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View Full Version : Glock 20 for first pistol?


nrakid88
07-18-2009, 11:34 AM
I have been shooting mostly a 1911 for a couple years, probably about 600 rounds of 45acp experience, and I am turning 21 soon. I plan on getting a glock 20 in 10mm, and reloading for it. 180 grains, 1280 fps, 661foot ppounds energy, 20 cents a round. I just wanted to know what you guys think. I like glock frames, they fit my hands better. And I dont think the recoil will be too much to get used to. Plus I can reload 10mm for cheaper that 9mm costs at the store. Anyone think this is a good or bad idea? Im not completely against getting a G17, but prefer a cartridge that will do its job. Plus I am thinking if I find the 10mm to be a little to much power, I can always down load it to FBI specs.

THT
07-18-2009, 11:36 AM
Have you shot one? If not, would suggest you shoot one before plunking down the cash for one. What are you planning on doing with it?

nrakid88
07-18-2009, 11:43 AM
I am planning on using it for target practice, carrying when I go camping or hiking, and HD.

nrakid88
07-18-2009, 11:45 AM
Ive shot a glock 21 too so I am thinking the two should be comparable. I dont know anyone with a glock 20, and I dont think any ranges around here rent them out.

Greg-Dawg
07-18-2009, 11:52 AM
Go for it.

sierrawoodsman
07-18-2009, 11:55 AM
There .40 S&W conversion barrels for it so you could shoot cheaper for target pratice. I would say go for it.

locosway
07-18-2009, 11:58 AM
http://lpfr.com/LPFR/Home.html has a Glock 20 for rent.

The 10mm is a superior round and you CAN get a .40 S&W barrel for the Glock 20 to switch between the two in a matter of seconds.

Also if you're reloading you can use most of the same equipment for the 10mm and the .40.

SJgunguy24
07-18-2009, 11:59 AM
I'd shoot one first. If you go with a 20 you can build a 45acp upper and just slap it on.

Z ME FLY
07-18-2009, 12:07 PM
First gun? Reloading? You can get a G20 if you want but you mention how cheap it was to reload. It would be even cheaper reloading a 9mm! I would suggest you go shoot a 10mm and see if you can handle the recoil. The recoil isn't that bad but you have to remember about follow up shots.

nrakid88
07-18-2009, 12:10 PM
First gun? Reloading? You can get a G20 if you want but you mention how cheap it was to reload. It would be even cheaper reloading a 9mm! I would suggest you go shoot a 10mm and see if you can handle the recoil. The recoil isn't that bad but you have to remember about follow up shots.

I would only be saving 6 cents a round for 9mm. I would rather pay six more cents a round for something that will put some hurt on what it hits. I will think about renting one first.

locosway
07-18-2009, 12:18 PM
I pick up my Glock 20 on Tuesday. Recoil can be changed by adding weight to the gun and running some lighter loads if you like.

If you're doing competition shooting then perhaps a 10mm isn't the round for you. Personally I like the round very much, and I'm going to try some amateur competitions with it. I also have the choice of going to a .40 S&W if I so choose just be switching the barrel.

If you've never shot a 10mm I'd suggest it. It's like a magnum for a semi-auto. That range I linked before said they have one for rent and the prices are reasonable.

D.R.E.
07-18-2009, 12:24 PM
I really like my G20, esp since you can convert to different calibers so easily. (E.g., I have barrels for 9x23, 9x25, 40, 357sig and a barsto for 10mm).

However, without a grip reduction many people find it awkward to hold. Also, 10mm is more expensive to load than it may seem --- if you shoot inside it's really hard to not lose a non trivial fraction of your cases with hot loads (they bounce everywhere).

I'd personally recommend a G35. It's very accurate. And once-fired 40 brass is dirt cheap (around $30 / 1000 last time I bought on GB) so it's no big deal if you lose 30% or more per range visit. Plus buying the initial 1,000 or 2,000 cases is not a small expense when you just got hit w/ the cost of the reloading equip.

You can swap in a barrel and hot load 357 sig to very close to the recoil of a 10mm if you want to work on your follow up shots under heavy recoil. Also you can probably hot load your 40 cases using IPSEC load data to close to what federal puts their 10mm at.

On the other hand the G20 will take the 50 GI conversion so that's pretty cool :43:

I'd recommend the dawson precision fiberoptic if you wind up going w/ a glock. Very nice sight picture.

nrakid88
07-18-2009, 12:31 PM
YEah, thats the only part of the 10mm I dont like, brass is going to be costly. But I do my shooting outdoors, so it shouldn't be too hard to find it all. I am pissed I missed midways once fired 10mm brass

locosway
07-18-2009, 12:34 PM
When are you planning on buying? I get mine on Tuesday and I'm in SCV/Valencia often because my aunt lives there. There's a range right there too.

D.R.E.
07-18-2009, 12:41 PM
YEah, thats the only part of the 10mm I dont like, brass is going to be costly. But I do my shooting outdoors, so it shouldn't be too hard to find it all. I am pissed I missed midways once fired 10mm brass

If you buy direct from starline its often cheaper. I've seen a bunch of auctions on gunbroker where once fired went for more than new.

Montana gold had good prices on 40 cal bullets.

I never shot 10mm out of my factory barrel. If it leaves a glock smile you might want to pick up a lone wolf barrel which will fully support the case. (Barsto barrels are great for 10mm, too, but more expensive.)

nrakid88
07-18-2009, 12:41 PM
Im still 2 and a half months away from being 21. i will pm you

D.R.E.
07-18-2009, 12:43 PM
Also, glocktalk's 10mm forum had a bunch of load data from Scott McNett (the guy who started double tap).


Those are pretty stout :43:

Cool thing about outside is that you can get a chrono and see the velocity effect of increasing powder.

nrakid88
07-18-2009, 12:51 PM
Yeah, I am thinking of chrono's, but I dont think I will get one till I get my 7mm RUM, haha, which is a few years down the road.

nrakid88
07-18-2009, 12:52 PM
Also I heard Double tap blends powders to get the 750 foot pound loads, so you can't really match those unless you really know what your doing

nrakid88
07-18-2009, 12:57 PM
[QUOTE=D.R.E.;2790441]If you buy direct from starline its often cheaper. I've seen a bunch of auctions on gunbroker where once fired went for more than new.

QUOTE]

WOw starline brass is way cheper than winchester. that will cut my loads to 18 cents

sammy
07-18-2009, 2:38 PM
I vote a big no if this is a first gun. You are starting from scratch and if you must have a center fire handgun a full size 9mm will help you develop good shooting habits. It is funny, when I go to the range with my G20 everyone wants to give it a go. An average shooter at 15 yards with a nice 6" group will normally on the first shot hit the target in the same fashion as the gun they were shooting. After they see what a hand full it is they are lucky to stay on paper in most cases. These are very decent shooters. They are just not use to the recoil (which is not terrible, just much sharper than they are use to). I am reloading for it but is not cheap and being a cautious reloader I throw out the cases after 4 loadings (the last reloading would be a lighter load 180g. bullet at about 1100fps). A Glock 9mm in any flavor is a *****cat in comparison. I vote for a G34 since we cannot CCW here in Ca. Long sight radius, great trigger and very competitive in USPSA and IDPA shooting. If I could only have one gun it would be a G34.

I am not saying you will not be able to shoot it. The odds are against you shooting it well as a first gun. I think you should find another calgunner here that will let you try one first. If you can put all 50 rounds in a 12" group at 15 yards it might work for you.

If you are in the Bay Area anytime let me know and I will be happy to let you shoot mine.


Hope this helps, Sammy

sammy
07-18-2009, 2:45 PM
YEah, thats the only part of the 10mm I dont like, brass is going to be costly. But I do my shooting outdoors, so it shouldn't be too hard to find it all. I am pissed I missed midways once fired 10mm brass

:smilielol5:

That is another thing. With the factory spring the cases make it out of orbit. I am running a 22# Wolf now and I am lucky to find half of them. With the heavier spring they go about 25' to the right and 5-10' back. At my local range that is no mans land. Odds are even worse at the National Forest I go to. With 15 miniutes of hunting there I get about 30% back. I normally bring a friend with me to track the brass in flight. It helps but still not a perfect system. Sammy

CSDGuy
07-18-2009, 3:08 PM
A Glock 20 with the 10mm FBI load (essentially .40 S&W) is a nice shooter. I normally shoot a G23 and it's not bad. Comparatively speaking, a G20 (I've shot one) is a much softer feeling pistol if you're using those FBI loads. Seriously! I had less felt recoil.

nrakid88
07-18-2009, 3:18 PM
Seems you know what your talking about. Damn... haha.

I vote a big no if this is a first gun. You are starting from scratch and if you must have a center fire handgun a full size 9mm will help you develop good shooting habits. It is funny, when I go to the range with my G20 everyone wants to give it a go. An average shooter at 15 yards with a nice 6" group will normally on the first shot hit the target in the same fashion as the gun they were shooting. After they see what a hand full it is they are lucky to stay on paper in most cases. These are very decent shooters. They are just not use to the recoil (which is not terrible, just much sharper than they are use to). I am reloading for it is not cheap and being a cautious reloader I throw out the cases after 4 loadings (the last reloading would be a lighter load 180g. bullet at about 1100fps).

I am not saying you will not be able to shoot it. The odds are against you shooting it well as a first gun. I think you should find another calgunner here that will let you try one first. If you can put all 50 rounds in a 12" group at 15 yards it might work for you.

If you are in the Bay Area anytime let me know and I will be happy to let you shoot mine.


Hope this helps, Sammy

nrakid88
07-18-2009, 3:25 PM
Actually you brought out a good point, recoil does affect accurracy...

sammy
07-18-2009, 3:35 PM
Actually you brought out a good point, recoil does affect accurracy...

You know, it is the anticipation of recoil that effects a shooters accuracy. The G20 in stock trim is superbly accurate. I got a KKM barrel to help preserve my brass and was surprised to find it not help my accuracy at all. As a matter of fact the best group I printed with my G20 was with the factory barrel. This group was at 15 yards using the KKM and my hand loads. Not great but I fight the dreaded flinch more with this gun than any of my other handguns.

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x183/carcrazysammy/007.jpg

nrakid88
07-18-2009, 4:20 PM
You actually have a good point. I don't want to work up a flinch. I think i will step down a caliber or two. I remember it took me a little bit to rid my mosin flinch I had acquired when that Russian rifle was all I could afford. I should dodge that bullet and start with a smaller caliber and work my way up huh?

locosway
07-18-2009, 4:33 PM
It's all in the training and practice. When my grandpa joined the Marines they handed him a M1911 and a M1. He was bruised all over from that 30-06, but over time with training you learn to use your tools.

I'm not saying that everyone should roll around with a .50 and just learn it, but the G20 can be loaded to "FBI" specs and you can even shoot .40's out of it. So, really, the G20 is very versatile with just a switch of the barrel (you don't even need a different mag or extractor).

I just bought the G20 knowing very well that a full power 10mm is very hard to control. However, I also know that I can use a lite load or even switch to a .40 if I like. So when I'm not trying to shoot someone through a bank vault I can run something liter if I like.

HowardW56
07-18-2009, 4:59 PM
I would only be saving 6 cents a round for 9mm. I would rather pay six more cents a round for something that will put some hurt on what it hits. I will think about renting one first.

Six cents a round adds up if you are serious about shooting... If you shoot regularly, 200 - 300 rounds a week is easy...

JeffMG
07-19-2009, 2:57 PM
A G20 wouldn't really be my first choice. Especially if you're new into handguns. The 10mm is not the easiest to control, especially on followup shots. Try shooting one before you buy to see how you like it first. But a G21 may be a better choice for you. Not to mention, the 10mm is sort of a dying round nowadays. Good luck with your first handgun purchase.

locosway
07-19-2009, 2:59 PM
A "lite" 10mm will have about the same recoil as the .45.

As for the 10mm dying, it's actually becoming more popular lately. There was a time when really no one had heard of it, but that's all changing.

JeffMG
07-19-2009, 3:13 PM
Things must be different here in CA but how is it gaining popularity and why? Sorry, I just moved here from AZ so I'm still adjusting here. But in AZ, the only people left using the 10mm are boar hunter and even that too is dying. It was a very popular round in the 80s, primarily designed for the FBI, but they soon found the full house loads a bit too much, so they loaded them "lite". Then the .40 was born, which had similar balistics as the 10mm lite. The .40 pretty much replaced the 10mm. So what's bringing the 10mm back around here?
If people are going to load them lite, why not just shoot a .40 or .45?

locosway
07-19-2009, 3:22 PM
More people are offering limited 10mm runs on their handguns. I also know of a few people who prefer them to other rounds, it just doesn't get covered in the popular gun magazines for some reason.

Why load it lite? For different reasons. HD would be a good reason, you don't want the round going through a few houses. Competitions are another reason, also getting to know the gun would be a good one.

The 10mm is nice because you DO have the option to either go lite or go big like a magnum out of the same round and the same gun without modifications.

Now, whether or not the G20 is a good first handgun... Well that all depends on who's buying it. My first two handguns were .45's, a very worn 1911 and then a new HK USP 45. I liked them both. Then my mom's boyfriend bought a Colt Delta Elite and to me it was like my 1911 but on steroids. I liked it a lot and started doing some research on the round. 10 years later I was in the market for a new handgun. I was pretty much set on getting a 10mm but was unable to get the model I wanted (1911) so I blindly purchased a Glock 20. I saved a lot of money, and hopefully I like it.

What I've noticed is people should buy what they like. If someone likes the 10mm for what ever reasons then they should get it. There's nothing worse in life then to look back and say I should have, or I wish I did... Just do it now and if you don't like it then sell it.

I think my next gun will be a .40 just because it will share reloading equipment with my 10mm and it's better for competitions which I'm thinking about getting into.

JeffMG
07-19-2009, 4:02 PM
Well put locoway and I can see where ya coming from. You don't sound like beginner so I'm not concerned with you shooting or reloading a 10mm.

True, people should buy whatever cal or gun they like. But at the same time, I've seen so many beginners buy calibers not fitted for them based on too much hearsay, marketing hype, and such. The guy that started this thread is just turning 21, only had less 1k 45 shooting experience, and already is planning on reloading the 10mm. Thats where I would shy away the 10mm as his first pistol, atleast until he's fired some rounds through a rental to confirm that he likes it.

Futurecollector
07-19-2009, 4:03 PM
DO IT!!!!

and then get all the convo barrels!

locosway
07-19-2009, 4:06 PM
Well put locoway and I can see where ya coming from. You don't sound like beginner so I'm not concerned with you shooting or reloading a 10mm.

True, people should buy whatever cal or gun they like. But at the same time, I've seen so many beginners buy calibers not fitted for them based on too much hearsay, marketing hype, and such. The guy that started this thread is just turning 21, only had less 1k 45 shooting experience, and already is planning on reloading the 10mm. Thats where I would shy away the 10mm as his first pistol, atleast until he's fired some rounds through a rental to confirm that he likes it.

Yeah, I'd suggest he do the same and in fact I was PM'ing him to see when we could meet so he could shoot mine. I don't have any full power loads atm, but what I do have is strong than the .40, and he's gonna pick some up too.

Also the G20 can shoot .40's with only a different barrel. The dies will be the same for the equipment between the two rounds as well.

Note: What market hype? No one even knows wtf a 10mm is... :D

JeffMG
07-19-2009, 4:34 PM
haha, I was referring to just how people choose their handguns and calibers in gerneral, not just the 10mm. But hey, in the 80s, the 10mm was on pretty much every single cover of gun magazines. They are a fun load to reload I have to admit. Lots of room to tinker.

It'd be nice if they made 10mm carbines or some sort though. I think one would be fun to shoot. The closest thing to one was a MP10 I shot long time ago. Kinda jumpy on tri burst but on single, it was pretty fun.

locosway
07-19-2009, 4:37 PM
Having a carbine that shoots a 10mm to compliment my G20 would be awesome. Maybe I can think about building an AR that shoots 10mm.

dexter9659
07-19-2009, 10:34 PM
A buddy of mine decided he wanted a g20 for his first pistol. His lack of experience with handguns shined through as he learned to shoot on the spongy glock trigger. He is a big guy, but the combination of the steep recoil coupled with the sponge trigger drove him to buy a single action gun. After learning on a single action trigger, he felt his skills improved much faster and with better all around application to other guns than if he just shot the safe-action g20.

This being said. I bought a sequentially SN g20 at the same time he did, and shot it out to 200 yards within 2 weeks.

Sheepdog1968
07-20-2009, 10:38 AM
I would not get a 10 mm as a first gun. Ammo costs more and will be harder to find (the current ammo shortage will stop at some point). If the first gun is to serve as a home defense weapon I'd go with either a 40 or 45. If the sole inteneded purpose is to shoot at the range I'd go w a 9 mm as 9 mm ammo is cheaper than 40 or 45 ammo.