PDA

View Full Version : unregistered but disassembled ok?


Ironballs
08-22-2005, 1:47 PM
so i have a few toys(two AK's) i chose to move outta state rather then register.. and now i need to move them. Do i need to find another out of state haven, or can i bring my toys home in parts, and leave them disassembled?

I am wondering if even having the unregistered reciever is a nono. (all item were purchased legally in ca pre 2000).
thnaks.

Charliegone
08-22-2005, 2:01 PM
If you are refering to the receiver that is big NONO! I believe the other parts are ok to bring over, but the receivers gotta stay out of state or could face some serious jail time. You could still own them, just not in this state. http://calguns.net/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

bwiese
08-22-2005, 2:31 PM
AR and AK receivers alone - even unassembled, and without evil features like pistol grips, folding stocks, etc. - fall back into Roberti-Roos banned "series" weapons by Aug 2000 Kasler decision.

You don't wanna possess these complete guns, or even bare receievers, in CA when unregistered.

Keep 'em out of state. You are allowed to OWN them - you had them legally before 1/1/2001 - but just can't have 'em inside CA.

However, all the other parts except the receiver (like barrels, small parts, stocks, etc.) are indeed legal to possess in CA.



Bill Wiese
San Jose

Ironballs
08-22-2005, 2:45 PM
thank you both, that makes it clear enough. =(
I will find another out of state location-

artherdGROUPEESUCKS
09-02-2005, 10:14 PM
There is more to this.

Category 1 and 2 (The so-called 'Series Bans' are a list of STAMPED MAKE/MODEL) These recivers you may not bring into CA or posess withough having them registered. EG: a "COLT AR-15" or "BUSHMASTER XM-15"

Category 3: Features weapons. ALL GOOD HERE!

You can own a JP Rifles CTR-02 in pieces here just fine. (this is an ar-type-design gun!) You can have a pistol grip for an M1a, but it just can't be bolted onto the full rifle, etc.

What, EXACTLY, do you own?

NOTE: the recent decision by the CA DOJ to allow "BUSHMASTER XM-15" marked recivers, that have been modified with a welded mag-well and 10-round internal mag, along with the Kelsear v Lockyear decision, seriously challenges the legality of the 'series ban'. It may be nothing more than fluff-language with no more legal standing.

saki302
09-03-2005, 4:10 AM
You *may* be able to use Harrott's to theoretically alow the importation of a non-named (Supreme ACME AR, for example- I made that up but..) AR/AK receiver.

HOWEVER.. The law hasn't really been tested yet.. AND...

If your AK's were assembled before 2000, you can probably bet they're almost certainly named weapons- Harrott's doesn't apply if they're on the list. Even a home built receiver at least has the benefit of the doubt- on the list = big nono.

DOJ approving a BM fixed mag receiver is surprising. I almost wouldn't be surrpised if they say it was a mistake 6 months from now and make owners turn them in, a-la the SKS fiasco with the AK mag mod.

-Dave

bwiese
09-03-2005, 12:25 PM
DOJ has approved GB Sales modified Bushmaster in addition to Vulcan and FAB10. The key legal difference for the modded Bushie is that Bushies are on the Roster of AR15 and AK Series Weapons.

Do not there are no black-letter laws banning Bushmaster XM15s, ASAs, Olympic Arms, Colt Sporters, Colt Match Targets, etc. Only "Colt AR15 and series". Members of this series must be administratively determined, while the Colt AR15 itself is specifically legislatively banned.

The Aug 2000 Kasler decision threw all these AR lowers back into the "Colt AR15 series" of the original Roberti-Roos guns. The later Harrott v Kings County decision just went on to say these guns/receivers had to be specifically named by DOJ - thus the DOJ Roster of AR15 and AK series Weapons.

All the AR receivers on this Roster are specifically named and share all AR15 features - mag well, pistol grip, action, etc. The DOJ Firearms Div. administratively determined members of this list under their regulatory authority granted to them. They have leeway to add/subtract from this list - like for modified Bushmasters.

Once a receiver has been modded to no longer have essential "AR-ness" - by welding up the magwell [or (possibly) removal of any way to have pistol grip attached] - the DOJ can allow this to be sold in CA provided those receivers entered CA either modified already, or the modifier was in CA and held a CA AW permit to legally have AW lowers prior to modification.

I believe it would, however, be illegal to have a welded up true Colt AR15 lower and DOJ could not allow this to be mangled into a weldup version. True, as-named, actual Colt AR15 rifles were specifically named in original Roberti-Roos law and are banned legislatively.
The "...and series" members reaffirmed/listed (due to Kasler and Harrott) allowed the DOJ to administratively determine the membership in this list by "AR15-ness", not name.

So, in summmary, DOJ rulings about welded up Bushmasters by GB Sales do not challenge Roberti-Roos law, Kasler or Harrott decisions. In fact, DOJ is well within its authority since it has the power to add/delete from the Roster, and membership in this roster is determined by administrative evaluation of "AR-ness" (or AK-ness). In the case of GB Sales Bushmaster, the lack of AR-ness let it override the mere name/model number.


Bill Wiese
San Jose