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Gun_Fanatic
10-08-2009, 11:14 PM
If I read this correctly, 922r only comes into effect when you modify an assault rifle. So when I get a new stock for my saiga, in order to keep it legal within federal laws, I have to start replacing gas pistons, foregrips, and such and I have to reach a certain amount of parts. Did I interpret that correctly?

69Mach1
10-08-2009, 11:16 PM
It deals with imported long arms specifically. When you modify the imported rifle, or assemble one with foreign made parts.
http://thegunwiki.com/Gunwiki/LegalFederal922rFeatures

Merc1138
10-08-2009, 11:30 PM
What 69mach1 said. And btw, stop using the brady bunch anti-gun crowd term "assault rifle". Your Saiga isn't an "assault rifle", it's not even fully automatic(and even that doesn't make something an assault rifle per se.), it's an anti-gun buzzword to make things sound more evil than they really are.

Gun_Fanatic
10-08-2009, 11:40 PM
ok sorry for using that term. so then how many us made parts do I need to put in the saiga. the stock and pistol grip are two and the fore grip is one and the gas piston is another so all together I have four. Is that enough? also the mag lock.

Merc1138
10-08-2009, 11:45 PM
In the link 69mach1 posted, toward the top is another link to the main 922r page, hit that link and scroll down. It explains how to count the parts, as well as a little worksheet to help you count parts, as well as links to firearms specific worksheets like an SKS or Saiga. When you're done reading that, make sure there aren't any other links you've missed, if you have, then go read those too.

IsaacGlass
10-08-2009, 11:53 PM
Read whats on the GunWiki site, do some research and if you still dont understand or have more question come back and post those specific Q's.

http://thegunwiki.com/Gunwiki/LegalFederal922rFeatures

69Mach1
10-09-2009, 12:04 AM
Some people curse 922r, but I think it's great because it totally gets around the "assault weapons" import ban of 1989. Not particually suitable for "sporting purposes" (925D). Not a problem. Change this here, replace those there and BAM! Identical rifle, but now legal.

BATF, what a bunch of........

Merc1138
10-09-2009, 1:50 AM
BATF, what a bunch of........

People that gave us an un-enforceable law that so long as everyone follows it gets us passed some silly anti-gun bs in this instance? I'm not into the whole russian rifle thing myself, but to be honest it seems like the only real purpose is to give some american companies a way to make some cash off of cheap russian surplus.

And yeah, I'd rather have no restrictions at all, but this one... nowhere near as bad as some of the others.

Gun_Fanatic
10-09-2009, 7:15 AM
I read all the gun wiki stuff and as far as I understand it, if I start putting assault rifle stuff on my saiga like a pistol griop and adjustable stock, then I have to start replacing parts on and in the gun with american parts. According to the tapco website I need six parts, is that correct?

69Mach1
10-09-2009, 7:39 AM
I read all the gun wiki stuff and as far as I understand it, if I start putting assault rifle stuff on my saiga like a pistol griop and adjustable stock, then I have to start replacing parts on and in the gun with american parts. According to the tapco website I need six parts, is that correct?

Yes, but a stock Saiga requires less.

B Strong
10-09-2009, 7:49 AM
People that gave us an un-enforceable law that so long as everyone follows it gets us passed some silly anti-gun bs in this instance? I'm not into the whole russian rifle thing myself, but to be honest it seems like the only real purpose is to give some american companies a way to make some cash off of cheap russian surplus.
And yeah, I'd rather have no restrictions at all, but this one... nowhere near as bad as some of the others.

If only that was true.

George Bush the First gave us the Import Ban as a public relations ploy.

Gun_Fanatic
10-09-2009, 9:56 AM
What do you mean a stock saiga?

djleisure
10-09-2009, 10:58 AM
What do you mean a stock saiga?

A "stock" Saiga is a Saiga fresh out of the box, in its original sporting layout. I believe a stock Saiga only requires the replacement (or removal of) four foreign parts. A bullet button does not count towards 922r, because you are not replacing a foreign part. Think of 922r as the "absence of" foreign parts not the "presence of" US made parts. You can throw all kinds of US made stuff on your gun, but if you still have more than 10 foreign made parts on it (ones that count towards 922r) then you are still in violation.

IsaacGlass
10-09-2009, 12:41 PM
A "stock" Saiga is a Saiga fresh out of the box, in its original sporting layout. I believe a stock Saiga only requires the replacement (or removal of) four foreign parts. A bullet button does not count towards 922r, because you are not replacing a foreign part. Think of 922r as the "absence of" foreign parts not the "presence of" US made parts. You can throw all kinds of US made stuff on your gun, but if you still have more than 10 foreign made parts on it (ones that count towards 922r) then you are still in violation.

Well said djleisure. You hijack his learning experience, oops I guess this is part of that cycle. A stock Saiga in sporting configuration doesnt come with a pistol grip which is why it wasnt checked on the worksheet. But these US made parts do count towards 922r parts replacement. Follow the links and read the parts count then head over to this link http://thegunwiki.com/Gunwiki/BuildSaigaVerifyCompliance and check off each part you are going to replace.

http://store.carolinashooterssupply.com/servlet/-strse-267/TAPCO-SAIGA-TRI-dsh-RAIL-HANDGUARD/Detail

http://store.carolinashooterssupply.com/servlet/-strse-121/TAPCO-SAIGA-AK47-REPLACEMENT/Detail

http://store.carolinashooterssupply.com/servlet/-strse-119/SAIGA-AK-TAPCO-FCG/Detail


(http://thegunwiki.com/Gunwiki/BuildSaigaVerifyCompliance)

ar15barrels
10-09-2009, 1:18 PM
A "stock" Saiga is a Saiga fresh out of the box, in its original sporting layout. I believe a stock Saiga only requires the replacement (or removal of) four foreign parts. A bullet button does not count towards 922r, because you are not replacing a foreign part. Think of 922r as the "absence of" foreign parts not the "presence of" US made parts. You can throw all kinds of US made stuff on your gun, but if you still have more than 10 foreign made parts on it (ones that count towards 922r) then you are still in violation.

This is the best description in this thread.

922r does not require ANY us made parts.
It just forbids more than 10 foreign made parts.

So, if the gun would function with less than 10 of the specifically listed 922r foreign parts, you are good.

However, when you start removing parts like stocks, pistol grips, pistons and triggers, the gun often won't function.
That's why you have to put US made parts on it.
US made parts are NOT FOREIGN MADE.

Gun_Fanatic
10-09-2009, 3:31 PM
I understand that I need US parts, I just need to know how many and what the best parts to replace are.

Josh3239
10-09-2009, 4:00 PM
You need to re-read it. 922r has nothing to do with American parts. If it has more than 10 imported stuff it is illegal period end of story. Remove the stuff or change it for non imported parts.

This link explains it and also explains the 922r regarding the Saiga:
http://home.comcast.net/~navy87guy/home/922r.html

IsaacGlass
10-09-2009, 4:31 PM
I understand that I need US parts, I just need to know how many and what the best parts to replace are.

My links I supplied kinda illustrate what parts are best to changed.

stix213
10-09-2009, 5:18 PM
Dude, stop trying to figure this crap out on your own and just use the automated checklist.

http://thegunwiki.com/Gunwiki/BuildSaigaVerifyCompliance

Unclick the boxes for US made parts, or parts you don't even have (like a pistol grip for example) and check boxes for foreign parts, and it figures out if you are legal or not.

This crap only applies if you modify your rifle into an "unsporting" configuration to where it could not legally be imported. For example, using high cap mags, forward vertical grip, pistol grip, and several other changes make it unsporting. In a nutshell the law works by making unsporting imported guns illegal, period, where an imported gun is one that has more than 10 imported parts. 10 or less makes it not imported as far as 922r is concerned, so that is where this parts count BS comes into play. If you go "unsporting" just get your parts foreign parts count down low enough (10) to where your gun is no longer considered a foreign gun.

Using US made magazines goes a long way since they count as 3 parts already, and since the Saiga only has 14 counted parts stock, you are almost there. I just use US made Surefire mags and swapped the handguard - done! Easy as pie, and only required the turn of a single screw, plus the stock handguard is super lame anyway (where do I hang all my mall ninja gear? give me rails!). If you are doing a full conversion, plenty of the internal parts can easily be changed at that time too.

A stock saiga with no modifications, and using 10 round mags, is in its original imported configuration and is perfectly legal because it is considered "sporting." You can even add a thumbhole stock like mine and be fine, cause they are imported with those too. Only when you install some "unsporting" features, like my vertical forward grip on mine, do you have to worry about this crap.

Vertical forward grip does make popping cantelopes from the hip more fun btw :)

Gun_Fanatic
10-09-2009, 8:42 PM
so as long as I stick with American magazines I really don't need to get anything other than a new stock cause if so that just made this 80 times cheaper. Really the only reason this worried me is cause I want the vertical forward grip eventually and tapco makes a cheap stock that has a pistol grip on it and I wanted to use that. I just thought I needed six parts but if the magazine counts then I really only need a stock and I'm fine the way I'm understanding this.