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BigBamBoo
09-09-2009, 9:26 AM
............

freonr22
09-09-2009, 9:39 AM
" i will lock and load and be on the front lines"

1911su16b870
09-09-2009, 9:39 AM
No other flag should fly over ole glory... :mad:

5150Marcelo
09-09-2009, 9:39 AM
IBTL!

:D

The Wingnut
09-09-2009, 9:43 AM
Yet again, National Socialism painted as a horse of a different color. Mussolini is grinning at Hitler in hell.

My blood boils at the sight, but it's his first amendment right, and he fought for it. Were it any other flag - or rather, symbol - would he really be getting press?

BigBamBoo
09-09-2009, 10:01 AM
..............

tgriffin
09-09-2009, 10:18 AM
I fully agree, granted you're in the United States. However, I think he has a really good point. Flags are just materialistic items...what we should be concerned about is the direction of our country and the way the government is treating its people. If the symbolism of a swastika over a United States flag upside down bothers you, then the reality of fascism and communism overtaking our republic should really be of concern.

+1 I agree.

BlackDrop50
09-09-2009, 10:24 AM
I haven't read the story but it doesn't look like a swastika but the native american symbol for "good luck" or "well being" especially with the birds around it. The symbol has been used by many other cultures and the nazis twisted it and used it backwards for evil.


The news story is also not working for me, goes to another story.

BigBamBoo
09-09-2009, 10:31 AM
.............

Flopper
09-09-2009, 10:38 AM
I haven't read the story but it doesn't look like a swastika but the native american symbol for "good luck" or "well being" especially with the birds around it. The symbol has been used by many other cultures and the nazis twisted it and used it backwards for evil.


Many cultures and religions used the swastika in the same orientation as the nazis; Hitler didn't reverse it.

Also, I'm not defending Nazism in the slightest, but the explanation that Hitler twisted the Swastika backwards "for evil" is overly simplistic. Hitler didn't think he was evil. He thought he was saving his race.

He appropriated the swastika from the cultures that his anthropologists studied in Asia, including Tibet, where they "determined" his Aryan race originated.

And those birds encircling the swastika don't look like doves or any other birds which represent peace. They look like the eagles that secondarily represented the Third Reich, and by extension Nazism.

Alaric
09-09-2009, 10:41 AM
The guy flying it is not well informed. He calls it "a symbol of communism" that we should get used to. Uh, nope, sorry. The swastika was a symbol of the Nazi party. Far-right nationalists, and about as opposite from commies as you can get.

As for his right to fly it, sure go right ahead. It's his land. But he is offending a lot of people by using such symbolism to make his statement.

pmrtruck
09-09-2009, 10:42 AM
I fully agree, granted you're in the United States. However, I think he has a really good point. Flags are just materialistic items...what we should be concerned about is the direction of our country and the way the government is treating its people. If the symbolism of a swastika over a United States flag upside down bothers you, then the reality of fascism and communism overtaking our republic should really be of concern.

Why is it that too many people have no clue what is going on in today's political world.
They will react to "drama" but the "drama" is never presented properly and the couch potatoes do absolutely NO research yet will come up with complaints which really have little relevance to the presented "drama"...

Lots of good issues are destroyed and bastardized due to illogical arguments.

Republicans tout what they are doing...Look At Us!
Democrats tout what the Republicans are doing WRONG!

If I argued like the Democrats I could NEVER be proven wrong. All I state are facts. (after all, it is easier to pick out someones flaws, human nature).

If I argued like the Republicans, my ego would not allow me to have a connection with my constituents. I would be weakened.

Well, maybe we are getting what we deserve...

God, I hope not.

bwiese
09-09-2009, 10:50 AM
The guy flying it is not well informed. He calls it "a symbol of communism" that we should get used to. Uh, nope, sorry. The swastika was a symbol of the Nazi party. Far-right nationalists, and about as opposite from commies as you can get.

As for his right to fly it, sure go right ahead. It's his land. But he is offending a lot of people by using such symbolism to make his statement.

Yup. Nutjob.

ANY flag above the US flag boils my blood.

And my (late) dad has flak in his leg and dead B17 crewmates from the home of that swastika. I don't think this idiot has the balls to meet a WWII vet, they dispatched the real thing and then have to put up with the amateur loons.

Not gonna waste my time watching the video.

POLICESTATE
09-09-2009, 10:50 AM
It is true that people do get the government they deserve. It is incumbent on the citizens of any country to change their government if they don't like it. Of course they need to do this through peaceful and lawful means, but once those are exhausted and that government is tyrannical (which it would be if it ignores the people) then any option is on the table.

This was exactly how our nation was formed in the first place. We tried to reason with George III, we tried everything we could and all he did was crap on us. Well not much you can do about that but fight. Freedom is worth fighting for after all. If people don't want to fight for their freedom then they don't deserve it.

The Wingnut
09-09-2009, 10:55 AM
It IS a Third Reich flag, or rather, what may be a 'fantasy' piece. It shares elements of several other Third Reich flags, but I haven't the time to track it down specifically.

It bears the most resemblance to Adolf Hitler's personal flag (http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/de1935ah.html):

http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/images/d/de1935ah.gif

GrizzlyGuy
09-09-2009, 10:59 AM
Good for him, he fought for his right to do that and now he's exercising that right. But without watching the video, it would be real easy for people to jump to the wrong conclusion about his background and motives.

Good for the news crew, they understood that Ole Glory flying upside down means distress and not disrespect. I'll bet that 98% of the population get that wrong.

If he raised up an 'Obama = Socialist' T-shirt along with the flags, people might better comprehend his point. Most people don't seem to comprehend that our republic is in danger, and the danger comes from our own politicians.

odysseus
09-09-2009, 11:23 AM
The guy is a tool and ignorant.

First if he is a patriot he should respect our flag better.

Second he is an idiot for saying this is about making a point that our country is steering towards communism. The whole thing reeks of stupidity.

Why he chose this flag, who knows more but him. Certainly though he will bring unto himself accusations of being a neo nazi, and for good reason as his excuses are feeble.

Kid Stanislaus
09-09-2009, 11:43 AM
Oh well, fruitcakes abound.

PatriotnMore
09-09-2009, 11:51 AM
His points are valid, his methods are poor. I think we will see more people reaching their respective limits with this government, if government continues down the current path.

People are getting fed up.

Lex Arma
09-09-2009, 12:20 PM
The flag symbolism is provocative, disturbing and tasteless.

He is right about one thing though, one of the most dangerous myths out there is that fascism is the opposite of communism. They are both death to freedom, cloaked in different uniforms. The continuum is liberty at one end and complete state control of your life on the other.

To the extent that we keep the meter pegged closer to liberty, we will enjoy prosperity, health, security and freedom. The labels on the other side (communism, socialism, fascism, etc....) don't really matter.

pmrtruck
09-09-2009, 12:27 PM
Comp^2

So True!

With the internet, I have uncovered things; made connections where there appeared to be none; and most importantly discovered things I thought to be one way, turn out to be another way.

I can usually discover things in less than 10 minutes on the internet. Although I do need to put down the TV remote.

I was skeptical about Al Gore's internet way back in the 80's.

Turns out I was wrong.

Way to go AL...Now if he would just keep going.

VOTE THEM ALL OUT IN 2010!

xrMike
09-09-2009, 12:37 PM
Video...


takes...


too...

Dirk Tungsten
09-09-2009, 12:45 PM
He is right about one thing though, one of the most dangerous myths out there is that fascism is the opposite of communism.



Wow. While I respect and appreciate the work you do on behalf of the 2nd amendment, I have to say I'm dissapointed to see someone so well respected as yourself repeating this.

I don't know where this (the idea Communism and Fascism are the same thing)got started, but the historical revisionism and ignorance of political philosophy necessary to make this equivocation seem to be picking up steam in the past few years.

The two ideologies are complete polar opposites, as Fascism is at it's core a repudiation of the pricipals that underpin both liberal democracy and Socialism/Communism. One need only pick up any of the primary sources, paticularly The Doctrine of Facism by Benito Mussolini or even Mein Kampf to see, in the words of some of the movements founders, what they are about. I highly recommend these works, particularly the Mussolini one, to anyone interested the subject. Almost all Fascist literature contains an element of the rejection of democratic ideals, parties and practices, as well as a strong rebuke of Communism in both theory and practice.

On the other side of the coin, anti-fascism is a strong recurring theme in Socialist lit from the 1930's unitl present. Yes, formal facist parties do continue to exist even today, some gaining parlimentary seats in several european countries. To sum up, both ideologies do still have adherents, both are still doing pretty well around the world, and both represent a threat to democracy and capitalism.

Don, this wasn't meant to pick on you, but to see someone as intellegent and well educated as yourself make the mistake to conflating the two ideologies was disapointing (i've come to expect it from the peanut gallery). I guess I'm gonna need to find someone else to represent me, god forbid. :no:

Edit: Guy in video is an idiot, and LOL "iraqi veteran". Really, news guy?

pretz
09-09-2009, 1:17 PM
Hey......someone watched the video! See how a picture alone can stir up the masses...or how it can be used to steer people in a certain direction?

Take care,Stan

This guy is making a political statement, as is his right. It is inflamatory, disrespectful, controversial, and certainly not how I would display our flag, but I see his point.

I am more upset over our ersatz 9/11 patriots who buy a Chinese made flag (which may not even be accurate) from a store owned by a French business, fly it from their Japanese car, fueled by Arabian oil. And they don't bother spending five minutes on the internet to find the proper and respectful manner of displaying our flag! In short time, these flags become soiled and tattered, and are never retired in the proper fashion.

odysseus
09-09-2009, 1:33 PM
You are correct on your points regarding the Fascist movement and the historical Marxism/Communist theory. However the intersection people connect the two together is that in actual practice, they both are oligarchies that submitted their people to horrific state controlled government, and Communists acted/act as fascists in practice. How else can you control a people, when human nature is wholly directed for individual rights to property and control of one's labor? Theories aside, the actual practice on the street has many similarities. East Germany and the Stasi are good examples of such an amalgamation.

Note of trivia because life is interesting: Before Hitler purged those members, the early National Socialist movement and party did contain leadership that were supportive of communism. A lot of early Nazi motivation towards organized labor movements, angst against the wealthy "bourgeois", and calls for nationalized socialism were from the same garden as marxist thought. The early separation of the two were largely racist as Germans did not have any love for the racial groups of slavic nations, and what they felt was "jewism" in eastern europe. Of course by the time Hitler came on the scene and took control of the the party, much of it evolved into a corrupt oligarchy of fascism and central party wealth accumulation.

However I seriously doubt that this character in the video understands any of that.

I don't know where this (the idea Communism and Fascism are the same thing)got started, but the historical revisionism and ignorance of political philosophy necessary to make this equivocation seem to be picking up steam in the past few years.

ojisan
09-09-2009, 1:57 PM
Duuuhh....Commies....duuuhh...hammer and sword...duuuhh...or somethin'...
http://i277.photobucket.com/albums/kk63/dakotalamoureaux/image056.gif

JerryM
09-09-2009, 2:15 PM
Hey...

Leave this poor guy alone.

I suspect he is not going to his mandated PTSD treatment program.

With free time on his hands, he decided to downgrade our flag under some Nazi Fanboi made in china flag.

But this method got him TV time for sure. Right or wrong he got in the news.

bridgeport
09-09-2009, 2:31 PM
Read some of Joseph Campbell's work on mythology and symbolism. Very powerful stuff.

SwissFluCase
09-09-2009, 2:36 PM
The problem that I have is that the US flag is the symbol of the US People. It is not the mark of our government. The Great Seal is the mark of our government, and he should be disrespecting *that*.

Regards,


SwissFluCase

Texas Boy
09-09-2009, 2:46 PM
I thought the news story was very well done - they pointed out that the upside down flag was a symbol of distress, and that the Nazi flag was associated with fascism not communism. I also liked the interview with his neighbor (also a veteran) who basically said he didn't like it, but it was free speech and he supported the guys right to do so, even if he didn't agree with him.

The guy obviously understands how to get attention and start people talking - unfortunately he has no clue how to capitalize on it. In his interviews (or at least the sections shown) he says he is upset with the direction the government is going and how they are failing to take care of veterans and elderly - but he fails to back up his claims or give examples. He might as well just say "the government sucks".

The display does a good job creating controversy, but a poor job conveying his message. Yeah, the upside down flag made it clear he thought the US was in trouble - but I never would have guessed he thought we were becoming socialist.

God Bless The Mauser
09-09-2009, 2:51 PM
LOL, he seriously thinks it stands for Communism? I don't think Nazis hated anything more than Communism, not even the Jews and they hated them pretty bad.

socal2310
09-09-2009, 2:54 PM
The two ideologies are complete polar opposites, as Fascism is at it's core a repudiation of the pricipals that underpin both liberal democracy and Socialism/Communism. One need only pick up any of the primary sources, paticularly The Doctrine of Facism by Benito Mussolini or even Mein Kampf to see, in the words of some of the movements founders, what they are about. I highly recommend these works, particularly the Mussolini one, to anyone interested the subject. Almost all Fascist literature contains an element of the rejection of democratic ideals, parties and practices, as well as a strong rebuke of Communism in both theory and practice..

Fascism explicitly rejects the idea of individual liberty while Communism merely abandons it when politically expedient. I will grant that, academically, they are very different animals. Practically speaking however...

Ryan

odysseus
09-09-2009, 3:04 PM
LOL, he seriously thinks it stands for Communism? I don't think Nazis hated anything more than Communism, not even the Jews and they hated them pretty bad.

Let's refine that a little more, since I am in this mood to.

Nazi's were more against Bolsheviks than say all merits of marxism. Especially in its earlier times. They hated them due to more historical racial divides as well throughout eastern Europe. They felt that Communism represented in eastern europe was also a product of "jewism". Ironic since jewish culture was also largely capitalistic.

One has to keep significantly in mind when talking about the Nazis is the motivation of the "Third Reich" and the racial identity and movement deeply involved. You cannot separate this from their political ideology nor their international relations. Nationalism and Socialism based on a racial identity of a German led society that was to be the overall owner of Europe and eventually the world as Fascism would become the dominate world power.

Another interesting point largely ignored in these discussions: Nazi's, as official ideology, did not like capitalism either. They also hated America's market driven economy and drive for wealth. They hated the individualism capitalism is a part of, and often Hitler prophesied of our (USA) soon (in his world) demise because of it.

chris
09-09-2009, 4:36 PM
His points are valid, his methods are poor. I think we will see more people reaching their respective limits with this government, if government continues down the current path.

People are getting fed up.

yes people are getting sick of the crap from this state and DC as well. 2010 is not far off. time to vote the turds out and flush them down the toilet.

Harley Quinn
09-09-2009, 4:47 PM
Seeing the flags, is a reminder that America, is in distress.

Hitler was a socialist:

http://constitutionalistnc.tripod.com/hitler-leftist/id9.html

Some mention

KylaGWolf
09-09-2009, 5:04 PM
Quite frankly while yes the guy has the right to his freedom of speech hes an idiot. First off NO flag should fly over the US flag in our country period. Second to use a symbol that represents to many what is hatred is even worse. Now the reason it bothers me is due to the fact that someone close to me survived Hitlers so called solution. She lost everyone else in her family EVERYONE.

Now you may think that is drama but quite frankly I think YOU wanted the drama in posting that link. And do you really think that the anti-gun people will not jump on this video and use it to their advantage. I can almost guarantee they will milk this for all its worth. Look the gun guy is a racist. Look the gun guy agrees with Hilters views even if it is the furthest thing from the truth.

Hunt
09-09-2009, 5:40 PM
Hey......someone watched the video! See how a picture alone can stir up the masses...or how it can be used to steer people in a certain direction?

Take care,Stan

or bait, don't trust these criminals in office now

Satex
09-09-2009, 6:29 PM
The guy is a moron, but it's within his right to be one. The swastika in his flag does refer to the Nazi party especially given the Nazi emblems surrounding it. Not only that, but the Nazis had nothing to do with the communists. As a matter of fact, Hitler despised the communists and considered them to be a danger. So not only is he a moron, but also uneducated.

To those that jump and claim that the swastika is a symbol of prosperity I say nonsense. Yes, the swastika was used in the past by African tribes as a symbol of prosperity, but WWII has transformed the meaning of the symbol to something much darker. So its meaning is what everyone interprets it to mean.

odysseus
09-09-2009, 10:31 PM
To those that jump and claim that the swastika is a symbol of prosperity I say nonsense. Yes, the swastika was used in the past by African tribes as a symbol of prosperity, but WWII has transformed the meaning of the symbol to something much darker.

The "swastika" as a form has a long history - and yes an occult meaning for the short lived Hitler's Nazi movement. However it is currently still in use today by Buddhist and Hindus in India, China, Japan, USA, etc. So Hitler's use of it doesn't detract from them in their use of it (though usually in an opposite direction) - so don't be offended when you see them use it in their religious temples, cemeteries, and such - they have had long claim of it before and after WWII.

Theseus
09-09-2009, 10:56 PM
To me a flag is nothing more than a piece of fabric. It is far more important to actually preserve our nation and the the spirit that is our nation than a piece of fabric that represents our nation.

I forget where I was attacked, but I believe it was OCDO when I mentioned that I would help protect someone that was burning the flag against those who would seek to do them harm.

Burn it all you want, as long as you respect the ideals that permit the burning.

steelrain82
09-09-2009, 11:29 PM
not my flag! it may just be a piece of fabric but way to many people have died and spilled their blood for that piece of fabric.

ivanimal
09-09-2009, 11:52 PM
The message is good when he interviews, but I would slap his face for flying ANY flag over ours. I don't care who he is or what the result would be. He is in for some pain.

Alaric
09-10-2009, 12:10 AM
The message is good when he interviews, but I would slap his face for flying ANY flag over ours. I don't care who he is or what the result would be. He is in for some pain.

It's a flag Ivanimal. A piece of fabric, a symbol. Does his expression of free speech offend you so much that you seriously want to assault the man?

Even if you don't agree with the message, you have to respect the right to convey it. More pointedly, even if you disagree with the means to convey the message you have to respect the right to convey it.

Palimino Stripe
09-10-2009, 12:35 AM
"The things that the flag stands for were created by the experiences of a great people. Everything that it stands for was written by their lives. The flag is the embodiment not of sentiment, but of history." -Woodrow Wilson

Seesm
09-10-2009, 12:55 AM
Not too pumped on that flag on top... bad deal.

ivanimal
09-10-2009, 1:14 AM
It's a flag Ivanimal. A piece of fabric, a symbol. Does his expression of free speech offend you so much that you seriously want to assault the man?

YES

Even if you don't agree with the message, you have to respect the right to convey it. More pointedly, even if you disagree with the means to convey the message you have to respect the right to convey it.
And passionate Americans will show him how they feel.


People have died so that no one would fly another flag over it on our soil. If I seem a little over reactive to you we may have a different view of the situation. He has the right to express his opinion. He may get a nosefull if he does it in front of me.

Theseus
09-10-2009, 1:17 AM
not my flag! it may just be a piece of fabric but way to many people have died and spilled their blood for that piece of fabric.
I disagree. . . Many have died and spilled their blood for what the flag represents.

To me it would be tragic that someone would be willing to die for the fabric and not the ideals for which said fabric represents.

fourdoorchevelle
09-10-2009, 4:58 AM
Wow. While I respect and appreciate the work you do on behalf of the 2nd amendment, I have to say I'm dissapointed to see someone so well respected as yourself repeating this.

I don't know where this (the idea Communism and Fascism are the same thing)got started, but the historical revisionism and ignorance of political philosophy necessary to make this equivocation seem to be picking up steam in the past few years.

The two ideologies are complete polar opposites, as Fascism is at it's core a repudiation of the pricipals that underpin both liberal democracy and Socialism/Communism. One need only pick up any of the primary sources, paticularly The Doctrine of Facism by Benito Mussolini or even Mein Kampf to see, in the words of some of the movements founders, what they are about. I highly recommend these works, particularly the Mussolini one, to anyone interested the subject. Almost all Fascist literature contains an element of the rejection of democratic ideals, parties and practices, as well as a strong rebuke of Communism in both theory and practice.

On the other side of the coin, anti-fascism is a strong recurring theme in Socialist lit from the 1930's unitl present. Yes, formal facist parties do continue to exist even today, some gaining parlimentary seats in several european countries. To sum up, both ideologies do still have adherents, both are still doing pretty well around the world, and both represent a threat to democracy and capitalism.

Don, this wasn't meant to pick on you, but to see someone as intellegent and well educated as yourself make the mistake to conflating the two ideologies was disapointing (i've come to expect it from the peanut gallery). I guess I'm gonna need to find someone else to represent me, god forbid. :no:

Edit: Guy in video is an idiot, and LOL "iraqi veteran". Really, news guy?

no he got it right

In the sense of oligarchy vs freedom

DioQooFIcgE

Old Timer
09-10-2009, 5:24 AM
I would slap his face for flying ANY flag over ours. I don't care who he is or what the result would be. He is in for some pain.Hmmm. You might have some problem there. With the entire US Navy! "When it is displayed from the same flagpole with another flag - of a state, community, society or Scout unit - the flag of the United States must always be at the top except that the church pennant may be flown above the flag during church services for Navy personnel when conducted by a Naval chaplain on a ship at sea." (From Flag Etiquette, STANDARDS of RESPECT, www.usflag.org)

:)

Old Timer
09-10-2009, 5:32 AM
Does his expression of free speech offend you so much that you seriously want to assault the man?Excellent point! I am an old soldier. I have, literally, given my pound of flesh to protect and defend the rights we, as free citizens of the United States of America, enjoy. And that includes the right, no matter how reprehensible I find it to be, to burn or otherwise show disrespect for the flag (1st Amendment right).

It always amazes me how the RKBA community screams loudly about our rights but so many of us refuse to defend the rights of others. Is it any wonder they won't support our 2nd Amendment rights when we threaten them with bodily harm for exercising their 1st Amendment rights? :(

pretz
09-10-2009, 1:12 PM
Hmmm. You might have some problem there. With the entire US Navy! "When it is displayed from the same flagpole with another flag - of a state, community, society or Scout unit - the flag of the United States must always be at the top except that the church pennant may be flown above the flag during church services for Navy personnel when conducted by a Naval chaplain on a ship at sea." (From Flag Etiquette, STANDARDS of RESPECT, www.usflag.org)

:)

Thank you! Thank you! Thank you! One thousand times over, Thanks!

Anyone who claims to respect our flag should use the link that Old Timer has provided.

TaxAnnihilator
09-10-2009, 1:36 PM
Well put. Makes sense to defend them all or eventually lose them all.

I do take issue with people saying that you have to respect what others are saying even if you disagree. Respect is earned not freely given. Prove you have integrity and are worthy of respect.

A better way of saying respect what they are saying is to respect the right so many have died for, which enables him to freely make his statement.

It always amazes me how the RKBA community screams loudly about our rights but so many of us refuse to defend the rights of others. Is it any wonder they won't support our 2nd Amendment rights when we threaten them with bodily harm for exercising their 1st Amendment rights? :(

Lex Arma
09-10-2009, 3:48 PM
Wow. While I respect and appreciate the work you do on behalf of the 2nd amendment, I have to say I'm dissapointed to see someone so well respected as yourself repeating this.

I don't know where this (the idea Communism and Fascism are the same thing)got started, but the historical revisionism and ignorance of political philosophy necessary to make this equivocation seem to be picking up steam in the past few years.

The two ideologies are complete polar opposites, as Fascism is at it's core a repudiation of the pricipals that underpin both liberal democracy and Socialism/Communism. One need only pick up any of the primary sources, paticularly The Doctrine of Facism by Benito Mussolini or even Mein Kampf to see, in the words of some of the movements founders, what they are about. I highly recommend these works, particularly the Mussolini one, to anyone interested the subject. Almost all Fascist literature contains an element of the rejection of democratic ideals, parties and practices, as well as a strong rebuke of Communism in both theory and practice.

On the other side of the coin, anti-fascism is a strong recurring theme in Socialist lit from the 1930's unitl present. Yes, formal facist parties do continue to exist even today, some gaining parlimentary seats in several european countries. To sum up, both ideologies do still have adherents, both are still doing pretty well around the world, and both represent a threat to democracy and capitalism.

Don, this wasn't meant to pick on you, but to see someone as intellegent and well educated as yourself make the mistake to conflating the two ideologies was disapointing (i've come to expect it from the peanut gallery). I guess I'm gonna need to find someone else to represent me, god forbid. :no:

Edit: Guy in video is an idiot, and LOL "iraqi veteran". Really, news guy?

Thank you for criticizing my post, allow me to return the favor.

I went back and read my post. I didn't say communism and fascism were the same thing. I said, with respect to liberty, they were both dangerous. I also said, with respect to freedom, that they were NOT opposites.

You suggested a book to me, let me recommend one to you: Liberal Fascism by Jonah Goldberg.

Two final points:

(1) Do you really care if the mob taking your property and standing you up against a wall before a firing squad is waiving a flag with a swastika or hammer/sickle? Will being able to distinguish the political philosophy of your murderers give you some comfort? [BTW, I have a degree in political science, with a minor in political philosophy, go back and read your Plato, Hume, Rousseau, Kant, Schopenhauer, Hitler, Mussolini, Nietzsche, Marx, Engels -- you will find that communism and fascism do indeed share a common root. An irrational worship of the collective.]

(2) I don't usually require my clients to take a political test before I represent them. Of course my clients may propose any (legal) terms they want before contracting my services. If you don't want me to represent you based on some perceived differences in political philosophy that is your prerogative. I would hope that you would reconsider that decision in the event you actually need my expertise and allow me to persuade you that I am intelligent and well educated.

Lifeofahero
09-10-2009, 4:22 PM
Good for him, he fought for his right to do that and now he's exercising that right. But without watching the video, it would be real easy for people to jump to the wrong conclusion about his background and motives.

Good for the news crew, they understood that Ole Glory flying upside down means distress and not disrespect. I'll bet that 98% of the population get that wrong.

If he raised up an 'Obama = Socialist' T-shirt along with the flags, people might better comprehend his point. Most people don't seem to comprehend that our republic is in danger, and the danger comes from our own politicians.

I agree. His intention is valid but his execution is bad. People will take it as a sign of disrespect vs. a warning that our republic is in danger.

Shotgun Man
09-10-2009, 4:27 PM
[...]

Don, this wasn't meant to pick on you, but to see someone as intellegent and well educated as yourself make the mistake to conflating the two ideologies was disapointing (i've come to expect it from the peanut gallery). I guess I'm gonna need to find someone else to represent me, god forbid. :no:

Edit: Guy in video is an idiot, and LOL "iraqi veteran". Really, news guy?

I would run from any client who appears to be prone to exhibiting such dramatics over an ill-founded, non-consequential, semantic distinction.

Lex Arma never equated communism and facism. He merely said that they are not opposites.

He did however equate the two in terms of them being menacing to freedom. He did that forcefully and articulately.

He sounds like he'd be a good lawyer.

Harley Quinn
09-10-2009, 5:31 PM
The guy is a moron, but it's within his right to be one. The swastika in his flag does refer to the Nazi party especially given the Nazi emblems surrounding it. Not only that, but the Nazis had nothing to do with the communists. As a matter of fact, Hitler despised the communists and considered them to be a danger. So not only is he a moron, but also uneducated.

To those that jump and claim that the swastika is a symbol of prosperity I say nonsense. Yes, the swastika was used in the past by African tribes as a symbol of prosperity, but WWII has transformed the meaning of the symbol to something much darker. So its meaning is what everyone interprets it to mean.

True, the Indians (India) used it also, but as mentioned now it is hooked up to very bad vibes...

Here is a good read:

http://history1900s.about.com/cs/swastika/a/swastikahistory.htm

Regards

bomb_on_bus
09-10-2009, 5:47 PM
I wonder if anyone has thought about getting the NLR, KKK, AB and the like to actually back the president. If all the hate groups backed him that could be a surefire way to get the public opinion down to the point that they throw him out of office.

AEC1
09-10-2009, 6:31 PM
Everyone is hammering this guy. I think he is awesome. He is not demeaning our national ensign at all. He is displaying it properly. Upside down to show the distress that the union is in. I 100% agree America is in distress.

The source of our distress? Fascists. I am not educated. I am a mere high school grad who has spent my life in defense of this nation.

I say facisism is the right term for what we are going through. I don’t see the current political power to be socialist. They are fascist. Why do I say that? Well from what I understand socialism to be, is that we all work for the common good and no one has more then the other.

Fascist is the advancement of what group of people on the backs of all others.

Does anyone really think Boxer is going to give up her jet and live like us? Is she going to tap her fortune for you? What about Pelosi? Clinton? Dingle? Reed? Kennedy? I don’t think so.

This man is 100% right. America is in distresses, symbolized by the National Ensign being upside down. The source of our distress is sitting on our heads beating us; see it is right there on top of us, Fascists.

I know that NAZI flag is seen in distaste. So what. It is about time that freedom loving Americans got good and pissed off. It is about time someone made us uncomfortable.

So what if the left uses this against us. We need to stop placating these people. Don’t be scared of being called a name. Get angry, get pissed.

I am.

Who thinks Thomas Payne, and George Washington and Sam Adams cared what the British called them. I am so thankful that 230 years or so ago, there were men that were not afraid of a label. There were men that were willing to risk everything they had, not only money and property, but their lives, their family’s lives and all their friend lives for freedom.

My prayer is that there are still men like this one, which are willing not only to be called names like we have done here, but to die for this nation. If there are none left I fear that this nation is already dead.

I WANT MY FREEDOM LOVING COUNTRY BACK!!!

fullrearview
09-10-2009, 6:35 PM
I fully agree, granted you're in the United States. However, I think he has a really good point. Flags are just materialistic items...what we should be concerned about is the direction of our country and the way the government is treating its people. If the symbolism of a swastika over a United States flag upside down bothers you, then the reality of fascism and communism overtaking our republic should really be of concern.

+1

Many people have died for his right to do that, and if that pisses people off they should be outraged at the administrations agenda!

Sgt Raven
09-10-2009, 6:50 PM
Thank you for criticizing my post, allow me to return the favor.

I went back and read my post. I didn't say communism and fascism were the same thing. I said, with respect to liberty, they were both dangerous. I also said, with respect to freedom, that they were NOT opposites.

You suggested a book to me, let me recommend one to you: Liberal Fascism by Jonah Goldberg.

Two final points:

(1) Do you really care if the mob taking your property and standing you up against a wall before a firing squad is waiving a flag with a swastika or hammer/sickle? Will being able to distinguish the political philosophy of your murderers give you some comfort? [BTW, I have a degree in political science, with a minor in political philosophy, go back and read your Plato, Hume, Rousseau, Kant, Schopenhauer, Hitler, Mussolini, Nietzsche, Marx, Engels -- you will find that communism and fascism do indeed share a common root. An irrational worship of the collective.]

(2) I don't usually require my clients to take a political test before I represent them. Of course my clients may propose any (legal) terms they want before contracting my services. If you don't want me to represent you based on some perceived differences in political philosophy that is your prerogative. I would hope that you would reconsider that decision in the event you actually need my expertise and allow me to persuade you that I am intelligent and well educated.

:owned: :shock: :oops:

steelrain82
09-10-2009, 8:24 PM
I care what he does with the flag! it's fine that he has his freedom
of expression that's his right just like our 2nd. but what makes me mad is that flag over it. to me it's not about the Nazi flag it's the fact that it is above my flag that I like many have fought for and have friends that died for. at least he could have put it under our flag. I agree more with the country turning into a fascist state than a commie one.

Shotgun Man
09-10-2009, 8:28 PM
look I care what he does with the flag! it's fine that he has his frwedo
of expression that's his right just like our 2nd. but what makes me mad is that flag over it. to me it's not about the Nazi flag it's the fact that it is above my flag that I like many have fought for and have friends that died for. at least he could have put it under our flag. I agree more with the country turning into a fascist state than a commie one.

You lost me before "frwedo."

steelrain82
09-10-2009, 8:54 PM
haha I fixed it I meant freedom. stupid Iphone changing my words around. just like a politician. 2012 Iphone for prez

mmbasser
09-10-2009, 9:08 PM
I agree with those who said there is little difference between Commies and Fascists in a practical sense. In the end, liberty suffers, and who really cares what "they" call themselves?

I accept that some get pissed about flag protocol, and for some very good reasons. But, I think the more important point is that he is correct in portraying the sentiment that this country is in trouble. What gets me pissed the most is that the trouble is brewing from within, and it's not from just one political party but from both of the majors.

Who would argue that the previous administration enabled future admins to exploit the patriot act, if the Bushies didn’t? I’m not taking a position on whether they did use it nefariously, but I know I cannot trust any of them or the Dems!

Who would argue that the SCOTUS decision on eminent domain was in line with “American Principles as we know them”. I certainly don’t for either of the above examples.

We have a problem that needs to be addressed, and I think that is the main point!

ivanimal
09-11-2009, 12:56 AM
Hmmm. You might have some problem there. With the entire US Navy! "When it is displayed from the same flagpole with another flag - of a state, community, society or Scout unit - the flag of the United States must always be at the top except that the church pennant may be flown above the flag during church services for Navy personnel when conducted by a Naval chaplain on a ship at sea." (From Flag Etiquette, STANDARDS of RESPECT, www.usflag.org)

:)

I doubt the US navy flies the same flag as the OP. Thank you for the link.

Originally Posted by Old Timer View Post
It always amazes me how the RKBA community screams loudly about our rights but so many of us refuse to defend the rights of others. Is it any wonder they won't support our 2nd Amendment rights when we threaten them with bodily harm for exercising their 1st Amendment rights?

My reaction and feelings are mine. I will not apologize for them. I am sure more people feel as I do, than as he does. Does it make me right and him wrong? No. But I would do as I said I would if confronted. That is plain truth.

fourdoorchevelle
09-11-2009, 5:14 AM
But I would do as I said I would if confronted.

and thats what would make you wrong

Old Timer
09-11-2009, 7:03 AM
I doubt the US navy flies the same flag as the OP.Except that is not what you said, you said, " . . . for flying ANY flag over ours . . . " But I would do as I said I would if confronted. That is plain truth.You would commit a crime because you don't like somebody's point of view?

ivanimal
09-12-2009, 1:16 AM
Except that is not what you said, you said, " . . . for flying ANY flag over ours . . . " You would commit a crime because you don't like somebody's point of view?

I stand corrected. I am sorry I did not know of the Navy's rule. I think you get my point here.

I would do as I said it make no difference to me what you think or say. Just as I would go to the aid of a less fortunate person. I am no saint but I always try to do whats right.

Criminal or not.

In my point of view flying that flag above ours is criminal. I think I have made myself perfectly clear. Now leave me alone.

Harley Quinn
09-12-2009, 6:17 AM
I stand corrected. I am sorry I did not know of the Navy's rule. I think you get my point here.

I would do as I said it make no difference to me what you think or say. Just as I would go to the aid of a less fortunate person. I am no saint but I always try to do whats right.

Criminal or not.

In my point of view flying that flag above ours is criminal. I think I have made myself perfectly clear. Now leave me alone.

Backing criminals will get you into trouble, who makes the law? Many criminals have caused it to become case law...Opinions we all have them.

Regards

TripleT
09-12-2009, 7:19 AM
I could care less wtf his message is, even if I may completely agree with it. He lost me by the way he treated our flag. As others have said, that is wrong. Doesn't really matter what the message is after you've kicked every vet that has ever served in the ballz by disrespecting the flag...

gef
09-12-2009, 7:32 AM
The guy's an idiot, all people will see in the Nazi flag period.