6:56 PM
Go to the state website and do a search for request of public information. Fill out the form and submit it. :)

Seesm
10-12-2009, 8:06 PM
So lame... I bet there was 20 to 1 to not put 962 in effect... We should have won this BIG.

devildog999
10-12-2009, 8:08 PM
They don't want us to know

GrizzlyGuy
10-12-2009, 8:15 PM
Thanks to the California Public Records Act, they are required to give you those records if you make an appropriate request. See here:

http://www.thefirstamendment.org/capra.html

guntntteacher
10-12-2009, 8:19 PM
ITs because with that kind of information you can fight. They keep al kinds of numbers adn trace calls. I worked for a local politican and we got all kids of data from state calls from sac.

spitkiss
10-12-2009, 8:29 PM
The results will be posted in approximately...




2 Weeks!!!!



sorry couldn't resist

razorx
10-12-2009, 8:30 PM
Someone needs to submit this, please confirm when submitted.

jdberger
10-12-2009, 8:32 PM
Someone needs to submit this, please confirm when submitted.

Why not you?

U2BassAce
10-12-2009, 8:37 PM
They said the Harvey Milk total was 100,000 (CNN - link was on this site), and mostly for VETO. And it passed!!!

That was probably the janitor who answered the line!!!! :)

THey also said Twitter was in favor of signing that bill. Maybe something to remember next time?

advocatusdiaboli
10-12-2009, 9:03 PM
THey also said Twitter was in favor of signing that bill. Maybe something to remember next time?

Maybe, but I think it didn't matter. I think the governor made up his mind on a combination of personal lobbying and back room deals in trades for support on other bills and citizen support or rejection mattered little in the end. The oligarchs like to throw us a bone every now and then so they can maintain the illusion of democracy, keep the majority docile thinking they have a say, and are then free to manipulate the government for their (and their cronies) enrichment.

vrand
10-12-2009, 9:07 PM
So lame... I bet there was 20 to 1 to not put 962 in effect... We should have won this BIG.

more like 20,000 to 1 :tank:

razorx
10-13-2009, 12:39 AM
Why not you?

:yawn::yawn:

I think I'll do it again.

:yawn::yawn:

One liner responses are so predictable, I assumed someone would do this.

How about, letting the OP respond since he was pursuing this? Of course, post count is kind of a clue, but I decided to work with it anyway.

If no one else is in the queue, I'll will submit it. It is just a form...

I guess I could say why not you as well, but that would be such a tiresome and meaningless exchange, like so many.

obeygiant
10-13-2009, 12:44 AM
I just called the Governor's office to request the results for the phone poll, FAX and letter tally for AB 962. I was told that It might be privileged and protected information as it is used to help the Gov come to a decision etc.

I stressed that I was only looking for numbers pro & con, not actual communications or names. I was told I still may not be able to get the info but should submit a public records act request.

Anyone have any experience with this? Know if it is protected info?

Paging Oaklander...............

oldrifle
10-13-2009, 12:50 AM
What's with this 2 weeks thing? I never got where that joke came from.

Is it because "two weeks" is the common answer you get to a question about how long something will take? When I ran a little mail order outfit in Chicago I'd ask my suppliers how long it would take to get new product. I'd always hear "about two weeks" which is the length of time I would tell my customers until I finally wised up and doubled it. :rolleyes:

The results will be posted in approximately...




2 Weeks!!!!



sorry couldn't resist

ldivinag
10-13-2009, 1:32 AM
What's with this 2 weeks thing? I never got where that joke came from.


back in around dec 2005, just when then OLL movement started, our friend IGGY (who then worked for the DOJ) claimed that the new OLL AR lowers would be put on the banned list.

how long would it take?

yup... you guessed it. two weeks.

so there was a rush in those 2 weeks to get as many OLLs.

only problem was... other than it never actually happened, was when the 2 week countdown would start...

oaklander
10-13-2009, 2:38 AM
Here. Let me look at this.

Paging Oaklander...............

oaklander
10-13-2009, 2:48 AM
PRA request sent. It took 5 minutes. I will update this thread when they reply.

JagerTroop
10-13-2009, 6:00 AM
What's with this 2 weeks thing? I never got where that joke came from.

Is it because "two weeks" is the common answer you get to a question about how long something will take? When I ran a little mail order outfit in Chicago I'd ask my suppliers how long it would take to get new product. I'd always hear "about two weeks" which is the length of time I would tell my customers until I finally wised up and doubled it. :rolleyes:

Tw_YryVgLOg&feature

oldrifle
10-13-2009, 8:57 AM
LOL... see? 2 weeks is the standard answer. That's why I never believe anyone when they tell me "two weeks". It's always BS. I've worked in a few different industries and it's always the same. :D

xxdabroxx
10-13-2009, 9:09 AM
Yay for Oak, the PRA request guru! I hope we are not disappointed.

DocSkinner
10-13-2009, 9:17 AM
Pretty irrelevant, really. This was Arnie doling out rewards. How the current system works. Reason, rationality, logic, law, and responsiveness to all citizens all fell by the wayside a LONG time ago.

Kid Stanislaus
10-13-2009, 9:17 AM
Thanks to the California Public Records Act, they are required to give you those records if you make an appropriate request.

Yeah, but WHY should we have to submit a formal request for such basic information. We're not ask'n for somebody's social security number!!

DocSkinner
10-13-2009, 9:29 AM
Yeah, but WHY should we have to submit a formal request for such basic information. We're not ask'n for somebody's social security number!!

Because it is the government - it somebodies job to design the proper request format, and someone's job to process them. Bureaucrat job security...

GrizzlyGuy
10-13-2009, 9:36 AM
Yeah, but WHY should we have to submit a formal request for such basic information. We're not ask'n for somebody's social security number!!

I've given up trying to identify the why's behind a lot of the government's actions. In most cases the generic 'to deprive citizens of liberty and make their lives more miserable' seems to fit. :(

In this case, it's not all bad that they get 10 days to consider and respond to a request. For example, I suspect that their call logs include the phone numbers of each caller via caller ID (unless the caller disabled that). If an anti-gun organization requested the logs and the government just handed them out in their entirety without thinking, the anti-gunners could then do reverse lookups on the numbers and start hassling us individually.

Something like that is not unheard of. The folks who supported gay marriage gained access to the list of people who made donations in favor of prop 8 (against gay marriage) and hassled them.

The government should release the requested information, but I hope they purge all the phone numbers to protect everyone's privacy rights on both sides of the issue. The law allows them to do that, and that's a good thing IMHO. From the page I linked to, among the types of records exempted from disclosure:

"Home Addresses in DMV, voter registration, gun license, public housing, local agency utility and public employee records are exempt, as are addresses of certain crime victims. (6254(f),(u), 6254.1, 6254.3, 6254.4, 6254.16, 6254.21)"

http://www.thefirstamendment.org/capra.html

Decoligny
10-13-2009, 9:36 AM
What's with this 2 weeks thing? I never got where that joke came from.

Is it because "two weeks" is the common answer you get to a question about how long something will take? When I ran a little mail order outfit in Chicago I'd ask my suppliers how long it would take to get new product. I'd always hear "about two weeks" which is the length of time I would tell my customers until I finally wised up and doubled it. :rolleyes:

Dont know if it has anything to do with the "Two Weeks" as used here but in the movie "O Brother Where Art Thou" George Clooney's character is at a Genreal store trying to get a transmission belt for a Ford, the clerk says "I can order it, it'll take two weeks to get here" he then asks for a can of "Dapper Dan" hair pomade. The clerk says "We carry FOP..., we can order Dapper Dan, it'll take two weeks to get here". George replies "Well isn't this just a geographical oddity, this town is two weeks from everywhere."

CalNRA
10-13-2009, 9:40 AM
Dont know if it has anything to do with the "Two Weeks" as used here but in the movie "O Brother Where Art Thou" George Clooney's character is at a Genreal store trying to get a transmission belt for a Ford, the clerk says "I can order it, it'll take two weeks to get here" he then asks for a can of "Dapper Dan" hair pomade. The clerk says "We carry FOP..., we can order Dapper Dan, it'll take two weeks to get here". George replies "Well isn't this just a geographical oddity, this town is two weeks from everywhere."

post 31, meet post 24 :D

Tw_YryVgLOg&feature

SigAlert
10-13-2009, 10:18 AM
I know so many apathetic gun owners in this state who have gone through life blissfully unaware of what the anti's can do to them. They think they are above this because they are only interested in Hunting or SASS and have no interest in CCW.

They think NRA members are right wing rednecks and turn their noses up to anyone who prefers polymer. I knew one guy who thought micro-stamping was a good idea because "The bullets do the killing". I can't wait to see the look on their faces when they get fingerprinted like a criminal for the first time.


I've been warning them this is coming. There are Politicians out there who will build their careers on the systematic dismantling of ALL of our gun rights.


Welcome to the party! Good luck getting Cowboy loads at Big 5.

And Thank you Calguns for your hard work and keeping all of us on the same page!

jdberger
10-13-2009, 10:28 AM
:yawn::yawn:

I think I'll do it again.

:yawn::yawn:

One liner responses are so predictable, I assumed someone would do this.

Then perhaps you should of stood up and said, "I'll do it!" instead of asking someone else to carry the load.

How about, letting the OP respond since he was pursuing this? Of course, post count is kind of a clue, but I decided to work with it anyway.

If no one else is in the queue, I'll will submit it. It is just a form...

There you go again, waiting for permission. Take the initiative.

I guess I could say why not you as well, but that would be such a tiresome and meaningless exchange, like so many.

You're welcome to, but 1) I'm not that interested in the information and 2) I'm working on something else.

I don't think that anyone here would accuse me of not carrying my weight. ;)

Decoligny
10-13-2009, 3:55 PM
post 31, meet post 24 :D

I am at work and a lot of the imbedded pictures/videos just show up as white squares.

5hundo
10-13-2009, 3:57 PM
I just called the Governor's office to request the results for the phone poll, FAX and letter tally for AB 962. I was told that It might be privileged and protected information as it is used to help the Gov come to a decision etc.

I stressed that I was only looking for numbers pro & con, not actual communications or names. I was told I still may not be able to get the info but should submit a public records act request.

Anyone have any experience with this? Know if it is protected info?

Next time they tell you some trash like that, remind them of the freedom of information act... :rolleyes:

wildhawker
10-13-2009, 4:03 PM
Next time they tell you some trash like that, remind them of the freedom of information act... :rolleyes:

I think you meant CPRA (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Public_Records_Act).

ETA: Saw that Oak's already on it. And the fun begins!

ke6guj
10-13-2009, 4:06 PM
Next time they tell you some trash like that, remind them of the freedom of information act... :rolleyes:might be better to mention the Public Records Act instead, since the Freedom of Information Act does not apply to CA.

CalNRA
10-13-2009, 4:08 PM
They think NRA members are right wing rednecks and turn their noses up to anyone who prefers polymer. I knew one guy who thought micro-stamping was a good idea because "The bullets do the killing". I can't wait to see the look on their faces when they get fingerprinted like a criminal for the first time.



any calgunner who has ever met me in person would rofl at that notion

Anyhow, I don't know if AB962 will wake up the SASS and hunting-only crowd until the reloading components get regulated. A guy I talked to at the range who was shooting a very nice SA revolver said he didn't care because "the handgun ammo are for automatics for criminals and he reloads his 357 anyway"

I was speechless.

jont92619
10-14-2009, 9:37 AM
I have sent the request for the information to the Gov's office...

obeygiant
10-14-2009, 10:20 AM
PRA request sent. It took 5 minutes. I will update this thread when they reply.

See, all it takes is the right man. Thanks,Oak.

oaklander
10-14-2009, 11:55 AM
:D

:D

See, all it takes is the right man. Thanks,Oak.

razorx
10-14-2009, 12:43 PM
I have sent the request for the information to the Gov's office...

Cool.

In response to someone's earlier post about usefulness of this data...

Not any really in terms of AB962. However, it is very useful to determine effectiveness of "campaign" based on the calls for action which could be used as a baseline for subsequent issues.

Useful data would be:

Support for and against AB962 since date of bill passage in Assembly through signature by governor:

Number of calls/day with date with unique and non-unique phone numbers to governor's office.

Number of emails/day with date summarized by unique and non-unique phone numbers to governor's office.

Number of faxes/day with date summarized by unique and non-unique fax numbers to governor's office.

No personally identifiable information requested.

It would be interesting to trend this to calls for action on this forum plus others to measure ability to mobilize. Data format below:

bill (string), event (string type enum "phone", "fax", "email"), eventnum(integer), unique flag(string type enum "Yes", "No"), support (string type enum "Yes", "No"), timestamp (date)

To extend this further for comparison analysis will all other initiatives, request could be made for ALL bills rather than just AB962 specific.

Curious about time also rather than just date but...

Thanks to the OP and Oaklander for submission, if the above data elements are not covered, I can submit my specific request.

If one were to a be a bit more "inquisitive" as to the nature of Arnold's awareness of these statistics, the request could also be for any correspondence which provided all statistics in any form for AB962 to the governor.

I am not that inquisitive since I don't think it is has actionable relevancy, unless someone else can think of a reason.

I like data. :D