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advocatusdiaboli
10-12-2009, 4:13 PM
He stresses that local governments proved that such restrictions contribute positively to public safety. I am unaware of such statistical evidence but he claims he finds it convincing. This is important to note--we now know we lsot, not because we didn't rally enough people, that we didn't phone, fax, email enough. We lost because the governor was convinced by someone that this law will increase public safety. The more we know about our adversaries tactics, the better equipped we'll be to take them on more successfully next time.

"California Governor Signs AB962 Restricting Ammunition

Sacramento, CA -- AB962, the bill that would restrict ammunition sales in California was signed this past evening by Governor Schwarzennegger.

The bill will take effect on February 1, 2011. His comments are below:

“To the Members of the California State Assembly: I am signing Assembly Bill 962.

This measure would require vendors of handgun ammunition to keep a log of information on handgun ammunition sales, store ammunition in a safe and secure manner, and require the face to-face transfer of ammunition sales.

Although I have previously vetoed legislation similar to this measure, local governments have demonstrated that requiring ammunition vendors to keep records on ammunition sales improves public safety. These records have allowed law enforcement to arrest and prosecute persons who have no business possessing firearms and ammunition: gang members, violent parolees, second and third strikers, and even people previously serving time in state prison for murder.

Utilized properly, this type of information is invaluable for keeping communities safe and preventing dangerous felons from committing crimes with firearms.

Moreover, this type of record keeping is no more intrusive for law abiding citizens than similar laws governing pawnshops or the sale of cold medicine. Unfortunately, even the most successful
local program is flawed; without a statewide law, felons can easily skirt the record keeping requirements of one city by visiting another. Assembly Bill 962 will fix this problem by
mandating that all ammunition vendors in the state keep records on ammunition sales.

As Governor, I have sought the appropriate balance between public safety and the right to keep and bear arms. I have signed important public safety measures to regulate the sale and transfer of .50 caliber rifles, instituted the California Firearms License Check program, and promoted the use of microstamping technology in handguns. I have also vetoed many pieces of legislation that sought to place unreasonable restrictions and burdens on firearms dealers and ammunition vendors.

Assembly Bill 962 reasonably regulates access to ammunition and improves public safety without placing undue burdens on consumers. For these reasons, I am pleased to sign this bill.”

Darklyte27
10-12-2009, 4:38 PM
What I dont get is why it doesnt say, if you have restrictions after checking your ID or background you cannot buy ammo. If you have no restrictions, you can buy ammo regardless of amount etc.

locosway
10-12-2009, 4:38 PM
Notice how he can cite several bills he's passed, but none he vetoed?

He's a tool, just like all the rest of them. If I thought I had any shot in politics I'd run...

beemaze
10-12-2009, 4:53 PM
Although I have previously vetoed legislation similar to this measure, local governments have demonstrated that requiring ammunition vendors to keep records on ammunition sales improves public safety. These records have allowed law enforcement to arrest and prosecute persons who have no business possessing firearms and ammunition: gang members, violent parolees, second and third strikers, and even people previously serving time in state prison for murder.

Utilized properly, this type of information is invaluable for keeping communities safe and preventing dangerous felons from committing crimes with firearms.


Lies, Lies, Lies.

Let's see:

1) Pasadena tried recording ammunition sales and it DID NOT work. Law was repealed.

2) Inglewood, CA still has this law on the books. I recently purchased ammo from LAX range in Inglewood. Vendor told me that not ONCE has the information kept been asked for by law enforcement. Inglewood continues to have one of the highest violent crime rates in L.A. County.

BTW, I wrote Arnie that the above measures did not work...I guess he didn't get my message lol.

Moreover, this type of record keeping is no more intrusive for law abiding citizens than similar laws governing pawnshops or the sale of cold medicine.

Really?

Since when do I have to get fingerprinted for cold medicine?

All of this smacks of Socialism, no surprise since Arnie's father Gustav was a member of the National Socialist Worker's Party.....

supersonic
10-12-2009, 4:55 PM
He's sooo proud of the "regulations on transfer and sale of .50 caliber rifles." I wonder if he realizes how that just made getting a slightly MORE powerful rifle (510DTC) much easier now that all these great companies offer "snap-on" 50 caliber uppers for our AR's @ such a substantially cheaper price than the 'boutique" 50BMG prices??? THAT, is proof ALONE that these laws have ZERO EFFECT.:cool:

steelrain82
10-12-2009, 5:00 PM
I don't know about you guys, but everytime I read it I read it in an ahnold voice.

M9Man
10-12-2009, 5:36 PM
That coward...now whose the girly man :mad:.

Czechsix
10-12-2009, 6:09 PM
Liar....liar....boo......booooooo.....liar......bo ooooooooo

I think we need to do our own viral vid

berg
10-12-2009, 6:52 PM
Already being discussed here: http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=230665

advocatusdiaboli
10-12-2009, 6:56 PM
What is important for me in all of this (beside the counter attack based on interstate commerce and carriers) is that his explanation gives us insights into how our opposition got the job done. Some group of people assembled statistics and built an argument that this restriction promotes public safety. They must have drawn stats from communities that have such similar restrictions and extrapolated the results to California. I, for one, was not aware they doing this in their lobbying efforts--I never saw or heard any stats in the news or here about it. If we'd known, we could have taken the stats and look more objectively at them to see if we could sink their story. But as it was, I think their story unchallenged by us because we didn't know of it, sailed through the governors ear unchallenged.

I acknowledge their cleverness. They won this round. But it is one battle not the whole war and maybe we've gained valuable intelligence from this one.

team1320
10-12-2009, 7:01 PM
this sucks... they keep screwing the responsable gun owners..:mad:

dfletcher
10-12-2009, 7:04 PM
I love the logic. Because some loser has a meth habit, I have to stand on line to buy a single package of cold medcine - and that's cited as a good reason to sign a gun law.

thomashoward
10-12-2009, 7:08 PM
I don't know about you guys, but everytime I read it I read it in an ahnold voice.

That's funny. I just read it in an Ahnold voice

Don't worry kalifornia friends, we'll be baaack

locosway
10-12-2009, 7:14 PM
I love the logic. Because some loser has a meth habit, I have to stand on line to buy a single package of cold medcine - and that's cited as a good reason to sign a gun law.

It's funny, sometimes I'll buy two or more different packages of allergy medicine. Meth is made from this and not cold medicine. I've never been looked at funny or anything.

Librarian
10-12-2009, 7:49 PM
The statement is a fig-leaf, folks.

Arnie, I think, believes he needs DeLeon or other Dems for something that Arnie wants.

He didn't need to say a thing, yet he emitted this gaseous nonsense.

ColdDeadHands1
10-12-2009, 7:56 PM
Dear Arnie:
Go F&^% yourself.

Love,
ColdDeadHands

Seesm
10-12-2009, 7:57 PM
Terrible..

McGlock
10-12-2009, 8:12 PM
As Governor, I have sought the appropriate balance between public safety and the right to keep and bear arms. I have signed important public safety measures to regulate the sale and transfer of .50 caliber rifles, instituted the California Firearms License Check program, and promoted the use of microstamping technology in handguns. I have also vetoed many pieces of legislation that sought to place unreasonable restrictions and burdens on firearms dealers and ammunition vendors.



Well done Arne, because most if not all .50 caliber rifles are used in crime situations. I remember when that .50 took out..wait…ok how about the time that robber used the .50 for…oh hold on, well I know its been used somewhere.

coolusername2007
10-12-2009, 8:31 PM
He stresses that local governments proved that such restrictions contribute positively to public safety. I am unaware of such statistical evidence but he claims he finds it convincing. This is important to note--we now know we lsot, not because we didn't rally enough people, that we didn't phone, fax, email enough. We lost because the governor was convinced by someone that this law will increase public safety. The more we know about our adversaries tactics, the better equipped we'll be to take them on more successfully next time.

Sure, good point. But you can be armed with all the right data, right numbers, lots of supporters for your position, etc. But in the end the politician will still do whatever he/she wants. Is this wrong? Absolutely. We're supposed to be a representative republic, not a democracy. We need to bring that important difference back into the mainstream. Also, we need to revitalize what I think is another important point...we are not interested, in any way, shape, or form of improving, increasing or enhancing personal or public safety at the expense of individual liberties! It's always "for public safety", or "for the children", we need our message to be "We'll take liberty, you can keep your safety."

yzernie
10-12-2009, 10:18 PM
These records have allowed law enforcement to arrest and prosecute persons who have no business possessing firearms and ammunition: gang members, violent parolees, second and third strikers, and even people previously serving time in state prison for murder.

Utilized properly, this type of information is invaluable for keeping communities safe and preventing dangerous felons from committing crimes with firearms.

As Governor, I have sought the appropriate balance between public safety and the right to keep and bear arms.
His comment about public safety is assinine. He's so concerned about public safety but he and his group of thieves in Sacto are stealing money right and left from counties and cities so he can fund his BS. Law enforcement has seen a dramatic reduction in state funding. My department is currently holding 200+ positions vacant because we don't have the funding to keep them filled. "Public safety is my concern" is such a HUGE distance from reality.

fullrearview
10-12-2009, 10:25 PM
local program is flawed; without a statewide law, felons can easily skirt the record keeping requirements of one city by visiting another. Assembly Bill 962 will fix this problem by
mandating that all ammunition vendors in the state keep records on ammunition sales.



Whats the difference between city to city or state to state? I call :icon_bs:

M. Sage
10-12-2009, 10:34 PM
Moreover, this type of record keeping is no more intrusive for law abiding citizens than similar laws governing pawnshops or the sale of cold medicine.

Evidently we're not keeping that cold medicine under tight enough wraps... :rolleyes:

team1320
10-12-2009, 11:27 PM
so what happens with ammo that we have now? in 2011 will we be able to use it at the range?

obeygiant
10-13-2009, 12:50 AM
Dear Arnie:
Go F&^% yourself.

Love,
ColdDeadHands

Ja, Arnold's a NAZI like his father before him.

The apple didn't fall far from the tree.

these posts are not conducive to keeping a thread open nor are they representative of the message that we should be sending here at CGN.

supersonic
10-15-2009, 5:00 PM
these posts are not conducive to keeping a thread open nor are they representative of the message that we should be sending here at CGN.

It's called "FREEDOM OF SPEECH." At this point, I think the vast majority are tired of holding their tongues & working so hard to conduct themselves in a 'restrained' manner, only to be handed a steaming pile of excrement for their efforts. I truly support anyone's right to hammer "our Governor" (the son of a Nazi Party member who, by the way should NEVER have been elected in the first place, by the way, because he was NOT even an American citizen until well into adulthood:rolleyes:)

locosway
10-15-2009, 5:03 PM
Unfortunately freedom of speech doesn't work on a private forum.

I do agree though that people should, can, and will speak their mind when their state is being flushed down the toilet by the one person who can save it.

supersonic
10-16-2009, 9:02 AM
Unfortunately freedom of speech doesn't work on a private forum.


Whether or not it 'works' is entirely up to the reader. And as far as my statement(s) about the governor, I was not trying to infer that he is/was a 'nazi' or that he isn't 'American.' My point is simply that, given the 2 facts I pointed out, ANY other person (without the Hollywood/ULTRA-rich$$/politico-Kennedy connections PLUS the star-power alone) would have been disqualified outright. Period. End of story. And now we have to endure the 'steaming pile' being dumped over our collective head(s) by this lucky, privileged actor-turned-politician who (technically) should not even be holding office to begin with. : "Go back to Austria, Arnold!....Oh, I forgot: your citizenship was revoked in your homeland because of your behavior & actions unbecoming of a citizen.":rolleyes:

locosway
10-16-2009, 9:04 AM
Whether or not it 'works' is entirely up to the reader. And as far as my statement(s) about the governor, I was not trying to infer that he is/was a 'nazi' or that he isn't 'American.' My point is simply that, given the 2 facts I pointed out, ANY other person (without the Hollywood/ULTRA-rich$$/politico-Kennedy connections PLUS the star-power alone) would have been disqualified outright. Period. End of story. And now we have to endure the 'steaming pile' being dumped over our collective head(s) by this lucky, privileged actor-turned-politician who (technically) should not even be holding office to begin with. : "Go back to Austria, Arnold!....Oh, I forgot: your citizenship was revoked in your homeland because of your behavior & actions unbecoming of a citizen.":rolleyes:

andddddddd, that's why if you read both of the sentences I posted you'll see I completely agree with you. :)

ZRX61
10-16-2009, 9:18 AM
It's funny, sometimes I'll buy two or more different packages of allergy medicine. Meth is made from this and not cold medicine. I've never been looked at funny or anything.

Related to this subject:
I had to buy some methanol last week so I head to the local race shop. They tell me they no longer sell it by the gallon because it's used by people who run meth labs... so now they only sell it in 5gal cans....
So I head over to another supplier who are willing to sell anywhere from 1gal to multiple 55gal drums of the stuff.. & no ID is needed etc.. :)

Ditto if you buy a bunch of bulk sugar from Costco & then mix it into 55gal drums of diesel to make things that go "bang".. I guess they don't teach that in HS Chem these days...

locosway
10-16-2009, 9:23 AM
Yeah, biodiesel uses methanol as well. It's a fuel, there's no need to restrict it.

tpliquid1
10-16-2009, 9:32 AM
when you guys read it do you use arnold voice? I do.

GunOwner
10-16-2009, 10:10 AM
What is important for me in all of this (beside the counter attack based on interstate commerce and carriers) is that his explanation gives us insights into how our opposition got the job done. Some group of people assembled statistics and built an argument that this restriction promotes public safety. They must have drawn stats from communities that have such similar restrictions and extrapolated the results to California. I, for one, was not aware they doing this in their lobbying efforts--I never saw or heard any stats in the news or here about it. If we'd known, we could have taken the stats and look more objectively at them to see if we could sink their story. But as it was, I think their story unchallenged by us because we didn't know of it, sailed through the governors ear unchallenged.

I acknowledge their cleverness. They won this round. But it is one battle not the whole war and maybe we've gained valuable intelligence from this one.


Does anyone know (or know how we can find out) what statistics they used? Someone mentioned to me that Arnie's people were saying the law in Sacramento has resulted in 200 arrests of felons. I would like to know where they get this ridiculous stuff so I can intelligently respond. I do not believe this type of law COULD result in any additional arrests . So, I would like to know where they get this ridiculous stuff so I can intelligently respond. We advance the cause by being informed and intelligently responding with facts and logic to those that are ignorant.

p.s. I recognize logic and facts do not work to convince the Brady folks and other gun grabber organizations as their paycheck and donations are driven by the fear and misinformation they spread. My hope is to convince honest people who have been brainwashed by the FUD they get from the popular media.

Question: Does anyone know what "facts" they are spouting to support this law?

locosway
10-16-2009, 10:14 AM
Does anyone know (or know how we can find out) what statistics they used? Someone mentioned to me that Arnie's people were saying the law in Sacramento has resulted in 200 arrests of felons. I would like to know where they get this ridiculous stuff so I can intelligently respond. I do not believe this type of law COULD result in any additional arrests . So, I would like to know where they get this ridiculous stuff so I can intelligently respond. We advance the cause by being informed and intelligently responding with facts and logic to those that are ignorant.

p.s. I recognize logic and facts do not work to convince the Brady folks and other gun grabber organizations as their paycheck and donations are driven by the fear and misinformation they spread. My hope is to convince honest people who have been brainwashed by the FUD they get from the popular media.

Question: Does anyone know what "facts" they are spouting to support this law?

It's likely that a felon got rolled on weapons charges again. When asked where he got the ammo he said "so and so shop". So they went there, found the records, and charged him with the ammo violation. :rolleyes:

Other than that, there is no active checking afaik. It's all just more paperwork and burden in an already heavily regulated industry.

Justintoxicated
10-16-2009, 10:18 AM
Arnold is Skynet, sent here to thwart the resistance. But we already knew that right?

supersonic
10-16-2009, 11:25 AM
andddddddd, that's why if you read both of the sentences I posted you'll see I completely agree with you. :)

an-da-da-da-da-da-da I Got it. And I agree with your sig line. 10MM rules all.:thumbsup:

Hozr
10-16-2009, 12:20 PM
Sacramento City has had this arcane ordinance in place for a while no (Thanks Kevin McCarty) and SPD had been pimping the success of it in the Sacramento Bee newspaper a TON right before the signing deadline. I'm sure the police chief was in speaking on it's behalf as well. What never got mentioned was that of the 9 criminals they caught trying to purchase ammunition it takes about 50 officers/detectives off the streets to deal with all the paperwork. In fact, the gang problen got sobad last year with gang realated shootings/homicides they had to pull ALL officers off the ammo watch to put them back on the streets to control crime. In the 2 week show of force there were about 100 arrests as opposed to 9 in the preceeding year.

Where is the money better spent?