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RolinThundr
07-16-2009, 10:20 PM
How often are Chinese/Norinco Type 54 (Tokarev) handguns in 7.62x25 sold here in CA?

Secondly, how does the 7.62x25 cartridge handle?

11011500a
07-16-2009, 10:34 PM
CZ52 and TT 33 are what I have been seeing around the area for sale. I have a TT33 Romanian I like how it shoots, the cartridge seems to be spot on. The recoil is mild but loud, all around I like it.

Gunaria
07-16-2009, 10:48 PM
Recoil is nothing worse than than a 45 or 357.

smle-man
07-17-2009, 7:11 AM
I have a T54, bought it many years ago. The slide on mine is a bit soft and has gotten a bit mushroomed where it impacts on the frame. The manual gives an estimated service life of 2k rounds so you can decide for yourself just what level of metalurgy went into the gun. On the plus side it is stone reliable, reasonably accurate, and it has a chrome lined bore.

Frijolito1988
07-17-2009, 7:30 AM
They dont pop up very often, but are also not extremely hard to find. The recoil is sharp but nothing special. Here is my Norinco Tokarev 213 with 7.62x25 barrel.

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj297/frijolito1988/GUNS/DSC00838.jpg

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj297/frijolito1988/GUNS/DSC00653.jpg

gun toting monkeyboy
07-17-2009, 9:13 AM
Last I heard, they haven't been imported since the mid 90s. They crop up on the used market every so often. They are decent pistols for the price. You have a better chance of finding a Polish or Romanian one right now. Same gun, better finish. I have 10,000+ rounds through my Chinese one, so their view on service life may be a bit off. As for the cartridge, it is fun. The rounds usually go zipping out at between 1200-1500 fps depending on what brand. They are loud, and have up to a 3 foot fireball when you shoot them. So playing with them at night is a good way to attract attention at the range. Ammo is fairly inexpensive, as S&B have boxes of 50 in the $12-16 range at many stores. Its not as cheap as it was when they had the Norinco and Chicom surplus stuff, but that was banned from importation back in the Clinton era. As an interesting side note, most of the military surplus ammo will go zipping through light soft body armor with little or no resistance. I teasted some on some 3 inch bullet resistant glass/polycarbonate, and it had no trouble penatrating. It did way better than .357 mag of 9mm in that department.

-Mb

sigfan91
07-17-2009, 9:17 AM
Last I heard, they haven't been imported since the mid 90s. They crop up on the used market every so often. They are decent pistols for the price. You have a better chance of finding a Polish or Romanian one right now. Same gun, better finish. I have 10,000+ rounds through my Chinese one, so their view on service life may be a bit off. As for the cartridge, it is fun. The rounds usually go zipping out at between 1200-1500 fps depending on what brand. They are loud, and have up to a 3 foot fireball when you shoot them. So playing with them at night is a good way to attract attention at the range. Ammo is fairly inexpensive, as S&B have boxes of 50 in the $12-16 range at many stores. Its not as cheap as it was when they had the Norinco and Chicom surplus stuff, but that was banned from importation back in the Clinton era. As an interesting side note, most of the military surplus ammo will go zipping through light soft body armor with little or no resistance. I teasted some on some 3 inch bullet resistant glass/polycarbonate, and it had no trouble penatrating. It did way better than .357 mag of 9mm in that department.

-Mb

Wow, why did FN even bother to develop the 5.7x28? Just use the tried and true 7.62x25.

Quiet
07-17-2009, 11:43 AM
The Norinco hadguns are kinda rare in the USA.
They've been banned from importation since the early/mid-'90s.

RolinThundr
07-17-2009, 12:18 PM
I found one for sale online, but of course there is that "will not sell to CA" BS. Would it be possible for my dad to buy it for me, he lives in a free state, and do an intrafamilial transfer? Ok, seller is in CA, but its a gun store, so I guess since its not a private piece (ppt) then it can't be sold in CA?

gun toting monkeyboy
07-17-2009, 4:42 PM
Wow, why did FN even bother to develop the 5.7x28? Just use the tried and true 7.62x25.

Because the Russians didn't wear light soft body armor. And there is a world of difference between civilian bullet resistant glass. And the heavier stuff you find on armored cars and real military vehicles. The steel jacketed military ball ammo in 7.62x25 is great on penatration. Especially for a pistol round. But it isn't in the same class as a rifle round. A .223 or a 7.62x39 round will do far more. The little 5.7 will go through Soviet era armor out to 50 meters. The 7.62x25 would only annoy them.

-Mb

Quiet
07-17-2009, 4:43 PM
Ok, seller is in CA, but its a gun store, so I guess since its not a private piece (ppt) then it can't be sold in CA?

They are probably thinking since it's not on the approved list and it's in their inventory, then they can not sell it in CA.

However, you might want to contact the gunstore and tell them since it is listed as a C&R firearm, they can sell it in CA.

ATF Curios and Relics List (http://www.atf.gov/firearms/curios/1972-2007/section2.pdf)
Chinese Communist, types 51 and 54 (Tokarev) pistols, cal. 7.62mm.

Keep in mind that it needs to be marked as a Type 51 or a Type 54, in order to be C&R exempt.
If it is a Norinco Model 213, then it is a newer production version and not C&R exempt.

Q
07-17-2009, 6:29 PM
They dont pop up very often, but are also not extremely hard to find. The recoil is sharp but nothing special. Here is my Norinco Tokarev 213 with 7.62x25 barrel.

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj297/frijolito1988/GUNS/DSC00653.jpg
Nice.:D

JT27
08-07-2009, 12:42 AM
They are probably thinking since it's not on the approved list and it's in their inventory, then they can not sell it in CA.

However, you might want to contact the gunstore and tell them since it is listed as a C&R firearm, they can sell it in CA.

ATF Curios and Relics List (http://www.atf.gov/firearms/curios/1972-2007/section2.pdf)


Keep in mind that it needs to be marked as a Type 51 or a Type 54, in order to be C&R exempt.
If it is a Norinco Model 213, then it is a newer production version and not C&R exempt.

So the 213 9mm model is NOT legal to be bought here in CA?

Quiet
08-07-2009, 2:00 AM
So the 213 9mm model is NOT legal to be bought here in CA?

Legal to own and purchase via PPT.
However, since it is not on the approved list and it is not a C&R exempt handgun, it can't be imported into CA, unless you have an exemption (LEO/intra-familial gift/etc.)

JT27
08-07-2009, 2:15 AM
Oh okay. I see a few listings in gunbroker and they are all outside of California. I'd like to get a 213 in 9mm but I guess I can't have them shipped here...

Timberland
08-07-2009, 7:03 AM
Oh okay. I see a few listings in gunbroker and they are all outside of California. I'd like to get a 213 in 9mm but I guess I can't have them shipped here...

Why? It is kind crappy if you just want a cheap 9mm get a highpoint. Awkward grips, lame saftey, but in 7.62 it would be great.

JT27
08-07-2009, 9:24 AM
Well I just like this gun in general and I thought it would be easier to have it in 9mm since I already have another handgun in this caliber. I actually didn't know there was any big difference between the 54 and 213 other than caliber.

P08
08-07-2009, 5:09 PM
I have seen many at gunshows here in southern california, many of which were vet bringbacks. I prefer those because they lack the add-on safety. I believe that they are known as the M21, some are even sterile -lack any markings.

JT27
08-07-2009, 9:45 PM
Really? I'll probably go check out Crossroads of the West later this month then. Do they do PPT there?