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Shotgun Man
10-03-2009, 3:46 PM
According to the California Senate's own website, the Governor has only 12 days to sign a bill submitted to him:


Step 5: You Can Still Act After Your Bill Goes To The Governor
The Governor has 12 days to sign, approve without signing, or veto a bill. A letter or phone call to the Governor's Office is appropriate to state your position on the bill.
If the bill is signed or approved without a signature, it goes to the Secretary of State to be chaptered. If the governor vetoes the bill, a two-thirds vote in each house is needed to override the veto. The Governor's office releases veto messages which explain the veto; these messages are available from the Governor's Office and on the Internet.


http://www.senate.ca.gov/~newsen/schedules/bill2law.htp

On a side note, I found this game on how a bill becomes a law on the assemby's website. You plug in your proposed legislation, you go through the process and the governor signs it.

http://www.assembly.ca.gov/acs/kids/kids1/page2.asp


BILL NUMBER: AB 1434
CHAPTERED October 3, 2009
BILL TEXTFILED WITH SECRETARY OF STATE October 3, 2009
FILED WITH SECRETARY OF STATE October 3, 2009
APPROVED BY GOVERNOR October 3, 2009
PASSED THE ASSEMBLY October 3, 2009
PASSED THE SENATE October 3, 2009
INTRODUCED BY Assembly Member LeBear October 3, 2009
An act related to Health & Safety
THE PEOPLE OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA DO ENACT AS FOLLOWS:
The Right of the People to Keep and Bear Arms and Ammunition Shall Not Be Infringed. http://www.assembly.ca.gov/acs/kids/kids1/govsig.gif

joelberg
10-03-2009, 4:14 PM
So this means we're screwed?

obeygiant
10-03-2009, 4:20 PM
From an earlier thread here (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showpost.php?p=3067660&postcount=2477)

The Legislative Process (http://sam.dgs.ca.gov/TOC/6000/6945.htm)
# Action by Governor


1. Sign or Veto—Article IV, Section 10 of the California Constitution provides: "Each bill passed by the Legislature shall be presented to the Governor. It becomes a statute if he signs it. He may veto it by returning it with his objections to the house of origin, which shall enter the objections in the journal and proceed to reconsider it. If each house then passes the bill by roll-call vote entered in the journal, two-thirds of the membership concurring, it becomes a statute." This latter action of the Legislature to approve by a two-thirds vote a bill vetoed by the Governor is referred to as a "veto override.”

2. Item Veto—The California Constitution provides: "The Governor may reduce or eliminate one or more items of appropriation while approving other portions of a bill.

3. He shall append to the bill a statement of the items reduced or eliminated with the reasons for his action. The Governor shall transmit to the house originating the bill a copy of his statement and reasons. Items reduced or eliminated shall be separately reconsidered and may be passed over the Governor's veto in the same manner as bills." Overriding a gubernatorial veto requires a two-thirds vote.

4. Deadlines for Action—The Constitution goes on to specify how much time the Governor has to act on (sign or veto) a bill sent to him/her. If the Governor does not act within that time, the bill becomes law without signature. Generally, the Governor’s deadlines are as follows:

1. In the first year of the session:

If the bill is delivered to the Governor before the interim recess: 12 days to act.
If the bill is delivered after the beginning of recess: 30 days to act.

2. In the second year of the session:

If the bill is delivered before adjournment: 12 days to act.
If the bill is delivered on or after September 1: until September 30 to act.

The Governor’s timeframe for action begins when the bill is received. The date a bill passes the Legislature usually is not the day the Governor receives it. After passage by the Legislature, the bill must go to “enrolling and engrossing” where it is prepared for formal transmission to the Governor. Sometimes, several days will elapse between the time of final legislative approval of a bill and the time the Governor receives it.

obeygiant
10-03-2009, 4:22 PM
So this means we're screwed?

it means we have until the 11th for him to veto it.

joelberg
10-03-2009, 4:25 PM
it means we have until the 11th for him to veto it.

Ah gotcha, that's what I thought. Man this bill has really got me bummed.

Shotgun Man
10-03-2009, 4:27 PM
So this means we're screwed?

I didn't mean to suggest that we are screwed.

I was pointing out confusing, misinformation on the senate website.

badhabit90
10-03-2009, 4:36 PM
i hate the fact that a "bill" can be enacted so quickly without anyone really knowing about it. i also hate the fact that the MEDIA always uses the term "assault weapon" for ANY rifle that is found within a felons home.

WHY OH WHY ISNT THE NRA INVOLVED IN THIS?!???!? HECK they just helped ARIZONA pass a law that allows you to carry in a bar now.

KylaGWolf
10-03-2009, 4:46 PM
OK guys this means we need to turn up the heat on him to veto these bills so get on the phone and CALL. FAX email his office. If you have twitter tweet him like mad. I want to see his office so bogged down they have to put in four new fax lines just to handle the faxes.

Phil3
10-03-2009, 4:50 PM
This is going to be a long 8 days, and if not vetoed by the 9th (Friday), it will be hard to remain optimistic. Still, Arnold has returned a previous ammo bill that was restrictive on gun shops.

Found on the CA government website.

In 2007, the Legislature approved legislation to address the problem of Internet sales of ammunition to minors by requiring third parties (e.g., common carriers) to obtain verification of the buyer's age. (AB 2714 (Torrico).) Governor Schwarzenegger vetoed that bill and in his veto message stated the following:

It is important to ensure that minors do not use mail-order or internet sales to obtain access to items prohibited under current law that could be dangerous if used improperly. However, current law already requires sellers to verify the age of a purchaser who wishes to buy ammunition at the time of sale. By adding a new requirement that retailers ensure third party verification of the identity of the purchaser at time of delivery, this bill could inadvertently subject legitimate retailers to criminal penalties for actions that they have no control over. As a result, this bill could be counter productive by providing a negligible benefit to public safety while concurrently
discouraging legitimate business.

In addition, this bill would allow local governments to enact their own measures governing the sale of ammunition if they are stricter than state law. Statewide uniformity of the laws regulating firearms is critical to public safety. By allowing local governments to proliferate local measures regarding the sale of ammunition that significantly differ from state law, this bill could result in inconsistent regulation, interpretation, and enforcement of firearms laws by businesses, law enforcement, and the public.

For these reasons, I am returning this bill without my signature.

Phil3
10-03-2009, 4:52 PM
OK guys this means we need to turn up the heat on him to veto these bills so get on the phone and CALL. FAX email his office. If you have twitter tweet him like mad. I want to see his office so bogged down they have to put in four new fax lines just to handle the faxes.

I am wearing out the numbers on the phone keys for 916-445-2841.

- Phil

Trench Broom
10-03-2009, 10:01 PM
Keep wearing those numbers out! Gotta go make more calls....

blackberg
10-03-2009, 10:21 PM
he actually just received the bill on the 30th, so it is 12 days,

-bb

obeygiant
10-03-2009, 10:33 PM
i hate the fact that a "bill" can be enacted so quickly without anyone really knowing about it. i also hate the fact that the MEDIA always uses the term "assault weapon" for ANY rifle that is found within a felons home.

WHY OH WHY ISNT THE NRA INVOLVED IN THIS?!???!? HECK they just helped ARIZONA pass a law that allows you to carry in a bar now.

Here's a few thoughts for your consideration.

The NRA has been on it for some time.


http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=158884

http://www.nraila.org/legislation/read.aspx?id=5051

http://www.nraila.org/Legislation/Read.aspx?ID=5065

I will help you with the mail though:

https://www.nramemberservices.org/faq.asp

Jeez Hawker,

The NRA has been on top of 962 and 585 since day one. Are you not a member of your local member's council? Do you not get ILA alerts?

The NRA is all over this, both at levels that are visible, and on the back end stuff actually up in Sacto. . .

You won't get much support for any anti-NRA rhetoric here, Calguns and the CGF works closely with the NRA in California, and we get stuff done.

Ive seen 2 threads started by the NRA here on the subject.

Paul Payne is your NRA bigwig assigned to CA and talks directly to the NRA VP.

The other Volunteer is Mike who runs the NRA alert system and posted the "one click" thread for the same subject.

There really isnt a member here who goes under "NRA" so I can see where it looks like they dont post here but they do.

That said, the other guys who are passing out flyers and setting up local meeting are the NRA as well. I dont think Cabellas has anything on the Calguns NRA network you see here everyday.

Bingo. And besides Paul, we have our NRA legislative liaison in Sacramento, Ed Worley who's a helluva guy.

Calgunners and CGF can't do what they do best without some NRA folk (and some new CRPA staff!) out there.

Also, remember that many many Calgunners are NRA members and if an alert goes out it may be posted first here thru help of a Calgunner - and just isn't fancy-printed with the NRA logo.

The NRA:

- Has a full-time paid lobbiest in California. This is the only state where that is true.

- Has the Members' Council program. Again, California is the only state where that is true.

- Has a second full-time paid employee who gets into all kinds of interesting lobbying and outreach activities, and who reports directly to NRA HQ. Again, this is only true in California.

- Has the CAL-ERTs system for getting information out to those NRA members who bother to sign up for it.

- Has the one-click system, which is designed to allow NRA membership to let Sacramento know exactly what we think of their legislative activities.

So you tell me: what else do you want the NRA to do?



Heh, one thing I just realized...

With all the *****ing about what the NRA does or doesn't do... Have you READ the thread title about the ammo ban?

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?p=3128580

"CALNRA: AB962 Mail Order Ammo Ban Goes to the Governor's Desk, 9/11"

You got that right, CALNRA.

Just curious - is everyone who's concerned about the NRA involved in their MC? Volunteered at an NRA event? Talked to Paul Payne about what they can do for the cause?

$35 a year does not mean we get to do nothing and play armchair quarterback.

obeygiant
10-03-2009, 11:15 PM
From the Legislative Calendar here (http://www.senate.ca.gov/~newsen/schedules/LEGIS.HTP) on Page 2 of the JointCalendar2009.pdf (http://www.senate.ca.gov/~newsen/schedules/_CALENDAR/jointCalendar2009.pdf)

IMPORTANT DATES OCCURRING DURING INTERIM STUDY RECESS
2009
Oct. 11 Last day for Governor to sign or veto bills passed by the Legislature on or before Sept. 11 and in the Governor’s possession after Sept. 11 (Art. IV, Sec.10(b)(1)).

badhabit90
10-04-2009, 6:06 PM
Here's a few thoughts for your consideration.

first off, i dont mean what i say below personal, it is just my view right now because of the knucklehead that decided to introduce this bill as we all know it serves no purpose....:)

i renewed my NRA membership earlier this year and my father is a life member.

well i thank you for the "thoughts" , however, when i went to my local show just recently here on the central coast....the NRA representative really couldnt give me any confirmation on what the NRA is really doing. dont you think everyone involved with the NRA should be informed?? im mean he was the rep for the booth and perhaps he should have had more info on hand instead of "welp , join the NRA to help the fight..." not a good sales pitch if you ask me. im just another pissed off californian that has to worry about the BATFE knocking on my door or taking my guns from the range for a "questionable" rifle/ "bullet button". now i cannot give my fellow officer i work with a box of ammo at the range for fear of "not being a vendor" of sorts. then, when i want to purchase say, 1000 rounds of .308/7.62 .223/5.56 ...9mm....45acp or anything will i be looked at through the BATFE??? am i going to be investigated because i purchase so much ammunition?? how about others?? just because i have purchased this ammo doesnt mean now im going on a crime spree, it just means that im serious about my shooting. how about those that compete?? how about those that just purchase it for practice outside their departments?? paperwork you fill out doesnt ask you if you are law enforcement when you purchase a gun, and i dont believe the ammo form will either.

fact of the matter is, there are laws already enacted to prohibit criminals from having ammo in their possession. this is up to the Probation/Parole departments to check peoples homes, cars, etc. they are subject to search at anytime. now im going to be treated like one because i have to fill out a form(invading my privacy on how much i purchase) now if this passes.

first person that gets in trouble on calguns and get sent to a Federal Correctional Facility on the central coast, i will surely give you an extra tray and extra blankets..... ;)

hope this all made sense because im just mad is all....just seems like no matter what we all do here, make our calls, send our emails, etc. we just are chipping at a huge rock....that never seems to get smaller. frustrating.

could you imagine if Gray Davis were still in office??ugh..

badhabit90
10-04-2009, 6:15 PM
OH i forgot to ask...why doesnt the NRA do commercials in California?? do they do commercials at all?? that is a PERFECT way to contact the public on this bill to veto. just like elections..??? just a thought.....

bodger
10-04-2009, 7:11 PM
OH i forgot to ask...why doesnt the NRA do commercials in California?? do they do commercials at all?? that is a PERFECT way to contact the public on this bill to veto. just like elections..??? just a thought.....



My guess is the TV stations in CA won't take ads from the NRA.

And to hell with giving my fingerprint and ID when I purchase ammo. If this horsecrap bill becomes law, I will never buy another round of ammo in this state.
Free states will get my ammo business. Period. Enough is enough.

Sometimes I wonder how far these legislative idiots think they can push people.

Shotgun Man
10-04-2009, 7:20 PM
My guess is the TV stations in CA won't take ads from the NRA.

And to hell with giving my fingerprint and ID when I purchase ammo. If this horsecrap bill becomes law, I will never buy another round of ammo in this state.
Free states will get my ammo business. Period. Enough is enough.

Sometimes I wonder how far these legislative idiots think they can push people.

Don't you understand?

As it is, gangmembers can buy ammo without a background check.

This law is going to denude criminals who are already intent on violating the law.

Imagine if a criminal can no longer buy ammo in CA, why, I'm sure the handgun-related homicide rate is going to plummet.

Imagine the near Utopia that will surely follow the passage of AB 962.

I can't wait.

HondaMasterTech
10-04-2009, 7:29 PM
Don't you understand?

As it is, gangmembers can buy ammo without a background check.

This law is going to denude criminals who are already intent on violating the law.

Imagine if a criminal can no longer buy ammo in CA, why, I'm sure the handgun-related homicide rate is going to plummet.

Imagine the near Utopia that will surely follow the passage of AB 962.

I can't wait.

Heh.

Southwest Chuck
10-04-2009, 9:52 PM
.... to hell with giving my fingerprint and ID when I purchase ammo. If this horsecrap bill becomes law, I will never buy another round of ammo in this state.
Free states will get my ammo business. Period. Enough is enough.

Sometimes I wonder how far these legislative idiots think they can push people.

I couldn't have said it better. My sentiments exactly! :cuss:

CenterX
10-04-2009, 9:54 PM
My thoughts are that he will let it become law without signing the bleeping thing.

obeygiant
10-04-2009, 10:03 PM
Don't you understand?

As it is, gangmembers can buy ammo without a background check.

This law is going to denude criminals who are already intent on violating the law.

Imagine if a criminal can no longer buy ammo in CA, why, I'm sure the handgun-related homicide rate is going to plummet.

Imagine the near Utopia that will surely follow the passage of AB 962.

I can't wait.

Why wait? The utopia should already exist in Los Angeles (De Leon's district), wait..........there was that whole Los Angeles Avenues Gang thing....

bodger
10-04-2009, 10:27 PM
Don't you understand?

As it is, gangmembers can buy ammo without a background check.

This law is going to denude criminals who are already intent on violating the law.

Imagine if a criminal can no longer buy ammo in CA, why, I'm sure the handgun-related homicide rate is going to plummet.

Imagine the near Utopia that will surely follow the passage of AB 962.

I can't wait.


LOL. You betcha, we're on our way to a gun crime free state!!

Yeah, already in Los Angeles proper a fingerprint and ID is required. For some time now thanks to the City Council.

And my gosh, look how the crime rate has dropped! Those evil gangbangers would never have thought to drive to Culver City and buy ammo.

It's just unbelievable the crap these legislators will introduce and try to call a crime deterrent. It's gun control for the sake of it, one drop at a time.

jakemccoy
10-04-2009, 10:34 PM
i hate the fact that a "bill" can be enacted so quickly without anyone really knowing about it. i also hate the fact that the MEDIA always uses the term "assault weapon" for ANY rifle that is found within a felons home.

I understand your concern. However, the people who care, and will do something, know about the bill.

Networks won't spoon feed all proposed legislation to people through their local news stations. Otherwise, ratings would plummet. There are a lot of bills I don't really care about. I would rather not see their advertisements if I don't proactively seek the information. There's just not enough time in my day to stress over every bill coming through.

There might be a TV channel that provides notice of all legislation. Is it C-Span? That channel is like tuning in to watch paint dry.

jakemccoy
10-04-2009, 10:52 PM
And to hell with giving my fingerprint and ID when I purchase ammo. If this horsecrap bill becomes law, I will never buy another round of ammo in this state.
Free states will get my ammo business. Period. Enough is enough.

That's my initial knee-jerk reaction as well. However, wow, such a reaction from all gun owners would have a damaging effect on all things gun related in California. Do you shoot at range? I do. I really don't want to see anymore ranges having to close their doors due to lack of revenue. If all California gun owners start buying their ammo out of state, then the ranges will suffer. There's no real alternative to a range for me. I'm not going out 200 miles into the desert just to shoot.

badhabit90
10-04-2009, 11:06 PM
Don't you understand?

As it is, gangmembers can buy ammo without a background check.

This law is going to denude criminals who are already intent on violating the law.

Imagine if a criminal can no longer buy ammo in CA, why, I'm sure the handgun-related homicide rate is going to plummet.

Imagine the near Utopia that will surely follow the passage of AB 962.

I can't wait.

okay wait a minute....

if you are a known gang member, then you usually have a wrap sheet. therefore it is already illegal for a gangmember to possess any ammunition at all. it will violate their conditions of parole or probation.

heck, why sell guns in CA then if there is going to be a Utopia....didnt Hitler try this in Nazi Germany??

oh im sorry sir, you cant buy this gun from the back of my trunk because your background check didnt clear.....go burglarize a home instead. maybe the background check person there will clear you......or better yet... go talk with Chuco or Spider down the block OH LiL Flipper has one for sale 100 bucks!!

AND if you are a criminal, then you shouldnt be purchasing ammo anyways. YOUR A CRIMINAL....i dont think they really care about laws anyways THATS WHY THEY ARE A CRIMINAL....get it yet??? makes no sense at all....

badhabit90
10-04-2009, 11:17 PM
My guess is the TV stations in CA won't take ads from the NRA.

And to hell with giving my fingerprint and ID when I purchase ammo. If this horsecrap bill becomes law, I will never buy another round of ammo in this state.
Free states will get my ammo business. Period. Enough is enough.

Sometimes I wonder how far these legislative idiots think they can push people.

i guess the TV stations cant be swayed enough to have an ad campaign for this, but they can show smear campaigns on each others opponents during election times....sad just sad. sad that the media can sway hundreds of people to believe in something that is sooo not true, but yet the candidates lie out their teeth to get your vote.

gun control...worked for Hitler....yeah thats the ticket.:mad:

jakemccoy
10-04-2009, 11:17 PM
Don't you understand?

As it is, gangmembers can buy ammo without a background check.

This law is going to denude criminals who are already intent on violating the law.

Imagine if a criminal can no longer buy ammo in CA, why, I'm sure the handgun-related homicide rate is going to plummet.

Imagine the near Utopia that will surely follow the passage of AB 962.

I can't wait.

Without a smiley thingy or LOL or whatever, only people with a dry sense of humor will get you. ;)

jakemccoy
10-05-2009, 12:02 AM
I disagree. California will be left with criminals and victims. Fortunately, other state governments/populations realize that isn't the answer. Besides, do you really blame anyone? Don't these people have lives to live and families to raise? If leaving California is what anyone feels is best for them and their family, more power to them.

I'm thinking you didn't read my post or something. You said you disagree. That means you're saying California ranges WON'T suffer if all gun owners bought ammo out of state.

All the ranges I've seen are ran by businesses that also sell ammo. Regardless if gun owners have lives to live and families to raise, people buying ammo out of state would decrease the overall traffic and the bottom line at the ranges. By the way, I hope it turns out that I'm 100% wrong.

NocturnalDoc
10-05-2009, 3:40 AM
Statewide uniformity of the laws regulating firearms is critical to public safety. By allowing local governments to proliferate local measures regarding the sale of ammunition that significantly differ from state law, this bill could result in inconsistent regulation, interpretation, and enforcement of firearms laws by businesses, law enforcement, and the public.

For these reasons, I am returning this bill without my signature.


So, the Governator has confirmed that CCW rights (i.e. shall-issue) should be consistent statewide.

"Statewide uniformity of the laws regulating firearms is critical to public safety."

Hope he really believes that.

natasha69
10-05-2009, 12:50 PM
The governor is sitting on over 500 bills right now. I read an article saying that while he's not pounding the drums, he is threatening to veto everything unless the legislature passes funding for a water project for CA (something we need!! imagine that).

It is very unlike him to not have signed anything by this time and have so many bills in limbo.