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ap3572001
09-27-2009, 3:49 PM
I gave been reading a bunch about AR's since the became legal in CA. Bought two. I have some questions. What is the deal with a " Complete rifle" VS a build? If someone buys a complete STAG upper and then buys a Stag complete lower and puts them together, isn't it a factory rifle? Or a RRA lower and a RRA Varmint upper? Would this be considered a FACTORY rifle?

technique
09-27-2009, 3:55 PM
nope...

If you slap a Stag upper on a Stag lower and sell it....If I bought it I can call Stag to see how it was sold. If I give em the serial # they will tell me that the lower left stripped and not as a complete rifle.

missiontrails
09-27-2009, 3:55 PM
I gave been reading a bunch about AR's since the became legal in CA. Bought two. I have some questions. What is the deal with a " Complete rifle" VS a build? If someone buys a complete STAG upper and then buys a Stag complete lower and puts them together, isn't it a factory rifle? Or a RRA lower and a RRA Varmint upper? Would this be considered a FACTORY rifle?

Well, not exactally. Complete rifles are inspected and test fired at the factory as the complete unit. Sometimes they actually have different model names also. For example, you can put a Stag 2HT on a lower and what do you have? Answer, A HOME BUILD. If you buy that as a complete rifle, you have a Stag 2T. Hell, Noveske even laser etches a little white Noveske logo over the upper/lower seam to permanently mark many of their factory complete rifles.

ap3572001
09-27-2009, 4:00 PM
So for example a factory build RRA lower and also Factory build RRA upper , that were bought and put together are somehow different from a rifle in THE SAME configuration that left the factory as complete gun? How are they different?

missiontrails
09-27-2009, 4:05 PM
So for example a factory build RRA lower and also Factory build RRA upper , that were bought and put together are somehow different from a rifle in THE SAME configuration that left the factory as complete gun? How are they different?

That is still DIY build. Besides, someone on the inside told me that RRA fits, or hand selects their uppers and lowers on their complete rifles. Bottom line, if it leaves the factory with one barcode for everything, it's a rifle, more than one barcode, it's PARTS.

swerv512
09-27-2009, 4:08 PM
That is still DIY build. Besides, someone on the inside told me that RRA fits, or hand selects their uppers and lowers on their complete rifles. Bottom line, if it leaves the factory with one barcode for everything, it's a rifle, more than one barcode, it's PARTS.

^^^
+1...
Factory will verify whether purchase was made as a complete rifle (1 serial number) versus parts (upper and lower marked different...)

technique
09-27-2009, 4:09 PM
So for example a factory build RRA lower and also Factory build RRA upper , that were bought and put together are somehow different from a rifle in THE SAME configuration that left the factory as complete gun? How are they different?

I just explained that to you above....

If you were RRA would you warranty a DIY build?

ap3572001
09-27-2009, 4:13 PM
I guess my question was wrong. What mean is , as far as function goes, is it BETTER to buy a complete rifle? Will i know the difference in any way? ( Other than resale.)

technique
09-27-2009, 4:16 PM
Its not better or worse...its up to you what you wanna do.

Just a word of caution with building a complete RRA AR....be sure you are not building one that my be a listed configuration on the Kasler list (http://www.ag.ca.gov/firearms/infobuls/kaslist.pdf)

missiontrails
09-27-2009, 4:16 PM
I guess my question was wrong. What mean is , as far as function goes, is it BETTER to buy a complete rifle? Will i know the difference in any way? ( Other than resale.)

Right now there are so many complete rifles available, why build, unless you are doing something ultra special. Buy a good quality rifle, and many have lifetime warranties. What are you looking for, size, price?

ap3572001
09-27-2009, 4:18 PM
I know about RRA list. By the way, how does RRA quality compares to other brand name makers?

missiontrails
09-27-2009, 4:19 PM
You keep mentioning RRA, something like this:http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=1545 ???

technique
09-27-2009, 4:19 PM
I know about RRA list. By the way, how does RRA quality compares to other brand name makers?

what style are you going for?

missiontrails
09-27-2009, 4:20 PM
Or somehing like the CMMG in this picture: http://www.marksarmory.com/50701.html

ap3572001
09-27-2009, 4:22 PM
I really like Mid-length chrome lined.

osis32
09-27-2009, 4:22 PM
a lot of companies also warranty their uppers only. if you build up your own lower usually fixing it yourself isnt too expensive or labor intensive so if you wanna save on tax (which is outrageous here) you might want to consider building your own and buying a complete upper.

ap3572001
09-27-2009, 4:24 PM
So what would be the VERY best 16" FACTORY build rifle available to us in CA???

technique
09-27-2009, 4:33 PM
So what would be the VERY best 16" FACTORY build rifle available to us in CA???

for a middy

BCM
Noveske
CMMG

maybe a few others.

technique
09-27-2009, 4:35 PM
Saber defense is another great middy!

missiontrails
09-27-2009, 4:41 PM
Your budget is what matters, because if price is not an issue, Technique said what needs to be said. If price matters, then CMMG all the way. I have turned into a bit of a CMMG "Homer."

dieselpower
09-27-2009, 5:11 PM
By building the firearm you can take your time and build it slowly. Some people want a warranty, others want to know every part. The $$ is about the same, sometimes less, sometimes more.

I will never buy a complete AR15 again. I see no reason for it. If I have $900 I can buy all the parts and build it in less then 1 afternoon. If I have $100 a pay check, I can build it over time

IsaacGlass
09-27-2009, 11:41 PM
Take your pick?


http://www.lewismachine.net/images/product/CQBPS16.jpg
http://www.lewismachine.net/product.php?p=188&cid=12&session=371b9fa8d7240eeb92680d88b852bb80

http://www.lwrci.com/portals/0/Products/m6a2/M6A2_10smll.jpg
http://www.lwrci.com/Products/M6A2/tabid/70/Default.aspx

http://noveskerifleworks.com/imimg/r-lcbv-556_1a.jpg
http://noveskerifleworks.com/cgi-bin/imcart/display.cgi?item_id=r-lcbv-556&cat=47&page=1&search=&since=&status=

http://www.sigsauer.com/upFiles/catalog/product/556ER-Detail-R.jpg
http://www.sigsauer.com/Products/ShowCatalogProductDetails.aspx?categoryid=35&productid=247


http://www.robarm.com/images/XCR%20Accessories/XCR_Fiixed.jpg
http://www.robarm.com/products.asp?cat=10

I can build my own AR but rather buy factory built rifles new or used.